False Prophets

[APAK]

you dont believe in the Trinity, i doubt much else you believe is true. You JW are quite the cult.

Beside scripture, you are also very ignorant of my beliefs and my strong non-affiliation with any known sect, cult or official religious denomination. I do not belong to any one of these three types I just mentioned as you belong to at least two.

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

Beside scripture, you are also very ignorant of my beliefs and my strong non-affiliation with any known sect, cult or official religious denomination. I do not belong to any one of these three types I just mentioned as you belong to at least two.

im just your standard calvinist presbyterian (PCA).

 

[Wrangler]

@Desire Of All Nations, note that your Ephesians 3:9 translation you used in one of your posts is from one of the KJVs or one of the other 15% of similar translation. They are all in error as they added the phrase 'through Jesus Christ' deliberately for a Trinity bias. This language is not in the earliest Greek manuscripts and many other post 1500s translations. Just saying....

Even the VOICE translation makes this mistake. (it is not an anti-trinitarian translation as has been alleged).

 

[Wrangler]

The KJV is the most correct translation.

Except for all the rest.

 

[Wrangler]

you dont believe in the Trinity

The trinity is not in the Bible. Why does anyone believe it?

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

If a person's fruit is bad, it's because their doctrines are bad.

Define fruit. When someone says "by their fruit you will know them", I think of this: " But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience. kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self control. Against such there is no law. " Gal. 5:22-23
It is more about the composition of a person's character reflected in his actions and deeds. It could be reflected in what comes outnof their mouths or his teaching - if he is a teacher. Not many of us claim nor are qualified to teach a class in Biblical theology amd I doubt that you have the credentials. These are just discussion/sharing forums. I suppose some may think they are conducting their own self appointed scholarly class - lol.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Actually, it can be.
Prophesying is speaking the words of God. That includes speaking the written word of God. You'll notice when you read the Prophets they expound on the already known word of God, not just predict future events.

Yes, well I was taught that speaking forth the word of God is prophesying too. Prophets do teach but teachers aren't necessarily prophets. There is a distinction in Eph. 4:11

 

[amadeus]

The trinity is not in the Bible. Why does anyone believe it?

It probably has a lot to with history and tradition and really little to do with loving God. Some sincere people simply do not know anything else. That, [the trinity], is what they have been taught and to even seriously question it would be a costly thing to their own ways... that is the ways of their flesh.

To actually go to the Bible and read it without one's own prejudices and the traditions of family and/or church [the one they or their family have attended of years... even generations] channeling their thoughts is an impossible thing for most people. God could change that , but He must be asked... or someone must really surrender to Him even on that. God does not force people to walk any particular way.

People are often [usually?] more interested in fitting in with a particular group [where friends and family are a part] than they are in really pleasing God and following Him... although many would deny it.

To actually follow Jesus as He walks rather than to follow the pathway of friend, family and home church is the thing to do...! One of those impossible things?

 

[Ferris Bueller]

but teachers aren't necessarily prophets.

I agree. Not all who teach have the specific anointing and gift to teach. And I'm okay with that.
Just like some people who evangelize do not have the specific gift and office of evangelist.
That doesn't nullify their efforts to evangelize. It just means they don't have that specific office. And so their efforts and results will be somewhat limited.

But to the point in question here, prophecy isn't just forecasting future events. It includes speaking the words of God already revealed to us. A prophet does that with power, directly in the power of the Holy Spirit speaking through him. Meanwhile, there may be teachers who are not prophets who are simply relating God's word out of the Bible. Nothing wrong with that. God can use that, too. If he can't, or doesn't, most of us are wasting a lot of time here in the forums, lol.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

The trinity is not in the Bible. Why does anyone believe it?

This is why I believe it:

"I am the First and the Last..." Revelation 1:17

3 "...how is it that Satan has filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit...? 4 ...You have not lied to men, but to God!”" Acts of the Apostles 5:3-4​

I don't know how it works (like a lot of other things).
I just know it is what it is.

 

[Enoch111]

It probably has a lot to with history and tradition and really little to do with loving God.

That is a very misleading statement, since the Holy Trinity is firmly embedded in the Bible starting with Genesis 1:1 and confirmed in John 1:1 (as well as many other passages).

To love God is to believe God, and if God tells us that the Godhead consists of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, then that is God's truth, not man's traditions. So the ones who attack the Trinity also attack the deity of Christ, which is also an attack on the Gospel, which is also an attack on the Bible. Do you see the chain of attacks?

 

[amadeus]

It probably has a lot to with history and tradition and really little to do with loving God...

That is a very misleading statement, since the Holy Trinity is firmly embedded in the Bible starting with Genesis 1:1 and confirmed in John 1:1 (as well as many other passages).

Misleading? If the Trinity is true and God wants us to believe in it, what is wrong with what I suggested here:

To actually go to the Bible and read it without one's own prejudices and the traditions of family and/or church [the one they or their family have attended of years... even generations] channeling their thoughts is an impossible thing for most people. God could change that...

...To actually follow Jesus as He walks rather than to follow the pathway of friend, family and home church is the thing to do...! One of those impossible things?

Would the Holy Spirit lead us astray if and when we come to God with open empty hands, mind and heart... and simply saying, "Lead me Lord?"

To love God is to believe God, and if God tells us that the Godhead consists of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, then that is God's truth, not man's traditions. So the ones who attack the Trinity also attack the deity of Christ, which is also an attack on the Gospel, which is also an attack on the Bible. Do you see the chain of attacks?

How does a person grow in God if he insists on holding onto everything he already has? How can any of our errors be corrected if we refuse to admit the possibility that we have any errors?

 

[Truth7t7]

the Trinity is Biblical. The KJV is the most correct translation.

410 years and going strong, The 1611 King James Comittee, 60 Christian men with qualifications uncompared, a masterpiece to the english speaking world

• PATRON
  • King James I
• TRANSLATION OVERSEER
  • Richard Bancroft
• COMMITTEE OF TWO
• COMMITTEE OF REVISERS
• FIRST WESTMINSTER COMPANY
• FIRST CAMBRIDGE COMPANY
• FIRST OXFORD COMPANY
• SECOND CAMBRIDGE COMPANY
• SECOND OXFORD COMPANY
• SECOND WESTMINSTER COMPANY
• TRANSLATOR
  • Thomas Sparke
• PRINTER
  • Robert Barker
• CONTRIBUTORS
  • (Illustrators, Geneologies, Maps, Etc.)
  • John Speed (Genealogies, Map)
  • Cornelis Boel (Artist/Engraver)
  • John More (Map)
  • Renold Elstrack (Engraver)
  • Hugh Broughton (Genealogies)

INTRODUCTION
At least sixty men were directly involved in the translation of the King James Bible (hereinafter KJB). Most were Translators, while a few were project overseers, revisers and editors. Some served in several roles. Who were these men? What were their backgrounds? What did they share? In what ways were they different? They were a diverse group. While some were born in large cities and towns, most were from small villages scattered throughout England. Several were the children of university graduates, most were not. They were sons of mariners, farmers, school teachers, cordwainers (leather merchants), fletchers (makers of bows and arrows), ministers, brewers, tailors, and aristocrats. All were members of the Church of England, but their religious views ran the gamut. Some were ardent Puritans, others staunch defenders of the religious establishment. Some believed in pre-destination and limited salvation as taught by John Calvin, while others believed in self-determination and universal access to heaven as taught by Jacobus Arminius.

All of the Translators were university graduates. Oxford and Cambridge claimed nearly equal numbers of Translators as alumni. All of the Translators except one were ordained Church of England priests. While several of the Translators had traveled to the Continent, only one had ventured to the New World. Most of the Translators were married men (38 of 60) with families. Most of the Translators spent a significant portion of their career associated with their colleges and universities as fellows, involved in teaching and administration. As fellows, they were not allowed to marry. As a result many delayed marriage until they had established themselves in church office away from the university. When the translation commenced in 1604-1605, the majority of the Translators, 22, were in their forties, 16 men were in their thirties, 15 in their fifties, 3 in their sixties and 3 in their twenties.

One Translator died in his thirties, six in their forties, nineteen in their fifties, sixteen in their sixties, four in their seventies, three in their eighties and one, over one hundred. Nine of the Translators died before the KJB was published in the 1611.

Most of the Translators were in comfortable economic circumstances during and after their time involved in the translation. The association and friendships they developed during the translation project generally advanced their careers. Some of the Translators went on to high church and academic office. Five went on to serve as bishops and two as archbishops.

They all had a familiarity with the ancient languages of Latin, Greek, Hebrew, and often many more. They came on the historical scene at a time when the knowledge of early biblical texts and language was exploding. Such a flowering of interest and expertise was unique. Bible historian, Gordon Campbell, has observed:

The population from which scholars can now be drawn is much larger than in the seventeenth century, but it would be difficult now to bring together a group of more than fifty scholars with the range of languages and knowledge of other disciplines that characterized the KJB Translators. (Bible – The Story of the King James Version 1611-2011 Oxford, Gordon Campbell, Oxford University Press 2010.)

For such a diverse group, they worked together in harmony during a generally contentious time. They had disagreements, to be sure, but they labored on, year after year. There were no "tell all books" published after the fact. Miles Smith remarked in his preface to the KJB, the Translators "were greater in other men's eyes than in their own, and sought truth rather than their own praise". They approached the task of translation with humility, understanding they were standing on the shoulders of giants like William Tyndale. Believers all, the Translators, according to Smith "craved the assistance of God's Spirit by prayer" as they proceeded in their work.

Though almost all were well known within the religious and academic community of the time, their involvement in the translation went largely unnoticed by the public. Their individual and group effort was not the subject of historical inquiry until many years after the fact. As a result, little information about the process of translation survived. The lives of the Translators and sometimes their very identity became obscured with time. In certain instances, the place of their birth and burial is unknown, and their family circumstance in doubt. Until this anniversary year, few could name even one Translator, let alone sixty. The following brief biographies are written in the hope to shed further light on these men who contributed so much.

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

410 years and going strong, The 1611 King James Comittee, 60 Christian men with qualifications uncompared, a masterpiece to the english speaking world

• PATRON
  • King James I
• TRANSLATION OVERSEER
  • Richard Bancroft
• COMMITTEE OF TWO
• COMMITTEE OF REVISERS
• FIRST WESTMINSTER COMPANY
• FIRST CAMBRIDGE COMPANY
• FIRST OXFORD COMPANY
• SECOND CAMBRIDGE COMPANY
• SECOND OXFORD COMPANY
• SECOND WESTMINSTER COMPANY
• TRANSLATOR
  • Thomas Sparke
• PRINTER
  • Robert Barker
• CONTRIBUTORS
  • (Illustrators, Geneologies, Maps, Etc.)
  • John Speed (Genealogies, Map)
  • Cornelis Boel (Artist/Engraver)
  • John More (Map)
  • Renold Elstrack (Engraver)
  • Hugh Broughton (Genealogies)

INTRODUCTION
At least sixty men were directly involved in the translation of the King James Bible (hereinafter KJB). Most were Translators, while a few were project overseers, revisers and editors. Some served in several roles. Who were these men? What were their backgrounds? What did they share? In what ways were they different? They were a diverse group. While some were born in large cities and towns, most were from small villages scattered throughout England. Several were the children of university graduates, most were not. They were sons of mariners, farmers, school teachers, cordwainers (leather merchants), fletchers (makers of bows and arrows), ministers, brewers, tailors, and aristocrats. All were members of the Church of England, but their religious views ran the gamut. Some were ardent Puritans, others staunch defenders of the religious establishment. Some believed in pre-destination and limited salvation as taught by John Calvin, while others believed in self-determination and universal access to heaven as taught by Jacobus Arminius.

All of the Translators were university graduates. Oxford and Cambridge claimed nearly equal numbers of Translators as alumni. All of the Translators except one were ordained Church of England priests. While several of the Translators had traveled to the Continent, only one had ventured to the New World. Most of the Translators were married men (38 of 60) with families. Most of the Translators spent a significant portion of their career associated with their colleges and universities as fellows, involved in teaching and administration. As fellows, they were not allowed to marry. As a result many delayed marriage until they had established themselves in church office away from the university. When the translation commenced in 1604-1605, the majority of the Translators, 22, were in their forties, 16 men were in their thirties, 15 in their fifties, 3 in their sixties and 3 in their twenties.

One Translator died in his thirties, six in their forties, nineteen in their fifties, sixteen in their sixties, four in their seventies, three in their eighties and one, over one hundred. Nine of the Translators died before the KJB was published in the 1611.

Most of the Translators were in comfortable economic circumstances during and after their time involved in the translation. The association and friendships they developed during the translation project generally advanced their careers. Some of the Translators went on to high church and academic office. Five went on to serve as bishops and two as archbishops.

They all had a familiarity with the ancient languages of Latin, Greek, Hebrew, and often many more. They came on the historical scene at a time when the knowledge of early biblical texts and language was exploding. Such a flowering of interest and expertise was unique. Bible historian, Gordon Campbell, has observed:

The population from which scholars can now be drawn is much larger than in the seventeenth century, but it would be difficult now to bring together a group of more than fifty scholars with the range of languages and knowledge of other disciplines that characterized the KJB Translators. (Bible – The Story of the King James Version 1611-2011 Oxford, Gordon Campbell, Oxford University Press 2010.)

For such a diverse group, they worked together in harmony during a generally contentious time. They had disagreements, to be sure, but they labored on, year after year. There were no "tell all books" published after the fact. Miles Smith remarked in his preface to the KJB, the Translators "were greater in other men's eyes than in their own, and sought truth rather than their own praise". They approached the task of translation with humility, understanding they were standing on the shoulders of giants like William Tyndale. Believers all, the Translators, according to Smith "craved the assistance of God's Spirit by prayer" as they proceeded in their work.

Though almost all were well known within the religious and academic community of the time, their involvement in the translation went largely unnoticed by the public. Their individual and group effort was not the subject of historical inquiry until many years after the fact. As a result, little information about the process of translation survived. The lives of the Translators and sometimes their very identity became obscured with time. In certain instances, the place of their birth and burial is unknown, and their family circumstance in doubt. Until this anniversary year, few could name even one Translator, let alone sixty. The following brief biographies are written in the hope to shed further light on these men who contributed so much.

AMEN!!!

 

[Enoch111]

How can any of our errors be corrected if we refuse to admit the possibility that we have any errors?

What errors?
1. The Trinity is God's Truth
2. The deity of Christ is God's Truth
3. The true Gospel is God's Truth

So kindly point out the errors.

 

[Truth7t7]

It probably has a lot to with history and tradition and really little to do with loving God. Some sincere people simply do not know anything else. That, [the trinity], is what they have been taught and to even seriously question it would be a costly thing to their own ways... that is the ways of their flesh.

To actually go to the Bible and read it without one's own prejudices and the traditions of family and/or church [the one they or their family have attended of years... even generations] channeling their thoughts is an impossible thing for most people. God could change that , but He must be asked... or someone must really surrender to Him even on that. God does not force people to walk any particular way.

People are often [usually?] more interested in fitting in with a particular group [where friends and family are a part] than they are in really pleasing God and following Him... although many would deny it.

To actually follow Jesus as He walks rather than to follow the pathway of friend, family and home church is the thing to do...! One of those impossible things?

The Godhead is a biblical fact, as John 14:26 clearly shows

1. God The Holy Ghost "He Shall Teach"
2. God The Father "Will Send"
3. God The Son "I Have Said"

John 14:26KJV
26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

1 John 5:7-8KJV
7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

Romans 1:20KJV
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

 

[amadeus]

What errors?
1. The Trinity is God's Truth
2. The deity of Christ is God's Truth
3. The true Gospel is God's Truth

So kindly point out the errors.

I am not God, my friend. I do still live by faith which I believe is:

"...the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen."

The One that will point our errors when allowed to do so is the Holy Spirit.

If you have definite knowledge from God of these things rather than only faith regarding these things, I am glad for your revelation.

Quench not the Spirit!

 

[amadeus]

The Godhead is a biblical fact

1 John 5:7-8KJV
7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

Romans 1:20KJV
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

So then you along with @Enoch111 have had a revelation from God.

Me... I simply return to that lowest room each day and allow God to elevate or exalt me if and when He will...

"But when thou art bidden, go and sit down in the lowest room; that when he that bade thee cometh, he may say unto thee, Friend, go up higher: then shalt thou have worship in the presence of them that sit at meat with thee.
For whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted." Luke 14:10-11

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

I am not God, my friend. I do still live by faith which I believe is:

"...the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen."

The One that will point our errors when allowed to do so is the Holy Spirit.

If you have definite knowledge from God of these things rather than only faith regarding these things, I am glad for your revelation.

Quench not the Spirit!

i would say that the Bible is definitive knowledge.

 

[Truth7t7]

So then you along with @Enoch111 have had a revelation from God.

Me... I simply return to that lowest room each day and allow God to elevate or exalt me if and when He will...

"But when thou art bidden, go and sit down in the lowest room; that when he that bade thee cometh, he may say unto thee, Friend, go up higher: then shalt thou have worship in the presence of them that sit at meat with thee.
For whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted." Luke 14:10-11

No personal revelation as you claim, just a clear and simple biblical fact that is presented to all that will read Gods words of truth seen below

The Godhead is a biblical fact, as John 14:26 clearly shows

1. God The Holy Ghost "He Shall Teach"
2. God The Father "Will Send"
3. God The Son "I Have Said"

John 14:26KJV
26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

1 John 5:7-8KJV
7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

Romans 1:20KJV
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: