williemac said:
JW's typically feel that they do not have any assurance that they themselves will survive Armageddon. They are taught thay what they have is hope. I asked one if he expected he would survive, and he replied with "I hope to". I then asked if he was sure he would survive and got the same reply. I then mentioned that it was by faith and he agreed, so I asked him what faith is. He promptly went to his NWT, and read from Heb.11:1...." Now faith is the assured expectation of things hoped for...." He didn't get any furhter before his mouth dropped, having admitted that he did not have faith, only having the hope but not the assured expectation. I believe God had given me the wisdom to direct this questioning to him.
The point is that faith should give one the assurance of his eternal destiny. But James said that a double minded man is unstable. So here is where we get tripped up by our enemy. He will introduce passages in the bible that are mis applied by some and taken out of context by some, and cause doubts to occur about what God said concerning the way to salvation. If you want to see some of these conflicting doctrines that cause a person to believe opposite things simultaneously, just look at some of the discussions on this website on the subject. One such discussion is "how to get to heaven". I had an adversary on that site who continuosly mis quoted me and mis applied my replies, also mis applying scripture in the process (in my humble opinion).
My recent replies on that subject are a little off topic. However, the original point is that what happened to the Galatians has not ceased to be a thorn in the flesh of the gospel over the centuries. They had received life and the Spirit by the hearing of faith, but aftwerwrd were beguiled into adding works of the flesh for justification (law). As long as a person feels he must maintain his status with God through any other means than faith, he will be unstable, because it will no longer be by God's promise alone and by the work of One man alone (Jesus), but also by a person's own effort as well. Rom. chapter 5 should erase this error. But there is leaven lurking in our midst.
In addition to these things, God has given the Holy Spirit as a guarantee of our inheritance. I often wonder how is it that a person can have the Spirit but not the guarantee. Faith has to do with taking God at His word. It is called our victory that overcomes the world (1John 5:4). We are told to put on the armour of God, not the least of which is the shield of faith. I suggest one reads AND BELIEVES John 5:24, for starters. This is also the helmet of salvation. The whole armour is put on through understanding the truth. This is the way that contradiction can be put out of the heart. James said..."purify your heart you double minded".
Assurance of Salvation is there or it ain't. But BEING there it may just be lukewarm complacency and secondly IT ITSELF is not biblically said to be required.
IN fact for most this is a rational construct when true assurance is Spirit to spirit. I avow there is NO DIRECT LINK from mental assurance and Salvation, since rationally you can affirm many things.
And the heart of attitude is the core of faith. The blessed gut knowing is the knowing of faith. The constant and still small presence of God in our lives the relationship in Covenant is what faith in action is.
For most the intimate presence of God is TOO MUCH to handle, as Jack Nicholson said about TRUTH. No man normally hears God or sees Him as He is. This is Truth and let no Waco Messiah lead to astray. Koresh had it not, but he was assured OF it in his bean.
Bean Knowing is not faith at all. The assurance of things not seen is a spiritual dynamic. Spirit is obedient until death comes. And the spiritual awakening is day by day.
And why is BEAN KNOWING not knowing at all?
Well, since it considers probabilities, and the full spectrum of God, not only His relational aspect to you and me subjectively...
...faith having nothing to do with BEAN KNOWING since probabilities are seen through spiritual eyeballs not empirical eyeballs.
SOVEREIGN perspective puts you in heaven OR hell, with the probabilities even against you.
SPIRITUAL perspective sees your God and you in relationship, day by day, and en total what God will talk to you about at the Judgement. From Spirit to spirit. You and God, God and you.
You stuff takes some reading nothead, maybe its an accent coming through the keyboard, I agree that fear is a healthy thing to have, and I really like this last line above, fills me with strength. Thank you sincerely.
Hey, theoretically what is gonna happen when you post "I have a fear of hell?"
Every brother and his momma and his sister gonna baby you and reassure since we think this is the way to go.
Let me tell you the ancient core of knowing was GUT KNOWING and this through the enteric (?) nervous system, the bundle of nerves in your gut. This has recently been called by scientists your second brain.
Wow I got two brains, must be TWICE as smart as Hammerhead for instance. He only got metal for brains in ONE brain.
Seriously we KNOW fear mainly through our gut. And this FEAR is for a reason if God put it there. So then you gotta figure this out, is it from the Devil or God? Evil spirit or principallity or heaven?
See Peter was struck with fear when he saw all them fishes in the net. He was being IRRATIONAL in the face of Grace yet I say the FEAR he felt was for a godly reason, in order to be ready to FOLLOW HIS LORD to the ends of the earth.
"Have mercy upon me lord, for I am a sinful man." NOW he is ready and of right attitude.
And when Peter stumbled, could it not be said it was because HE DID NOT FEAR as well he should in time and place?
See fear can be for GOOD REASON. And accent or not I will not say NOT TO FEAR if we ARE TO FEAR. So I ain't a girly man. Let us be spiritual men and have courage. The KIND which girds up one's loins, sir.
The first post to you was a testimony that you will fear when you are on the hotseat. Me too and for good reason. God will put you to rest and SHOLOM spiritual peace or not. But to DENY this fear will come is to placate yourself as every lukewarm Baptist OSAS or not, Cheap Grace or not, Free Pass to Heaven or not will gloss.
We fear not the wrath of God since we are considering all else in life BUT. This is not godly or good. Much better to be gutfully FEARFUL as this Battle on Earth is a SERIOUS one. And it IS life or death for not only me and you but the ones in our midst.
Life and death. To fear is to be alive as the condition of man is. NOT WRONG en whole. Work out your salvation with fear AND TREMBLING in my absence as well as my presence, that YOU NOT STUMBLE in your complacency. Selah.
Why would Paul say this about HIMSELF unless he too feared YHWH Maker of Heaven and Earth?
Gosh did I forget to mention one more thing as conclusion? As much fear as Peter feared, in the face of Grace and all of them fishes...
did he not go to his death with SUPERNATURAL bravery and courage?" Crucify me upside down, for I am not worthy to be crucified as my lord was."
Traditional statement yes, but I believe it, for Peter walked the walk of a man like you or me. AND PREVAILED even to the songs of angels to eternity.