"As" a thief

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Trekson

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Here is a list of the verses that are known as a “thief in the night” verse. Many use these in their argument for a pre-trib rapture or the theology of imminence regarding the timing of the return of the Lord. If the focus of these verses were a message to “watch for Christ” then several generations were practicing the ultimate exercise in futility because we know He won’t return until the signs we are given are fulfilled. More after these verses:

Matt. 24:42-44 – “Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. 43 But know this, that if the good man of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. 44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.”

Luke 12:39-40 – “And this know, that if the good man of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. 40 Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.”

John 10:10 – “The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.”

1 Thessalonians 5:2
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.”

1 Thessalonians 5:4
But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.”

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.”

Revelation 3:3
Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.”

Revelation 16:15
Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.”

For those who care, I’ve explained in another post about Rev. 16:15, just scroll down in the topics in this category and you’ll find it.

However, I believe the message these verses are teaching isn’t to “watch” for Christ. It is to “watch” out for our souls. Consider these verses:

Matt. 26:41 – “Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.”

1 Cor. 16:13 – “Watch ye, stand fast in the faith, quit you like men, be strong.”

2 Tim. 4:5 – “But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.”

1 Pet. 4:7-9 – “But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer. 8 And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins. 9 Use hospitality one to another without grudging.”

These verses tell us in what manner we are to ‘watch”. I’ve heard many preachers who, in their misplaced zeal venture into what I call “fear-mongering evangelism” who portray Christ as a vengeful God who is just waiting to catch the most believers off guard then swoop in and rapture the “most holy” and while returning to heaven laugh gleefully and holler out, “suffer my wrath and tribulation, losers”. This is just so wrong, that words cannot describe my distaste for this style of preaching. Perhaps this passage sums it up best:

Luke 12:42-46 – “And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season? 43 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 44 Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath. 45 But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken; 46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.”

So the message isn’t to “watch” for Christ, it is to “watch” over our souls and to never get weary in well doing. Just, generally living the Christian life as best as we can with God’s help.
 

Born_Again

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I would have to agree. That would be very taxiing to be afraid of God's wrath on a daily basis... I watch over my soul not only because it is as the Lord commanded but it is also for my own good. If you stray... you dont want that day to happen to be the same day that is your last in whatever form.....

As a theif can cover all of your life... Keeping watch on your soul also keeps you from doing evil, in any aspect. The message... Live for the Lord!!! Pretty cut and dry!!
 

Retrobyter

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Shalom, Trekson.

Trekson said:
Here is a list of the verses that are known as a “thief in the night” verse. Many use these in their argument for a pre-trib rapture or the theology of imminence regarding the timing of the return of the Lord. If the focus of these verses were a message to “watch for Christ” then several generations were practicing the ultimate exercise in futility because we know He won’t return until the signs we are given are fulfilled. More after these verses:

Matt. 24:42-44 – “Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. 43 But know this, that if the good man of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. 44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.”

Luke 12:39-40 – “And this know, that if the good man of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. 40 Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.”

John 10:10 – “The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.”

1 Thessalonians 5:2
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.”

1 Thessalonians 5:4
But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.”

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.”

Revelation 3:3
Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.”

Revelation 16:15
Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.”

For those who care, I’ve explained in another post about Rev. 16:15, just scroll down in the topics in this category and you’ll find it.

However, I believe the message these verses are teaching isn’t to “watch” for Christ. It is to “watch” out for our souls. Consider these verses:

Matt. 26:41 – “Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.”

1 Cor. 16:13 – “Watch ye, stand fast in the faith, quit you like men, be strong.”

2 Tim. 4:5 – “But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.”

1 Pet. 4:7-9 – “But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer. 8 And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins. 9 Use hospitality one to another without grudging.”

These verses tell us in what manner we are to ‘watch”. I’ve heard many preachers who, in their misplaced zeal venture into what I call “fear-mongering evangelism” who portray Christ as a vengeful God who is just waiting to catch the most believers off guard then swoop in and rapture the “most holy” and while returning to heaven laugh gleefully and holler out, “suffer my wrath and tribulation, losers”. This is just so wrong, that words cannot describe my distaste for this style of preaching. Perhaps this passage sums it up best:

Luke 12:42-46 – “And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season? 43 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 44 Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath. 45 But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken; 46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.”

So the message isn’t to “watch” for Christ, it is to “watch” over our souls and to never get weary in well doing. Just, generally living the Christian life as best as we can with God’s help.
Did you know that there’s an alternative view of Revelation 16:15? It’s really quite eloquent:

Have you ever wondered why verse 15 is placed where it is in Revelation? Look at the context:

Revelation 16:12-16
12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon (Har Megiddown , the “Mountain or Hill of Megiddow," in Hebrew).
KJV


Doesn’t this seem somewhat out of place? It would if you are thinking that this has to do with “Christians” or believers! It doesn’t! It has to do with His ENEMIES! They - the "kings of the earth and of the whole world" - have been convinced to gather to the battle of the great day of El Elyon! What chance do they have of winning? So, what does the Messiah do prior to that battle? HE STEALS THEIR CLOTHES, POSSIBLY INCLUDING THEIR EQUIPMENT! The word “blessed” means “happy” and is treated like we use the words “fortunate” and “lucky.” It comes from the same root as “bliss.” They’re going to be gathered to Har Megiddown, but wouldn’t it be better to go into a battle with something to wear?! How ridiculous would it be to try to fight a battle in your underwear?! The Messiah is simply trying to keep them OUT of the battle by stealing their clothes while they sleep! It’s a JOKE of humorous irony!
 

boldncourageous

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Dec 6, 2014
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Trekson said:
Here is a list of the verses that are known as a “thief in the night” verse. Many use these in their argument for a pre-trib rapture or the theology of imminence regarding the timing of the return of the Lord. If the focus of these verses were a message to “watch for Christ” then several generations were practicing the ultimate exercise in futility because we know He won’t return until the signs we are given are fulfilled. More after these verses:

Matt. 24:42-44 – “Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. 43 But know this, that if the good man of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. 44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.”

Luke 12:39-40 – “And this know, that if the good man of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. 40 Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.”

John 10:10 – “The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.”

1 Thessalonians 5:2
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.”

1 Thessalonians 5:4
But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.”

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.”

Revelation 3:3
Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.”

Revelation 16:15
Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.”

For those who care, I’ve explained in another post about Rev. 16:15, just scroll down in the topics in this category and you’ll find it.

However, I believe the message these verses are teaching isn’t to “watch” for Christ. It is to “watch” out for our souls. Consider these verses:

Matt. 26:41 – “Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.”

1 Cor. 16:13 – “Watch ye, stand fast in the faith, quit you like men, be strong.”

2 Tim. 4:5 – “But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.”

1 Pet. 4:7-9 – “But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer. 8 And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins. 9 Use hospitality one to another without grudging.”

These verses tell us in what manner we are to ‘watch”. I’ve heard many preachers who, in their misplaced zeal venture into what I call “fear-mongering evangelism” who portray Christ as a vengeful God who is just waiting to catch the most believers off guard then swoop in and rapture the “most holy” and while returning to heaven laugh gleefully and holler out, “suffer my wrath and tribulation, losers”. This is just so wrong, that words cannot describe my distaste for this style of preaching. Perhaps this passage sums it up best:

Luke 12:42-46 – “And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season? 43 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 44 Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath. 45 But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken; 46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.”

So the message isn’t to “watch” for Christ, it is to “watch” over our souls and to never get weary in well doing. Just, generally living the Christian life as best as we can with God’s help.
I totally agree with your interpretation of "watch"

The "as a thief..." issue remains a serious one for the pretrib view. Serious problem attempting to separate the rapture from the second coming. Which "as a thief.." verses pertain to the rapture and which ones pertain to the second coming. For the pretrib view to stand ALL of the verses must pertain to the first event, because it would announce and declare the second. We can't have Jesus being a liar in the nature in which he declared how he would return for the second coming.

Problem the Rev. 3:3 to the church of Sardis (rapture) is the same message to the same people at the end.... Rev. 16:15 (second coming). Oops, the church is addressed after Rev. 4:1.
 

Trekson

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Hi Retro, Sorry if you felt ignored, but what you wrote was too silly to be taken seriously.