And his name shall be called Immanuel!

[APAK]

1Th 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Th 5:10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

Mat 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Is it possible that the "virgin" is Christ's church who claim that God is with us?

For "they" shall call his name Emmanuel. Who is "they" ?

2Co 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

Mat 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Hugs

The war of the seeds indeed has never stopped since the fall of man(kind). We wait for the end, and will be soon..

 

[Waiting on him]

I come in the volume of the book!

 

[Ziggy]

Many good questions @Ziggy, have a look at this
Luke 1:28 KJV

So, I see this "outside the box" so bare with me.

This angel, is a messenger. This messenger is a son of God. Not "the" son of God, but one of many messengers, like a prophet or perhaps a priest, that has come to Mary to give her the good news.

Jesus says in heaven there is neither male nor female. This means to me, that when interpreting the bible the same rules apply to either gender.
Instead of reading the nexr few versus seeing men, try seeing women instead:

Dan 1:3 And the king spake unto Ashpenaz the master of his eunuchs, that he should bring certain of the children of Israel, and of the king's seed, and of the princes;
Dan 1:4 Children in whom was no blemish, but well favoured, and skilful in all wisdom, and cunning in knowledge, and understanding science, and such as had ability in them to stand in the king's palace, and whom they might teach the learning and the tongue of the Chaldeans.
Dan 1:5 And the king appointed them a daily provision of the king's meat, and of the wine which he drank: so nourishing them three years, that at the end thereof they might stand before the king.

I believe the history of Mary is that her parents gave her over to the syngogue for the service of the church.
So Mary spent some time of her youth growing up among the priesthood.
When she began to become of age a husband was found for her, Joseph.
They were engaged to be married but not yet wed.

During these years Mary would have been taught in the ways of the priesthood. She would have had access to the Torah and the scriptures.
She would be unblemished, well favoured, skilful in wisdom and in knowledge, she would also be privy to science (yesterdays science, perhaps astrology, how to read the signs of the times and such) .
And yet not fully learned because she didn't understand what the message being sent meant.
Kind of like Saul/Paul.

The Bible interprets what a son of God is:
Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Gabriel is an intriguing character. The Bible calls him an angel and a man.

Dan 9:20 And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God;
Dan 9:21 Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation.
Dan 9:22 And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding.
Dan 9:23 At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth, and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision.

Luk 1:26 And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,
Luk 1:27 To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary.
Luk 1:28 And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
Luk 1:29 And when she saw him, she was troubled at his saying, and cast in her mind what manner of salutation this should be.
Luk 1:30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God.
Luk 1:31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
Luk 1:32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
Luk 1:33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.
Luk 1:34 Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?
Luk 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.

and herein lies the question:

Genesis 6:4 KJV
[4] There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

I have a really hard time wrapping my head around a virgin birth. A literal birth.
Gabriel came to tell Mary she was going to get pregnant and it wasn't going to be Joseph.
And although this goes against all fundamental christian theology and beliefs, I believe Mary was impregnated by
Caiaphas.

Mat 26:3 Then assembled together the chief priests, and the scribes, and the elders of the people, unto the palace of the high priest, who was called Caiaphas,

Man is a fascinating creature. A little power goes to their head when their "integrity" and "righteousness" is challenged.

Mar 14:60 And the high priest stood up in the midst, and asked Jesus, saying, Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee?
Mar 14:61 But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
Mar 14:62 And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
Mar 14:63 Then the high priest rent his clothes, and saith, What need we any further witnesses?
Mar 14:64 Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.

It was Caiaphas who came up with the idea that it would be Jesus who would be sacrificed for the nation.

Jhn 18:14 Now Caiaphas was he, which gave counsel to the Jews, that it was expedient that one man should die for the people.

Show me in the OT where God requires human sacrifice for his people.

I believe Caiaphas the High Priest got Mary pregnant. But the spirit within Jesus came from God.
Caiaphas sitting on the "throne" in no way could be found out to be the father. Thinking David and Bathsheba here.
So he decided to hide his own sin, he would have Jesus killed to save his own arse.
When Jesus was asked if he was the Son of the Blessed, he didn't lie, because Caiaphas considered himself as High Priest the Blessed one.
Caiaphas would not be unthroned by an illigetimate son.

But we know that what man devises for evil, God turns into a blessing:
Gen 50:20 But as for you, ye thought evil against me; but God meant it unto good, to bring to pass, as it is this day, to save much people alive.

cont:

 

[Ziggy]

I believe in miracles. Spiritual miracles. How God can make a path where things fall into place like clockwork regardless who throws stumbling blocks in the path.
Healing is internal which manifests itself externally. Like praying for someone to get well.
It is the spirit that heals. The body alone is helpless.

The woman caught in adultery, they wanted to stone her. But the law requires both man and woman be stoned.
Where was the man?
Now Joseph when he came to take Mary as his wife, she was found with child.
She was betrothed to Joseph and by the law should have been stoned.
And yet the "angel" told Joseph to keep her. Because that which was in her was most "Holy"
The Jews even accused Jesus of being a child of fornication.
Where would they get such thoughts if Joseph married Mary before she had the child?
Why wouldn't they just accept Joseph as the father?
Who told them Jesus was born out of wedlock?

Who told thee thou wast naked?

Sometimes we live in a world full of naivety. It's truly difficult to imagine what a criminal mind actually looks like.
We like to believe the best in all people. And willing to blindly look the other way instead of facing the truth.
Jesus Christ is God's son. Not because of any earthly seed, but the spiritual seed of faith God planted in him.

The body died because it was carnal and was conceived in sin.
But the Spirit within the man was pure and holy and good.

The only other explanation is that God impregnated Mary while she was betrothed to Joseph.
Is God a fornicator? Did God commit adultery?
No.
But somebody did.

I don't mean for this to be offensive to anyone,
It's what I believe.

Hugs

 

[Waiting on him]

I believe in miracles. Spiritual miracles. How God can make a path where things fall into place like clockwork regardless who throws stumbling blocks in the path.
Healing is internal which manifests itself externally. Like praying for someone to get well.
It is the spirit that heals. The body alone is helpless.

The woman caught in adultery, they wanted to stone her. But the law requires both man and woman be stoned.
Where was the man?
Now Joseph when he came to take Mary as his wife, she was found with child.
She was betrothed to Joseph and by the law should have been stoned.
And yet the "angel" told Joseph to keep her. Because that which was in her was most "Holy"
The Jews even accused Jesus of being a child of fornication.
Where would they get such thoughts if Joseph married Mary before she had the child?
Why wouldn't they just accept Joseph as the father?
Who told them Jesus was born out of wedlock?

Who told thee thou wast naked?

Sometimes we live in a world full of naivety. It's truly difficult to imagine what a criminal mind actually looks like.
We like to believe the best in all people. And willing to blindly look the other way instead of facing the truth.
Jesus Christ is God's son. Not because of any earthly seed, but the spiritual seed of faith God planted in him.

The body died because it was carnal and was conceived in sin.
But the Spirit within the man was pure and holy and good.

The only other explanation is that God impregnated Mary while she was betrothed to Joseph.
Is God a fornicator? Did God commit adultery?
No.
But somebody did.

I don't mean for this to be offensive to anyone,
It's what I believe.

Hugs

I’m not offended in the least, Paul tells Timothy to not listen to all the fables and endless genealogies.

 

[Waiting on him]

I believe in miracles. Spiritual miracles. How God can make a path where things fall into place like clockwork regardless who throws stumbling blocks in the path.
Healing is internal which manifests itself externally. Like praying for someone to get well.
It is the spirit that heals. The body alone is helpless.

The woman caught in adultery, they wanted to stone her. But the law requires both man and woman be stoned.
Where was the man?
Now Joseph when he came to take Mary as his wife, she was found with child.
She was betrothed to Joseph and by the law should have been stoned.
And yet the "angel" told Joseph to keep her. Because that which was in her was most "Holy"
The Jews even accused Jesus of being a child of fornication.
Where would they get such thoughts if Joseph married Mary before she had the child?
Why wouldn't they just accept Joseph as the father?
Who told them Jesus was born out of wedlock?

Who told thee thou wast naked?

Sometimes we live in a world full of naivety. It's truly difficult to imagine what a criminal mind actually looks like.
We like to believe the best in all people. And willing to blindly look the other way instead of facing the truth.
Jesus Christ is God's son. Not because of any earthly seed, but the spiritual seed of faith God planted in him.

The body died because it was carnal and was conceived in sin.
But the Spirit within the man was pure and holy and good.

The only other explanation is that God impregnated Mary while she was betrothed to Joseph.
Is God a fornicator? Did God commit adultery?
No.
But somebody did.

I don't mean for this to be offensive to anyone,
It's what I believe.

Hugs

Which brings up my second question. Why all the genealogy of Joseph in the book of Matthew?

 

[Waiting on him]

There had to have been countless documents in the temple as a testament to who everyones baby daddy was. Though at the time none of I could have been proved.

 

[Jim B]

Which brings up my second question. Why all the genealogy of Joseph in the book of Matthew?

Because one's ancestry was extremely import to the Jewish culture.

 

[Waiting on him]

Did Gabriel also pay a visit to Elizabeth?

 

[Ziggy]

Which brings up my second question. Why all the genealogy of Joseph in the book of Matthew?

So that makes me think of Boaz and Ruth.
And yet it was Naomi that claimed Obed was her lineage and not of the Moabites that Ruth came from.

Rth 4:16 And Naomi took the child, and laid it in her bosom, and became nurse unto it.
Rth 4:17 And the women her neighbours gave it a name, saying, There is a son born to Naomi; and they called his name Obed: he is the father of Jesse, the father of David.

Joseph raised Jesus (nursed him) until Joseph is no longer in the picture.
So who is Caiaphas?
Joseph ben Caiaphas (/ˈkaɪ.ə.fəs/; c. 14 BC – c. 46 AD[1]), known simply as Caiaphas (Hebrew: יוֹסֵף בַּר קַיָּפָא, romanized: Yōsēf bar Qayyāfā; Koinē Greek: Καϊάφας, romanized: Kaïáphas [ka.iˈa.ɸas]) in the New Testament, was the Jewish high priest who, according to the gospels, organized a plot to kill Jesus. He famously presided over the Sanhedrin trial of Jesus.[2] The primary sources for Caiaphas' life are the New Testament, and the writings of Josephus. Josephus records that he was made high priest by the Roman procurator Valerius Gratus after Simon ben Camithus had been deposed.

The Babylonian Talmud (Yevamot 15B) gives the family name as Kuppai, while the Jerusalem Talmud (Yevamot 1:6) mentions Nekifi. The Mishnah, Parah 3:5, refers to the family name as hakKof (perhaps "the Monkey", a play on his name for opposing the Pharisees).[4]

The family name Caiaphas קַיָּפָה has three possible origins:[citation needed]

• from קוּפָּה 'basket', 'tub', verbalized as קִיֵּף , whence קַיָּף meaning 'basket maker', or a worker utilizing baskets such as to sell spices
• "as comely" in Aramaic
• a "dell", or a "depression" in Akkadian.

Political implications[edit]
Caiaphas was the son-in-law of Annas by marriage to his daughter and ruled longer than any high priest in New Testament times. For Jewish leaders of the time, there were serious concerns about Roman rule and an insurgent Zealot movement to eject the Romans from Israel. The Romans would not perform executions for violations of Halakha, therefore a charge of blasphemy would not have mattered to Pilate. Caiaphas' position, therefore, was to establish that Jesus was guilty not only of blasphemy, but also of proclaiming himself to be the Messiah, which was understood as the return of the Davidic kingship.

According to Josephus, Caiaphas was appointed in AD 18 by the Roman prefect Valerius Gratus[2] who preceded Pontius Pilate.

According to John, Caiaphas was the son-in-law of the high priest Annas, who is widely identified with Ananus the son of Seth, mentioned by Josephus.[15] Annas was deposed after the death of Augustus, but had five sons who served as high priest after him. The terms of Annas, Caiaphas, and the five brothers are:

• Ananus (or Annas) the son of Seth (6–15)

• Eleazar the son of Ananus (16–17)
• Caiaphas, properly called Joseph son of Caiaphas (18–36/37), who had married the daughter of Annas (John 18:13)
• Jonathan the son of Ananus (spring 37)
• Theophilus ben Ananus (37–41)
• Matthias ben Ananus (43)
• Ananus ben Ananus (63)

So when considering the lineage of Joseph...
Luk 3:38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

I suppose lineage is to determine proof of "heirhood" to the throne, or legitimize coming from God himself.
Although I believe all people come from God, but this is the way the Jews could keep their heritage??

So why was the genealogy of Joseph important?
Interesting to note that Caiaphas' name was also Joseph...
just making an observation.. interesting though.
What happened to Joseph who was betrothed to Mary after the scene at the temple when Jesus said he must be about "his father's" business?
Hugs

 

[Ziggy]

Did Gabriel also pay a visit to Elizabeth?

He paid a visit to Zacharais in the temple and told him the Elizabeth would also be with child.

 

[Ziggy]

Did Gabriel also pay a visit to Elizabeth?

Which really makes me think about how John came about.
Zacharias was in the temple praying. He notices an "angel" who calls himself Gabriel.
Gabriel tells Zacharias that Elizabeth is going to have a son.
Due to some unbelief, seeing Elizabeth was way past her prime, the angel made Zacharias dumb like a mule, until the day of his birth.
So we're not going to talk about it.. see?
Mums the word.

I also understand how some people can read the bible walking away thinking what a bunch of fables and stories.
Because on the surface it just don't make sense to the rational mind.
Like Sarah having a child in her 90's. I believe the word "concieved" means so much more than getting pregnant.
It's what's conceived in the mind.
I understand the bible to be a book that is constructed not on material facts but spiritual truth.
And if your looking at the shell (carnal knowledge) you won't see the seed (spiritual understanding) in it.

I have no problem with science and the big bang, that man evolved from the elements of the earth.
I have no problem with literal giants or even a great flood.
But it's what is written between the lines that most people miss.
The truth is in the spaces between the ink.

Hugs

 

[Webers_Home]

.

Why all the genealogy of Joseph in the book of Matthew?

Jesus' mom was informed that her son would be given David's throne. (Luke
1:32)

David's throne is restricted to his posterity. (Ps 89:4)

David's son Solomon was first in line. (1Chron 22:9-10)

So then, in order to qualify for David's throne, potential candidates have to
be related to both David and Solomon.

Jesus was related to David thru his mother (Rom 1:3) But the throne doesn't
pass down to David's posterity via their mothers.

The genealogy in Matthew certifies that Joseph is related to Solomon and it
also certifies that Jesus is related to Joseph.

FAQ: Jesus was virgin-conceived. How then is he related to Joseph?

REPLY: By means of adoption; which is a process that gives fatherless kids
the right to a man's name, plus just as much right to inheritance as the
man's natural progeny.

* Jacob set a precedence for adoption back in the 48th chapter of Genesis
when he took Joseph's two sons Manasseh and Ephraim to be his own, thus
giving them a status as tribal heads equal to Jacob's original twelve.
_

 

[Bob Estey]

Why does Matthew use this scripture from the 8th century Old Testament text in reference to the birth of Christ?

Because, I believe, Jesus is God in flesh - "God with us."