I wasn't trying to make your head swell... I thought I would give an example of love that you showed me... However... I don't think it is being received.
ETERNAL SECURITY FOR EVERYONE
- Thread starter Michael BoryAlis
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That's alright we are all at different levels. And some are at a level where they are unable to accept the truth as it is presented to them...such as the truth that we can experience and exhibit the love of the Lord. Not that it originates from us...But God is the one who loves other people through us.
And no, I didn't think you were trying to make my head swell...
I genuinely believe that the right kind of love does not originate in man.
That is better than I have heard from you before. Give God the glory! Either for your words or for my ears or for both!
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Actually you started with the chess metaphor. But the sad reality is that if one dies apart form Christ they are lost forever!
The true account of Lazarus and the rich man sheds much light on this topic that does not have many bible verses to explain it.
Luke 16:19-31
King James Version
19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:
20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
Points to remember:
1. The rich man did not even seek to repent and be saved from torment.
2. Verse 26 Abraham told him there was a great gulf fixed so that people could not cross over!
That plus <
Revelation 14:10-12
King James Version
10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
The torment of the lost ascends up forever! this should settle the matter for all.
Alvertsky
Active Member
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Which is why you do not understand!
Heb 9 is judgment meaning an execution of sentence!
Yes verse 28 is for those living who are looking unto HIm. Not the dead!
And if order means anything to you- then you would know that the new heavens and new earth (the all things new) occurs after the great white throne judgment and the lost are cast into the lake of fire! As rev. also says, the smoke of their torment will ascend from forever to forever!
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
I worry about neither. I trust both to the living god who promised to keep me and teach me. It amazes me how so many here pretend to practice the forbidden dark art of mindreading! If you saw how I live my life- You would probably repent in sackcloth for implying such a thing! Am I perfect? Not hardly- but I know whim my Savior is!
Romans12:9.....”Your Love must be Sincere.....HATE what is EVIL.....Cling to everything that is good”
You don't love your enemies?
I would question as to whether you have the Holy Ghost...
Rom 5:5, And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
And thus whether you have genuine faith in Jesus Christ...
Gal 3:14, That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
I don’t “ love my enemies” any more than I “ give all of my possessions to the poor” or “ invite strangers into my home to feed and clothe” or give BOTH of my cars away if somebody asks me to give them one of them.Those are some of the OTHER requirements you failed to mention.....
I am not close to where I should be or would even “like” to be.....Because I REST in the Gospel Of Grace Plus Nothing, the Holy Spirit indwells me and perhaps if I live long enough , that Spirit will Transform me to the point that I would cheerfully do ALL the things that ideally should be done....
These demands that are IMPOSSIBLE to do without extreme reluctance ( if they don’t come from the Heart, don’t waste your time— it is a Dead Work)
I ain’t Jesus . I can’t do all of the things that I am told to do.I lack the Faith.I also do not have the Faith to “ walk on water” or move a mountain just by telling it to move.Perhaps that day will arrive before I die, although I seriously doubt it.Until then, all these things that I “ should” be able to do but “ can’t” do justvreveal to me that I need GRACE and plenty of it. How about you ?
Alvertsky
Active Member
I know that there are works in accordance with His love that He has prepared beforehand for me to walk in; and that He has not required it of me to give away two cars or give all of my possessions to the poor. The latter thing would profit me nothing if I have not love.
But do you believe, or do you not believe, what it says in Romans 5:5? Have you apprehended that verse for your own life?
What matters is the root of His requirement; that we apprehend the love of the Lord by faith. if you have rejected the love of the Lord over the fact that you think that He would require too much of you in the long run if you were to live according to that love, then you have missed a specific truth in holy scripture...that He is not going to put anything in front of us that we can't handle (1 Corinthians 10:13).
The Lord graciously made it a reality in my life that I did not have even one car in ownership to myself when you required it of me to give you two of my cars. So, the Lord did not require it of me to give away two of my cars. I think that if I had owned two cars, He would have either provided money for a third or else He would have prevented you from asking me for the two. Because He loves me and does not want me to be overly burdened.
You should consider that the Lord would be that way towards you as well; and receive the love of the Lord into your heart. Love is not necessarily measured by the extent of your deed. The person who gave their body to be burned didn't even have love; and I would conclude that there are those who do not give their bodies to be burned who do indeed have love.
The word "complete" is therefore better translated as "perfect."
Col 2:10, And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
That they are two different words is evident in the following.
Col 4:12, Epaphras, who is one of you, a servant of Christ, saluteth you, always labouring fervently for you in prayers, that ye may stand perfect and complete in all the will of God.
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Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Well to one who is looking to twist th emeaning of the context- to you it will look bad.
I do not worry about hw I live because I strive to live for HIM! And I know if I fail 1 JOhn 1:9 works! Sorry you are so willing to look for the worst in believers.
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