FEAR OR LOVE

[Lambano]

My basic idea is that the younger generations do not respect authority and have no real objective moral values.
There is no sin, no God, so anything is allowed; there are no consequences except maybe some physical ones - but none spiritual.

Atheism has overtaken our young.
The New Atheists convinced many that God does not exist because He cannot be proven impirically.
Started years ago with the Professors who were already liberal and open minded to EVERYTHING.
GK Chesterton said that a person that believes in everything
believes in nothing. (a terrible quote, I'm sure).

So why should fear work? (not that I think it's the best method).
There is nothing to fear.

The reason I don't think evangelism by fear works anymore:

In the other thread, I pointed out that Paul never preached "turn-or-burn" to the Gentiles. And Jesus only used the threat of Gehenna to people who already believed in the God of the Bible, who already believed in a God who would judge them, who believed in an afterlife (the warnings were to Pharisees; not the Sadducees), and who already believed in an objective standard of morality (as defined by Torah). Without that shared world-view, Hell makes no sense. My target audience didn't pick up on the significance of that.

When evangelizing, you are almost BY DEFINITION dealing with people who do not share the same world-view. Certainly the "cultural-Christian" world-view is gone here in the Western societies. Pressing the fear-of-god button doesn't work because you have to sort-of believe in God already. In my own case, it worked because I was an adolescent, and there was an unstated assumption that the adults with the authority knew something that I didn't. I don't think that assumption applies today either.

 

[GodsGrace]

The reason I don't think evangelism by fear works anymore:

In the other thread, I pointed out that Paul never preached "turn-or-burn" to the Gentiles. And Jesus only used the threat of Gehenna to people who already believed in the God of the Bible, who already believed in a God who would judge them, who believed in an afterlife (the warnings were to Pharisees; not the Sadducees), and who already believed in an objective standard of morality (as defined by Torah). Without that shared world-view, Hell makes no sense. My target audience didn't pick up on the significance of that.

I did read that post and I understood.
It does bring up the question: What about those that do NOT believe?
John 3:36 states that we need both:

36 "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

Jesus also said that we must be born again and that we must obey Him.

When evangelizing, you are almost BY DEFINITION dealing with people who do not share the same world-view. Certainly the "cultural-Christian" world-view is gone here in the Western societies.

Agreed.

Pressing the fear-of-god button doesn't work because you have to sort-of believe in God already.

Agreed.
What is there to fear if God does not exist?

In my own case, it worked because I was an adolescent, and there was an unstated assumption that the adults with the authority knew something that I didn't. I don't think that assumption applies today either.

Agreed.

 

[quietthinker]

Where is the word SHOULD used to which you're referring?

talons remark below

No but we should have a very firm understanding of a reverence for the Almighty God and the KJV does call this fear .

Agreed.
Also, let's say that those that do not end up with God do not want to be with God.
It is their choice.

Also, there is some good also here, not just bad.
If it were all bad...it would already be the true hell where there is no good at all.

I think Hell is progressive. Ultimately it is death where the soul has destroyed itself (the seeds of sin have grown and born fruit)
Hell is a description of that outer darkness; that black hole; everything that loves and practices a lie and by its very nature implodes. We can see this in the fall of Nations where corruption eats them out from the inside.....the driving principle being glorification of the self at the expense of the other.

 

[ShineTheLight]

First of all I think dismissing the word 'should' is a smart thing.
'Should' always assumes it knows, when in fact it is just manipulative.

Secondly, there is nothing attractive about fear for this brown duck but I am aware that slabs of inhabitants get off on fear. The film industry exploits it with an avalanche of fear based movies......a testimony to the depth of the sickness of the soul.

Hell is what we create for ourselves and others. Just look at global news with the intensity of deception, oppression and destruction increasing. Yes, there is and will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, not because God has imposed it but because we (humans) have created the reasons for it.

Jesus return is a rescue mission from the fear and destruction perpetrated by both men and demons.

What about these?

Proverbs 14: 27
The fear of the LORD is a fountain of life, to depart from the snares of death.

Matthew 10: 28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Proverbs 1: 7
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Jeremiah 5: 21-25
21 Hear now this, O foolish people and without understanding, who have eyes and see not, who have ears and hear not:
22 Fear ye not Me?” saith the Lord. “Will ye not tremble at My presence, who have placed the sand for the bound of the sea by a perpetual decree, that it cannot pass it; and though the waves thereof toss themselves, yet can they not prevail; though they roar, yet can they not pass over it?
23 But this people hath a revolting and a rebellious heart; they have revolted and gone.
24 Neither say they in their heart, ‘Let us now fear the Lord our God, who giveth rain, both the former and the latter in his season; He reserveth unto us the appointed weeks of the harvest.’
25 Your iniquities have turned away these things, and your sins have withheld good things from you.

 

[quietthinker]

What about these?

Proverbs 14: 27
The fear of the LORD is a fountain of life, to depart from the snares of death.

Matthew 10: 28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Proverbs 1: 7
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Jeremiah 5: 21-25
21 Hear now this, O foolish people and without understanding, who have eyes and see not, who have ears and hear not:
22 Fear ye not Me?” saith the Lord. “Will ye not tremble at My presence, who have placed the sand for the bound of the sea by a perpetual decree, that it cannot pass it; and though the waves thereof toss themselves, yet can they not prevail; though they roar, yet can they not pass over it?
23 But this people hath a revolting and a rebellious heart; they have revolted and gone.
24 Neither say they in their heart, ‘Let us now fear the Lord our God, who giveth rain, both the former and the latter in his season; He reserveth unto us the appointed weeks of the harvest.’
25 Your iniquities have turned away these things, and your sins have withheld good things from you.

I think the word 'fear' can be and is used in the context of respect, particularly in the OT.
In the case of of Matthew 10:28 I ask, who is it that kills? John 10:10 tells us who kills and Hebrews 2:14 tells us who it is that has the power of death

In the NT we have the identifier of who it is that kills.

Matthew 10:28
'Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell'.

John 10:10
The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full

Hebrews 2:14
Since the children have flesh and blood, he too shared in their humanity so that by his death he might break the power of him who holds the power of death—that is, the devil—