Christians are not under the New Covenant

[Moriah's Song]

We are all imperfect, but we are all trying to learn the truth of God's word.

No, there are definitely individuals here that have hardened hearts like the Pharisees, are blind to the truths of scripture, and deaf to considering that they just might be wrong in their beliefs to the point it is useless for those of us who do believe that the theory of dispensationalism is the root cause of their being so indoctrinated that they cannot "see the forest for the trees."

For those kinds of people, Jesus had many "woes" for. When Jesus was on earth He exposed the burden of Pharisees by saying "

Mat 11:28-30..."Come to me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you, and learn from me; for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light."​

The burden of false teachings by man are always to be exposed. I would WANT someone to pull me out of such heresitcal beliefs. When people are indoctrinated they cannot comprehend that they have been mislead by men like John Nelson Darby, Charles Taze Russell, Mary Baker Eddy, and Joe smith of the Mormons just to name a few.

 

[Moriah's Song]

But if you show me anywhere in teh bible when the New Covenant as God wrote it has been fulfilled I have been willing to look. But not as you think or some commentator thinks, but as God declared the results of the covenant.

I did. You have not taken the blindfolds off, taken the plugs out of your ears nor opened your hardened heart to even consider for one moment that you are 100% wrong about the New Covenant and so, as I said before, go back and re-read what has already been posted and THEN we can possibly discuss it again. But as I see it, all you are still doing is posting Jermiah 31 over-and-over again because that is all you have.

 

[theefaith]

You wrote:

Anti-Semitic means "prejudiced or hostile towards the Jews". You claimed, without any supporting evidence (and I could not find any), that the Jews created the Freemasons (which has been accused of Satanism - whether correct or not) and thereby the "menace of communism". They were anti-Jewish statements, and libelous.

they may want it that way! It means prejudice against semites those descendants of sem the son of Noah and includes many ethnic groups not just the perfidious Jews who rejected thier own salvation and killed their own savior

the founder of political Zionism said the Jews created the Freemasons

 

[Moriah's Song]

Please can we have more brotherly love?

The word "love" has 4 different meanings to it. If a friend sees you starting to consider that the Jehovah's Witnesses are a legitimate Christian denomination because of what they tell you and you do nothing to convince HIM/OR HER otherwise, do you "love" your friend or not?

 

[theefaith]

Love and truth!

love rejoiceth with the truth!

 

[keithr]

If a friend sees you starting to consider that the Jehovah's Witness are a legitimate Christian denomination because of what they tell you and you do nothing to convince them otherwise, do you "love" your friend or not?

Eh? "If a friend sees you ... and you do nothing to convine them ... do you love your friend?" This is confusing/poor English! Surely 'them' should be 'him'? Who is the 'they' referring to - the Jehovah's Witnesses?

Are you saying that if a person should start to consider JW's a legitimate Christian denomination then he should out of love try to convince all his friends to also consider JW's as Christians too? My answer would be that is not necessary, it does not matter. If your friend is a Christain and he is not showing respect to JW's then yes, then I would consider pointing out to him that he should love even his enemies.

BTW, I do consider that the JW's are a legitimate Christian denomination - in fact I consider them to be far better Christians than the majority of so called Christians from most of the other thousands of denominations.

 

[keithr]

they may want it that way! It means prejudice against semites those descendants of sem the son of Noah and includes many ethnic groups not just the perfidious Jews who rejected thier own salvation and killed their own savior

Not according to English dictionaries. To quote from other dictionaries, it means:

Discrimination against Jews.
Hostility toward or prejudice against Jews or Judaism.​

The IHRA (International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance) Plenary in Budapest decided to adopt the following working definition of antisemitism in 2016:

“Antisemitism is a certain perception of Jews, which may be expressed as hatred toward Jews. Rhetorical and physical manifestations of antisemitism are directed toward Jewish or non-Jewish individuals and/or their property, toward Jewish community institutions and religious facilities.”​

the founder of political Zionism said the Jews created the Freemasons

See Judeo-Masonic conspiracy theory - Wikipedia. It says, "The Judeo-Masonic conspiracy is an antisemitic and antimasonic conspiracy theory involving an alleged secret coalition of Jews and Freemasons. These theories were popular on the far-right, particularly in France, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Germany, Russia and Eastern Europe, with similar allegations still being published". It's all lies.

 

[Moriah's Song]

Eh? "If a friend sees you ... and you do nothing to convine them ... do you love your friend?" This is confusing/poor English! Surely 'them' should be 'him'? Who is the 'they' referring to - the Jehovah's Witnesses?

Are you saying that if a person should start to consider JW's a legitimate Christian denomination then he should out of love try to convince all his friends to also consider JW's as Christians too? My answer would be that is not necessary, it does not matter. If your friend is a Christain and he is not showing respect to JW's then yes, then I would consider pointing out to him that he should love even his enemies.

BTW, I do consider that the JW's are a legitimate Christian denomination - in fact I consider them to be far better Christians than the majority of so called Christians from most of the other thousands of denominations.

keith, ok you are right about the "a friend" and "them" usage but it is usually customary to overlook little unintended slips so I will correct that since it confuses you.

Secondly, in regards to your considering the JW's as a legitimate Christian denomination goes and believe they are far better than Christians goes, that is your problem not mine. But if I had a friend that I know was conversing with a JW and listening to their distortions of scripture I would certainly, out of love, try to convince him/her/them whatever, by showing their distortions. I'm not saying they are not nice people at all. They are mislead by the Watchtower and are following a man named Charles Taze Russell's re-interpeting scripture to fit his ideas - especially about the end of the world date setting, calling God "a god" and that only 144,000 chosen hierarchy will be in heaven with the peons down on earth looking up at the privileged elite.

 

[keithr]

keith, ok you are right about the "a friend" and "them" usage but it is usually customary to overlook little unintended slips so I will correct that since it confuses you.

It still seems backwards to me. Surely a better example would be "If you saw a friend start to consider JW's as legitimate Christians, would you try to convince him otherwise, because of your love for him?"

Secondly, in regards to your considering the JW's as a legitimate Christian denomination goes and believe they are far better than Christians goes, that is your problem not mine.

I don't consider it a problem!

But if I had a friend that I know was conversing with a JW and listening to their distortions of scripture I would certainly, out of love, try to convince him/her/them whatever, by showing their distortions.

And out of his love for you he might try to convince you of the truth of what he had learnt from the JW's. Would you still remain friends, and conduct your conversations in a friendly manner? You should do!

 

[theefaith]

Eh? "If a friend sees you ... and you do nothing to convine them ... do you love your friend?" This is confusing/poor English! Surely 'them' should be 'him'? Who is the 'they' referring to - the Jehovah's Witnesses?

Are you saying that if a person should start to consider JW's a legitimate Christian denomination then he should out of love try to convince all his friends to also consider JW's as Christians too? My answer would be that is not necessary, it does not matter. If your friend is a Christain and he is not showing respect to JW's then yes, then I would consider pointing out to him that he should love even his enemies.

BTW, I do consider that the JW's are a legitimate Christian denomination - in fact I consider them to be far better Christians than the majority of so called Christians from most of the other thousands of denominations.

they can’t be Christians if they deny the savior and reject basic Christian doctrine
I.e. the divinity of Christ and the holy trinity!

2 pet 2:2 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

 

[theefaith]

Not according to English dictionaries. To quote from other dictionaries, it means:

Discrimination against Jews.
Hostility toward or prejudice against Jews or Judaism.​

The IHRA (International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance) Plenary in Budapest decided to adopt the following working definition of antisemitism in 2016:

“Antisemitism is a certain perception of Jews, which may be expressed as hatred toward Jews. Rhetorical and physical manifestations of antisemitism are directed toward Jewish or non-Jewish individuals and/or their property, toward Jewish community institutions and religious facilities.”​

See Judeo-Masonic conspiracy theory - Wikipedia. It says, "The Judeo-Masonic conspiracy is an antisemitic and antimasonic conspiracy theory involving an alleged secret coalition of Jews and Freemasons. These theories were popular on the far-right, particularly in France, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Germany, Russia and Eastern Europe, with similar allegations still being published". It's all lies.

a Semite is an ethnic person not a religion
The dictionary is run like Hollywood by the wretched Jews

the Jewish bankers funded hitler and inspired the holocaust do they could use it to get a Jewish state in Palestine

Theadore Herzel

“The Masonic lodges are established all over the world to help us achieve our independence, those PIGS the non Jewish Freemasons will never understand the final objects of Freemasonry”

THE JEWISH TRIBUNE, New York, Oct. 28, 1927, Cheshvan 2, 5688, Vol. 91, No. 18: “Masonry is based on Judaism. Eliminate the teachings of Judaism from the Masonic ritual and what is left?”

read the The Protocols of the Elders of Zion!

 

[theefaith]

They are anti-Christ anti-Christian
Christ killers who daily commit blasphemy against Christ and his holy church!

Most heresy is fomented by the Jews!

 

[keithr]

The dictionary is run like Hollywood by the wretched Jews

You really are a Jew hater, and a spreader of lies. You should be ashamed of yourself. A Christian should be Christ-like, having the mind of Christ - he should be humble, gentle, patient, loving, speaking evil of nobody. You can't share in Christ's kingdom rule if you have a hatred of the Jews (or anybody).

Titus 3:2-7 (WEB):

(2) to speak evil of no one, not to be contentious, to be gentle, showing all humility toward all men.
(3) For we were also once foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving various lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.
(4) But when the kindness of God our Savior and his love toward mankind appeared,
(5) not by works of righteousness which we did ourselves, but according to his mercy, he saved us through the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
(6) whom he poured out on us richly, through Jesus Christ our Savior;
(7) that being justified by his grace, we might be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.​

As Jesus said,Matthew 5:43-48 (ESV):

(43) “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’
(44) But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,
(45) so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.
(46) For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same?
(47) And if you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same?
(48) You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.​

 

[keithr]

they can’t be Christians if they deny the savior and reject basic Christian doctrine
I.e. the divinity of Christ and the holy trinity!

I'm quite sure that the JW's do not deny our Saviour, Jesus. There is no requirement to believe in man-made doctrines such as the Trinity. Romans 10:9 (ESV):

(9) because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.​

 

[theefaith]

You really are a Jew hater, and a spreader of lies. You should be ashamed of yourself. A Christian should be Christ-like, having the mind of Christ - he should be humble, gentle, patient, loving, speaking evil of nobody. You can't share in Christ's kingdom rule if you have a hatred of the Jews (or anybody).

Titus 3:2-7 (WEB):

(2) to speak evil of no one, not to be contentious, to be gentle, showing all humility toward all men.
(3) For we were also once foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving various lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.
(4) But when the kindness of God our Savior and his love toward mankind appeared,
(5) not by works of righteousness which we did ourselves, but according to his mercy, he saved us through the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
(6) whom he poured out on us richly, through Jesus Christ our Savior;
(7) that being justified by his grace, we might be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.​

As Jesus said,Matthew 5:43-48 (ESV):

(43) “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’
(44) But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,
(45) so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.
(46) For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same?
(47) And if you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same?
(48) You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.​

never anything to indicate Jew hating, but the behavior of the Jews

speaking the truth is not Christ-like Jn 14:6

 

[keithr]

never anything to indicate Jew hating, but the behavior of the Jews

As an example, you wrote, "The dictionary is run like Hollywood by the wretched Jews". Calling them "wretched" shows your hostility towards them, and your hatred of them. Jesus said, Matthew 15:18-20 (WEB):

(18) But what comes out of the mouth proceeds from the heart, and this defiles a person.
(19) For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false witness, slander.
(20) These are what defile a person. ...​

speaking the truth is not Christ-like Jn 14:6

What has John 14:6 got to do with speaking the truth?:

(6) Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.​

Do you really think that Jesus didn't speak the truth, and that lying is Christ-like? Good grief!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I did. You have not taken the blindfolds off, taken the plugs out of your ears nor opened your hardened heart to even consider for one moment that you are 100% wrong about the New Covenant and so, as I said before, go back and re-read what has already been posted and THEN we can possibly discuss it again. But as I see it, all you are still doing is posting Jermiah 31 over-and-over again because that is all you have.

No you have shown me opinions of commentators and shown me reinterpreted commentary that does not fulfill the passage as written. If you do not know that is what you did- you should not accuse others of what you are guilty of.

Jeremiah 31:31-34 is the entire content of the NewCovenant in the bible! That is why I go to it.

You do not show how that passage has been fulfilled as written, but as reinterpreted by you and others.

I have read your opinions of Jer. 31 many times, but they are allegorical commentary and not literal fulfilment!

Why can't you recognize that or are you ashamed of your own heremenutic system of trying to understand Scripture?

YOu have thrown out Jesus is a mediator and refuse to recognize that mediators work when a contract,/covenant/ agreement has not gone into effect yet as is defined in Greek, Hebrew and English!

You have thrown out that Jews were there at Pentecost and they got preference and first choice- but that is not the new covenant and you know that!

As a kid you must have been a champ at teh game twister, for you sure are great at twisitng around from answering a simple question asked of you! ;)

 

[Ronald Nolette]

No, there are definitely individuals here that have hardened hearts like the Pharisees, are blind to the truths of scripture, and deaf to considering that they just might be wrong in their beliefs to the point it is useless for those of us who do believe that the theory of dispensationalism is the root cause of their being so indoctrinated that they cannot "see the forest for the trees."

For those kinds of people, Jesus had many "woes" for. When Jesus was on earth He exposed the burden of Pharisees by saying "

Mat 11:28-30..."Come to me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you, and learn from me; for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light."​

The burden of false teachings by man are always to be exposed. I would WANT someone to pull me out of such heresitcal beliefs. When people are indoctrinated they cannot comprehend that they have been mislead by men like John Nelson Darby, Charles Taze Russell, Mary Baker Eddy, and Joe smith of the Mormons just to name a few.

Thus sayeth the fourth person of the god head.

So you do consider dispensationalists as unsaved! Okay !Once again your arrogance and presumptuousness has not gone unnoticed before the throne of God!

So is it safe to assume that according to Messiah Moraih, what is necessary for salvation is trust in the death , burial and physical resurrection of Jesus as the only acceptable payment for ones sins and not be a dispensationalist?

 

[theefaith]

As an example, you wrote, "The dictionary is run like Hollywood by the wretched Jews". Calling them "wretched" shows your hostility towards them, and your hatred of them. Jesus said, Matthew 15:18-20 (WEB):

(18) But what comes out of the mouth proceeds from the heart, and this defiles a person.
(19) For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false witness, slander.
(20) These are what defile a person. ...​

What has John 14:6 got to do with speaking the truth?:

(6) Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.​

Do you really think that Jesus didn't speak the truth, and that lying is Christ-like? Good grief!

non Jews are pigs according to these zionists

 

[theefaith]

Christ replaced david as king Lk 1:32-33
The church replaced Israel as kingdom matt 21:43
The new covenant replaced the old
Heb 8:13