Did Jesus have faith ?

[ChristisGod]

First of all, you have no idea how much I have studied this out. Secondly, Jesus, not some ecumenical council, is my authority.

You enjoy the comfort and security of allowing others to do your thinking. Your comments display the devils bargain with authoritarian rule: He gives you comfort and a sense of security in exchange for blind obedience. You have "religious beliefs" rather than "rational beliefs". You believe various goofy ideas, not because they make sense in the real world, but out of loyalty to your religion. Rather than placing complete trust and confidence in Jesus Christ, you are placing your confidence in other men, who are hamstrung by their culture. You have a strong belief in a dogma of your religion, which is not based in truth. It's goofy.

Your so-called doctrine of the hypostatic union is goofy. Silly, wacky foolish, whatever you want to call it. The idea that Jesus is 100% God and 100% man is absurd. Your goofy doctrine is inconsistent with reason and common sense. Only someone committed to a religious dogma will affirm the irrational belief that something or someone can have more than one nature. pbbbt.

Consider any other dichotomy or antithesis and one can see the problem.

100% hot, 100% cold; Either something is hot or it is cold. It isn't hot and cold at the same time.
100%out, 100%safe (baseball); Either the player was out or he was safe. Not both.
100%dark, 100%light; Either a man is a son of darkness or he is a son of light
100%fictional, 100%real; Either Micky Mouse is a real person or a cartoon character
100%alive, 100%dead; A person placed into a coffin better be dead.
100%God, 100%man. Either Jesus is a man or he isn't.

All goofy ideas.

Due to the fact that an ecumenical council, hamstrung by Aristotle, an ancient philosopher/scientist's incorrect theories about how the world works, and death threats from a diabolical institution claiming to represent Jesus, we have this goofy idea, which is like an electrified fence. Anyone who touches it gets killed.

But our faith is not contrary to reason. Reason isn't the enemy of faith; fantasy is.

1)God is One Being, 3 Persons

2)You are one human being, one person with one nature which is human.

3)Jesus is one Divine being, one Person with a Divine and human nature-

4)These are biblical facts whether or not one understands them or accepts them with their reason/logic.

hope this helps!!!

 

[CadyandZoe]

1)God is One Being, 3 Persons

2)You are one human being, one person with one nature which is human.

3)Jesus is one Divine being, one Person with a Divine and human nature-

4)These are biblical facts whether or not one understands them or accepts them with their reason/logic.

hope this helps!!!

You and I share a different definition of facts.

 

[ChristisGod]

You and I share a different definition of facts.

What is your definition of God, man and Jesus ?

 

[Tong2020]

'I am crucified with Christ:
nevertheless I live;
yet not I, but Christ liveth in me:
and the life which I now live in the flesh
I live by the faith of the Son of God,
Who loved me, and gave Himself for me.'
(Gal 2:20)

Hello @Christophany,

I woke with this verse on my mind, and realised that it had application to this thread. Here again the words, 'the faith of the Son of God' is referred to, as has been referenced in previous entries, with such verses as Galatians 2:16 and Philippians 3:9 which also refer to, 'the faith of Christ'. I would appreciate hearing your response to these verses please. If you have already responded, and I have missed it, perhaps you would direct me to it by it's reference number (#..)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hello @charity,

KJV Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

If we'll consider KJV Gal.2:16, it says that a man is justified by the faith of Jesus Christ. I checked on other KJV passages that speak about the subject to see if they say the same thing as what Gal. 2:26 says.

KJV Romans 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

It says that a man is justified by faith. Could this be taken as being justified by the faith of Jesus as in Gal. 2:16? If we take that to be so, then we have Romans 3:28 as "Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by the faith of Jesus without the deeds of the law." That seems to have no problem with Gal. 2:16. However, that would render it getting out of line with verse 27.

KJV Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: 2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Verse 1 speaks of being justified by faith. Could this be taken as being justified by the faith of Jesus as in Gal. 2:16? If we take that to be so, then we have Romans 5:1 as "Therefore being justified by the faith of Jesus, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. That seems to have no problem with Gal. 2:16. However, that would render it getting out of line with verse 2.

Also, consider the question: How does the faith of Jesus justify a man?

And consider the verse that follow Galatians 2:16:

Gal. 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

Is it the faith of Jesus or is it Jesus Christ Himself that justifies a man?

Here's another to consider. This part of Galatians 2:16, "....even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ.." seems to present a problem, that is, the part "we have believed in Jesus Christ" is equivalent to having faith in Jesus Christ, which by that, the passage says, "that we might be justified by the faith of Christ". That to me, in itself sounds off a contradiction or a disharmony, moreso if we consider verse 17 which speaks of us justified by Christ.

Hope this helps.

Tong
R1135

 

[charity]

Hello @charity,

KJV Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

If we'll consider KJV Gal.2:16, it says that a man is justified by the faith of Jesus Christ. I checked on other KJV passages that speak about the subject to see if they say the same thing as what Gal. 2:26 says.

KJV Romans 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

It says that a man is justified by faith. Could this be taken as being justified by the faith of Jesus as in Gal. 2:16? If we take that to be so, then we have Romans 3:28 as "Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by the faith of Jesus without the deeds of the law." That seems to have no problem with Gal. 2:16. However, that would render it getting out of line with verse 27.

KJV Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: 2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Verse 1 speaks of being justified by faith. Could this be taken as being justified by the faith of Jesus as in Gal. 2:16? If we take that to be so, then we have Romans 5:1 as "Therefore being justified by the faith of Jesus, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. That seems to have no problem with Gal. 2:16. However, that would render it getting out of line with verse 2.

Also, consider the question: How does the faith of Jesus justify a man?

And consider the verse that follow Galatians 2:16:

Gal. 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

Is it the faith of Jesus or is it Jesus Christ Himself that justifies a man?

Here's another to consider. This part of Galatians 2:16, "....even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ.." seems to present a problem, that is, the part "we have believed in Jesus Christ" is equivalent to having faith in Jesus Christ, which by that, the passage says, "that we might be justified by the faith of Christ". That to me, in itself sounds off a contradiction or a disharmony, moreso if we consider verse 17 which speaks of us justified by Christ.

Hope this helps.

Tong
R1135

Hello @Tong2020,

Thank you for considering Galatians 2:

'We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law,
.. but by the faith of Jesus Christ,
.... even we have believed in Jesus Christ,
...... that we might be justified by the faith of Christ,
........ and not by the works of the law:
.......... for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ,
.. we ourselves also are found sinners,
.... is therefore Christ the minister of sin?
God forbid.'
(Galatians 2:15-17)

* In these verses Paul is recounting to the Galatians a confrontation he had had with Peter: in which he had defended the freedom of the Gentile believer. He includes Peter when he says to him in v.15, 'We who were Jews by nature': and He says that they both knew that man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ. They had both believed in Jesus Christ, that they may be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law, by which they knew no flesh can be justified. They sought to be justified by Christ.

* What is the faith of Jesus Christ? He willingly lay down His life as an atonement for sin: and as the words of a hymn says, ... ... and opened the life-gate that all may come in.' - That in itself was an act of faith on His part.

* The countrymen of both Peter and Paul had a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God's righteousness (ie., justification) were seeking to establish their own righteousness (ie., to justify themselves), by the keeping of the law, and therefore had not submitted themselves unto the righteousness (ie., justification) which is of God.' (Romans 10:1-4) 'For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness (ie., justification) to every one that believeth'.

* You have quite rightly referred to Romans 3:27-28 & Romans 5:1.

* I believe it is 'the faith of Jesus Christ', or 'His faithfulness' in laying down His life for the sin of mankind, and rising again to 'justification of life,' that justifies those who believe in Him as God's only begotten Son. The One Who took upon Himself the penalty for sin in order that we may live through Him. It is by our identification with Christ in His death, His burial, His quickening and His resurrection, that we become dead unto sin, and alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord; and that is a work of God which comes into operation the moment we believe on the Lord Jesus Christ (baptism by the Spirit). In Whom we receive the forgiveness of sin and the hope of eternal life, and are accepted by God the Father in the Beloved; thereby being made complete in Him.

'Therefore as by the offence of one
judgment came upon all men to condemnation;
even so by the righteousness of One
the free gift came upon all men
unto justification of life.'
(Rom 5:18)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Tong2020]

Hello @Tong2020,

Thank you for considering Galatians 2:

'We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law,
.. but by the faith of Jesus Christ,
.... even we have believed in Jesus Christ,
...... that we might be justified by the faith of Christ,
........ and not by the works of the law:
.......... for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ,
.. we ourselves also are found sinners,
.... is therefore Christ the minister of sin?
God forbid.'
(Galatians 2:15-17)

* In these verses Paul is recounting to the Galatians a confrontation he had had with Peter: in which he had defended the freedom of the Gentile believer. He includes Peter when he says to him in v.15, 'We who were Jews by nature': and He says that they both knew that man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ. They had both believed in Jesus Christ, that they may be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law, by which they knew no flesh can be justified. They sought to be justified by Christ.

Regarding justification, to me, one is justified by someone, that is, Jesus Christ, and is justified through faith. I see it in the same way I see salvation, where one is saved by Jesus Christ (the Savior), and is saved through faith.

* What is the faith of Jesus Christ? He willingly lay down His life as an atonement for sin: and as the words of a hymn says, ... ... and opened the life-gate that all may come in.' - That in itself was an act of faith on His part.

To me, I see Jesus as having faith for so many reasons. Let me give a couple of reasons.

Jesus was born under the law. He submitted to the Law and obeyed the commandments therein. That would tell us that He believed the Law is holy, and the commandment holy and just and good. That clearly is having faith in God who gave the Law.

Jesus always pray to the Father in heaven. That is clearly having faith in the Father in heaven.

What is the faith of Jesus Christ? I'd say it is faith in the one true God. His faith was shown by and in all of His works, all that He had done, as faith is shown in works (James 2:18).

The countrymen of both Peter and Paul had a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God's righteousness (ie., justification) were seeking to establish their own righteousness (ie., to justify themselves), by the keeping of the law, and therefore had not submitted themselves unto the righteousness (ie., justification) which is of God.' (Romans 10:1-4) 'For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness (ie., justification) to every one that believeth'.

What is the righteousness of God? To me, the righteousness of God is not the same as justification, though are very much related and connected.

KJV Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

* I believe it is 'the faith of Jesus Christ', or 'His faithfulness' in laying down His life for the sin of mankind, and rising again to 'justification of life,' that justifies those who believe in Him as God's only begotten Son. The One Who took upon Himself the penalty for sin in order that we may live through Him. It is by our identification with Christ in His death, His burial, His quickening and His resurrection, that we become dead unto sin, and alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord; and that is a work of God which comes into operation the moment we believe on the Lord Jesus Christ (baptism by the Spirit). In Whom we receive the forgiveness of sin and the hope of eternal life, and are accepted by God the Father in the Beloved; thereby being made complete in Him.

'Therefore as by the offence of one
judgment came upon all men to condemnation;
even so by the righteousness of One
the free gift came upon all men
unto justification of life.'
(Rom 5:18)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

As for me, I believe, Jesus Christ is the Savior, and is the one who justifies, and that it is the Father who gives people to Jesus Christ, drawing them to Jesus, having granted them to come to Jesus, and be saved by Him (John 6). Faith (obviously in God, in Jesus Christ) is through and by which these people are justified by and in Jesus Christ. And that it is by grace that they are saved by Jesus Christ, through faith (Eph. 2).

Tong
R1145