Did Jesus return around 70 AD?

[Jay Ross]

Did Jesus return around 70 AD?

NO, it is very difficult for anyone to return around 70 AD because 70 AD is difficult to find as it is on the fourth cardinal axis which is used for measurement and very difficult to hold onto to wrap oneself around..

 

[shepherdsword]

The proof is in the Bible. There are interpretations that cover all your questions, just like there are interpretations that explain Premill and Amill positions.

The problem I see is that folks tend to say it should be obvious there was no coming in 70AD but then fail to present any physical evidence. All it would take is to have a physically dead body of David, an apostle, or any other believer prior to 70AD. Where’s the evidence? We can’t prove a negative, so we can’t prove Christ came by saying there aren’t any physical bodies of believers but we can prove a positive, by presenting a physical body and thus proving there wasn’t a coming in 70AD.

There is no evidence as of yet that Noah’s ark existed but we all believe it because we believe the Bible is true. When a person reads the Bible and comes to the understanding that a soon coming was prophesied, they believe it and come to the conclusion that it happened in 70AD based on the secular writings of people like Josephus.

The burden of physical evidence is on you to prove the resurrection happened. There is no physical evidence if it never happened. There should be some if it did happen. Please show it to us. Unless a body has been mummified it is long in the dust by now

A human body typically takes 10 to 15 years to decompose down to a skeleton in a standard casket, and another 80 to 100 years (or longer) for the bones themselves to disintegrate and return to the soil. [1]
Total decomposition time depends heavily on burial conditions, environment, and preparation:

Timeline Breakdown

• • Soft Tissue Decay (1 to 10 years): Soft organs and muscles liquefy and break down via autolysis (self-digestion) and putrefaction (bacterial action). In uncoffined or natural burials, soft tissues vanish in about 1 year, leading to skeletonization in 5 to 10 years. In a standard sealed casket with embalming chemicals, reaching a complete skeleton takes 10 to 15 years (and up to 50+ years if tightly sealed in metal). [1, 2, 3, 4]
  • Skeletonization to Disintegration (50 to 100+ years): Once only the skeleton remains, the inorganic and organic components of bone slowly leach into the surrounding earth. This final breakdown into mineral dust or soil generally takes another 80 years or more, depending on whether the bones are exposed or buried
  • How many years since 70AD?

 

[grafted branch]

The burden of physical evidence is on you to prove the resurrection happened. There is no physical evidence if it never happened. There should be some if it did happen. Please show it to us. Unless a body has been mummified it is long in the dust by now

A human body typically takes 10 to 15 years to decompose down to a skeleton in a standard casket, and another 80 to 100 years (or longer) for the bones themselves to disintegrate and return to the soil. [1]
Total decomposition time depends heavily on burial conditions, environment, and preparation:

Timeline Breakdown

• • Soft Tissue Decay (1 to 10 years): Soft organs and muscles liquefy and break down via autolysis (self-digestion) and putrefaction (bacterial action). In uncoffined or natural burials, soft tissues vanish in about 1 year, leading to skeletonization in 5 to 10 years. In a standard sealed casket with embalming chemicals, reaching a complete skeleton takes 10 to 15 years (and up to 50+ years if tightly sealed in metal). [1, 2, 3, 4]
  • Skeletonization to Disintegration (50 to 100+ years): Once only the skeleton remains, the inorganic and organic components of bone slowly leach into the surrounding earth. This final breakdown into mineral dust or soil generally takes another 80 years or more, depending on whether the bones are exposed or buried
  • How many years since 70AD?

A person can’t prove a negative. I can’t prove that there are no bodies of believers prior to 70AD. There always could be a body that has yet to be discovered. A person can prove a positive by presenting a body of a believer who died prior to 70AD.

It might be difficult because a human body decomposes but nevertheless we do have things like James’ ossuary. All I’m really saying is there is no proof that a resurrection didn’t happen and that is the only thing that can be proven physically speaking.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

In Daniel 12:1-2 it says at that time shall Michael stand up, with a resurrection of some into everlasting life and some into everlasting contempt.

Yes, that is talking about the resurrection of ALL of the dead at the coming hour that Jesus spoke about. Not all of the dead have been resurrected, so it hasn't happened yet. Don't turn something simple into something complicated.

In Revelation 12:7 Michael fights the dragon.

Does Michael take a stand to fight the dragon at a future final coming of Christ? If the answer is no, then John 5:28 is talking about the Matthew 27 resurrection or a 70AD resurrection.

I don't believe Revelation 12:7 has any direct relation to Daniel 12:1-2. Revelation 12:7 is talking about Satan and his angels being kicked out of heaven around the time of Christ's death and resurrection at which point Satan was no longer able to accuse believers before God in heaven anymore because their sins had been covered by the blood of Christ. And, again, Matthew 27:52-53 says nothing about anyone being resurrected unto condemnation and to shame and everlasting contempt. You're trying to relate unrelated verses.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Did Jesus return around 70 AD?

NO, it is very difficult for anyone to return around 70 AD because 70 AD is difficult to find as it is on the fourth cardinal axis which is used for measurement and very difficult to hold onto to wrap oneself around..

 

[shepherdsword]

A person can’t prove a negative.

Then why are you asking me to prove one? I am asking you to prove the resurrection happened. (positive)You are asking me to prove it didn't(negative)

 

[grafted branch]

I don't believe Revelation 12:7 has any direct relation to Daniel 12:1-2.

Is the Michael in Daniel 12 the same Michael in Revelation 12? If it is the same Michael then Revelation 12 is when Michael stands up.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Is the Michael in Daniel 12 the same Michael in Revelation 12? If it is the same Michael then Revelation 12 is when Michael stands up.

You are just making an assumption for no real reason other than that both verses mention Michael. That is not how to interpret scripture. The context of each passage is different, as I already explained. Do you see any resurrection referenced in Revelation 12? It's not there. You're trying to relate unrelated verses, as I already said. And, you continue to not address what I'm saying about Matthew 27:52-53 as far as the fact that it says nothing about anyone being resurrected unto shame and everlasting contempt at that time. That will happen in the future when all of the dead throughout the world are resurrected and then judged. The judgment of all people can be seen in Matthew 25:31-46. That clearly has not happened yet. It will happen after all of the dead are resurrected in the future when Jesus returns.

 

[jeffweeder]

Jesus most likely was talking about the Matthew 27:52-53 resurrection.

Not likely at all.
Jesus had not ascended at that point.
We know that when he appears again after ascending, we will have a body like his glorious body and that hasn't happened to anyone yet. Mortality will finally put on immortality.

 

[grafted branch]

Then why are you asking me to prove one? I am asking you to prove the resurrection happened. (positive)You are asking me to prove it didn't(negative)

There are empty graves in Jerusalem but if I say that proves a resurrection nobody’s going to simply believe it because that’s circumstantial evidence. There are no other records of the Matthew 27:52-53 resurrection but we believe it happened because the Bible says so.

It all comes down to how we interpret the scripture. Again, if a body of a pre 70AD believer was discovered, almost nobody would think a 70AD resurrection occurred.

 

[grafted branch]

You are just making an assumption for no real reason other than that both verses mention Michael. That is not how to interpret scripture. The context of each passage is different, as I already explained. Do you see any resurrection referenced in Revelation 12? It's not there. You're trying to relate unrelated verses, as I already said. And, you continue to not address what I'm saying about Matthew 27:52-53 as far as the fact that it says nothing about anyone being resurrected unto shame and everlasting contempt at that time. That will happen in the future when all of the dead throughout the world are resurrected and then judged. The judgment of all people can be seen in Matthew 25:31-46. That clearly has not happened yet. It will happen after all of the dead are resurrected in the future when Jesus returns.

I’m interpreting scripture with scripture. There is only one Michael and he takes a stand in Revelation 12. I’m sorry that doesn’t fit your narrative but it does fit the Preterist view.

 

[grafted branch]

Not likely at all.
Jesus had not ascended at that point.
We know that when he appears again after ascending, we will have a body like his glorious body and that hasn't happened to anyone yet. Mortality will finally put on immortality.

Matthew 27:53 says “And came out of the graves after his resurrection …”

It happened after His resurrection.

 

[TribulationSigns]

This is when believers have been born again through the Spirit of Christ. It is when we spiritually have part in Christ, Who is the "first resurrection." I agree this happens in life before we die, when we have part in the first resurrection partaking of Christ's resurrection life, our eternal spiritual life, living and reigning with Him physically on earth, but spiritually in the Kingdom of God in heaven.

You got it.