Biblical Mary

[Wrangler]

All the Lords in Luke 1 are God. That is all I am focussing on.

Time for you to stop dissembling and answer my post.

While that is your dogma, that is not the actual text. Mary is the mother of Lord Jesus, not God. It's a sin to go beyond the word of God.

 

[David in NJ]

As a former Catholic myself I say this: RUN to Jesus and Jesus alone -"Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is no other name under heaven given amongst men whereby we MUST be saved" Acts 4:12

"Come out of her my people lest you receive of her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues." Revelations 18:1-4

 

[BreadOfLife]

Really?
So small everything has to fit in your box or it's ignorant.
Pfff!

No, I calls'em as I sees'em - and YOU are wrong about the "title" of the Pope.

Some would disagree and call them Wise.

Except that Christ's Church is Called:
The Holy Temple in the Lord...(Eph 2:19)
...not Catholic

Except that Christ's Church is built upon the foundation of :
Christ, the Chief corner stone, the Apostles and prophets....(Eph 2:20)
...not only a Catholics Peter.

Except that Members of Christ's Church are lifetime Members, fellowcitizens in the Household of God....(Eph 2:19)
...not kicked out, called names, like Catholics do.

Except that foundation, fellowcitizens, are bound Forever by the rock that:
Jesus IS the Christ the Son of the Living God
(Matt 16:16 / John 20:31)
....not Simon Peter or a succession of Roman Bishops.

Except that Scripture is expressly sufficient for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. (2 Tim 3:16)
...not Catholics quoting philosophies of other Catholics...and the "persecuters" badmouthing men who put their Trust in Scirpture.

* True that...your Catholic Church has a standing of it's own...apart from Christ Jesus.
* Wise some Catholic men do not fall for all the official Chruch's goopy standing positions.

- Except that Christ's Church IS Catholic (Acts 9:31)
- Except that this Catholic church of His was given ALL Authority in Heaven AND earth (Matt. 18:16-18, Matt. 18:15-18, Luke 10:16, John 16:12-15, John 20:21-23)
- Except that we are ONLY lifetime members of His Church IF we cooperate with His grace (Matt. 7:19-23, Matt. 10:22, Matt. 24:13, Matt. 25:31–46, John 15:1-6, Rom. 11:22, 1 Cor. 4:4, 1 Cor. 9:27, 1 Cor. 10:12, 1 Tim. 4:1, 1 Tim. 4:16, 2 Tim. 2:12, Heb. 3:6, Heb. 3:12-14, Heb. 6:4-6, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Pet. 2:20-21, 2 Pet. 3:17, 1 John 2:24, 1 John 5:13, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19)
- Except that (2 Tim 3:16) DOES NOT say that Scripture is "sufficient" - but "PROFITABLE" for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness
- Except that the "Rock" (Kepha) in Matt. 16:18 is PETER - not Jesus

STUDY your Bible - don't just quote it . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Deception always appears to be fun for you...

Instead of hiding behind Scriptural references....
Quote the Scripture that says:
"Sinless Mary"

As soon as YOU give me the quotes for "Faith ALONE" and "Scripture ALONE" . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Well if they are repudiating heresy, then they may be heretics to those holding the heresy, but not heretics in the eyes of God and His Inspired Word.
And it was their Roman Catholic beliefs specifically that they repudiated- especially Popery!

HUH???

Do you even understand what heresy is??
Do you know what a heretic is??

your arguments are childish - not "child-like" with all of its perceived innocence.
Childish, as in stupid and NOT well-thought-out.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Well your ignorance of the SCriptures are showing. The Bible doesn't declare as to the why Jesus handed over Mary's care to John, just that He did.

But as to Mary having other children:

Matthew 12:
47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.
48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?
49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!
50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

Mark 6
King James Version
6 And he went out from thence, and came into his own country; and his disciples follow him.
2 And when the sabbath day was come, he began to teach in the synagogue: and many hearing him were astonished, saying, From whence hath this man these things? and what wisdom is this which is given unto him, that even such mighty works are wrought by his hands?
3 Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon? and are not his sisters here with us? And they were offended at him.

Matthew 13:54-56
King James Version

54 And when he was come into his own country, he taught them in their synagogue, insomuch that they were astonished, and said, Whence hath this man this wisdom, and these mighty works?
55 Is not this the carpenter's son? is not his mother called Mary? and his brethren, James, and Joses, and Simon, and Judas?
56 And his sisters, are they not all with us? Whence then hath this man all these things?

Please don't try the "cousin thig. that doesn't fly linguistically, grammatically, contextually or culturally ! Jesus had at least four brethren and two sisters according to Gods Word!

JOseph and Mary , once Jesus was born, did a lot of knowing each other as a good jewish husband and wife would do according to the law.

ONE more time, Einstein:
WHERE do ANY of these passages make the claim that these are Mary's children??
I've already shown you several verses that show they are the children of ANOTHER woman and man.

And you STILL haven't been able to show me WHY those "other" children of hers couldn't take care of her - and why Jesus "had" to appoint John to do it.
Your "logic" has gaping holes in it . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Well they may have Catholic in their name, but only the roman Catholic church recognizes the Pope as Supreme Pontiff and only the Roman CAtholic church is headquarteredin rome. You can strain at your gnats all you want but everyone knows that the Roman church is ts own sect and though the other Cathooic churches have commonality, they are their own sects with their own leaders and headquarters. YOu may all be in communion with the pope, but each sect has its own leader and none other recognize the pope as the ultimate head.

Yet another idiotic post with idiotic claims made by a guy who doesn't pay attention.

Melkite Catholics submit to the Pope's Authority.
Maronite Catholics submit to the Pope's Authority.
Coptic Catholics submit to the Pope's Authority.
Byzantine Catholics submit to the Pope's Authority.
Ruthenian Catholics submit to the Pope's Authority.
Alexandrian Catholics submit to the Pope's Authority.
As do ALL the rest of the Liturgical Rites that comprise the ONE Catholic Church.

WHAT part of this are you having difficulty with??
I ALMOST feel guilty explaining it to you in this way because it truly seems that you have a serious learning disability.

If that is the case - then I apologize for being abrupt.
Perhaps a debate forum is NOT the best place for someone like you to spend your time . . .

 

[Mungo]

While that is your dogma, that is not the actual text. Mary is the mother of Lord Jesus, not God. It's a sin to go beyond the word of God.

Jesus is God

 

[BreadOfLife]

While that is your dogma, that is not the actual text. Mary is the mother of Lord Jesus, not God. It's a sin to go beyond the word of God.

It's ALSO a sin to reject His Word.

Jesus is GOD (Isaiah 7:14, Isaiah 9:6, Matt. 4:7, John 1:1, John 1:3, John 8:58, John 10:30, John 15:9, John 20:28, Acts 5:3-4, 2 Cor. 4:4, Phil. 2:6, Col. 2:9, 1 Tim. 3:16, Heb. 1:8, Titus 2:13).

 

[David in NJ]

While that is your dogma, that is not the actual text. Mary is the mother of Lord Jesus, not God. It's a sin to go beyond the word of God.

Trinity is 100% declared by God (Elohim) in the Bible beginning in Genesis.

 

[David in NJ]

While that is your dogma, that is not the actual text. Mary is the mother of Lord Jesus, not God. It's a sin to go beyond the word of God.

Wrangler, the clear foundation for the Trinity of God(Elohim) starts in Genesis.

The Hebrew word for 'one' in the shemah 'Hear oh Israel the Lord thy God(Elohim) is one(echad)....'
Elohim and Echad are Plural terms denoting two or more.
"Let US make man in Our Image"
I am the Elohim of #1 Abraham #2 Isaac #3 Jacob

 

[Taken]

No, I calls'em as I sees'em - and YOU are wrong about the "title" of the Pope.

Expand your narrow knowledge.

Title -
A title is one or more words used before or after a person's name...

Currently YOUR POPE is a man named:
Jorge Mario Bergoglio, son of Petra Bergoglio, and has assumed the Name "Francis" and "Several Titles", including pope (that your own Church established and ADDED more Titles over the years )

STUDY your Bible - don't just quote it . . .

Learn how to Understand Scripture "According to God," rather than Referencing a Scripture and regurtating a mans Understanding.

 

[Taken]

As soon as YOU give me the quotes for "Faith ALONE" and "Scripture ALONE" . . .

More Deception through Deflection -
You claimed Mary was Sinless...I ask for Scriptures to support your claim...

Like a coward you Deflect and demand I give you something.

Case closed on "your Mary's Sinless claims"...
Zero supportative Scripture.

Truth prevails....
Rom 3:[23] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Truth prevails... ONLY ONE exception
JESUS, "without" Sin...espressly repeated IN Scripture.
1 Pet 2:22
Heb 4:15
1 John 2:5

Glory to God, He Truth prevails.

 

[David in NJ]

More Deception through Deflection -
You claimed Mary was Sinless...I ask for Scriptures to support your claim...

Like a coward you Deflect and demand I give you something.

Case closed on "your Mary's Sinless claims"...
Zero supportative Scripture.

Truth prevails....
Rom 3:[23] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Truth prevails... ONLY ONE exception
JESUS, "without" Sin...espressly repeated IN Scripture.
1 Pet 2:22
Heb 4:15
1 John 2:5

EXCELLENT

Glory to God, He Truth prevails.

 

[Taken]

As a former Catholic myself I can say this: Your picture of the wafer is not Holy and it is not Jesus. It is idolatry.

As a former Catholic I say to you: Escape these doctrines of demons and run into the Grace of Christ - PLEASE Read Ephesians and the Gospel of John. The Catholic church will be burned with fire upon the Lord's Return - the Pope and the Vatican are wolves in sheeps clothing as are many pedophile preists.

I'm right, you're wrong...vain deceit
Catholic Church...philosophies of men
Catholic Church...traditions of men.
Catholic Church...chief authority over women and children, but never being a husband or father.
Catholic Church...pope "holy father"

Col 2: [8] Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Christ's Church;
Holy Temple of the Lord (Eph 2:21)

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Proving my point. Lowercase ‘Lord’ is NOT a synonym for God. Only the capitalized variant is.

So, a Catholic starts off this thread under false pretenses, pretending your doctrine is in the Bible when it is not.

Had the statement been, Mary is the mother of our Lord, I would have agreed all day long.

It's a matter of Understanding Knowledge and changing scripture with that handy word "Therefore".

Jesus, came to earth and left earth;
AS the Son of man.

On earth, Knowledge of Him was revealed;
Son of God, Lord, Master, Teacher, Rabbi, Power /(Christ), Spirit, Sinless, Salvation, True Light, etc.
KNOWING who Jesus IS:
Is one thing.
Changing Scripture via Knowledge and what has NOT YET been MANIFESTED to See...
Is corrupt for man to do.

Christ is the Power of God, no one SEES Gods POWER, only the Reflection of His POWER.

God Eternal, has no mother or father.

Noone will SEE GOD, until they are RISEN UP in "HIS" Likeness.

Correct Jesus IS Lord.
Mary was a temporary earthly mother of our heavenly Lord who came down from Heaven to Earth, to offer mankind Gods Word of Salvation.

 

[Taken]

And no way of coming up with the notion of Immaculate Conception of Mary.

Scripture never speaks of Mary's "CONCEPTION", which would precisely be her 'egg' being fertalized.

She was "CONCEIVED" (pregnant) IN her womb, with a body God prepared FOR His Word, and called His Word a "holy thing" that God sent to her WOMB.
"Immaculate Conception" is a false teaching.
No "conception" occurred!

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Post# 939

How?
Please explain . . .

I’ll let the scriptures explain it to you:

"Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?" (Proverbs 20:9)

"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God" (Romans 3:23)

 

[David in NJ]

I'm right, you're wrong...vain deceit
Catholic Church...philosophies of men
Catholic Church...traditions of men.
Catholic Church...chief authority over women and children, but never being a husband or father.
Catholic Church...pope "holy father"

Col 2: [8] Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Christ's Church;
Holy Temple of the Lord (Eph 2:21)

Glory to God,
Taken

Are you referring to something I said??? There is only One Holy Temple and it is His Body which we who know Him consist as Living Stones built up into a Spiritual House - the House of God. 1 Peter 2: 1-5

 

[Berserk]

It is important to recognize that Catholic mariology is legitimated by the biblical grounds for praying to saints.
Catholic mariology becomes a biblically legitimate biblical option if these 4 truths can be established:
(1) Rev. 6:9-10 implies that the righteous dead remain informed about what is happening to believers on earth.
(2) Hebrews 12:1-2 implies that deceased saints surround spiritual athletes during their life race, cheer them on, and support them.
(3) The report in 2 Maccabees 15:13-15 (attested in Matthew 16:14) is true that Judas Maccabaeus had vision of
Jeremiah praying the Jewish army on to victory over the Greeks, a vision that came true. Note history books don't
have to be divinely inspired to recount historical incidents!
(4) The vision of the exalted Mary in Revelation 12:1-2 uses imagery of the birth of the god Apollo to a goddess mother, persecution from a dragon
and a divinely organized escape to a remote locale. There is no comparable parallel to this imagery in Scripture!
Evangelicals on this site have offered nothing but mindless denials without evidence in their response to (1)-(4).



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