Christians are sinners, but not of the devil

[Always Believing]

Forgiveness is found on the Cross.
Confessing sin, does not get you "re-forgiven" or "saved again".
All it does is help you out of your guilt trip and condemnation, until you do it again.
So, the answer is not to stay in "sin and confess then repeat".
Isn't that obvious to you? It should be by now.
I provided the answer to this discipleship failure, in a couple of recent Threads.

We are forgiven when we confess from the heart to Jesus and take up our own cross. The only one that was ever on Jesus' cross was Jesus.

There is no need to be reforgiven or saved again, if we aren't sinning again. I prefer to call it reconciliation and restored back to the race as before.

If you are saying that conviction for sinning is a guilt trip and false condemnation and so you don't allow yourself to be convicted for sinning, then you are in serious trouble. You are calling the work of the Spirit that brings people to Christ a guilt trip and a lie. That is dangerously close to blaspheming the Holy Spirit. At the very least you are searing your conscience to God. If you are saying that you don't ever have to confess any sinning you may do, then you can't be forgiven by God and are headed to the grave still in your condemnation. Even if you say you are not sinning and so don't need to confess it, the way you are teaching is seriously dangerous stuff.

The only thing that happened for all the world at once when Jesus rose from the dead was the pouring out of the Spirit upon all people to begin convicting them of their sins and drawing them to Jesus Christ for repentance and forgiveness of their past lives. When God first loved the world as a whole in the Person of the Holy Spirit, it was to convict all the world of sins.

Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment. (John 16.7-9)

Jesus didn't come just to condemn the sinner, but His Spirit does come to convict all men everywhere of sinning for our own good, and you are teaching like that love and conviction of God is of the devil and hateful and deceitful guilt tripping. Like we say in the military, you need to straighten out that attitude of yours.

 

[theefaith]

We are all Christians that believe Jesus is the Christ, and we are all sinners that need to believe in Him all the time. But we are not sinners like others that do not believe Jesus is the Christ. Before Jesus saved me, I used to try and sin as much as possible, because I liked it so much, but now I hate it when I sin. I love Jesus being in my mind and heart and do not try to sin nor enjoy it, but I still do. When we sin we still believe Jesus is the Christ and our Savior, and we are not of the devil as others enjoying their sinning without any faith in Jesus.

I have no problem telling others I am a Christians sinner if they ask me. But I do not tell them I am of the devil nor a child of the devil when I do sin, because I don't enjoy it at all.

This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God's child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister. (1 John 3.10)

Even when we are sinning, we still love Jesus and our fellow Christians and are not of the devil.

satan at the fall gained a certain dominion over mankind God by the immaculate conception of Mary regained the kingdom and we now belong entirely to God!

believers are not Christians but only neophytes and catechumens
Faith and baptism are necessary to be Christian

Baptism is the initiation of the new and eternal covenant!

You cannot enter on you’re own or by “faith alone”!

Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Baptismal regeneration a new creation in Christ! 2 Cor 5:17

A sacrament is an oath! A sacred promise from God! Ez 36:25-27
Acts 2:38-39 (this promise)

No baptism no grace!

A sacrament is an outward sign for all men including infants And a gift from God to help us see what he does inwardly and invisibly by his grace!

As grace Washes our souls in the merits of Jesus blood from original and personal sin, so the outward action of washing is visible!

without the outward action the inward action cannot take place!

Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 water and washing
acts 22:16 wash away your sin!

Jn 3:5 Born again BY water and the spirit! Not by “faith alone”!

They did not go to Jerusalem and preach “accept Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior “

They went to the river (water) and they baptized! Jn 3:22

A covenant requires an outward sign of the inward action of grace!

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Acts 22:16 washing away your sins.

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism.

1 pet 3:21 baptism saves you.

You cannot enter on you’re own or by faith alone!

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Heb 2:11 For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


Baptism!

God breathed life into Adam, gen 2:7 and we received this life from our fathers!

Christ breathed on the apostles our spiritual fathers, we receive the new covenant life of God’s grace from them thru faith & baptism! Jn 20:21-23 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 eph 2

Born again! Born from above!

'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,

Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." 87 The faithful Christian who I has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," 88 with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.

St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13

Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

Sealed in the ark, sealed in the church the ark of salvation by God thru baptism!



Christ instituted the holy church for the salvation of all men, (repent and believe the gospel, with the institution of the sacraments to convey grace to sanctify souls!


Effects of faith & baptism!

Ez 36:25-27 washed in baptism, with a new heart and the Spirit
Jn 3:5 born again in baptism
Mk 16:16 faith & baptist
Acts 2:38 repentance & baptism
Acts 8:36-38 faith & baptism
Acts 22:16 baptism washes away sin
Rom 6:3 died with Christ
Col 2:12 risen with Christ
1 cor 12:13 baptized into the church
Gal 3:27 by baptism put on Christ
2 Tim 1:10 eph 2:1 and 5 brought to life
2 cor 5:17 new creation
Eph 1:13 sealed by the Holy Spirit
Eph 4:5 one baptism
Eph 5:26 faith and baptism
Titus 3:5 baptismal regeneration
1 pet 1:2 washed in Christ’s blood
1 pet 2:9 the kingdom of light
1 pet 3:20-21 baptism saves us!

“Faith alone” accomplishes nothing!
1 cor 13:2 even all faith (alone) without charity avails NOTHING!!!

Faith and baptism!

Scripture says none of the things about “Faith alone”!

2 Peter 1:11
For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

The Christian sacrament of baptism is the Initiation into the new covenant and must be ministered to you by the apostles!




“Faith alone”

Questions

where does scripture says we have died with Christ by “faith alone”?

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

where does scripture say we are members of Christ and his church by “faith alone”?

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

where does scripture says we put on Christ by “faith alone”?

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Where does scripture say our sins are washed away by “faith alone”?

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

where does scripture say we are saved or justified by “faith alone”?

1 pet 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!

The only reference in scripture to “faith alone” is James 2:24 NOT BY “FAITH ALONE”?

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

How can you enter by your own if it must be ministered to you? Baptism is done unto you, “not do it yourself by faith alone”

Jn 3:5 born again by faith alone?

Where is “Accept Christ as your personal lord & savior” is found in scripture?

They did not go preaching this line but went immediately to the river and baptized Jn 3:22

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Eph 4:5 one baptism

Why don’t it say one teeny tiny little act of “faith alone”???

When we first believed we are saved?

Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

How can salvation be nearer than when we first believed if you’re saved by believing?

1 pet 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Matt 24:13 endures to the end Shall be saved.

How can salvation happen when we first believed if it’s the end?

If salvation is by “faith alone” then faith would be the greatest!
1 cor 13:13 charity is the greatest!

Even all faith much less “faith alone” without charity avails nothing!
1 cor 13:2

Faith alone” unbiblical!

 

[Behold]

I used to mock grace

Legalism mocks Grace.

Legalism , regarding the born again, is the teaching and belief that trying to be good and keep commandments, is how you stay saved.
This teaching and belief denies the Cross.

 

[robert derrick]

We are forgiven when we confess from the heart to Jesus and take up our own cross. The only one that was ever on Jesus' cross was Jesus.

There is no need to be reforgiven or saved again, if we aren't sinning again. I prefer to call it reconciliation and restored back to the race as before.

If you are saying that conviction for sinning is a guilt trip and false condemnation and so you don't allow yourself to be convicted for sinning, then you are in serious trouble. You are calling the work of the Spirit that brings people to Christ a guilt trip and a lie. That is dangerously close to blaspheming the Holy Spirit. At the very least you are searing your conscience to God. If you are saying that you don't ever have to confess any sinning you may do, then you can't be forgiven by God and are headed to the grave still in your condemnation. Even if you say you are not sinning and so don't need to confess it, the way you are teaching is seriously dangerous stuff.

The only thing that happened for all the world at once when Jesus rose from the dead was the pouring out of the Spirit upon all people to begin convicting them of their sins and drawing them to Jesus Christ for repentance and forgiveness of their past lives. When God first loved the world as a whole in the Person of the Holy Spirit, it was to convict all the world of sins.

Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment. (John 16.7-9)

Jesus didn't come just to condemn the sinner, but His Spirit does come to convict all men everywhere of sinning for our own good, and you are teaching like that love and conviction of God is of the devil and hateful and deceitful guilt tripping. Like we say in the military, you need to straighten out that attitude of yours.

Now this is an excellent point. The world sees conviction as condemnation only, but Christians know it is necessary to draw all men to repentance and be forgiven by God. Those who therefore say conviction for sin is guilt-tripping and unjust condemnation, have no hope of repentance and forgiveness of sin.

Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment.

Notice it is the Comforter that convicts of sin to draw to repentance and forgiveness, and not just to condemn. Conviction is good for the repentant, and is evil to the unrepentant.

The chastisement of the Lord is not the morning after, which all sinners experience in the flesh. That is not personal chastisement from God, but is natural response of the flesh to being sinned with and abused by the sinner.

As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

The loving chastisement of the Lord is conviction for sin, which is not happy in itself, but is good for repentance from the Comforter. Therefore, those who say conviction for sinning is an unwanted guilt-trip, are rejecting any chastisement from God to repent.

By practicing their doctrine, they make themselves illegitimate children refusing correction of the Father.

A thread can be posted about your inspiration of the first love and conviction, if you don't mind.

 

[theefaith]

Legalism mocks Grace.

Legalism , regarding the born again, is the teaching and belief that trying to be good and keep commandments, is how you stay saved.
This teaching and belief denies the Cross.

eph 2:8 does not refer to you’re salvation it’s already past tense when Paul wrote it so it refers redemption accomplished by Christ apart from our involvement

Christian faith includes baptism Jn 3:5 by water and the spirit and not faith alone 1 cor 13:2 and 1 cor 13/13

1) you claim you were “saved” without faith?
2) you claim you were “saved” before you were born?
3) if it’s not your faith, then who’s?
4) what does quickened mean in vs 1?
5) since it’s grace and not something we do, your saying all men are saved?

redemption, justification, sanctification, and salvation are not the same:

matt 24:13 he who endures to the end shall be saved!

grace needs works to bear fruit!

John 12:24
Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

grace must be put into action to bear fruit!

 

[theefaith]

Called to suffer:

Matthew 10:38
And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

Matthew 16:24
Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Matthew 16:25
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

Romans 8:17
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

2 Corinthians 12:9
And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

2 Thessalonians 1:5
Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:

Colossians 1:11
Strengthened with all might, according to his glorious power, unto all patience and longsuffering with joyfulness;

2 Tim 2:3 Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.

2 Timothy 2:12
If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:

Phil 1:29
For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

1 pet 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;

James 1:2-8
My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations; Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience. But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing

Hebrews 6:12
That ye be not slothful, but followers of them who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

Hebrews 10:36
For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.

Hebrews 12:4
Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.

1 Peter 2:20
For what glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.

Romans 8:17
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

2 Timothy 2:12
If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:


Rev 2: 19 I know thy works, and charity, and service, and faith, and thy patience, and thy works; and the last to be more than the first.

Rev 2:23 .....I will give unto every one of you according to your works.


2 cor 1:6
And whether we be afflicted, it is for your consolation and salvation, which is effectual in the enduring of the same sufferings which we also suffer: or whether we be comforted, it is for your consolation and salvation.

7 And our hope of you is stedfast, knowing, that as ye are partakers of the sufferings, so shall ye be also of the consolation.

Heb 2:10
For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings

 

[Always Believing]

Now this is an excellent point. The world sees conviction as condemnation only, but Christians know it is necessary to draw all men to repentance and be forgiven by God. Those who therefore say conviction for sin is guilt-tripping and unjust condemnation, have no hope of repentance and forgiveness of sin.

Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment.

Notice it is the Comforter that convicts of sin to draw to repentance and forgiveness, and not just to condemn. Conviction is good for the repentant, and is evil to the unrepentant.

The chastisement of the Lord is not the morning after, which all sinners experience in the flesh. That is not personal chastisement from God, but is natural response of the flesh to being sinned with and abused by the sinner.

As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

The loving chastisement of the Lord is conviction for sin, which is not happy in itself, but is good for repentance from the Comforter. Therefore, those who say conviction for sinning is an unwanted guilt-trip, are rejecting any chastisement from God to repent.

By practicing their doctrine, they make themselves illegitimate children refusing correction of the Father.

A thread can be posted about your inspiration of the first love and conviction, if you don't mind.

Sure. Let me know what you post.

 

[Always Believing]

Legalism mocks Grace.

Legalism , regarding the born again, is the teaching and belief that trying to be good and keep commandments, is how you stay saved.
This teaching and belief denies the Cross.

It denies your cross which I don't care about. Doing works of the flesh with grace mocks grace and denies the resurrection and power of Jesus Christ. We don't try to do good. We do it to please God and be in fellowship with Jesus. If you're trying not to do good in order not to try and stay saved in order to keep your teaching, then obviously you aren't doing any good at all. Your teaching has made you mentally messed up so that you are trying to do the exact opposite of what God commands us to do in order to be His sons.

Beloved, do not imitate what is evil, but what is good. He who does good is of God, but he who does evil has not seen God. (3 John 1.11)