Does God Change His Mind?

[Hitch]

THE FUNDAMENTAL PREMISE IN ITS CONTRAST WITH THE TRADITIONAL CLASSICAL PREMISE​

At the root of this whole subject there is an unmentioned premise that must be clearly grasped in its contrast with the traditional classical theology.
The classical view emphasized that God’s sovereign determination of his plan does not eliminate the reality of the rational agents’ (angels and humans) ability to take decisions in view of motives so as to be accountable to God’s judgment. The Philadelphia Confession of Faith, paralleling in this the Westminster Confession, states:

God hath Decreed in Himself from all Eternity, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will, freely and unchangeably, all things whatsoever come to pass; yet so as thereby is God neither the author of sin . . . nor is violence offered to the will of the creature. . . (3:1).
The doctrine of this high mystery of predestination... (3:7).​

Because the coexistence of these two aspects cannot be fully harmonized within the range of finite reason, there is a ready recognition of a mystery or antinomy at this point.
The open view asserts that certainty is incompatible with free agency, so that a divine determination has to stop at the place where freedom begins, If freedom is to be properly recognized it is obviously impossible to know in advance what a free agent will decide. Foreknowledge, even with God, is guesswork: educated guesswork perhaps, but guesswork nevertheless. Prophecy, therefore, to the extent that it involves free agents, or agents that are in existence by virtue of some free decision, is clearly impossible. Any attempt to it, even by God himself, remains open to the possibility of being wrong. Assuming, therefore, that God created some free agents in that sense, it was impossible for him to have a clearly delineated purpose with precise expectations in detail. The only possibility is a wide-open universe, not a merely “partially open” universe as Boyd asserts. Obviously God would plan in detail the course of physical bodies like the sun and the planets, or like hydrogen and oxygen, but as soon as free agents have a place in the equation, a situation of risk is involved. God, by creating angels and humans, ceased to be the almighty sovereign of heaven and earth who planned all things according to his own majestic, wise and holy purpose, but he accepted the role of the monumental gambler who, trusting in his unlimited adequacy, chose to open wide the door to unforeseen, unlimited possibilities to be determined by the will of the creatures. This is what is implied in the title of John Sanders’ recent volume: The God Who Risks. What the results of this risk entailed will be considered below.



http://www.the-highway.com/possible_Nicole.html

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

Yes he does , and yes he has. Next question.

 

[Hitch]

Yes he does , and yes he has. Next question.

Then assurance of salvation is impossible.

Yes he does , and yes he has. Next question.

So all that stuff about watching Israel you make such a fuss over.

How do you know that is still in the plans?

How do you know the canon is complete?

Pagans ascribed human frailties to their gods , so do you.

 

[Nathantaurus90]

No, God doesn't change;

James 1:17:

''Whatever is good and perfect comes down to us from God our Father, who created all the lights in the heavens. He never changes or casts a shifting shadow.''

Malachi 3:6:

''For I, Jehovah, change not; therefore ye, O sons of Jacob, are not consumed.''

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

He changed his mind in Nineveh

 

[aspen]

No God does not change His mind. When it appears that He is changing His mind, He is merely trying to teach humanity empathy or obedience.

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

I know I am splitting hairs but Genesis 6:7 reads :

[sup]7 [/sup]So the Lord said, “I will wipe from the face of the earth the human race I have created—and with them the animals, the birds and the creatures that move along the ground—for I regret that I have made them.

then later He said :

[sup]8 [/sup]But Noah found favor in the eyes of the Lord.

Can we say He changed His mind ? ..... He saved the eight people on the ark , plus the animals

Also ... does God still regret he made us (as per verse 7) .... or has he changed his mind?

Like I said , I am probably guilty of splitting hairs .... maybe it would be more correct to say God ... "had a change of heart"

I confess being uncomfortable pretending to know even the slightest thing about all the attributes of God. I am not qualified.

Yet I do have complete faith he will never change his mind about our salvation. He has given us His word.

But he also says "All Israel will be saved" ... He made a covenant with them too.

He says He does it (saves Israel) for His own reasons , and for His Holy Name .... not because Israel deserves it.

Lets face it .... we don't deserve anything either.

Whew !!!

 

[aspen]

I don't know about that Arnie....

Seems to me that God could not be all-knowing if He could change His mind or really have regrets.

I also think that the witnesses of God who passed down the stories that make up the Bible would certainly have the perspective that God changed His mind when they saw the Flood.

Guess we will have to wait until Heaven to know for sure

 

[JoeinArkansas]

I don't know about that Arnie....

Seems to me that God could not be all-knowing if He could change His mind or really have regrets.

I also think that the witnesses of God who passed down the stories that make up the Bible would certainly have the perspective that God changed His mind when they saw the Flood.

Guess we will have to wait until Heaven to know for sure

God certainly does not change His mind. If He did it would mean that He is not all knowing and all powerful. This creation is completely operating by the will of God. Nothing happens in His creation that He did not plan and cause it to happen. He is fully responsible for all things...including all the evil in the world. All is progressing as He planned from the beginning. He is not on plan B or C. He reigns supreme and His will is being done and will always be done. He has a time and a season for all things. Evil and death are part of His plan now but they will not always be. Someday, when God's plans for His creation are complete, Jesus will turn over the Kingdom of Heaven to Him, having saved all of mankind and destroyed death (and evil). To believe anything to the contrary is to bring God down to the level of mankind who is weak and sinful.

Isa 45:5-7 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me: That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else. I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Isa 54:16 Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy.

Ecc 1:13 An experience of evil God has given to the sons of humanity to humble them by it.

Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Job 23:13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? And what his soul desireth, that will he do. (Darby)

Isa 46:10-11 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it, I will also do it.

2 Chron 20:6 and he said, Jehovah, God of our fathers, art not thou God in the heavens, and rulest thou not over all the kingdoms of the nations? And in thy hand there is power and might, and none can withstand thee. (Darby)

1 Cor 15:20-28 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the consummation, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Joe

 

[aspen]

God certainly does not change His mind. If He did it would mean that He is not all knowing and all powerful. This creation is completely operating by the will of God. Nothing happens in His creation that He did not plan and cause it to happen. He is fully responsible for all things...including all the evil in the world. All is progressing as He planned from the beginning. He is not on plan B or C. He reigns supreme and His will is being done and will always be done. He has a time and a season for all things. Evil and death are part of His plan now but they will not always be. Someday, when God's plans for His creation are complete, Jesus will turn over the Kingdom of Heaven to Him, having saved all of mankind and destroyed death (and evil). To believe anything to the contrary is to bring God down to the level of mankind who is weak and sinful.

Isa 45:5-7 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me: That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else. I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Isa 54:16 Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy.

Ecc 1:13 An experience of evil God has given to the sons of humanity to humble them by it.

Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Job 23:13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? And what his soul desireth, that will he do. (Darby)

Isa 46:10-11 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it, I will also do it.

2 Chron 20:6 and he said, Jehovah, God of our fathers, art not thou God in the heavens, and rulest thou not over all the kingdoms of the nations? And in thy hand there is power and might, and none can withstand thee. (Darby)

1 Cor 15:20-28 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the consummation, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Joe

Glad we can agree on this topic.

 

[rand]

Of Course He changes His mind. Didn't Moses get God to repent (change his mind) about killing all the Jews and starting over with him (Moses). Didn't God change His mind about when Jesus' time would come as far as Mary getting Jesus to turn water into wine?

God will never, however, go back on His word. That will never happen--if He spoke it, it will come to pass. His word is like a covenant.

 

[[email protected]]

The question lead to some incorrect conclusions.

If a man is saved, may he never fear punishment? The answer is no. He may certainly expect punishment if he sins. Salvation/justification is not a license to sin. It is written that on the day a righteous man sins, all his righteousness will be forgotten. Does that necessarily extend to eternal damnation? I don't believe it does.

Like a good parent, Our Heavenly Father is well able to chastise His children without throwing them out of the household.

May we expect Divine Providence to change His mind having once promised or stated a thing? No. With exception. While God may not grant a thing He declares shall not be granted, He is not without mercy. Evidence is in holy writ where God stated Moses would not enter the promised land. He did, however, extend His mercy to allow Moses to SEE the promised land. The Father shows extreme genius in His ability to mix justice and mercy - quite beyond that of human capacity to imagine.

but that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...