"Before Abraham Was, I AM"

[GodsGrace]

Why is the power of sin the law?
You said the catechism of the catholic church is correct. That stated break one of the commands you break them all.

The Catechism is repeating what James stated:


James 2:10
10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all.

If your justification hinges on obeying them, an example:
A young teenager who has just reached puberty believes they must obey the TC to remain justified in God's sight. Before them stands the tenth commandment:
Thou shalt not covet/thou shalt not desire what is not yours to desire/thou shalt not lust/thou shalt not dwell on any impure thought. What will the young teenager think?
''''I must not lust, I must not dwell on any impure thought, I don't want to go to hell, I must not have impure thoughts''
What do you think will be the result? Can you escape thinking of what you fear, or will thoughts of what you fear consume you? What would you fear more than being cast into hell? The more you fear the more you concentrate on what you fear
Hence: The power of sin is the law
And it is biblical, In Rom7:7-11 Paul is speaking of the time the law came to him, as a thirteen year old when he made a commitment to God:
Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet/one of the Ten Commandmants.

8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead. 7&8

There is n o watered down version of the TC in the bible, only the true version!

You do not reply to my posts.....
I do wonder why.

 

[GodsGrace]

You didnt answer my question, please answer it first. If you believed you had no justification as a christian of obeying the moral law, would you then go out and happily sin as much as you like?

saved,,,you've ignored quite a few of my posts to you, but demand that I reply to each one of yours.
It works both ways in case you haven't noticed.

So my conversation with you is over.

 

[GodsGrace]

Those filled with the Spirit do live precisely as they please; in obedience to God.

Very poetic replies.

IF someone lives in obedience to God...
sinning will be held to a minimum and God's laws will live in the heart of the person.

Those who do NOT obey God are most probably not saved although it's not for me to say.

Some believe that they get saved and then no matter what they do, their salvation is still assured.

THIS is NOT what the NT teaches and this should be made very clear to anyone reading along.

Jesus said:

Matthew 7:21
21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.

 

[GodsGrace]

Those filled with the Spirit do live precisely as they please; in obedience to God.

I think we should stop with this poetic writing.

IF we wish to be saved,,,we MUST live according to the commandments and rules Jesus left us with.
Whether we enjoy it or not, whether we agree with the rules or not.

John 3:36
36 "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."


It is possible to be disobedient to the Son.
Those will not see life but the wrath of God.

 

[GodsGrace]

Obedience to God is not only part of salvation, but the very indication of it.

Then let's be very clear for those reading along.
If we are not obedient...we will not be saved.


2 timothy 4:3
3For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions,

 

[GodsGrace]

I got your answer then to mean, no, judging from the inferences I gathered on this subject from your posts. Thanks

Where are the post numbers that say what YOU THINK I said?

You should not INFER anything...
but just read and understand what members are saying.

This is probably the same reason you cannot understand scripture.

 

[saved by grace 101]

saved,,,you've ignored quite a few of my posts to you, but demand that I reply to each one of yours.
It works both ways in case you haven't noticed.

So my conversation with you is over.

If we are going to be honest, I've been addressing your posts constantly, but you refuse to answer the one question I asked you, so it isn't me that wouldn't respond to you as all can see. So yes, as you cannot even answer one question put to you the conversation is over

 

[saved by grace 101]

You contend to limit the power of God, saying what He cannot do. Neither John nor I say such.

Jeremiah 32:17-19 details the God of Whom I speak:

17 ‘Ah, Lord God! It is you who have made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm! Nothing is too hard for you.
18 You show steadfast love to thousands, but you repay the guilt of fathers to their children after them, O great and mighty God, whose name is the LORD of hosts,
19 great in counsel and mighty in deed, whose eyes are open to all the ways of the children of man, rewarding each one according to his ways and according to the fruit of his deeds.

I say I am forgiven and God smiles upon me as He guides me morning to morning.

What God tells me is very clear and easy to understand. I try to share it, but it makes sense how Jesus spoke truth to everyone and they were usually amazed or furious.

You really see yourself among the Disciples and not the crowd? I was in the crowd until only recently. I had to reject everything the crowds believe to see the truth.

Maybe you think John contended to limited the power of God too, saying what he cannot do, as John testified he was not sinless. Im afraid Pat statements on the internet won't get you very far

 

[saved by grace 101]

You contend to limit the power of God, saying what He cannot do. Neither John nor I say such.

Jeremiah 32:17-19 details the God of Whom I speak:

17 ‘Ah, Lord God! It is you who have made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm! Nothing is too hard for you.
18 You show steadfast love to thousands, but you repay the guilt of fathers to their children after them, O great and mighty God, whose name is the LORD of hosts,
19 great in counsel and mighty in deed, whose eyes are open to all the ways of the children of man, rewarding each one according to his ways and according to the fruit of his deeds.

I say I am forgiven and God smiles upon me as He guides me morning to morning.

What God tells me is very clear and easy to understand. I try to share it, but it makes sense how Jesus spoke truth to everyone and they were usually amazed or furious.

You really see yourself among the Disciples and not the crowd? I was in the crowd until only recently. I had to reject everything the crowds believe to see the truth.

Here’s a sample list of what it would take to obey the TC, Christ’s teaching and the second greatest commandment and avoid sin. Remember, not one slip up, or you fail to achieve sinless perfection:



Let’s start with the Ten Commandments:

Do you ever put anything before God in your life?

Do you ever build any graven images in your mind?

Do you always honour your parents without exception.

Have you ever looked at a woman with lust in your eye? (Jesus ratified the commandment)

Have you ever fibbed about anyone, or been untruthful about a person in anyway?

Have you dwelt on any impure thought?

Do you ever desire ANYTHING of your neighbours, whether material goods or a member of their household?

Do you fully obey the law relating to the inner man, the law only you and God need know you break?

Jesus commands:

If someone asked to lend from you would you gladly lend to them without ever expecting anything back?

If someone stole from you, would you offer them more than what they stole with nothing but love in your heart for them?

Do you not invite friends or family home for a meal, but rather the poor, blind, lame and beggars?

If you have ever fasted, have you even hinted to anyone you are fasting?

Do you truly in your heart love your enemies, those who may malign, harass or persecute you?

Do you leap for joy if you are persecuted?

Second greatest commandment

Do you always truly love all those you come into contact with in thought, word or deed, constantly, including our enemies, those who may be unkind to us, persecute or harass us?



All examples of what it takes to obey the TC, Christ’s teaching and the second greatest commandment.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Paul said you die to the law, that is not what your catechism stated, just the opposite. So your continued justification does not hinge on obeying the TC?

Nope.

Start a new thread and I’ll explain it to you again – in more detail . . .

 

[saved by grace 101]

Nope.

Start a new thread and I’ll explain it to you again – in more detail . . .

'''so that all men may attain salvation through faith, Baptism and the observance of the Commandments.”

Well the above is straight out of one of your catechisms.

 

[saved by grace 101]

Nope.

Start a new thread and I’ll explain it to you again – in more detail . . .

'''The Council of Trent teaches that the Ten Commandments are obligatory for Christians and that the justified man is still bound to keep them''''
And what does that mean? If you do not do what you are bound to do you will remain justified anyway?

 

[GodsGrace]

'''so that all men may attain salvation through faith, Baptism and the observance of the Commandments.”

Well the above is straight out of one of your catechisms.

Pretty funny saved !!
God's word...which you don't seem to understand.....
states that we MUST be baptized,,,we MUST obey the commandments,,,and we MUST, of course, HAVE FAITH.

But I leave you in the capable hands of @BreadOfLife .... who is capable of much more patience than I am.

 

[saved by grace 101]

Pretty funny saved !!
God's word...which you don't seem to understand.....
states that we MUST be baptized,,,we MUST obey the commandments,,,and we MUST, of course, HAVE FAITH.

But I leave you in the capable hands of @BreadOfLife .... who is capable of much more patience than I am.

You had to deflect, I understand, because you were afraid to answer just one question.

 

[saved by grace 101]

Pretty funny saved !!
God's word...which you don't seem to understand.....
states that we MUST be baptized,,,we MUST obey the commandments,,,and we MUST, of course, HAVE FAITH.

But I leave you in the capable hands of @BreadOfLife .... who is capable of much more patience than I am.

You mean we MUST obey the commandments you constantly transgress. How does that work?

 

[GodsGrace]

'''The Council of Trent teaches that the Ten Commandments are obligatory for Christians and that the justified man is still bound to keep them''''
And what does that mean? If you do not do what you are bound to do you will remain justified anyway?

You must have missed John 3:36....

And many other verses
Matthew 7:21 is a great one.
Matthew 7:26-27 too.
Matthew 24 is great.
and so many more.

May God have mercy on you for destroying His teachings.

 

[XtraPercept]

Very poetic replies.

All glory to God; I am blessed.

I think we should stop with this poetic writing.

I will not; it stems from my faith.

Then let's be very clear for those reading along.
If we are not obedient...we will not be saved.

You are correct; but you don't see how it actually works for not understanding "saved" or "obedient" as expressed and taught by the Apostles.

Maybe you think John contended to limited the power of God too, saying what he cannot do, as John testified he was not sinless. Im afraid Pat statements on the internet won't get you very far

John said "All things through Him were created, and without Him, not one thing was made that was made," in the most literal interpretation of the Greek to English. That's at the start of his Gospel.

He knew Jesus personally. He did not attempt to limit the power of God as you do.

Here’s a sample list of what it would take to obey the TC, Christ’s teaching and the second greatest commandment and avoid sin. Remember, not one slip up, or you fail to achieve sinless perfection:

See, you still argue the wrong point entirely! You can't see from John's perspective.

I am not perfect. I sin. Always have, and am likely to continue until my resurrection, albeit to an ever diminishing extent for learning what the Spirit is teaching me. Teaching, present progressive, as in daily.

Shouldn't a lesson learned be reflected somehow?

If you are still battling sin and shame, are the lessons you seek to apply accomplishing your goals?

I'm not perfect, but I have no shame, and I sin a whole lot less than I used to.

 

[saved by grace 101]

You must have missed John 3:36....

And many other verses
Matthew 7:21 is a great one.
Matthew 7:26-27 too.
Matthew 24 is great.
and so many more.

May God have mercy on you for destroying His teachings.

Go on, take a deep breathe and make the plunge. If you thought your continued justification did not depend on you obeying the Ten Commandments, would you then feel entitled to happily sin as much as you like?
Maybe you don't know the answer, or are concerned at giving it

 

[GodsGrace]

All glory to God; I am blessed.



I will not; it stems from my faith.



You are correct; but you don't see how it actually works for not understanding "saved" or "obedient" as expressed and taught by the Apostles.

YOU don't know if I know how it works.
It's wonderful how new members think they know everyone on a board.

I do agree with the rest of what you've written to the other member.

John said "All things through Him were created, and without Him, not one thing was made that was made," in the most literal interpretation of the Greek to English. That's at the start of his Gospel.

He knew Jesus personally. He did not attempt to limit the power of God as you do.



See, you still argue the wrong point entirely! You can't see from John's perspective.

I am not perfect. I sin. Always have, and am likely to continue until my resurrection, albeit to an ever diminishing extent for learning what the Spirit is teaching me. Teaching, present progressive, as in daily.

Shouldn't a lesson learned be reflected somehow?

If you are still battling sin and shame, are the lessons you seek to apply accomplishing your goals?

I'm not perfect, but I have no shame, and I sin a whole lot less than I used to.

 

[saved by grace 101]

I am not perfect. I sin. Always have, and am likely to continue until my resurrection, albeit to an ever diminishing extent for learning what the Spirit is teaching me. Teaching, present progressive, as in daily.

So you don't expect to attain to sinless perfection on this earth. That would agree with what I have stated