Acts 2: 38-39

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Rella ~ I am a woman

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Acts 2:38-39

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Who can explain what verse 39 means?
 

L.A.M.B.

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It means that the gift of the Holy Spirit wasn't just for that generation, or just for the Jews, but for all Christians.
:Bestest: :Bestest: :Bestest:

Amen and amen.
Cessationalism is from the pits of darkness!
 
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Rella ~ I am a woman

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It means that the gift of the Holy Spirit wasn't just for that generation, or just for the Jews, but for all Christians.
And children?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Mom and Dad repent and get baptized and get the Holy Ghost....

It is a promise to them and to their children..........

So the children get baptized to receive the Holy Ghost????

Elsewhere is a pointed debate on the baptism of infants.... which is claimed and is true it is not mentioned in the bible.... so I thought of that when I saw this.
 

FaithWillDo

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Acts 2:38-39

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Who can explain what verse 39 means?
Dear Rella,
"you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off" is referring only to Jews. The revelation that salvation was also for the Gentiles was not given until later (Acts 11).

Also, verse 38 is referring to the Early Rain of the Spirit and not to the Latter Rain of the Spirit (also called the baptism of the Spirit).

James 5:7 Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the farmer waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receives the EARLY and LATTER RAIN. 8 Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.

The Apostles received the Early Rain of the Spirit during Christ's ministry. This is evidenced by their recognition that Jesus was the Christ and by their confession of faith. The Apostles received the Latter Rain of the Spirit on the Day of Pentecost.

Conversion and salvation require both the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit.

The Early Rain of the Spirit is given by Christ so that a person will have a "measure of faith", make a confession of faith and have certain spiritual gifts. With the Early Rain, a person is called out from the world and will enter the church. Only after Christ gives this gift to a person are they to be baptized in water. Then, just as the Apostles had to do, the new believer must wait on the Lord to "come again" to pour out the Latter Rain.

Heb 9:28 So Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

The Early Rain will leave a new believer spiritually blind and carnally minded. Because it does, Christ will only appear to the new believer in the flesh. In other words, the new believer will only understand the truth of God (Christ) in a carnal way just as the Apostles did after they first believed. It is only after a believer receives the Latter Rain of the Spirit that the person's spiritual blindness will be healed and the truth of God will open up to their understanding.

Joe
 

Bob Estey

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Acts 2:38-39

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Who can explain what verse 39 means?
We are all welcome to accept God's gift of forgiveness, if we repent.
 
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Deborah_

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And children?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Mom and Dad repent and get baptized and get the Holy Ghost....

It is a promise to them and to their children..........

So the children get baptized to receive the Holy Ghost????

Elsewhere is a pointed debate on the baptism of infants.... which is claimed and is true it is not mentioned in the bible.... so I thought of that when I saw this.
In Jewish thought, "children" meant descendants (including grandchildren, great-grandchildren, and so on ad infinitum). Of course children (in age) can become Christians, be forgiven, and receive the Holy Spirit. But I don't think this verse is referring to infant baptism, because Peter says that baptism follows repentance.
 
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Rella ~ I am a woman

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In Jewish thought, "children" meant descendants (including grandchildren, great-grandchildren, and so on ad infinitum). Of course children (in age) can become Christians, be forgiven, and receive the Holy Spirit.
Thank you.
But we must always be aware that there were obvious exceptions.

1st, regarding children ( which would have included infants) we are told by Paul in 1 Cor 7:14

For the unbelieving husband is sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified through her believing husband; for otherwise your children are unclean, but now they are holy.

What does this sanctification mean. Got Questions answers (in part)

To be sanctified is to be “set apart.” Synonyms for sanctified are holy, consecrated, and hallowed. The Bible speaks of things being “sanctified,” and people, such as the Israelites (Leviticus 20:7–8) and Christians (Ephesians 5:26).

For a thing to be sanctified means it is set apart for a special use.
Things that are sanctified are reserved for God’s purposes and should not be used for mundane tasks.

Jesus spoke of Himself as being sanctified in John 17:19; in other words, He is holy and “set apart” from sin. His followers are to be similarly set apart from sin and for God’s use (see 1 Peter 1:16).

People who are sanctified are born again and therefore part of God’s family (Hebrews 2:11).
They are reserved for God’s use. They know “the sanctifying work of the Spirit” in their lives (1 Peter 1:2). They abstain from sexual immorality (1 Thessalonians 4:3). They understand they have been “called to be his holy people” (1 Corinthians 1:2).

Sanctify according to Webster: (in part)

sanctify​

verb

1: to set apart to a sacred purpose or to religious use : CONSECRATE
2: to free from sin : PURIFY

Why would Paul mention children IF they need to come to the age of reason???

Please read the following posted, in part, elsewhere. (The False Doctrine of Infant Baptism)

The earliest mention of infant baptism was by Tertullian around A.D. 220. Tertullian mentions the practice in conjunction with sponsors who would aid in the childs spiritual training (as Godparents today).

Many say...
"...Infant baptism is not found anywhere in the Bible. There is not one example in the Bible of one single baby ever being baptized and its origins are largely pagan.

Yet
You are aware of the Jailer, Lydia, and Stephanus... all 3 had their households baptised.Their households. We often fail to mention....Acts 18:8 (NAS)8 Crispus, the leader of the synagogue, believed in the Lord with all his household, and many of the Corinthians when they heard were believing and being baptized.

Question.
Have you read anywhere in the bible or elsewhere that households did not include young children or infants?


See the following... emphasis mine.


Household - Bible Definition and Scripture References

Discover the meaning of Household in the Bible. Study the definition of Household with multiple Bible Dictionaries and Encyclopedias and find scripture references in the Old and New Testaments.
www.biblestudytools.com
www.biblestudytools.com
International Standard Bible Encyclopedia - Household

HOUSEHOLDhous'-hold:Three words are usually found in the Bible where the family is indicated. These three are the Hebrew word bayith and the Greek words oikia and oikos. The unit of the national life of Israel, from the very beginning, was found in the family.

In the old patriarchal days each family was complete within itself, the oldest living sire being the unquestioned head of the whole, possessed of almost arbitrary powers. The house and the household are practically synonymous.

God had called Abraham "that he might command his children and household after him" (Genesis 18:19). The Passover-lamb was to be eaten by the "household" (Exodus 12:3). The "households" of the rebels in the camp of Israel shared their doom (Numbers 16:31-33; Deuteronomy 11:6). David's household shares his humiliation (2 Samuel 15:16); the children everywhere in the Old Testament are the bearers of the sins of the fathers. Human life is not a conglomerate of individuals; the family is its center and unit.Nor is it different in the New Testament.

The curse and the blessing of the apostles are to abide on a house, according to its attitude (Matthew 10:13). A divided house falls (Mark 3:25).

The household believes with the head thereof (John 4:53; Acts 16:15,34).

Thus the households became the nuclei for the early life of the church, e.g. the house of Prisca and Aquila at Rome (Romans 16:5), of Stephanas (1 Corinthians 16:15), of Onesiphorus (2 Timothy 1:16), etc. No wonder that the early church made so much of the family life. And in the midst of all our modern, rampant individualism, the family is still the throbbing heart of the church as well as of the nation.

Henry E. Dosker

Further:
If family households did not consist of nuclear families in the modern understanding of a married couple and their children but were multigenerational (up to four generations... as history shows) and included the social arrangement of several families... related by blood and marriage... who lived in 2 or 3 connecting houses....

Inclusive of :
those who belong to the family household are mentioned a number of times in the Hebrew Bible
Gen 7 :1 Then the LORD said to Noah, “Enter the ark, you and all your household, for you alone I have seen to be righteous before Me in this time.
Gen 7:7 Then Noah and his sons and his wife and his sons’ wives with him entered the ark because of the water of the flood.
Gen 36:6 Then Esau took his wives and his sons and his daughters and all his household, and his livestock and all his cattle and all his goods which he had acquired in the land of Canaan, and went to another land away from his brother Jacob
Gen 45:10 “You shall live in the land of Goshen, and you shall be near me, you and your children and your children’s children and your flocks and your herds and all that you have.
Gen 46:26 All the persons belonging to Jacob, who came to Egypt, his direct descendants, not including the wives of Jacob’s sons, were sixty-six persons in all,

OKAY... I'll stop posting verses.... The last one shows how many people would be in Jacobs "inner circle" as it were. These texts indicate that the family household was primarily a kinship system that included lineal descent and lateral extension: grandparents, adult male children and their wives and children, unmarried children, and widowed and divorced adult daughters who may have had children.

Thus, it’s not just a matter of a nuclear family but of extended family , which makes it all the more likely that children would typically be present in a biblical “household.”

It’s very difficult, highly improbable, logically and exegetically, and in light of relevant historical knowledge, to concludes that a biblical “household” could not possibly contain small children.


Conclusion: Without writing an entire book this provides an understanding of the precise meaning of a biblical “household.”

And say with certainty If they usually contained children, then the Bible virtually describes infant baptism...

 

Deborah_

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Thank you.
But we must always be aware that there were obvious exceptions.

1st, regarding children ( which would have included infants) we are told by Paul in 1 Cor 7:14

For the unbelieving husband is sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified through her believing husband; for otherwise your children are unclean, but now they are holy.

What does this sanctification mean. Got Questions answers (in part)

To be sanctified is to be “set apart.” Synonyms for sanctified are holy, consecrated, and hallowed. The Bible speaks of things being “sanctified,” and people, such as the Israelites (Leviticus 20:7–8) and Christians (Ephesians 5:26).

For a thing to be sanctified means it is set apart for a special use.
Things that are sanctified are reserved for God’s purposes and should not be used for mundane tasks.

Jesus spoke of Himself as being sanctified in John 17:19; in other words, He is holy and “set apart” from sin. His followers are to be similarly set apart from sin and for God’s use (see 1 Peter 1:16).

People who are sanctified are born again and therefore part of God’s family (Hebrews 2:11). They are reserved for God’s use. They know “the sanctifying work of the Spirit” in their lives (1 Peter 1:2). They abstain from sexual immorality (1 Thessalonians 4:3). They understand they have been “called to be his holy people” (1 Corinthians 1:2).

Sanctify according to Webster: (in part)

sanctify​

verb

1: to set apart to a sacred purpose or to religious use : CONSECRATE
2: to free from sin : PURIFY

Why would Paul mention children IF they need to come to the age of reason???

Please read the following posted, in part, elsewhere. (The False Doctrine of Infant Baptism)

The earliest mention of infant baptism was by Tertullian around A.D. 220. Tertullian mentions the practice in conjunction with sponsors who would aid in the childs spiritual training (as Godparents today).

Many say...
"...Infant baptism is not found anywhere in the Bible. There is not one example in the Bible of one single baby ever being baptized and its origins are largely pagan.

Yet
You are aware of the Jailer, Lydia, and Stephanus... all 3 had their households baptised.Their households. We often fail to mention....Acts 18:8 (NAS)8 Crispus, the leader of the synagogue, believed in the Lord with all his household, and many of the Corinthians when they heard were believing and being baptized.

Question.
Have you read anywhere in the bible or elsewhere that households did not include young children or infants?


See the following... emphasis mine.


Household - Bible Definition and Scripture References

Discover the meaning of Household in the Bible. Study the definition of Household with multiple Bible Dictionaries and Encyclopedias and find scripture references in the Old and New Testaments.
www.biblestudytools.com
www.biblestudytools.com
International Standard Bible Encyclopedia - Household

HOUSEHOLDhous'-hold:Three words are usually found in the Bible where the family is indicated. These three are the Hebrew word bayith and the Greek words oikia and oikos. The unit of the national life of Israel, from the very beginning, was found in the family.

In the old patriarchal days each family was complete within itself, the oldest living sire being the unquestioned head of the whole, possessed of almost arbitrary powers. The house and the household are practically synonymous.

God had called Abraham "that he might command his children and household after him" (Genesis 18:19). The Passover-lamb was to be eaten by the "household" (Exodus 12:3). The "households" of the rebels in the camp of Israel shared their doom (Numbers 16:31-33; Deuteronomy 11:6). David's household shares his humiliation (2 Samuel 15:16); the children everywhere in the Old Testament are the bearers of the sins of the fathers. Human life is not a conglomerate of individuals; the family is its center and unit.Nor is it different in the New Testament.

The curse and the blessing of the apostles are to abide on a house, according to its attitude (Matthew 10:13). A divided house falls (Mark 3:25).

The household believes with the head thereof (John 4:53; Acts 16:15,34).

Thus the households became the nuclei for the early life of the church, e.g. the house of Prisca and Aquila at Rome (Romans 16:5), of Stephanas (1 Corinthians 16:15), of Onesiphorus (2 Timothy 1:16), etc. No wonder that the early church made so much of the family life. And in the midst of all our modern, rampant individualism, the family is still the throbbing heart of the church as well as of the nation.

Henry E. Dosker

Further:
If family households did not consist of nuclear families in the modern understanding of a married couple and their children but were multigenerational (up to four generations... as history shows) and included the social arrangement of several families... related by blood and marriage... who lived in 2 or 3 connecting houses....

Inclusive of :
those who belong to the family household are mentioned a number of times in the Hebrew Bible
Gen 7 :1 Then the LORD said to Noah, “Enter the ark, you and all your household, for you alone I have seen to be righteous before Me in this time.
Gen 7:7 Then Noah and his sons and his wife and his sons’ wives with him entered the ark because of the water of the flood.
Gen 36:6 Then Esau took his wives and his sons and his daughters and all his household, and his livestock and all his cattle and all his goods which he had acquired in the land of Canaan, and went to another land away from his brother Jacob
Gen 45:10 “You shall live in the land of Goshen, and you shall be near me, you and your children and your children’s children and your flocks and your herds and all that you have.
Gen 46:26 All the persons belonging to Jacob, who came to Egypt, his direct descendants, not including the wives of Jacob’s sons, were sixty-six persons in all,

OKAY... I'll stop posting verses.... The last one shows how many people would be in Jacobs "inner circle" as it were. These texts indicate that the family household was primarily a kinship system that included lineal descent and lateral extension: grandparents, adult male children and their wives and children, unmarried children, and widowed and divorced adult daughters who may have had children.

Thus, it’s not just a matter of a nuclear family but of extended family , which makes it all the more likely that children would typically be present in a biblical “household.”

It’s very difficult, highly improbable, logically and exegetically, and in light of relevant historical knowledge, to concludes that a biblical “household” could not possibly contain small children.


Conclusion: Without writing an entire book this provides an understanding of the precise meaning of a biblical “household.”

And say with certainty If they usually contained children, then the Bible virtually describes infant baptism...

That's as may be, but we were discussing Acts 2:38,39, and there's no justification for infant (as opposed to child) baptism there.
 

Rella ~ I am a woman

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That's as may be, but we were discussing Acts 2:38,39, and there's no justification for infant (as opposed to child) baptism there.
Fair enough.

Cannot help but wonder when an infant becomes a child?

38 Peter said to them, “Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

39 For the promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God will call to Himself.”

Now, Correct me if I am wrong.... And I know you will but I read the promise is specific and not baptism for the forgiveness of sins directed to children or all who were afar off.... but
the Gift of the Holy Spirit.... for as many as God will call.

A couple of commentaries read this way.

Matthew Henry's Concise Commentary
2:37-41 From the first delivery of that Divine message, it appeared that there was Divine power going with it; and thousands were brought to the obedience of faith. But neither Peter's words, nor the miracle they witnessed, could have produced such effects, had not the Holy Spirit been given. Sinners, when their eyes are opened, cannot but be pricked to the heart for sin, cannot but feel an inward uneasiness. The apostle exhorted them to repent of their sins, and openly to avow their belief in Jesus as the Messiah, by being baptized in his name. Thus professing their faith in Him, they would receive remission of their sins, and partake of the gifts and graces of the Holy Spirit. To separate from wicked people, is the only way to save ourselves from them. Those who repent of their sins, and give up themselves to Jesus Christ, must prove their sincerity by breaking off from the wicked. We must save ourselves from them; which denotes avoiding them with dread and holy fear. By God's grace three thousand persons accepted the gospel invitation. There can be no doubt that the gift of the Holy Ghost, which they all received, and from which no true believer has ever been shut out, was that Spirit of adoption, that converting, guiding, sanctifying grace, which is bestowed upon all the members of the family of our heavenly Father. Repentance and remission of sins are still preached to the chief of sinners, in the Redeemer's name; still the Holy Spirit seals the blessing on the believer's heart; still the encouraging promises are to us and our children; and still the blessings are offered to all that are afar off.

Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges
39. the promise is unto you, and to your children] Just as “to Abraham and his seed were the promises made” (Galatians 3:16), so is it to be under the new covenant.

Expositor's Greek Testament
Acts 2:39. ὑμῖν γὰρ: the promise was made to the very men who had invoked upon themselves and upon their children, St. Matthew 27:25, the blood of the Crucified.
 

Titus

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39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
For the promise= verse 38 the gift of the Holy Spirit. What's that gift?
Romans 6:23,
- for the wages of sin is death but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord

-For the promise is to you(those present hearing Peter's gospel sermon)
-For the promise is to you and to your children(future generations)
- For the promise is to you and to your children and to all who are afar off( these are the gentiles)
- For the promise is to you and to your children and to all who are afar off as many as the Lord our God will call(God calls all the world with His gospel of salvation)

- to all who are afar off read Ephesians 2:13, 11

- but now in Christ Jesus you who were once afar off have been brought near by the blood of Christ
verse 11,
- therefore remember that you were once gentiles in the flesh...


- as many as the Lord our God will call read 2Thessalonians 2:14,

- to which He called you by our gospel for the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ

Love you Rella
 

bro.tan

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Acts 2:38-39

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Who can explain what verse 39 means?
That promise goes far back to Abraham. Let's go to Genesis 17: 1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect. 2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly. 5 Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee. 6 And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee. 7 And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

So let's go into Genesis 22: 15 And the angel of the LORD called unto Abraham out of heaven the second time, 16 and said, By myself have I sworn, saith the LORD, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son: 17 that in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies; 18 and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.

So let' fast forward to the new Testament going into Galatians 3: (v.16) Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of One, AND TO THY SEED, which is Christ. (v.17) And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

To sum up what going on here in Galatians, Paul is explaining that Christ came from Abraham seed, and remove the animal Sacrificial law. But in the days of Abraham that animal law never was on the table, and was not needed for Abraham to obey and faith in God. But Commandments was always on the table. God’s holy commandments have been around forever even before man was created. Remember that Satan was kicked out of heaven because iniquity (sin) was found in him. And what is sin? The transgression of the law (commandments). Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Now we have just read the biblical definition of sin, the transgression (breaking) of the law (commandments.) It doesn’t matter what you or I think sin is, it’s what God says sin is that counts. (1John 3:4)

But let's skip down to v.24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. 26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

This is a quick version explaining this, it's a lot more to understand but for time sake.
 

Ritajanice

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Conversion and salvation require both the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit.
Not true....we are Born Of The Spirit...salvation comes from Gods Living witness His Holy Spirit...when he makes our spirit Born Again.....The Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children?

He talks to our spirit as he’s indwelling us, ( The Holy Spirit ,Gods Witness who witnesses Gods truth to our heart/ spirit?)...The Living Spiritual Birth?

Do you actually understand the Living Spiritual birth?

You understand that being Born Of The Spirit is “ Supernatural “ event which only Gods Living Holy Spirit can do?
Early and latter rains of the Spirit has NOTHING to do with being Born Again...utter nonsense.

My opinion/ testimony/ belief.
 
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FaithWillDo

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Not true....we are Born Of The Spirit...salvation comes from Gods Living witness His Holy Spirit...when he makes our spirit Born Again.....The Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are Gods children?

He talks to our spirit as he’s indwelling us, ( The Holy Spirit ,Gods Witness who witnesses Gods truth to our heart/ spirit?)...The Living Spiritual Birth?

Do you actually understand the Living Spiritual birth?

You understand that being Born Of The Spirit is “ Supernatural “ event which only Gods Living Holy Spirit can do?
Early and latter rains of the Spirit has NOTHING to do with being Born Again...utter nonsense.

My opinion/ testimony/ belief.
Dear Ritajanice,
I believe we have had this discussion before.

You make a lot of statements in your post but you lack any scriptural support.

The Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit are spiritual symbols which represent the time Christ gives the Holy Spirit to a person. The Early and Latter Rains are contained in the FARMING ANALOGY that Christ uses to teach His spiritual truths of the New Covenant.

Hos 6:3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and HE SHALL COME UNTO US AS THE RAIN, AS THE LATTER AND FORMER RAIN UNTO THE EARTH.

To be born again and have the inheritance that is promised to the Elect (spiritual seed & heirs of Abraham), it requires Christ to give a an Elect person both the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit.

The Early Rain of the Spirit is given to an Elect person to call them into the church (called to be a saint). It will give the person a measure of faith and certain spiritual gifts. However, the Early Rain is given to the person in a small measure:

Deu 32:2 My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain (Early Rain) upon the tender herb, and as the showers (Latter Rain) upon the grass:

Job 37:6 For he saith to the snow, Be thou on the earth; likewise to the small rain
(Early Rain), and to the great rain (Latter Rain) of his strength.

Joel 2:23 Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in Jehovah your God; for he giveth you the former rain
(Early Rain) in just measure, and he causes to come down for you the rain, the former rain and the latter rain, in the first month.

Because the Early Rain of the Spirit is given in measure, the Elect person will not be converted. They will remain spiritually blind (Mark 8:15:25) and carnally minded (1Cor 3:1). As a result, they will fall prey to Satan via the spirit of anti-Christ. This is when the Abomination of Desolation occurs within the Elect believer. As a result, they will "fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken" (Isa 28:12) and become "worse than the first" (Mat 12:43-45).

In this wicked and lost condition, the Elect believer's inheritance becomes weary.

Psa 68:9 Thou, O God, didst send a plentiful RAIN (Latter Rain), whereby thou didst confirm thine inheritance, when it was WEARY.

Jer 3:3 Therefore the showers have been withheld, and there hath been no Latter Rain; and thou hadst a whore's forehead, thou refusedst to be ashamed.

1Sam 12:17 Is it not wheat harvest to day? I will call unto the LORD, and he shall send thunder and RAIN
(Latter Rain); that ye may perceive and see that your wickedness is great, which ye have done in the sight of the LORD, in asking you a king.


Because the Elect believer is in a fallen away condition, it is necessary for Christ to "come again" and pour out the Latter Rain of the Spirit.

Without the Latter Rain of the Spirit, the Elect believer would remain lost and unconverted. They would lose their promised inheritance.

But since the Elect are blessed and chosen to be heirs of Abraham, Christ will come again and pour out the Latter Rain of the Spirit upon them. This is their moment of salvation and new birth:

Prov 16:15 In the light of the king's countenance is life (salvation); and his favour (blessing) is as a cloud of the Latter Rain.

For the reason the scriptures above present, both the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit are necessary for salvation/conversion/new birth.

James said this:

James 5:7 Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the farmer waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receives the EARLY and LATTER RAIN. 8 Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.

The MARRIAGE ANALOGY used by Christ teaches the same truths as does the Farming analogy. The Parable of the Ten Virgins is one of that analogy's primary teachings.

Paul teaches the same truths to the Corinthians but he does so without using an analogy.

Consider what Paul said to the unconverted Corinthian church:

1Cor 1:6 Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you (Early Rain): 7 So that you come behind in no gift; waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ: 8 Who shall also confirm you unto the end (Latter Rain), that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ (taught in "type" by the story of the woman taken in adultery, John 8:3-10).

Also, consider what Paul said to the Thessalonian church.

Since an Elect believer is in a fallen away spiritual state when Christ comes to them the second time with the Latter Rain and Judgment (Day of the Lord), Christ will come to them as a "thief in the night":

1Thes 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night (time of spiritual blindness). 3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety (they feel secure in the apostate church); then sudden destruction cometh upon them (judgment which destroys all things that makes the believer carnal), as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape (this is when the child of God is born/believer is born again).

Joe
 

Ritajanice

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Dear Ritajanice,
I believe we have had this discussion before.

You make a lot of statements in your post but you lack any scriptural support.

The Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit are spiritual symbols which represent the time Christ gives the Holy Spirit to a person. The Early and Latter Rains are contained in the FARMING ANALOGY that Christ uses to teach His spiritual truths of the New Covenant.
Complete and utter nonsense.

The written word of God does not say we are Born Again of the early or the latter rains,it doesn’t even make sense.

That is why your words are so “ confusing “ because sadly they are “ your” words.

John 3:3-8​

King James Version​

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
 

FaithWillDo

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Complete and utter nonsense.

The written word of God does not say we are Born Again of the early or the latter rains,it doesn’t even make sense.

That is why your words are so “ confusing “ because sadly they are “ your” words.

John 3:3-8​

King James Version​

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
Dear Ritajanice,
There is nothing more I can say if you can't receive the scriptures that I have posted.
Joe
 

Ritajanice

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To be born again and have the inheritance that is promised to the Elect (spiritual seed & heirs of Abraham), it requires Christ to give a an Elect person both the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit.
It requires no such thing.

We are Born Again of imperishable seed that liveth and abideth forever.

What seed? Whose seed and where does this seed liveth and abideth forever?

Is it a dead seed?...or a Living seed?
 

Ritajanice

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Dear Ritajanice,
There is nothing more I can say if you can't receive the scriptures that I have posted.
Joe
There is nothing you can say, no, that is correct..none of the scripture you post is relevant to being Born Of The Spirit.

What denomination are you?..if I may ask?
 
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Ritajanice

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Without the Latter Rain of the Spirit, the Elect believer would remain lost and unconverted. They would lose their promised inheritance.
1 Peter 1
Berean Standard BiblePar ▾
A Greeting from Peter
(2 Peter 1:1–2)
1Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ,
To the elect who are exiles of the Dispersion throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, chosena 2according to the foreknowledge of God the Father and sanctified by the Spirit for obedience to Jesus Christ and sprinkling by His blood:
Grace and peace be yours in abundance.
A Living Hope
3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By His great mercy He has given us new birthb into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, reserved in heaven for you, 5who through faith are shielded by God’s power for the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.
6In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while you may have had to suffer grief in various trials 7so that the proven character of your faith—more precious than gold, which perishes even though refined by fire—may result in praise, glory, and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ.
8Though you have not seen Him, you love Him; and though you do not see Him now, you believe in Him and rejoice with an inexpressible and glorious joy, 9now that you are receiving the goal of your faith, the salvation of your souls.
10Concerning this salvation, the prophets who foretold the grace to come to you searched and investigated carefully, 11trying to determine the time and setting to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when He predicted the sufferings of Christ and the glories to follow.
12It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves, but you, when they foretold the things now announced by those who preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven. Even angels long to look into these things.
A Call to Holiness
(Hebrews 12:14–17)
13Therefore prepare your minds for action.c Be sober-minded. Set your hope fully on the grace to be given you at the revelation of Jesus Christ. 14As obedient children, do not conform to the passions of your former ignorance. 15But just as He who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do, 16for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”d
17Since you call on a Father who judges each one’s work impartially, conduct yourselves in reverent fear during your stay as foreigners. 18For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life you inherited from your forefathers, 19but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or spot. 20He was known before the foundation of the world, but was revealed in the last times for your sake.
21Through Him you believe in God, who raised Him from the dead and glorified Him; and so your faith and hope are in God.
The Enduring Word
(Isaiah 40:6–8)
22Since you have purified your souls by obedience to the truth so that you have a genuine love for your brothers, love one another deeply, from a pure heart.e 23For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God. 24For,
“All flesh is like grass,
and all its glory like the flowers of the field;
the grass withers and the flowers fall,
25but the word of the Lord stands forever
.”f
And this is the word that was proclaimed to you
 
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FaithWillDo

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There is nothing you can say, no, that is correct..none of the scripture you post is relevant to being Born Of The Spirit.

What denomination are you?..if I may ask?
Dear Ritajanice,
All church denominations and sects of Christianity became apostate shortly after Paul's death. At that time, none of the flock was spared. Nothing has changed since that time.

After I was converted in 2005, I left the apostate church I was attending and have never gone back. Light does not have any fellowship with darkness. I now only fellowship with the few converted believers I have met on-line. I know of none locally except my wife who was converted at the time I was. There are no organized churches of any denomination that are not apostate. They all mix "works" with faith which is the foundation of Satan's false gospel.

Joe