Can angels repent?

[Big Boy Johnson]

Bible Verses about Hell Is Everlasting

Matthew 25:46
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life

Mark 9:47-48
If your eye causes you to stumble, throw it out; it is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye, than, having two eyes, to be cast into hell, where their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched

2 Thessalonians 1:8-9
dealing out retribution to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power

Revelation 14:11
And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Revelation 20:10
And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever

Revelation 20:14
Then death and hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

 

[Bob Estey]

Probably not.

By angels, I mean beings that exist in the spirit realm, including Satan.

Humans cannot directly observe the spirit existence of God. We do have the ability to choose to repent and be redeemed by Christ.

Angels can directly observe the spiritual existence of God. They can see that God exists. Yet, they choose to rebel against God.

Jesus says in Matthew 11:


Angels who see the realities of God and still rebel have no excuse. The Bible does not describe any redemptive plan for such beings. They seem to be incapable of repenting.

Jude 1:


If an angel falls, he is headed for judgment day.

‭‭‭Revelation‬ 20:


Humans are born in a fallen state of affairs, i.e., we cannot observe God directly. We are given a chance to repent. Angelic beings can observe God directly. They should know better. Once fallen, there is no chance to repent. Some humans will judge angels.

What is an angel?

 

[keithr]

No, there's no confusion on my end... that's over at yo house.

Where there's smoke, there's fire. The lake of fire is forever

Whether or not the fire lasts forever is irrelevant - Revelation 20:14 (KJV):

(14) And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.​

If hell will be cast into the lake of fire, then the lake of fire cannot be hell. As Matthew 25:41 (KJV) says:

(41) Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:​

It is the fire that is prepared for the devil and his angels, not hell (sheol/hades).

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Whether or not the fire lasts forever is irrelevant

Jesus said it was everlasting so what Jesus says is hardly irrelevant!

Death, hell, and the grave will all be thrown in to the lake of fire

 

[keithr]

Jesus said it was everlasting so what Jesus says is hardly irrelevant!

I had said that the "everlasting fire" is "prepared for the devil and his angels", not hell (sheol/hades) as you had claimed. You then saying that "The lake of fire is forever" is irrelevant to whether it is "everlasting fire" or hell that was prepared for the devil and his angels. (It's obvious that the fire is everlasting - the clue is in the words used: "everlasting fire"!)

Death, hell, and the grave will all be thrown in to the lake of fire

Well done, you've repeated what I wrote (although you got that wrong, because the verse that I quoted does not say that "the grave" will be thrown into the fire). So as I said, if hell is thrown into the fire, then hell cannot be the fire, and the fire cannot be hell. The fire is symbolic of destruction - death and hell will be destroyed, just as the devil and his angels will be destroyed. You confusing one for the other shows a lack of understanding, or of not paying enough attention to the details of what the Scriptures say. I'm trying to help you understand what the Bible says; hopefully you now understand it.

Revelation 12:12 (WEB):

(12) Therefore rejoice, heavens, and you who dwell in them. Woe to the earth and to the sea, because the devil has gone down to you, having great wrath, knowing that he has but a short time.”​

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

I had said that the "everlasting fire" is "prepared for the devil and his angels", not hell (sheol/hades) as you had claimed.

Revelation 20:14
And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

It's obvious that the fire is everlasting - the clue is in the words used: "everlasting fire

That's pretty funny!

if hell is thrown into the fire, then hell cannot be the fire

Jesus said that the rich man was in hell and was being tormented in the fire... so you believe Jesus spoke wrongly?

Just because death hell and the grave will be cast in to the lake of fire does not prove there is no fire in hell currently... that is, if one believes Jesus Christ knows what he's talking about

 

[Lambano]

Can angels repent?​

Do they need to?

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Do they need to?

Apparently some think they do.

Maybe they go out and gamble, lie, steal and whatnot and are in need of repentance... but they only do these things off the clock, and not when they are working for the Lord of course!

They might need to take a bath and do laundry too when they get stinky!

 

[keithr]

Just because death hell and the grave will be cast in to the lake of fire does not prove there is no fire in hell currently... that is, if one believes Jesus Christ knows what he's talking about

I'll just say it one last time. It is not hell that is prepared for the devil and his angels. Eternal fire is. Eternal fire is not the same thing as hell.

Matthew 25:41 (WEB):

(41) Then he will say also to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire which is prepared for the devil and his angels;​

Job didn't think there was anything to worry about in hell (Sheol), he even desired to go there:

Job 14:10-13 (WEB):

(10) But man dies, and is laid low. Yes, man gives up the spirit, and where is he?​

(12) so man lies down and doesn’t rise. Until the heavens are no more, they shall not awake, nor be roused out of their sleep.​

(13) “Oh that you would hide me in Sheol, that you would keep me secret, until your wrath is past, that you would appoint me a set time, and remember me! {resurrect to life again}​

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

I'll just say it one last time. It is not hell that is prepared for the devil and his angels. Eternal fire is. Eternal fire is not the same thing as hell.

Revelation 20:14
And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

You point... is a moot point because hell is going to be cast in to the lake of fire!

 

[keithr]

Revelation 20:14
And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

You point... is a moot point because hell is going to be cast in to the lake of fire!

Being thrown into the "lake of fire" is symbolic of being destroyed - it's not an actual fire. Death is symbolically speaking thrown into the fire, i.e. destroyed, hence "Death will be no more; neither will there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain, any more" (Revelation 21:4). Just as there will be no more death, there will also be no more hell. It is destruction that is prepared/planned for the devil and his angels, and similary hell will be destroyed.

Once what's been thrown into the fire has been destroyed there is then no longer any need for the fire to remain, but it is symbolically described as being everlasting fire to emphasise that the fire will not be extinguished before everything thrown into it is completely destroyed.

There's no point throwing Satan and angels into physical fire - they're spirit beings so fire does not affect them. For example, Exodus 3:2 (WEB):

(2) Yahweh’s angel appeared to him in a flame of fire out of the middle of a bush. He looked, and behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.​

and Judges 13:20 (WEB):

(20) For when the flame went up toward the sky from off the altar, Yahweh’s angel ascended in the flame of the altar. Manoah and his wife watched; and they fell on their faces to the ground.​

The Bible consistently uses fire as a metaphor for destroying, e.g. Deuteronomy 9:3 (MKJV):

(3) Therefore, understand today that Jehovah your God is He who goes over before you. Like a consuming fire, He shall destroy them, and He shall bring them down before your face. So you shall drive them out and destroy them quickly, as Jehovah has said to you.​

Consider also Revelation 19:20 (KJV), where the "scarlet-colored beast, full of blasphemous names, having seven heads and ten horns" (Revelation 17:3) is symbolic of the papal system and power:

(20) And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.​

Albert Barnes' Notes about this verse says:

These both were cast alive into a lake of fire - The beast and the false prophet. That is, the overthrow will be as signal, and the destruction as complete, as if the leaders of the combined hosts should be taken alive, and thrown into a pit or lake that burns with an intense heat. There is no necessity for supposing that this is to be literally inflicted - for the whole scene is symbolical - meaning that the destruction of these powers would be as complete as if they were thrown into such a burning lake.​

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Being thrown into the "lake of fire" is symbolic of being destroyed - it's not an actual fire.

And yet the people thrown in to the lake of fire will live forever being tormented in that fire!

Annihilationism is heresy and not legitimate Christian doctrine.

God says it's an actual fire and those claiming otherwise do so at their own peril.

 

[keithr]

And yet the people thrown in to the lake of fire will live forever being tormented in that fire!

You have misunderstood the Scriptures. "The wages of sin is death" (Romans 6:23), not an eternal life of torment. "the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord" (Romans 6:23). God only gives good gifts, not bad:

Matthew 7:11 (WEB):

(11) If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him!​

and a gift of eternal life for the purpose of eternal torment is not a good gift!

Annihilationism is heresy and not legitimate Christian doctrine.

God says it's an actual fire and those claiming otherwise do so at their own peril.

Revelation 17:8 (WEB):

(8) The beast that you saw was, and is not; and is about to come up out of the abyss and to go into destruction. ...​

confirms that being cast alive into a lake of fire means being destroyed. The papal system that the beast represents cannot be tormented by somehow engulfing it in fire! It is symbolic.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

You have misunderstood the Scriptures.

No, the misunderstanding is on your end for not accepting all that the Lord says in His Word.

God only gives good gifts, not bad:

He gave the gift of being eternally separated from Himself to the devil and his angles for themn to be tormented in the fires of hell for all eternity.

Those choosing to not walk with the Lord gets the devil's reward because if the Lord is not their Father, then by default the devil is there father so they spend eternity with them!

The lesson here is DON'T turn away from the Lord! Abide in Christ until the end of your life!

confirms that being cast alive into a lake of fire means being destroyed

It actually reads

Revelation 17:8
The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition

"Destruction" does not mean annihilationism which is
Mark 9:47-48
If your eye causes you to stumble, throw it out; it is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye, than, having two eyes, to be cast into hell, where their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched.

Revelation 14:11
And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”

Revelation 20:10
And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.


"Destruction" does not mean annihilationism which is a trick of the devil to get many to not get born again... believing they will cease to exist so why bother getting saved.

Whether they realize it or not, those teaching this false doctrine are being used by the devil to dupe people!

 

[lforrest]

Jesus died to redeem the world to himself. To join his resurrection we must be united with him in his death. But angels can not die and they are not under the authority of man so they do not join in renewal of the things corrupted by the fall of man as part of God's plan for redemption.

I don't even think angels can repent, they could be infinitely stubborn for all we know.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

they could be infinitely stubborn for all we know.

Only the fallen ones.

The ones that are loyal to the Lord follow orders!

 

[lforrest]

Only the fallen ones.

The ones that are loyal to the Lord follow orders!

They could be stubborn in their execution of their orders as well, which is determination not to change ones attitude or position. Not to be conflated with willfulness, where we do what we want without caring about what others want.

 

[keithr]

But angels can not die

Angels cannot be immortal (meaning they cannot die) because the Scriptures say that currently only God and Jesus are immortal:

1 Timothy 6:16 (WEB):

(16) who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light; whom no man has seen, nor can see: to whom be honor and eternal power. Amen.​

Jesus said, John 5:26 (WEB):

(26) For as the Father has life in himself, even so he gave to the Son also to have life in himself.​

Jesus said, Revelation 1:18 (WEB):

(18) and the Living one. I was dead, and behold, I am alive forever and ever. Amen. I have the keys of Death and of Hades.​

Therefore angels can die. Even Satan will die:

Hebrews 2:14 (KJV):

(14) Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;​

Ezekiel 28:13-19 (WEB):

(13) You were in Eden, the garden of God. Every precious stone adorned you: ruby, topaz, emerald, chrysolite, onyx, jasper, sapphire, turquoise, and beryl. Gold work of tambourines and of pipes was in you. They were prepared in the day that you were created.​

(14) You were the anointed cherub who covers. Then I set you up on the holy mountain of God. You have walked up and down in the middle of the stones of fire.​

(15) You were perfect in your ways from the day that you were created, until unrighteousness was found in you.​

(16) By the abundance of your commerce, your insides were filled with violence, and you have sinned. Therefore I have cast you as profane out of God’s mountain. I have destroyed you, covering cherub, from the middle of the stones of fire.​

(17) Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty. You have corrupted your wisdom by reason of your splendor. I have cast you to the ground. I have laid you before kings, that they may see you.​

(18) By the multitude of your iniquities, in the unrighteousness of your commerce, you have profaned your sanctuaries. Therefore I have brought out a fire from the middle of you. It has devoured you. I have turned you to ashes on the earth in the sight of all those who see you.​

(19) All those who know you among the peoples will be astonished at you. You have become a terror, and you will exist no more.”’”​

 

[keithr]

He gave the gift of being eternally separated from Himself to the devil and his angles for themn to be tormented in the fires of hell for all eternity.

You consider that a gift!

Those choosing to not walk with the Lord gets the devil's reward

The devil is not rewarded - he is punished.

because if the Lord is not their Father, then by default the devil is there father so they spend eternity with them!

Everyone's destiny is either eternal death or eternal life. Romans 6:23 (WEB):

(23) For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.​

Satan is going to be destroyed, i.e. he will die. Spending eternity with him is eternal death.

It actually reads

Revelation 17:8
The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition

I correctly quoted the WEB, which says "destruction", as does the YLT, LSV, ESV, TLV, Darby, ISV, GNB, Diaglot, etc..

"Destruction" does not mean annihilationism

The dictionary definition of annihilationism is to be permanently destroyed (Annihilationism Definition).

Mark 9:47-48
If your eye causes you to stumble, throw it out; it is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye, than, having two eyes, to be cast into hell, where their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched.

Jesus is talking about Gehenna in that verse, not hell.

Revelation 14:11
And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”

Revelation 20:10
And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

In both the above verses it is symbolic of being permanently destroyed and being a permanent example/reminder to those living forever of the results of living in an ungodly way. Similarly, Sodom and Gomorrah have been destroyed and remain an example of God's punishment of the wicked. They're not being continuously destroyed forever. Jude 1:7 (WEB):

(7) Even as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them, having, in the same way as these, given themselves over to sexual immorality and gone after strange flesh, are shown as an example, suffering the punishment of eternal fire.​

and 2 Peter 2:6 (WEB):

(6) and turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes, condemned them to destruction, having made them an example to those who would live in an ungodly way;​

"Destruction" does not mean annihilationism

Yes it does!

which is a trick of the devil to get many to not get born again... believing they will cease to exist so why bother getting saved.

Why bother responding to God's call? How about to secure immortality on a higher plane (heaven), living with Jesus and God foerever, and sharing in Jesus' inheritance, helping to govern God's eternal Kingdom? God doesn't want to scare people into doing right, by threatening eternal torture if they don't (God is not evil, and would never do such a thing). God wants people to love him. The choice people have is do they want to live forever with God's blessings, or do they want to die and never have a concsious moment again. One trick of the devil is to persuade people to live ungodly, hating, persecuting and killing other people supposedly in order to please God and so that they can go to heaven. That's what Muslims have been deceived into doing.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

You consider that a gift!

For the devil, yes!

It's what he deserves!

The devil is not rewarded - he is punished.

His punishment IS his reward...

satan is going to be destroyed, i.e. he will die. Spending eternity with him is eternal death.

And those that turn away from the Lord will go there with him... they will be conscience, awake, and aware of the torment they are experiencing for all eternity.

The dictionary definition of annihilationism is to be permanently destroyed

That's the viewpoint of the carnal mind of man and is not what God's Word says

Jesus is talking about Gehenna in that verse, not hell.

That's the viewpoint of the carnal mind of man and is not what God's Word says

In both the above verses it is symbolic of being permanently destroyed

Actually it's the reality that being "destroyed" is speaking of being eternally separated from the Lord where men andfallen angels are tormented forever in the burning lake of fire.

Yes it does!

That's the viewpoint of the carnal mind of man and is not what God's Word says

Why bother responding to God's call?

For those that are living fore today... WHY bother with getting saved after hearing the false doctrine that they won't be tormented in hell because God will just put their lights out and they'll cease to exist.

This false doctrine of annihilationism is just one of satan's many deceptions to trick people in to going to hell.