Fear God or Presume acceptance

[FollowHim]

I cannot seperate Jesus from who He is , but He isnt the bible, and the bible is not Him, He is there for you too, what are you afraid of, being called a fool. Unwilling to walk away from it all for Him, cant walk away from your religion, cant put down the bible. look up for you redemption draws nigh. Sorry Jesus too busy studying.

My friend you have missed something. Once someone fully understands your proposition there is nothing new to offer.
Your foundational emotional conclusion is your encounter. I see this. You want others to have this.

No matter how profound your experience or even true, can you accept people can hear your proposition and reject it, and you still love and respect them. I ask this, because this is the nature of love and its boundaries. God blesses the righteous and sinners alike.

This is not a war for domination, but understanding, and sharing. And yes I have religion, a belief system in God and my communion. And no I am not interested in walking away from this, because that is unbelief, or death to my soul. But deeper still there is nothing more I want than in Jesus and His word.

Now if you were saying look here in scripture the prophets and Jesus, and the apostles did this, and it is Gods way, I would say amen, let us walk together in His fellowship. But you have given the truth away, put down the bible, leave your faith. In the law you should be stoned to death for blasphemy.

6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, "Let us go and worship other gods" (gods that neither you nor your fathers have known,
7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other),
8 do not yield to him or listen to him. Show him no pity. Do not spare him or shield him.
Deut 13:6-8

From your sincerity and language you have no real idea what you are doing, and I am sure your experience is very real for you.
You are certainly not the first with such a revelation as Paul says

6 I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel--
7 which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ.
8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!
Gal 1:6-8

What you are not aware of Gods word is alive, and these verses I quote come to me as I think and share on these issues.
In the seed and the sower parable, Gods word is planted in our hearts and grows, so that it produces more seed, more of Gods word, which is literally what I am doing to you. I would say this is not my own doing, it comes from abiding in Him as Jesus says

7 If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you.
John 15:7

Gods words, Christ himself needs to dwell in our hearts and minds to fully commune with Him.

 

[FollowHim]

LSD

Just take a little tablet and what is real and what is fake will mix in a way you cannot tell what is true, but you will realise there are other ways of seeing reality than the one you have.

Oh yes, I need this new revelation, this new way of destroying my brain and keeping a grasp on what matters and what does not. And for those who hate their lives and limitations and want to experiment, it seems very appealing.

I did yoga once. The guy leading the group did not understand contemplative relaxation is not unique to yoga, but is known by everyone who desires to find peace and resolution in their lives. They have to calm the storms, make everything settled and none threatening. It is how as babies we cope with growing up, and learn to deal with everything stressful.

If you want out of body experiences, speak to any guru worth their salt. They have these by the bucket full.
But however profound, God roots us here on earth, to the emotional realities of daily life and learning how to love from the heart.
He embeds it all in two commands, Love God with all your heart, soul, strength and mind and love your neighbour as yourself.

That is our foundation, our rock, our centre, our core, our heart and soul, everything we are. Literally everything else flows from this. If anything in heaven or earth detracts from this it is sin. So Paul had some experiences or knew someone who had, and then says nothing more. It is because God grounds us here, in His Kingdom and His ways. Heretics hate this reality, because their hearts are not driven by God or His love or His gospel.

It is good to testify to these realities so the Lords people are encouraged to keeping walking on in Him. Amen and God bless you

 

[FollowHim]

I cannot seperate Jesus from who He is , but He isnt the bible, and the bible is not Him, He is there for you too, what are you afraid of, being called a fool. Unwilling to walk away from it all for Him, cant walk away from your religion, cant put down the bible. look up for you redemption draws nigh. Sorry Jesus too busy studying.

"I cannot seperate Jesus from who He is , but He isnt the bible, and the bible is not Him"

Here is a statement of rejection of religious practice of Christianity and its basic authority.
One similar speaker said 99% of churches are doomed to hell.

You cannot describe better the enemy of Gods people or a person who judges others for sincere convictions.
If you add on the venom and hatred such folk often use, you know if they had real power blood would flow.

Unfortunately it is this connection between revelation and then demonising a group that always leads to violence.
What do you do when people reject your construct? Either give up, or get more and more worked up until the opposition must be the most evil people imaginable, because why else are they not accepting what is obviously true?

Mental hospitals of full of people like this, and I mean this 100% seriously, who walk this road.
History shows equally what happens if they still function but hold a gun, millions die.

Anger is a dangerous thing, it takes simple statements and turns them into disgusting positions which must be removed.
This is why Jesus calls us to love our enemies, because always they are like us with a few small changes.
And once you see this, it is hard to hate, to be violent, to condemn and judge. But if you want an enemy, then it becomes very hard to give up hatred and bitterness, because these strong feelings begin to define you, like a heroic warrior fighting the last battle to the end.

A no joke, one guy describes himself exactly like this.
God bless you

 

[mjrhealth]

My friend you have missed something. Once someone fully understands your proposition there is nothing new to offer.
Your foundational emotional conclusion is your encounter. I see this. You want others to have this.

What is wrong with people discovering Christ for them selves.

Mat_16:24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Joh_10:4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
Joh_10:5 And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.
Joh_10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

what is wrong with Him, that you would have no one follow Him??

Joh_4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

do it your own way most do.

 

[mjrhealth]

"I cannot seperate Jesus from who He is , but He isnt the bible, and the bible is not Him"

Here is a statement of rejection of religious practice of Christianity and its basic authority.
One similar speaker said 99% of churches are doomed to hell.

You cannot describe better the enemy of Gods people or a person who judges others for sincere convictions.
If you add on the venom and hatred such folk often use, you know if they had real power blood would flow.

Unfortunately it is this connection between revelation and then demonising a group that always leads to violence.
What do you do when people reject your construct? Either give up, or get more and more worked up until the opposition must be the most evil people imaginable, because why else are they not accepting what is obviously true?

Mental hospitals of full of people like this, and I mean this 100% seriously, who walk this road.
History shows equally what happens if they still function but hold a gun, millions die.

Anger is a dangerous thing, it takes simple statements and turns them into disgusting positions which must be removed.
This is why Jesus calls us to love our enemies, because always they are like us with a few small changes.
And once you see this, it is hard to hate, to be violent, to condemn and judge. But if you want an enemy, then it becomes very hard to give up hatred and bitterness, because these strong feelings begin to define you, like a heroic warrior fighting the last battle to the end.

A no joke, one guy describes himself exactly like this.
God bless you

And see, this is what men do when they have no answer for the truth. This is not Gods doing.

 

[FollowHim]

And see, this is what men do when they have no answer for the truth. This is not Gods doing.

? You are right, 100%, well done. By what truth and what answer? You could be 100% wrong, and totally wrong.
But which is it?

 

[FollowHim]

What is wrong with people discovering Christ for them selves.

Mat_16:24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Joh_10:4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
Joh_10:5 And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.
Joh_10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

what is wrong with Him, that you would have no one follow Him??

Joh_4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

do it your own way most do.

discovering Christ for themselves?
Our faith is our personal discovery of Christ for ourselves. It is what born again believers are founded upon.
I think you have got things very confused.

 

[FollowHim]

The anarchist jumps in, stirs the pot and runs away.
Confusion acts like a smoke screen. If everything is confused, who is speaking the truth?

The foolishness of this approach is the truth speaks for itself.
Jesus asks us to explore and discover Him for ourselves through His word and spiritually in prayer and from the heart.
The truth of Christ is discovered in following Him.

The rich young man asked how he could have eternal life. Giving up his wealth and following Jesus.

The truth is Christ, is as we are changed we see what the truth is and how sin binds us to slavery and bondage.
But until we start we think we are free to sin and do as we want. A sad irony, we do as our passions lead, and they lead to death.

God bless you

 

[FollowHim]

A curse or dishonour

33 But Jacob said, "Swear to me first." So he swore an oath to him, selling his birthright to Jacob.
34 Then Jacob gave Esau some bread and some lentil stew. He ate and drank, and then got up and left. So Esau despised his birthright
Gen 25:33-34

There is a proposition here. I have in my hand an experience that I believe is valuable and you should desire but give up your faith and go after this experience, because I know it is so good. Now in the world of experimentation why not, what can you lose?

Esau had his birth right, as first born of the twins, and he was hungry, so why not lie to Jacob, because then he could get some food, I mean he would have his birth right no matter what he said to Jacob, God would not take it away.

What happened? God took Esau birth right away.

What is our birthright in Christ? Our faith. On what does our salvation rest? Our belief. So give up ones belief so that you can have a possible good spiritual experience. This is the same argument adulterers use. Have a little sex on the side, no one will know, it will be fun, it will not break your love for your wife, she will not mind. What does scripture warn? That ways are the ways of death.

How many people have come preaching, get this experience, leave this church and know anointing, fire, heaven, freedom from this group or preacher or transcendent state ....... ? And what do you get? Gold dust, feathers, golden crowns on teeth, jewels, the ability to control the weather, create your future, have your dreams come true, have health, wealth and no problems, live on the top deck and not at the bottom.

But no wonder things are not corrected because of the sin against the Lord and His word. The lifeline has been cut, and the ship is astray to drift into any waters that happen to come along.

What matters is not the adultery but the sin against the Lord and cutting off any hope of rescue.

God bless you

 

[Episkopos]

A curse or dishonour

33 But Jacob said, "Swear to me first." So he swore an oath to him, selling his birthright to Jacob.
34 Then Jacob gave Esau some bread and some lentil stew. He ate and drank, and then got up and left. So Esau despised his birthright
Gen 25:33-34

There is a proposition here. I have in my hand an experience that I believe is valuable and you should desire but give up your faith and go after this experience, because I know it is so good. Now in the world of experimentation why not, what can you lose?

Esau had his birth right, as first born of the twins, and he was hungry, so why not lie to Jacob, because then he could get some food, I mean he would have his birth right no matter what he said to Jacob, God would not take it away.

What happened? God took Esau birth right away.

What is our birthright in Christ? Our faith. On what does our salvation rest? Our belief. So give up ones belief so that you can have a possible good spiritual experience. This is the same argument adulterers use. Have a little sex on the side, no one will know, it will be fun, it will not break your love for your wife, she will not mind. What does scripture warn? That ways are the ways of death.

How many people have come preaching, get this experience, leave this church and know anointing, fire, heaven, freedom from this group or preacher or transcendent state ....... ? And what do you get? Gold dust, feathers, golden crowns on teeth, jewels, the ability to control the weather, create your future, have your dreams come true, have health, wealth and no problems, live on the top deck and not at the bottom.

But no wonder things are not corrected because of the sin against the Lord and His word. The lifeline has been cut, and the ship is astray to drift into any waters that happen to come along.

What matters is not the adultery but the sin against the Lord and cutting off any hope of rescue.

God bless you

While there is a danger in spiritual experiences...God is still connecting with His people. So you are way off here. You are speaking from your hurts and disappointments...which do not at all convey the message of the gospel which is indeed to be translated into the higher walk and experience in Christ. That is what grace is for.

We can speak of the dangers of drawing the wrong conclusions and creating a "status" based on spiritual visitations and encounters with God. There are evil spirits out there seeking to take advantage of they who are looking to be lifted up in their carnal state. But God is also out there with His Holy Spirit seeking to bring us into an intimate walk with Him. Hence the need of prophets and teachers in the Body.

But to be against ALL spirits puts you in as much danger as the false spiritualists are in. You run the risk of putting Jesus on the cross over and over again. The Pharisees stood against any possible divine encounter and persecuted Jesus for it. The more He claimed oneness with His Father the more angry they became. And you are also on this slippery slope. You do not have the fulness of God's grace...to deny others from advancing far beyond what you have imagined with your limited faith.

So I urge you to leave room for God. You are not the deliminator of God on earth. So you should embrace humility and the fear of the Lord.

 

[mjrhealth]

? You are right, 100%, well done. By what truth and what answer? You could be 100% wrong, and totally wrong.
But which is it?

I guess you will have to wait to find out.

Joh_3:27 John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.

Heb_12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

Thanks to my dad for that.

God bless

 

[FollowHim]

While there is a danger in spiritual experiences...God is still connecting with His people. So you are way off here. You are speaking from your hurts and disappointments...which do not at all convey the message of the gospel which is indeed to be translated into the higher walk and experience in Christ. That is what grace is for.

We can speak of the dangers of drawing the wrong conclusions and creating a "status" based on spiritual visitations and encounters with God. There are evil spirits out there seeking to take advantage of they who are looking to be lifted up in their carnal state. But God is also out there with His Holy Spirit seeking to bring us into an intimate walk with Him. Hence the need of prophets and teachers in the Body.

But to be against ALL spirits puts you in as much danger as the false spiritualists are in. You run the risk of putting Jesus on the cross over and over again. The Pharisees stood against any possible divine encounter and persecuted Jesus for it. The more He claimed oneness with His Father the more angry they became. And you are also on this slippery slope. You do not have the fulness of God's grace...to deny others from advancing far beyond what you have imagined with your limited faith.

So I urge you to leave room for God. You are not the deliminator of God on earth. So you should embrace humility and the fear of the Lord.

Make room for God?
This is the mantra of Bethel. Spiritualism is ok, whatever the enemy uses we can use.

Jesus is a social worker of the heart. The heart is everything. Get this right, cleansed, purified, made whole eternity opens its doors. Communism fails because people are lost, without a reference point other than themselves.

So much revolves around our contacts and forgiveness, being hurt and responding in retaliation. Why do marriages break down, families stop talking, groups split, one area splits from another, wars break out?

We need to make room for God in our hearts, in our walk, in our love and forgiveness.

 

[FollowHim]

I guess you will have to wait to find out.

Joh_3:27 John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.

Heb_12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

Thanks to my dad for that.

God bless

The truth is for you life is this encounter ( heavenly ) which is personal to you, wrapped in emotion and response of your mind.

Jesus encountered many people and it meant nothing, just another nice teacher. When I hear the answer is out of this earth, I weep. It's like UFO desperation. Sin is our clear and present danger, lust and desires for self indulgence is swamping everything. Loneliness and anxiousness is our plague. People are hyper sensitive and being hurt is the new sin. Learning to carry pain and forgive is our calling, literally because our Lord did, you would think is another gospel.

But then we now have the most spoilt generation ever to walk this earth. God bless you

 

[mjrhealth]

The truth is for you life is this encounter ( heavenly ) which is personal to you, wrapped in emotion and response of your mind.

Jesus encountered many people and it meant nothing, just another nice teacher. When I hear the answer is out of this earth, I weep. It's like UFO desperation. Sin is our clear and present danger, lust and desires for self indulgence is swamping everything. Loneliness and anxiousness is our plague. People are hyper sensitive and being hurt is the new sin. Learning to carry pain and forgive is our calling, literally because our Lord did, you would think is another gospel.

But then we now have the most spoilt generation ever to walk this earth. God bless you

And all you do is write nothing and deny the Spirit of God, How long, will you never open the door, or as he put it.

Mar_7:6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.

Please do it your way, just like the rest of "christianity". You made your choice you have to live with it.

 

[Candidus]

"I cannot seperate Jesus from who He is , but He isnt the bible, and the bible is not Him"

Here is a statement of rejection of religious practice of Christianity and its basic authority.
One similar speaker said 99% of churches are doomed to hell.

You cannot describe better the enemy of Gods people or a person who judges others for sincere convictions.
If you add on the venom and hatred such folk often use, you know if they had real power blood would flow.

Unfortunately it is this connection between revelation and then demonising a group that always leads to violence.
What do you do when people reject your construct? Either give up, or get more and more worked up until the opposition must be the most evil people imaginable, because why else are they not accepting what is obviously true?

Mental hospitals of full of people like this, and I mean this 100% seriously, who walk this road.
History shows equally what happens if they still function but hold a gun, millions die.

Anger is a dangerous thing, it takes simple statements and turns them into disgusting positions which must be removed.
This is why Jesus calls us to love our enemies, because always they are like us with a few small changes.
And once you see this, it is hard to hate, to be violent, to condemn and judge. But if you want an enemy, then it becomes very hard to give up hatred and bitterness, because these strong feelings begin to define you, like a heroic warrior fighting the last battle to the end.

A no joke, one guy describes himself exactly like this.
God bless you

The argument 25 years ago was saying that if you had doctrine, then you are not spiritual. But this a a false dilemma, for we do not have to choose between Spiritless Formalism or Formless Spiritualism. One can have form and substance based upon true knowledge revealed in the Bible and still be spiritual. Yes, one can believe that they are above the Scriptures and think that they have all truth. Both can be Christians, yet the later, when exposed to the light of Scripture, is usually exposed as deluded.

 

[FollowHim]

The argument 25 years ago was saying that if you had doctrine, then you are not spiritual. But this a a false dilemma, for we do not have to choose between Spiritless Formalism or Formless Spiritualism. One can have form and substance based upon true knowledge revealed in the Bible and still be spiritual. Yes, one can believe that they are above the Scriptures and think that they have all truth. Both can be Christians, yet the later, when exposed to the light of Scripture, is usually exposed as deluded.

I knew believers who were anointed by the Holy Spirit. It was like walking in daylight for them. They talked of scripture which others believed with new fervour and delight, angelic noises and exultation flowing from their lips. Then as the years rolled on, the euphoria died, the drudgery of life started to break in, arguments, problems, meeting together did not have the same zing, other things became important, and people stopped meeting so often, then not at all and it all faded away.

The emotional conclusion was our faith mattered when the emotions flowed, when the significance was felt. The Spirit was there when the singing reached a pitch, or people fainted or something different happened. Hysteria is a strange thing, give people some news and they faint on the floor, run around swinging from the ceiling, collapse sobbing in grief. Mix in God, the Lord of creation and you are actually talking to Him, and begin to see what this means, a few excited people, and they feed each other to this crescendo.

But love and life walks on behind it all, the realities of each day, the deadlines, the cost, the money, the problems and the successes. And God is with His people all the time, and because people are quiet or loud, happy or sad does not define their validity of faith or expression. So what faces these folk is they become what they called dead, they speak the words of faith but without the hyped feelings so it must be false. Speaking a creed is formalism not faith. Doing what needs to be done is empty working not service. Words do not matter, it is the heavenlies alone, relationship can rot I need the encounter of light, of exultation, of otherness because then I can have perfection.

Oddly, and I say oddly, in Christ we have the heavenlies, in our rooms, alone with Him, the beauty of the encounter, the touch of healing of our hearts, the love of caring for others and their emotional conclusions, no matter how distorted. There is Jesus, in the heart, speaking truth to power, truth to lost souls, truth to those made whole, who are not shaken but will walk into eternity. God bless you

 

[mjrhealth]

Yes, one can believe that they are above the Scriptures and think that they have all truth. Both can be Christians, yet the later, when exposed to the light of Scripture, is usually exposed as deluded.

Jesus said " Joh_8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

Luk_16:8 And the lord commended the unjust steward, because he had done wisely: for the children of this world are in their generation wiser than the children of light.

Teh light of scripture, ye just look at this forum, what light.

 

[FollowHim]

Jesus said " Joh_8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

Luk_16:8 And the lord commended the unjust steward, because he had done wisely: for the children of this world are in their generation wiser than the children of light.

Teh light of scripture, ye just look at this forum, what light.

Amen, such light, the light of life, love and joy in Christ, Praise the Lord.

What cynics do not like is those who delight in the living God and His work in our hearts, each and every day.
They see the problems and never the victories, the struggle and cost, but not the reason why, Jesus.

He is our centre, our delight, our love, our everything. His words bring life to our souls, refreshness to each new day, praise to our lips as each relationship blosoms under His word and the Holy Spirit. God bless you

 

[FollowHim]

I had a three way conversation with a believer, the new pastor of our church and myself.

The believer was complementing the pastor on his fervour and enthusiasm for Christ. He though counselled with the problems of the fellowship, its back biting, he would be worn down and broken. I laughed, because here was the personification of unbelief and focus on man and not on the Lord. Ministry is not defined by the response of man, but by God moving through us. Our victory is His victory, not whether people listen or reject the message. We are defined by God not by our society or its likes and dislikes. We are the Kingdom of heaven proclaiming Gods will and heart to man, to call them to the throne of grace and real freedom in Him.

It is now 14 years later, and our pastor is still rejoicing in God, lifting up praise to Him and knowing His victory.
So many focus and see what they want to see, not Gods work moving through His people. God bless you

 

[Episkopos]

Spiritualism is ok, whatever the enemy uses we can use.

You are seeing the counterfeit and allowing that to put you off from the actual spiritual realm of the kingdom of God where God dwells. The devil wouldn't need to counterfeit something that doesn't exist.

False healings, false prophets, false anointings...all of these take place because men want things that are very precious and rare to become more common and controllable. They want a god that is more accessible to the carnal flesh.

So the devil obliges them.

That is no reason to become an enemy of God in the Spirit. Because of lawlessness the love of many will cool off...and even become cynical and hostile to the deeper walk of God.