Christians have danced in church ....

[TheHolyBookEnds]

...The first time King David had the Ark brought toward Jerusalem he erred because he failed to follow God's clearly prescribed rules. The second time he got it together and did it the right way. This is why David is called the apple of His eye and a man after God's heart. He did not presume he had it all right all of the time. He made many mistakes, but he repeatedly accepted responsibility and made corrections and left judgment in God's hands. As a result God never rejected him in spite of his errors. Rather God built him up and gave him to us in the scriptures as an example for us.

Our perfect example of course is Jesus, but since all of have made mistakes before the Lord, sometimes we need someone like David to show us that God is merciful and we are not left in condemnation without hope. He is looking at our hearts all of the time.

I agree, David is a great example of humilty, in that he accepted the rebuke by God, and took the time to find out his error, and then corrected it.

1 Chronicles 15:2 Then David said, None ought to carry the ark of God but the Levites: for them hath the LORD chosen to carry the ark of God, and to minister unto him for ever.​

We can all be like this, and bear the law of God, as priests, taken for the Levites (Isaiah 66:21), and rejoice in serving our God, by obeying His word in worship and in service.

 

[TheHolyBookEnds]

...To me , when what a person believes and doesn't believe about the resurrection of Jesus Christ...one of the foundations of our faith. ( forgooten which thread of his this is in)

Sadly, the other person posting such material grossly misrepresents what I believe and teach. If you so desire, and without attempting to shift the focus of this thread, please feel free to listen to the following in the matter of the resurrection - https://www.thedesireofagesproject.com/uploads/6/2/6/8/6268448/da_chapter_81_he_is_risen-.mp3

And when I read about - When we Christians go to church on a Sunday ..we have taken the Mark Of The Beast

No one has the 'mark of the beast' yet. This was stated clearly on several occasions. I call you sister in the LORD.

and will end up in hell... ( again forgotten which threads that has been in..)

The 'mark of the beast' issue in Revelation 14:6-12 is most serious. The choices one makes in regards the material in those texts will determine the final side one is on. I only ask you, or any, to seriously study those texts word for word, line upon line.

I pray those responses are clear sister Helen, and the heart in which they are given. I have no animosity toward you, but do love you and so I share the truth. I also do not desire to see anyone 'go to hell', and especially no one on this forum, or the forums I have been to.

The subject of the thread was on song/dance, and so I posted a limited amount of material (I have many more videos, etc on the subject, from Frank Garlock, Karl Tsatalbasidis, Walter Veith, John Lomacang, Brian Newman, Steve Wohlberg, Lawrence Elliot Jr, etc., not all of whom are Seventh-day Adventists, and I could also share the secular perons who know these things, and what is in the music world, though they are much darker and grittier, They Sold their souls for Rock and Roll, Illuminati in the Music industry, etc), and may be seen here - http://www.pearltrees.com/awhn/media-music-more/id1593643

For instance, when Moses was upon Mt. Sinai and God told him to come down (with Joshua), Joshua thought he heard the sound of "war" (battle) in the camp (Exodus 32:17), but what was actually heard was dancing (Exodus 32:19), drums in music in worship of the false idol they called JEHOVAH, etc. The enemy had snuck in and gained them over while Moses (type of Christ) was up and away. Just as Christ returns, he will find the same corruption in the churches, and there will be execution of judgment about it.

Music is very powerful, and especially in worship, but it can be abused, and misunderstood (and lead people into error). 'Dancing' is also mentioned in scripture, in victories from war/battle/etc, such as after the crossing of the Red Sea (Exodus 15:20). See also 1 Kings 8:6, etc. There are not many passages on 'dance' in scripture, and a study may be done on it. It was never done in the Temple/Sanctuary. Brother Karl Tsatalbasidis has an excellent study on it also.

That people 'dance', such as the OP for hundreds of year, doesn't make it scripturally sound or sanctified, or even 'ok'. We must have a thus saith the LORD for all we do, for the Bible (KJB, the perfectly preserved word of God in English; Psalms 12:6-7, etc) is the final authority in all matters of faith and practice. The OP video and the actions therein is mere 'tradition'. God, as in the case with Uzzah, is very particular in regards the sacredness, holiness, reverence in worship.

I am also not condemning anyone in the video, or this thread, but seeking to give light (not heat) on the matter.

 

[Nancy]

Well...he has accomplished what he wanted...
Derailing this thread...

If the "gloves are off " and anything goes....and the moderators have given him a free reign on this forum...then maybe we should all do likewise and make sure we post lots of scriptures and uplifting posts , pictures , photographs and whatever on every page of his threads and disrupt all of them....as he seems to feel he has the right to do ....

And the Church said.....

 

[amadeus]

@TheHolyBookEnds
My complaint about lengthy videos without at least some accompanying explanation of content would still apply. You have explained now and I do appreciate that. Your tone also shows some of that bit of charity I mentioned.

Nevertheless, I know we do not agree on many things even yet. That may not change quickly... if ever. If we are both sincere and humble in following the Lord, then could we not both "be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment"?

"And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible." Mark 10:27

 

[lforrest]

It

Obviously flooding the Site with mile long back to back posts.. and pushing his agenda to warn us how if we keep Sunday we are going to hell..and his other false junk...is okay with @lforrest and the other Mods....then it seems that all things are allowable on here....we must remember that I guess.
News to me , as I did not know that.

To me it is " strange fire"...obviously I am wrong!!

Bless you Willie, sorry that your thread got derailed.
Don't give up brother....appreciate your posts.

Depends on the content, and if it is relevant to the OP, ether supporting or denying it. Tell me how his post has nothing at all to do with the OP.

There is also a handy tool to ignore people you wouldn't listen to anyways. I don't have that luxury.

We allow copy paste jobs, cause some people have prepared materials that are beneficial. But that also means you have to put up with propaganda.

 

[TheHolyBookEnds]

@TheHolyBookEnds
My complaint about lengthy videos without at least some accompanying explanation of content would still apply.

I can understand that and will try to keep that in mind for future, and try to include a brief (a few sentences) synopsis (I pray not to forget to do so). For these videos "Distraction Dilemma", the titles are clearly seen in the video screen itself, and thought that would be the best summation of them, and was one of the reasons I posted these without anything further.

You have explained now and I do appreciate that. Your tone also shows some of that bit of charity I mentioned.

Well, brother, I appreciate your own kindness and patience, or perhaps 'long-suffering', with me.

Nevertheless, I know we do not agree on many things even yet. That may not change quickly... if ever.

Holy Spirit and time (and with it events, if either of us are still around on this present earth, and then the material posted may be of benefit at that time, and worth all).

If we are both sincere and humble in following the Lord, then could we not both "be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment"?

Believe it with all my heart, since that is what scripture teaches, and so long as our final authority is God's word, and we are both listening to the same Holy Spirit, then it is only a matter of us accepting what God has for us.

"And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible." Mark 10:27

Absolutely, brother. I believe it, since God has so done it in the past in scripture, and God does not change.

 

[amadeus]

It

Depends on the content, and if it is relevant to the OP, ether supporting or denying it. Tell me how his post has nothing at all to do with the OP.

There is also a handy tool to ignore people you wouldn't listen to anyways. I don't have that luxury.

We allow copy paste jobs, cause some people have prepared materials that are beneficial. But that also means you have to put up with propaganda.

Thank you kindly for looking into this and responding. Having served as a moderator on another forum I understand too well the difficulties. I know that you cannot please all of the people all of the time. Know in any case that your efforts are appreciated.

 

[Butterfly]

Hi Rita

Well personally ...I am quite concerned when " people find his posts " interesting"

To me , when what a person believes and doesn't believe about the resurrection of Jesus Christ...one of the foundations of our faith. ( forgooten which thread of his this is in)

And when I read about - When we Christians go to church on a Sunday ..we have taken the Mark Of The Beast and will end up in hell... ( again forgotten which threads that has been in..)

Then sorry...no, it not the belief system I would encourage my grandkids to read..'because it's interesting or provokes thought .' People's whole spiritual lives have become shipwrecked for less.

It reminds me of 2 Kings 4
".... but as they began to eat it, they cried out, “Man of God, there is death in the pot!” And they could not eat it. "


But, as we always end up saying.." All are free to make their own choices."

Luke 8:18 "Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have."[/QUOTE

I was judging the post, not the person.I rarely have time to read many of the threads here, and so often as not everyone seems to judge everyone else- so you have a wider prospective of what others believe. Saying something is interesting is not saying I agree with everything, and I certainly had no time to watch all the videos. I raised the issue of whether entertainment can be classed as a distraction, and I do believe it an be.
Rita

 

[Butterfly]

Thank you, as the material is directly related to the OP. If the material is listened to, it also gets into dancing, which is never done in the Temple, Sanctuary, and never was a drum allowed in worship service in the Temple [period].

Enter-tain-ment, literally means "to come in" - "keep/hold in possession" - "the action of".

I am not amongst the group of people who think it's wrong to have music ' in a church building ' For me it's a balance between distraction and worship. Also Christ tore down the seperation between God and people - our bodies are the temple.
Rita

 

[LC627]

Maybe @lforrest can make a judgement on this...the back to back long posts are bad enough...but now we get back to back videos in threads...we would be here all night if we were really listening to them.

I mean, ELEVEN videos in three posts!!!! He knows darn well that no one will watch eleven videos.

On one other Site I used to be on...they even discouraged videos because it caused the Site to run so slowly and navigating the site became hard.

We don't all have up to date , top of the line devices!!

No one will watch even one, lol.

 

[amadeus]

I can understand that and will try to keep that in mind for future, and try to include a brief (a few sentences) synopsis (I pray not to forget to do so). For these videos "Distraction Dilemma", the titles are clearly seen in the video screen itself, and thought that would be the best summation of them, and was one of the reasons I posted these without anything further.

Thank you for this. Prior to responding to this post of yours to try to be fair I went back and listened to quite a bit of three different videos. The man seemed to be knowledgeable about scripture and apparently about music and he brings science also into it all. I heard some good things, but I was not drawn by it enough to take the time to listen to all he had to say.

There is a vision involved in following God and already I have such a vision although I know that so much of the time it remains as through a glass darkly. The face to face is coming as long as I am leaning on Him instead of on myself including my own knowledge and abilities. One of the hardest lessons for me to learn in my years of serving God was to allow God to help me unlearn a lot of what I took on when I was attending college. The videos for me if followed would take me back to relearn too much of that.

"Where there is no vision, the people perish:..." Prov 29:18

The thing about the injured railroad man and his frontal lobe injury and our frontal lobe I guess would catch the attention of many people, but it is really not there in that frontal lobe of our brain that the answer lies. We are not to use man's science to understand the things of God, but rather as we follow the lead of the Holy Spirit, as we consume the flesh of Jesus and at times we may be given some insight into man's science. But don't go too deep there. Man's science as anyone who has studied it even a little has changed a lot over the centuries. Things have been dropped or added and much in the way of technology has been developed which could be beneficial. It could be, and some will insist that it is, but as I look around and see the mess of men, including many the messes of many bearing that label of Christian and I realize the man's science has not improved man.

Some would say that neither has Christianity improved man. Again we come back to why Jesus came. Most people have still not gotten hold of it even as regular "church goers" according to what I am able to see:

"I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.
The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly" John 10:9-10

A lot of people who say with their mouths that they have Life... well I won't point fingers, but I do wonder.

Since so much emphasis is placed on the scriptures and prayers by the teacher in the videos, I have no doubt that some who are sincerely searching will find something good in the Lord in spite of the distractions. But those who tend to be distracted by music or sports or TV shows or whatever will also be distracted by a lot of the things on which he focuses.

Jesus is the answer, but many are seeing him as Nehushtan as our friend @bbyrd009 would say even they certainly believe that they are not deluded. Some as I said may not be, but unfortunately I am thinking that it is the same for too many of them with them in their gatherings as in so many other gatherings of people in what they call worship services.

This is what I saw too much of in the parts of the videos that I watched. Nehushtan is the wrong answer. It was then and it is when we call "Jesus" or we call it by the name of the particular favorite assembly or church we attend. There needs to be more than this to encounter and there is, but we need to keep our eyes on Him calling really on His name as we do and not looking around us and at the sea beneath our feet in fear.

Well as I said on another post here we likely disagree still on some things and this is the case.

Well, brother, I appreciate your own kindness and patience, or perhaps 'long-suffering', with me.

Holy Spirit and time (and with it events, if either of us are still around on this present earth, and then the material posted may be of benefit at that time, and worth all).

Believe it with all my heart, since that is what scripture teaches, and so long as our final authority is God's word, and we are both listening to the same Holy Spirit, then it is only a matter of us accepting what God has for us.

Absolutely, brother. I believe it, since God has so done it in the past in scripture, and God does not change.

No, God does not change but people can and they need to change. They cannot really change in the right direction without God. but He has provided the means for that be accomplished.

 

[bbyrd009]

in what they call worship services.

yup

 

[bbyrd009]

I am not amongst the group of people who think it's wrong to have music ' in a church building

me neither, but wadr you might go back to the Scriptural def of Church and nevermind the building.
Church is wherever i am!

 

[Phoneman777]

The "Preacher" said:

Ecclesiastes 7:4 The heart of the wise is in the house of mourning; but the heart of fools is in the house of mirth.​

Ivor "When in doubt, check with the neck" Myers. Love his presentation Sonic Warfare. Christians think they've got Satan cowering in the corner and they're keeping a watchful eye on him, when in reality, they are totally surrounded by Satanic forces and haven't got the slightest clue.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

No, they are not playing automatically. I went into a couple of them to see what they were about, but without spending a lot of time I could not tell whether they were even related to the OP.

Them being in the thread slows down my computer. The same thing happens on any thread where there are long videos. These are all over an hour each. When I check new posts each day, I run across them on threads where I have no interest in commenting. Those I simply move on to the next one even though each one is time consuming. I try to avoid them thereafter though it is not always possible to remember which ones are which.

When it happens on one where I may have a continuing interest in discussion it can be quite frustrating. I do not object to him posting and discussing, but being polite and considerate should be something we are all working to improve.... Thanks for your concern.

Sure, just check any thread featuring you tube songs, one after the other
It takes forever to load the pages without playing the songs

 

[marksman]

Speaking as one who has three university degrees and one theological degree, and has lectured at Bible College, there is a way to present material and a way not to. No lecturer will give you the content of five lectures in one go. They will present one lecture and let you go away to reflect on what you have been taught, or they might set you a task to fulfil about the lecture or you may discuss the content of the lecture in a tutorial.

Presenting five lectures all at one time is pointless, particularly as educational research shows that the average attention span is 20 minutes so trying to imbibe the contents of five lectures in one go is madness.

Anyone posting in these forums needs to take all that into consideration and not expect to get into heavy lecturing. often a few words will be more effective than a lengthy tome.

Most sermons in churches are a complete waste of time as they are too long. When people say to me the sermon was wonderful this morning I always ask what it was about and the reply usually is um..... it tickled their fancy but deposited nothing. (Does itching ears come to mind?).