Deconstruction Part 2: Into Apostolicity

[Hepzibah]

Do you know if Eastern Orthodox preaches the need to be born again of the Spirit? I asked an EO person that question on the forum recently but he never answered.

I am not an expert, but I believe that they say it is when we are Spirit baptized.

 

[Lizbeth]

I am not an expert, but I believe that they say it is when we are Spirit baptized.

ok, thanks. I will try to look it up. I wonder if they have the sacrament of "confirmation"...the RCC believes that is when one receives the Holy Spirit, but it is only a ritual.

 

[Hepzibah]

There is water baptism then hands are lain on the person and prayers are said for the Spirit to baptize. They believe it happens but it is doubtful.

No confirmation as far as I know.

 

[Hepzibah]

Baptism And The Ante-Nicene Fathers

How did the Ante-Nicene Church Fathers understand baptism? Was it essential or was it just a act of obedience? First let me clarify, the Ante-Nicene Church Fathers are those men who led the church prior to the Council of Nicaea in 325 A.D. Any...

www.christianityboard.com

 

[Lizbeth]

Baptism And The Ante-Nicene Fathers

How did the Ante-Nicene Church Fathers understand baptism? Was it essential or was it just a act of obedience? First let me clarify, the Ante-Nicene Church Fathers are those men who led the church prior to the Council of Nicaea in 325 A.D. Any...

www.christianityboard.com

Thanks for that. The Lord gave me understanding one time that water baptism is a kind of prophetic act, meaning that it uses the principle of first the natural then the spiritual. Enacting something in the natural realm by faith which helps to seal it or bring it about (if that's the right way to say it) in the spiritual realm. I'm sure we all must agree that water baptism without faith is just an empty ritual though. It doesn't save anyone in itself, but if we have come to faith in Christ baptism does have a certain power....I don't think God would have asked us to do it for no reason.

I believe it is a spiritual weapon in a way....helps to deal with sin....maybe that is what being baptized for the remission of sins means......it seems to help one walk away from sin. Without baptism from what I've seen it seems that people can struggle more with sins. Not carved in stone but just something I seem to have observed. Maybe it has to do with level of commitment as well...being baptized demonstrates a kind of commitment to the faith I think (assuming one has faith). Not being baptized after having believed sometimes might mean someone isn't as committed as they need to be.

Here's another kind of baptism that comes to mind, just as an aside since we're on the subject:

Mat 20:22-23

But Jesus answered and said, Ye know not what ye ask. Are ye able to drink of the cup that I shall drink of, and to be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with? They say unto him, We are able.

And he saith unto them, Ye shall drink indeed of my cup, and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with: but to sit on my right hand, and on my left, is not mine to give, but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared of my Father.


Act 14:22

Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.



The narrow way of the cross, the fellowship of His sufferings, trials and tribulations.

 

[Wynona]

Do you find yourself questioning man-inspired doctrines and traditions and the religious certainties associated with these? Are you outgrowing the framework that holds you back from spiritual growth? Join me as we explore what it means to be apostolic in our pursuit of Christ.

Loved the video. I felt encouraged.

You said, "You can forsake the flesh long before it's taken from you." toward the end. Do you mean walking in the Spirit or sowing to the Spirit?

This past three years, my husband and I have gone through a tough calling and suffered. But we know it means that God is calling us to carry our respective crosses. To die daily. To lose our lives so we can find it. No church prepared us but Scripture did.

We trust no church for now, only Scripture...

I think the terms you use are different than what Ive become used to. When you say "first cut" and "second cut", Ive heard it like, "To be saved initially is not the same as being saved in the end."

Those who practice iniquity get weeded out of the Kingdom by angels.

Id love to think we could find a church. But we might have to operate without an official one for a while yet.

Were being tested and tried. And were happy because that reassures us were doing things right. Because the call to Christ is a call to suffer.

I think first cut Christians can have better lives at first. But we can't stay there comfortably if were to answer the call fully and be chosen.

 

[Ritajanice]

I have never ever taken any interest in any other study of religion.

Why would I want to do that, when I know from day one that I’m Born Again/ spirit child of God.

Drawn by him, Born by his seed....a disciple follower of Christ, I have no choice, Praise God, he took me out of that nightmare of an existence....and placed me in His Son....what an Honour and Privilege that is.

I wouldn’t give any other theologian the time of day....when I have 24/7 communion with my Spirit Father , via His Spirit...chosen and predestined to become a spirit child of God!

My opinion testimony and belief.

 

[Episkopos]

Loved the video. I felt encouraged.

I'm pleased to know that you were encouraged (in the inner man)! Thank you for your encouragement! :) <><

You said, "You can forsake the flesh long before it's taken from you." toward the end. Do you mean walking in the Spirit or sowing to the Spirit?

IOW we sow to the Spirit long before we reap a spiritual walk of victory...or walk in the Spirit. We reap as we sow, but God will test us to make us genuine in faith and faithfulness. He is forging a character in His children that can withstand the rigours and attacks of one who stands in holiness. Not easy by any stretch. But God knows how to fortify what is weak and ready to break. The enemy doesn't need to attack those who have already been overcome by unbelief or else outer man religious certainties. These things he (the devil) both encourages and defends using human passions in the ones who are deceived into serving him.

This past three years, my husband and I have gone through a tough calling and suffered. But we know it means that God is calling us to carry our respective crosses. To die daily. To lose our lives so we can find it. No church prepared us but Scripture did.

Amen. To walk alone is the call of a saint. But at least you have each other! :) Finding others who walk the narrow path is very difficult. Either you will encounter unbelief or surface claimers which is much worse. Which is worse?.... a bottle of poison that is marked poison...or a bottle of poison marked "safe"?

We trust no church for now, only Scripture...

Again amen. Cursed are they who trust in men. You are the church. Jesus had nowhere to lay His head...no place He could call home in this world. Our citizenship is in heaven.

I think the terms you use are different than what Ive become used to. When you say "first cut" and "second cut", Ive heard it like, "To be saved initially is not the same as being saved in the end."

Or..."saved from" and "saved to". I use the word "cut" since God "cuts" a covenant with us who are willing to lose what we have to obtain what He wants to give us in His mercy and love.

Those who practice iniquity get weeded out of the Kingdom by angels.

Body ministry should be helping people to avoid that eventuality. But there are so few who understand kingdom things, eternal things.

Id love to think we could find a church. But we might have to operate without an official one for a while yet.

Or pray that the Lord sends people to you...to find other seekers to be in fellowship with.

Were being tested and tried. And were happy because that reassures us were doing things right. Because the call to Christ is a call to suffer.

Amen. When we suffer we receive comfort from the Lord. When we suffer much we get more comfort from Him.

I think first cut Christians can have better lives at first. But we can't stay there comfortably if were to answer the call fully and be chosen.

It's easy to accept a salvation that leaves sin intact. One can be seduced by a decoy gospel that promises forgiveness without holiness. But judgment is coming for those who abuse grace and turn away from God's will.

Thanks for your response. A breath of fresh air for me to read this. :) Peace and blessings to you and yours.

 

[Wynona]

Or pray that the Lord sends people to you...to find other seekers to be in fellowship with.

God is doing this in His timing. He is faithful.

Thanks for the detailed response. I appreciate what you said about sowing to the Spirit. How reaping can come both by increment and in full holiness. That makes sense to me and also is biblical.

I confess, when you used the term "higher walk" in the past, I wasn't sure what to think because we are all supposed to be on it. But I'll definitely grant that 99 percent of churches don't prepare believers for the narrow path, which is now what I think you mean by "higher walk".

 

[Wynona]

@Episkopos Hopefully Im not talking too much but my take on where I'm at now is that I'm sowing to the Spirit but have not overcome.

I have to stay in the Scriptures every day and avoid all the bad music and content like the plague in order to not be carnal and sinful. So, it's not that Wesleyan holiness or supernatural holiness experience, though there's been times when certain sins simply seem to fall off.

But not to worry. I think God can and will handle the journey with the lovely secret sauce of sainthood: suffering!

It's painful, but it sure works! Thanks again and God bless you and yours too!