Creationists

[Arnie Manitoba]

Ok ok, I could be a bit more specific.
I don't mean to offend anyone, I really don't.

But I find what Creationists believe bizarre. I had never heard of anyone thinking that people and dinosaurs coexisted. If somehad had told me that was what Creationists believed, I would have been skeptical. Until I met Creationists online who said they did.

But it was interesting, I wanted to know why Creationists went against what science has shown us. I could assume things, or go straight to the source and ask them why. So I did the second option.

Thank you .... and your reply makes sense .... best wishes in your studies and ask all the questions you want ... I withdraw my question asking why you are here.

Let me be very honest .... I am a firm Creationist and I realize how bizarre our position appears ... it sure looks that way at first glance.

You should also know it would not bother us one tiny bit if evolution was true .... why should it ?? Except Genesis says otherwise.

It is the evolutionist who has a problem with a Creator.

 

[snr5557]

What do you call a person who sows discord on the internet by starting arguments or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community(such as a forum, chat room, or blog), either accidentally or with deliberate intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion?

Wikipedia says troll. Just sayin...Carry on

I just wanted to see your viewpoint, I honestly didn't want to hurt anyone's feelings. I may have gotten heated in a debate and acted in frustration, but I tried to go back and apologize whenever my frustration got the better of me.

And they weren't off topic to me, they relate to Christianity so I assume we can talk about it on here.

 

[aspen]

Thank you .... and your reply makes sense .... best wishes in your studies and ask all the questions you want ... I withdraw my question asking why you are here.

Let me be very honest .... I am a firm Creationist and I realize how bizarre our position appears ... it sure looks that way at first glance.

You should also know it would not bother us one tiny bit if evolution was true .... why should it ?? Except Genesis says otherwise.

It is the evolutionist who has a problem with a Creator.

I think this is a reasonable position. Perhaps I will be interested in how God created the universe when I get to Heaven, but somehow, I cannot see it being relevant anymore.

 

[River Jordan]

You should also know it would not bother us one tiny bit if evolution was true .... why should it ?? Except Genesis says otherwise.

Where? I don't remember any scripture that says "evolution never happens".

It is the evolutionist who has a problem with a Creator.

In another thread I showed how the actual survey data indicates that the vast majority of "evolutionists" are theists.

 

[williemac]

Where? I don't remember any scripture that says "evolution never happens".


In another thread I showed how the actual survey data indicates that the vast majority of "evolutionists" are theists.

That is simply not true. There is no such thing as "the" survey data. The surveys are plentiful and all over the map. One of them has about 7% of evolutionists as being believers in a personal God. Even Einstein, who did not consider himself an atheist or an agnostic, did not believe in a 'personal' God. The word "theist" can take on any number of meanings depending upon the user of it, as well as the word "creationist".

That being said, the majority of surveys find that most scientists do not accept the idea of a superior and intelligent Being, being responsible for the existence of life. That is the reality. And most evolutionists prefer to think that life came along all on its own, and evolved from there.

While I can appreciate that most of us agree here that God created the universe and life, just how He did it is not fully known and will not be fully known or understood by anyone in this age. But the bible does not allow for the idea that He did it by evolving all of life's species from a single source. If He did that, there would be enough information in scripture to give room for that discussion. He is the Master communicator. He did not give any scriptural hint whatsoever for evolution of life from a single source.

He made man in His image....from the primordial soup? Not a chance. From an evolved chimpanzee (or facsimile thereof)? Really? REALLY? Are we even having this conversation?

 

[horsecamp]

being brought up Lutheran justification along with other bible teachings like creationism is just another part of being brought up to be Lutheran.

 

[IBeMe]

River Jordan : Can you provide a source where a scientist claims "rocks became men"?

That was a figurative representation of the plight.

I'll ask the technically correct question to comply with the tacky retort.

How long have you believed that dust and gas can become men?

.

 

[snr5557]

How long have you believed that dust and gas can become men?

.

...isn't that your belief?


"Genesis 2:7


7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul."

 

[Mr.Bride]

...isn't that your belief?
"Genesis 2:7

7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul."

Snr isn't all scripture God-breathed?

 

[KingJ]

When and why did you become a Creationist? If you can remember.

When I was in my teens and twenties I never really addressed or gave much thought to evolution or creation. I never saw evolution as a real threat to the bible's creation stories. That was until I got attacked publicly by a couple atheists for being a naive Christian. They used evolution as grounds to mock scripture. This forced me to deal with it. What I found was that evolutionists are like magicians. They use miss-direction and illusions to fill in the blanks. As Kent Hovind says a frog to a prince...quite a magic act indeed! How do you pull it off? Keep people focused on morphology and adaptation (Fact) whilst slipping in couple of millions and millions of years carbon dating.... as anything can happen over millions of years (half truth) then the stage is set to sneak in the theory that we come from frogs. Now this would not be such an issue if all in this world were Christians...but sadly most hate God. Now those that hate God love themselves. The purpose of evolution now becomes crystal clear. It is a belief system that encourages you to live as you please as you are your own god. As that song goes ''you and me baby ain't nothing but mammals... so lets do sin'.

I have also grown rapidly in my knowledge and understanding of scripture. I now know without a shadow of a doubt the importance of ''dealing with'' all scripture. Many Christians are guilty of ignoring scripture they can't deal with. This leads down only two possible paths. 1. False teacher or 2. Lose Christianity.

Conclusion: Knowing Jesus is Lord as truth (1 Cor 12:3) convinced me that His word is truth (John 1:1) and forced me to accept Genesis. Attacks by atheists forced me to learn / deal with Genisis as the goals of those driving evolution became clear.

 

[IBeMe]

snr5557 :
...isn't that your belief?
"Genesis 2:7
7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul."

_________________________________________
_________________________________________
Origin of Life
_________________________________________
_________________________________________

_________________________________________
Here is what I believe...
_________________________________________
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
_________________________________________


_________________________________________
Here is what you believe...
_________________________________________
null
_________________________________________


Whoops ... Rather void right now!

Well, there used to be a bunch of stuff there ... tons of theories ... mountains of formulas ...

Then, they found out all that stuff was real stupid.

Currently, there's a massive effort to find a replacement for stupid.

we're still waiting...

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

The evolutionist will observe a new variety of goatsbears plant and then offer it as proof that the whole universe simply made itself

Talk about a joke !!!!!

 

[KingJ]

Currently, there's a massive effort to find a replacement for stupid.

we're still waiting...

I was watching the science channel a while back. They were talking about the guy that invented the sludge theory. After a couple of years it was debunked by a student in his classroom. The student asked ''where did the sludge come from?'' .

 

[River Jordan]

That is simply not true. There is no such thing as "the" survey data.

What are you talking about? Of course it's true that I provided survey data to show that the vast majority of "evolutionists" cannot be atheists. If only 2% of the world's population are atheists, yet most people surveyed accept that evolution is real, then it's impossible for "most evolutionists are atheists" to be true. A two percent minority cannot make up a majority.

The surveys are plentiful and all over the map. One of them has about 7% of evolutionists as being believers in a personal God.

Sorry, but you're going to have to provide a link to that. No way I'm just taking your word for it.

Even Einstein, who did not consider himself an atheist or an agnostic, did not believe in a 'personal' God. The word "theist" can take on any number of meanings depending upon the user of it, as well as the word "creationist".

The claim was that "most evolutionists are atheists". A theist is the opposite of an atheist. Sheesh.

That being said, the majority of surveys find that most scientists do not accept the idea of a superior and intelligent Being, being responsible for the existence of life. That is the reality. And most evolutionists prefer to think that life came along all on its own, and evolved from there.

Now you're moving the goalposts.

While I can appreciate that most of us agree here that God created the universe and life, just how He did it is not fully known and will not be fully known or understood by anyone in this age. But the bible does not allow for the idea that He did it by evolving all of life's species from a single source. If He did that, there would be enough information in scripture to give room for that discussion. He is the Master communicator. He did not give any scriptural hint whatsoever for evolution of life from a single source.

He made man in His image....from the primordial soup? Not a chance. From an evolved chimpanzee (or facsimile thereof)? Really? REALLY? Are we even having this conversation?

The Genesis creation account has a consistent theme...God lets the earth bring forth life. That's evolution.

That was a figurative representation of the plight.

I'll ask the technically correct question to comply with the tacky retort.

How long have you believed that dust and gas can become men?

It, and your latest description, are deliberate straw man fallacies. If you cannot address the subject as it exists, then just say so.

As Kent Hovind says a frog to a prince...quite a magic act indeed!

Kent Hovind?? LOL! Well, that certainly explains a lot.

The evolutionist will observe a new variety of goatsbears plant and then offer it as proof that the whole universe simply made itself

Talk about a joke !!!!!

Can you show where anyone has done that?

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

I know of one survey in the USA where 70% of the scientists privately said they did not believe in evolution

But they also said they cannot go public because they would lose their positions or if they mentioned it as professors they would be censored and then never re-hired

Why do evolutionists feel so threatened by the concept of creation??

Molecular biologist David Berlinksi speaks on this topic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5r5cRlctLM&list=PLF5C05EE1C5AE2F72&index=1

 

[River Jordan]

I know of one survey in the USA where 70% of the scientists privately said they did not believe in evolution

But they also said they cannot go public because they would lose their positions or if they mentioned it as professors they would be censored and then never re-hired

Please provide a citation for this survey. No way I'm just taking your word for it.

Molecular biologist David Berlinksi speaks on this topic.

Please provide actual data, not unsubstantiated claims by people working at the creationist Discovery Institute.

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

.

.


Another wiggle and squirm by a devout fundamentalist evolutionist.

 

[River Jordan]

??????? Where's the survey you claim shows "70% of the scientists privately said they did not believe in evolution"?

 

[IBeMe]

River Jordan : It, and your latest description, are deliberate straw man fallacies. If you cannot address the subject as it exists, then just say so.

How long have you believed that dust and gas can become men through random occurrence?

If you can't answer, then just say so.

NASA's Exobiology program... origin, evolution, and distribution of life in the universe.

1. The Cosmic Evolution of the Biogenic Compounds
2. Prebiotic Evolution
3. The Early Evolution of Life
4. The Evolution of Advanced Life

( NASA- EXOBIOLOGY - A Program of NASA's Solar System Exploration Division - Written by NASA Exobiology Program Manager: Michael A. Meyer )

Epoch 2 & 3

Note: not a straw-man question ... real evolutionary science question.

.

 

[River Jordan]

How long have you believed that dust and gas can become men through random occurrence?

Never.

Note: not a straw-man question ... real evolutionary science question.

Yes it is.