All we need is the LORD Jesus to be saved
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Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
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● John 3:14-17 . . As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so
must the Son of Man be lifted up; that whoever believes may in him have
eternal life. For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten son,
that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
The incident to which Christ referred is located at Num 21:5-9.
Long story short: Moses' people became weary of eating manna all the time
at every meal. But instead of courteously, and diplomatically, petitioning
their divine benefactor for a different diet, they became indignant and
confrontational; angrily demanding better accommodations.
In response to their insolence, and their ingratitude for His providence; God
sent a swarm of deadly poisonous vipers among them; which began striking
people; and every strike was 100% fatal, no exceptions.
After a number of people died, the rest came to their senses and begged
Moses to intercede. In reply; The Lord instructed Moses to fashion a replica
of the vipers and hoist it up on a pole in plain view so that everyone dying
from venom could look to it for relief.
The key issue here is that the replica was the only God-given remedy for the
people's bites-- not sacrifices and offerings, not tithing, not church
attendance, not scapulars, not confession, not holy days of obligation, not
the Sabbath, not rosaries, not weeping, not the golden rule, not charity, not
Bible study and/or Sunday school, not self denial, not vows of poverty, not
the Ten Commandments, nor even one's ideology of choice, i.e. it wouldn't
have mattered whether somebody was Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Catholic,
Protestant, Baha'i, Atheist, Agnostic, or whatever. No; the replica was it;
nothing else would suffice to save their lives.
As an allegory, the brazen serpent indicates that Christ's crucifixion for the
sins of the world is the only God-given rescue from the wrath of God; and
when people accept it, then according to John 3:14-17 and John 5:24, they
qualify for a transfer from death into life. Those who reject his crucifixion as
the only God-given rescue from the sum of all fears, are already on the
docket to face it.
● John 3:18 . .Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does
not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the
name of God's one and only Son.
In context His son's "name" is relative to the brazen serpent incident.
_
● John 3:14-17 . . As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so
must the Son of Man be lifted up; that whoever believes may in him have
eternal life. For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten son,
that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
The incident to which Christ referred is located at Num 21:5-9.
Long story short: Moses' people became weary of eating manna all the time
at every meal. But instead of courteously, and diplomatically, petitioning
their divine benefactor for a different diet, they became indignant and
confrontational; angrily demanding better accommodations.
In response to their insolence, and their ingratitude for His providence; God
sent a swarm of deadly poisonous vipers among them; which began striking
people; and every strike was 100% fatal, no exceptions.
After a number of people died, the rest came to their senses and begged
Moses to intercede. In reply; The Lord instructed Moses to fashion a replica
of the vipers and hoist it up on a pole in plain view so that everyone dying
from venom could look to it for relief.
The key issue here is that the replica was the only God-given remedy for the
people's bites-- not sacrifices and offerings, not tithing, not church
attendance, not scapulars, not confession, not holy days of obligation, not
the Sabbath, not rosaries, not weeping, not the golden rule, not charity, not
Bible study and/or Sunday school, not self denial, not vows of poverty, not
the Ten Commandments, nor even one's ideology of choice, i.e. it wouldn't
have mattered whether somebody was Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Catholic,
Protestant, Baha'i, Atheist, Agnostic, or whatever. No; the replica was it;
nothing else would suffice to save their lives.
As an allegory, the brazen serpent indicates that Christ's crucifixion for the
sins of the world is the only God-given rescue from the wrath of God; and
when people accept it, then according to John 3:14-17 and John 5:24, they
qualify for a transfer from death into life. Those who reject his crucifixion as
the only God-given rescue from the sum of all fears, are already on the
docket to face it.
● John 3:18 . .Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does
not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the
name of God's one and only Son.
In context His son's "name" is relative to the brazen serpent incident.
_
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Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
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FAQ: If so; then how would someone go about appropriating the cross?
REPLY: By speaking up with a very simple prayer like the one below.
"God I know I'm a sinner who fully deserves retribution, and on track to get
it. I would like to take advantage of your son's death; if I may."
_
FAQ: If so; then how would someone go about appropriating the cross?
REPLY: By speaking up with a very simple prayer like the one below.
"God I know I'm a sinner who fully deserves retribution, and on track to get
it. I would like to take advantage of your son's death; if I may."
_
There is no record in the bible of anyone asking Jesus into their heart to be saved.
1. Belief & faith
2. Confession of belief as did the Ethiopian eunuch in Acts8 and in accordance with Romans 10:9
3. Repentance as the Jews were told to do on the day of Pentecost in Acts 2:38
4. Baptism for the forgiveness of sins also per Acts 2 38
If you do the above, you'll be saved and added to the body of Christ by the Lord.
mailmandan
Well-Known Member
John 10:9 - I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.
John 14:6 - Jesus said to him, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
Acts 4:12 - Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.
John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Acts 4:4 - However, many of those who heard the word believed; and the number of the men came to be about five thousand.
Acts 5:14 - And believers were increasingly added to the Lord, multitudes of both men and women.
John 14:6 - Jesus said to him, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
Acts 4:12 - Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.
John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Acts 4:4 - However, many of those who heard the word believed; and the number of the men came to be about five thousand.
Acts 5:14 - And believers were increasingly added to the Lord, multitudes of both men and women.
GRACE ambassador
Well-Known Member
So, we know it's a simple phrase children can easily do, but, Scripturally, are we telling them
The Truth? Jesus Did Say "let the little children come to Me," so just wondering, IF:
A) Jer 17:9 "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?"
Should we "ask Jesus to come into that"?
B) Mat 15:19 "For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications,
thefts, false witness, blasphemies" (cp Mar 7:21-22)
Why would "God, The HOLY One, The LORD Jesus Christ, Want to come into such
evil and filth"?
C) Would it not be better, in order to receive God's Eternal Salvation (Be Saved),
by believing What God's Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided, Teaches About This
Important Matter Of sinful man's Eternal Welfare? - ie:
Humble Christ, on the earth, To Israel, 12 apostles, Under The Law/covenants/Prophecy:
1) Repent (change mind about sin/agree With God "it is Wrong!") or perish
(Luk 13:3,5 Mar 1:4 Luk_3:3, 24:47}
+2) believe the gospel of the kingdom (Mat 4:23, 9:35, 24:14; Mar 1:14,15)
+
3) be baptized "For the remission of sin" (Mar 1:4 Luk_3:3, 7:29:30 24:47; Act 2:38)
+
4) "show works meet for repentance" (Mat 3:8), because,
+
5) "to the twelve tribes of Israel," "faith Without works is dead" (Jam 1:1, 2:17,26)
+
6) "keep the commandments" to "enter life" (Mat 19:17)
+
7) "one thing thou lackest...sell ALL/take up cross/follow Jesus" (Mar 10:17-23):
earthly prophecy/LAW/covenants ( Previous dispensation of God... )
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ” (online)
Glorified Christ, From Heaven, To ONE apostle and His 'ONE Body,' Under Grace / Mystery
( Current Dispensation of God ):
1) Repent (change mind about sin/agree With God "it is Wrong!"):
"Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, ↑ repentance toward God,
and ↓ faith toward our LORD Jesus Christ." (Acts 20:21)
2) believe (with ALL the heart, trust, place 100% faith in) The Gospel Of The Grace Of God:
"For I delivered unto you first of all That Which I also received, how That
Christ Died for our sins According To The Scriptures; And That He Was Buried,
and that He Rose Again the third day According To The Scriptures"
3) "By Grace Are ye Saved Through faith..."Plus Nothing!:
"...and That not of yourselves: It Is The Gift Of God: Not
of works, lest any man should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9)
Plus Nothing, Confirmed!:
"Not by works of righteousness which we have done, But According To His Mercy
He Saved us, By The Washing of Regeneration, and Renewing of The Holy Ghost"
(Titus 3:5)
Plus Nothing, Further Confirmed!:"Who Hath Saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our
works, but According To His Own Purpose And Grace, Which Was Given us
In Christ Jesus before the world began" (2 Timothy 1:9)
↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ The LORD ( With Grace And Mercy!!! ) Is All we need Today to Be Saved!! Amen!
Also Three Tenses Of God's Deliverance (Salvation) + good works for rewards:
Grace, Peace, And JOY In Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided (+ I and II)!
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St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Seems more like a myopic echo chamber to me, in dire need of a few challenges.
Whole lot of glad-handing going on here. I choose you to respond to first.
What does it mean to "ask Jesus into our hearts we will be saved"?
Sounds more like an evangelical catch phrase than anything tangible.
Is a person "lost" until they "ask Jesus into their heart"?
Does that then make them "saved", as in, no longer "lost"?
I'm not disagreeing. This isn't a refutation.
Intended as a challenge to a narrow mindset.
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Right.
Where did this "ask Jesus into your heart" thing come from? Not the Bible, me thinks.
LOL
Such a GREAT question!
Discussion point:
Do you think Jesus meant this as a directive ("keep the commandments"),
or was it a rhetorical question geared to a first century Jewish mindset?
I vote for the latter.
What was the one thing the young man lacked? (two things actually)
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St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Well, the OP is quite the tome. TLDR
Romans 2:14-16 NIV
(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
It's easy to spot a religious cult. They are in the church across the street from your church.
And they feel the same way about you.
Where does this get us? Build bridges, not walls.
What do you make of this?
Romans 2:14-16 NIV
(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
Tribalism.
It's easy to spot a religious cult. They are in the church across the street from your church.
And they feel the same way about you.
Where does this get us? Build bridges, not walls.
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Thanks for stating that as I don't need to now. But yes Jesus made it clear in the bible that faith alone won't save us. He spelled out the works meet for repentance in the sheep and goats. And a good church establishment as spelled out in the bible can help people and provide opportunities to help others whether it be service projects or visiting other members and helping them thru the church community.
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Let's not be in error either. Some will be saved by faith alone as they are incapable of works. They are the less fortunate mentally ill and disabled. Perhaps they can do some works. But let's not judge them either.
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St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Thanks for joining this previously very one-sided discussion.
Very interesting point in reference to Matthew chapter 25. (sheep and goats)
Here's my position on works.
In reference to salvation, there is only one work that has any bearing.
That is the work of the Atonement. Christ's work on our behalf.
The whole world (creation) and all of humankind are redeemed by the finished and complete work of the cross.
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world. - 1 John 2:2 NIV
Our works will be judged/evaluated to determine what was gold, silver, costly stones, or wood, hay, and straw.
The wood, hay, and straw will burn away. Leaving the gold, silver, and costly stones.
And even if it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved as one escaping through the flames.
1 Corinthians 3:12-15 NIV
If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw,
13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire,
and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. 14 If what has been built survives,
the builder will receive a reward. 15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—
even though only as one escaping through the flames.
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Yes we will not be saved without Jesus' atonement. We are dead in sin all of us except Jesus. However Jesus is judge and decides who will be saved. And he requires us to repent of our sins. The bible spells out works meet for repentance. The sheep and goats is a prime and perfect example of those works meet for repentance.
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
That's an interesting view, and very well-stated. Thanks.
Although you might be conflating repentance and confession.
Repentance means a turning away from. (by definition)
Are you familiar with the Harrowing of Hell? A title used to describe where Jesus went
and what he did for the three days between his death and resurrection.
No, I'm not familiar with the Harrowing of Hell. I am familiar that Jesus went and preached to the spirits in prison.
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Yes, that's it.
Since it happened once, it could happen again.
Matthew 12:40
For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
Note: Christ was laid in an above ground tomb.
Question: Where is the heart of the earth?
Answer: the realm of the dead
1 Peter 3:18-20
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit. 19 After being made alive, he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— 20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, Ephesians 4:8-10 This is why it says: “When he ascended on high, he took many captives and gave gifts to his people.” 9 (What does “he ascended” mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regions? 10 He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.)
1 Peter 4:6 NRSV
For this is the reason the gospel was proclaimed even to the dead, so that, though they had been judged in the flesh as everyone is judged, they might live in the spirit as God does.
Romans 14:9 For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.
Yes I think visits to spirit prison are for people that haven't had a chance to hear the gospel of Christ.
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Wow.
It just occurred to me that part of the sheep and goats discussion was visiting those in prison.
Never made that connection before. (with the afterlife) cc: @Hillsage @Chadrho @GRACE ambassador @David in NJ
Matthew 25:35-36 NIV
For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink,
I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me,
I was in prison and you came to visit me.’
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St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Yes, I agree. (humbly, of course) - LOL
"Christendom" was bashed earlier in the OP for not being onboard with this purely evangelical view.
Seems they are throwing out the Christ child with the bath water to me.
Certainly those in Catholicism and Orthodoxy would have a different view.
And other Christian groups as well.
Could you broaden your earlier post statement (that I replied to) to accommodate them somehow?
Just to be clear, I was raised evangelical, so I understood you completely.
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