Few are saved.

[Earburner]

<chuckles>


Of course.


Here's where we apparently disagree. And why I would really level the same assertion concerning you as you did me above. Well, not "full connection," but full impact.


Of course.


Not sure what you mean by God the Father "NEEDED" Jesus to be the Savior... If you mean that in the right sense, then yeah, but I'm not sure.

In addition, I think you are underestimating ~ unintentionally, I'm guessing ~ how great God's love is for us and how great His grace is.

Grace and peace to you.

The deepest desire that God the Father had/has was/is for Himself to permanently dwell within His creation of man. By Him dwelling within Jesus, and Jesus dwelling within us, the Holy Spirit is the vehicle for the both of them to dwell within us each forever.
John 14:23; Rev. 3:20.

 

[PinSeeker]

When that word is used it just introduces so much confusion.

What word? Eternity? It shouldn't. Eternity is the age to come. Yes, some people have other ideas about it, maybe, but it shouldn't.

Prior to becoming immortal one must die the second death, no matter whether you are chosen, or called or a non believer.

No, if one is born again of the Spirit, he or she is not subject to the second death, which is what those who are not elect are resurrected to (John 5:29). Now, Revelation 20 is what we're really talking about there, and that... Well, it shouldn't... but Revelation 20 causes some folks a lot of problems... <chuckles>

You're looking well past eonian life...

Not so...

and in doing so you ignore the purpose for God's Elect.

Of course not.

I dont think so.

Fair enough.

The Elect are the first resurrection.

Well, yes, each of us come to share in it, each at his/her own time... when, having been dead in his or her sin, he or she is born again of the Spirit ~ made alive together with Christ ~ and raised us up with Him and seated with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus (Ephesians 2). This is our sharing in the first resurrection, as it is put by John in Revelation 20. Collectively, then, yes, I'm fine with your saying "the Elect are the first resurrection," but again, this is how we share in the first resurrection, individually, and are blessed because we do... this is how John puts it in verses 4-6.

They are judges and saviours.

There is only one Righteous Judge, and one Savior. Christ Jesus is He. <smile>

Is it final judgment or eternal judgement?

The final judgment is executed/issued by Christ, and those on Jesus's left go away into judgment for eternity.

Yes God is the Lake of fire.

No, His judgment is the fire in which they are consumed... they are totally immersed in His judgment... for eternity. <shudder> There is no relief, and no hope of redemption or escape. This is the second death. <shudder>

It is second death; judgement.

Right; that's what I said...

Not if your of the Elect.

We will all be judged according to what we have done... "He will render to each one according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury. There will be tribulation and distress for every human being who does evil, the Jew first and also the Greek, but glory and honor and peace for everyone who does good, the Jew first and also the Greek" (Romans 2:6-12)... and again, Jesus gives us a picture of this final Judgment in Matthew 25-31-46. We are all there.

The Elect are judged now.

We can incur judgments, yes, but these are for our discipline now; God disciplines those He loves (Hebrews ) But the final Judgment is coming. The elect will be resurrected to eternal life, but we will be judged, along with everybody else, as I said. But we will have an Advocate, in Whose righteousness we will stand, as I said. We will stand in the congregation of the righteous (Psalm 1), on Jesus's right.

The Elect have an advocate now.

Sure we do. We have been redeemed. Sure.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[PinSeeker]

The deepest desire that God the Father had/has was/is for Himself to permanently dwell within His creation of man. By Him dwelling within Jesus, and Jesus dwelling within us, the Holy Spirit is the vehicle for the both of them to dwell within us each forever.
John 14:23; Rev. 3:20.

Sure. But He was never in need of anything, nor ever will be. He always had perfect fellowship with the Son and the Spirit. It pleased Him to create, for sure, and it will please Him ~ and bring Him glory ~ to make all His creation new (Revelation 21:5) and for us, His elect, to dwell with Him forever, and even to glorify them. But He didn't need it, as if He weren't complete in Himself.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[Earburner]

<chuckles>


Of course.


Here's where we apparently disagree. And why I would really level the same assertion concerning you as you did me above. Well, not "full connection," but full impact.


Of course.


Not sure what you mean by God the Father "NEEDED" Jesus to be the Savior... If you mean that in the right sense, then yeah, but I'm not sure.

In addition, I think you are underestimating ~ unintentionally, I'm guessing ~ how great God's love is for us and how great His grace is.

Grace and peace to you.

The deepest desire that God the Father has was for Himself to permanently dwell within His creation of man. By Him dwelling within Jesus, and Jesus dwelling within us, the Holy Spirit is now the vehicle for the both of them to dwell within us each forever.
KJV John 3:3-8, 14:23; Rev. 3:20

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

The deepest desire that God the Father has was for Himself to permanently dwell within His creation if man. By Him dwelling within Jesus, and Jesus dwelling within us, the Holy Spirit is now the vehicle for the both of them to dwell within us each forever.
KJV John 3:3-8, 14:23; Rev. 3:20

And if we turn away from the Lord to engage in sinful behavior the Lord has to reject us.

Unless we repent, stop our sinful behavior, and return to walking in agreement with Him once again

One cannot be in agreement with the devil and be in right standing with the Lord at the same time.

Sadly most churches / preachers these days teach that you can although the package it nicer sounding speech

 

[Earburner]

Sure. But He was never in need of anything, nor ever will be. He always had perfect fellowship with the Son and the Spirit. It pleased Him to create, for sure, and it will please Him ~ and bring Him glory ~ to make all His creation new (Revelation 21:5) and for us, His elect, to dwell with Him forever, and even to glorify them. But He didn't need it, as if He weren't complete in Himself.

Grace and peace to you.

You are going way overboard in what I was expressing. So, I will say it this way: "He always had perfect fellowship with the Son and the Spirit", yeah but NOT with His creation of man. But now that Jesus became the Perfect Mediator between us and God the Father, He stated that in His Son, He was well pleased, for FINALLY the contention/enmity between God and man was appeased, by the shedding of Christ's blood for the remission of sins under the New Covenant

 

[Earburner]

And if we turn away from the Lord to engage in sinful behavior the Lord has to reject us.

Unless we repent, stop our sinful behavior, and return to walking in agreement with Him once again

One cannot be in agreement with the devil and be in right standing with the Lord at the same time. View attachment 80069

Sadly most churches / preachers these days teach that you can although the package it nicer sounding speech

The Grace of God, if active in a believers life, IS GREATER than any sin, except one, the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

1 Cor. 3
[11] For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
[12] Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
[13] Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
[14] If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
[15] If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

 

[PinSeeker]

The deepest desire that God the Father has was for Himself to permanently dwell within His creation of man. By Him dwelling within Jesus, and Jesus dwelling within us, the Holy Spirit is now the vehicle for the both of them to dwell within us each forever.
KJV John 3:3-8, 14:23; Rev. 3:20

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeah disagree. <smile>

He surely desires all to come to knowledge of the truth and to be saved (1 Timothy 2:4), for sure. He created man for His own glory, sure. He loves His creation, for sure. But his "deepest desire" is His own glory. This is His chief end, just as ours is to glorify God and enjoy Him forever. Now, if you were to restate what you're saying here and rather then say, "God created us and all of creation for His own glory and to then have all His creation glory in Him and to, in the words of the Psalmist, inhabit our praises (Psalm 22:3)"... then we might be on the same page. <smile>

Or if you were to say it this way, which is closer to what you're saying, actually... "God the Father, God the Son, and God the Spirit have always been, are, and always will be one in each other, and God is making it... restoring it, actually... so that we are all one in each other and in Christ... and this will be to His glory, and... yes, we will glorify Him and enjoy Him forever in this way"... then, yeah. <smile>

And I'll say this, too, that God is not now, nor will He ever be, like, "Shoot! I missed that one; he/she got away!" <smile>

You are going way overboard in what I was expressing.

Ah, well, not really, but I can understand your reaction here. Maybe you're going... way underboard, Earburner.

So, I will say it this way: "He always had perfect fellowship with the Son and the Spirit", yeah but NOT with His creation of man.

Well at first He did, yes, but somebody messed that up, right? Now who was that...? <smile>

But now that Jesus became the Perfect Mediator between us and God the Father, He stated that in His Son, He was well pleased, for FINALLY the contention/enmity between God and man was appeased, by the shedding of Christ's blood for the remission of sins under the New Covenant.

Ah, not in full yet. But it will be. Sure.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[Earburner]

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeah disagree. <smile>

He surely desires all to come to knowledge of the truth and to be saved (1 Timothy 2:4), for sure. He created man for His own glory, sure. He loves His creation, for sure. But his "deepest desire" is His own glory. This is His chief end, just as ours is to glorify God and enjoy Him forever. Now, if you were to restate what you're saying here and rather then say, "God created us and all of creation for His own glory and to then have all His creation glory in Him and to, in the words of the Psalmist, inhabit our praises (Psalm 22:3)"... then we might be on the same page. <smile>

Or if you were to say it this way, which is closer to what you're saying, actually... "God the Father, God the Son, and God the Spirit have always been, are, and always will be one in each other, and God is making it... restoring it, actually... so that we are all one in each other and in Christ... and this will be to His glory, and... yes, we will glorify Him and enjoy Him forever in this way"... then, yeah. <smile>

And I'll say this, too, that God is not now, nor will He ever be, like, "Shoot! I missed that one; he/she got away!" <smile>


Ah, well, not really, but I can understand your reaction here. Maybe you're going... way underboard, Earburner.


Well at first He did, yes, but somebody messed that up, right? Now who was that...? <smile>


Ah, not in full yet. But it will be. Sure.

Grace and peace to you.

As for Psalm 22:3, why wouldn't God desire and find comradery, friendship and love among His OWN? Isn't it so, that they who are of the world, do the same with THEIR OWN?

I think that I "covered the bases" pretty good, but there are those who will always "call a foul", just to argue the point.

 

[PinSeeker]

As for Psalm 22:3, why wouldn't God desire and find comradery, friendship and love among His OWN?

I really don't even know why you would ask that question, to be quite honest... But if it's rhetorical... okay... <smile>

Isn't it so, that they who are of the world, do the same with THEIR OWN?

Sure, they all go their own way, doing what's right in their own eyes. Again, not sure why you would ask that question, to be quite honest... But if it's rhetorical... okay... <smile>

I think that I "covered the bases" pretty good...

Fair enough.

...there are those who will always "call a foul", just to argue the point.

I guess so, but I'm not doing that. Words are important. I think maybe we're just missing each other... or... Well, in my opinion, the words you're using leave something to be desired regarding clarity.

Grace and peace to you, Earburner.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

1 Cor. 3
[11] For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
[12] Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
[13] Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
[14] If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
[15] If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

That's speaking of our works and is not speaking of salvation.

Those that apply this to salvation have to claim other verses are lies meaning they claim God is contradicting Himself in His Word as they believe some things God says are true and other things He says are lies. The devil tricks them in to not accepting all the Lord says

This is common among the cherry pickers.

Top reasons why OSAS is not true

Romans 11:21,22
For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

2 Peter 2:20
For if after they have escaped the pollution of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

Hebrews 3:12
Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.

*A person cannot depart from something they were never a part of to begin with

1 Timothy 4:1,2
Now the Spirit speaks expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron

*A person cannot depart from the faith is they were never in the faith begin with

2 Corinthians 13:5
Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

2 Timothy 2:12
If we deny Him, He also will deny us

Romans 6:16
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

1 John 1:6
If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

Romans 2:7-11
To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
For there is no respect of persons with God.

James 1:22
But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

Romans 8:13
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
(NOT in our own strength - see Philippians 4:13)

Romans 6:14-16
For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

1 Peter 1:14-17
As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:
But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.
And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:

2 Peter 2:12-14
But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;
And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

John 15:2
Every branch in Me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

*Jesus is speaking of those in the Body of Christ in John 15:2

Matthew 7:16-21
Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

John 8:35
And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever.

James 5:19,20
Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Hebrews 10:28-31
He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

Only those led by the Spirit are the sons of God (Romans 8:14)

Corruption cannot inherit incorruption (1 Corinthians 15:50 - Gal 6:7,8 says we reap corruption when we sin)

2 Corinthians 13:5
Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

If OSAS was actually true, the Lord wouldn't be saying what He says in 2 Corinthians 13:5 and these other scriptures wouldn't even be in God's Word!

Here's another one that wouldn't be in God's Word if OSAS were actually true:

1 Corinthians 9:27
But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

1 Timothy 4:1,2
Now the Spirit speaks expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron

 

[PinSeeker]

So a comment, first. Maybe you'll answer without getting all mad... <chuckles> So yeah here:

Hebrews 3:12
Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.

*A person cannot depart from something they were never a part of to begin with

Ah, so cannot being a part of something be true in one way/sense and not in another? I mean, we can take part in something ~ participate in it ~ but never really be in accord with it... and really even unbeknownst to ourselves, in that we think we believe in something for a time but then at some point come to realize, "Hey, I don't really believe this," and therefore, depart. And this is what the writer of Hebrews is saying there, Big Body, that it's the evil heart of unbelief that leads them to depart from God. He says nothing there about God ever having had him, and the silence there should speak volumes. It does... Again, I can be participating in something, but come to myself at some point that my heart was never in it, and therefore, I depart from it.

me thing in 1 Timothy 4:1,2... "Now the Spirit speaks expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron..." So their conscience finally "woke them up," so to speak; why would their conscience bother them if they were not... participating in something that they came to understand their heart was not ever really in?

***************************************************

Now here, in response to another verse you cited and what you said about it, I'm just going to ask you a question. I would just like to hear your answer, Big Boy. Again, maybe you'll answer without getting all mad... <chuckles> So yeah here:

2 Timothy 2:12
If we deny Him, He also will deny us

This verse is very straightforward; there is no argument regarding what Paul is saying and what he means. Yes, if we deny Him, He also will deny us. But the question is, here, Big Boy, how do you reconcile that with what Jesus Himself says, also very straight-forwardly, in John 10:27-30? He says:

"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. I and the Father are one."

So how do you reconcile these two things?

Grace and peace to you.

 

[Earburner]

As for Psalm 22:3, why wouldn't God desire and find comradery, friendship and love among His OWN?

PS replied:
I really don't even know why you would ask that question, to be quite honest... But if it's rhetorical... okay... <smile>
> Again, concerning Psalm 22:3 my point is, from us, God doesn't want the empty mantra of ONLY worship and praise, like that of "the 4 Beasts which rest not day and night [24/7] saying: Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come".
No! God wants comradery, love and friendship from us who ARE HIS OWN, through our being born again of His Holy Spirit. In Psalm 22:3, God is not about seeking after mantras of empty praise, but rather caring, loving and friendly communication between his Saints and Himself.

Isn't it so, that they who are of the world, do the same with THEIR OWN?

PS replied:
Sure, they all go their own way, doing what's right in their own eyes. Again, not sure why you would ask that question, to be quite honest... But if it's rhetorical... okay... <smile>
> Exactly! The people of the world love those who ARE of the world. God doesn't call to repentance those who are satisfied and self righteous in their own eyes.

I think that I "covered the bases" pretty good...

PS replied: Fair enough.
> Thank you

...there are those who will always "call a foul", just to argue the point.

PS replied:
I guess so, but I'm not doing that. Words are important. I think maybe we're just missing each other... or... Well, in my opinion, the words you're using leave something to be desired regarding clarity.
> Instead of unraveling what I say, and telling me how to say it, for how you want to hear it,
how about just a simple acknowledgement of hitting the "like" icon.

Grace and peace to you, Earburner.
> To you also, Pinseeker.

 

[NayborBear]

Well you are going to be flabbergasted then

We are joint heirs with Christ Jesus... His physical body was resurrected and glorified and so will ours.

Jesus will forever live in a glorified physical body and real Christians will get the same and we will live in a physical world as in the end the Father moves Heaven to earth and real Christians will forever be with the Lord.

The gifts and callings of God are without repentance. He gave us a physical body and we will forever be in a physical body but the bodies of real Christians will be glorified.

“But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ, who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body. – Philippians 3:20-21

“Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years. – Revelation 20:6

“Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed—in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. – 1 Corinthians 15:51-52

“For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we will certainly also be united with him in a resurrection like his. – Romans 6:5

“Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned.” – John 5:28-29

Well? That's good!
How do you reconcile this?
1 Corinthians 15:51-52
Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be "changed", In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be "changed."

 

[PinSeeker]

I really don't even know why you would ask that question, to be quite honest... But if it's rhetorical... okay... <smile>
> My point is, from us, God doesn't want the empty mantra of ONLY worship and praise...

Hmmm, well, sure, I guess, but if we are really worshiping Him in spirit and truth, in which case God really is inhabiting our praises... enthroned on them ~ Psalm 22:3 ~ then it's certainly not any kind of "empty mantra.' And just to say, you may think so, and if so then fair enough, but I'm not really arguing with you here. I'm kind of wondering what you would call an empty mantra of worship and praise." Do you mean, emotionless, without "feeling"...? Because I would say that even just a simple statement about and/or acknowledgement of God and His greatness and holiness and Who He is certainly not empty. Even Psalm 22:3 is a simple acknowledgment of what is true about God. And Jesus quotes from Psalm 22 on the cross, you know... <smile> ...and you can actually feel the despair in it, but it is at the same time praise and worship of and hope in God.

God wants comradery, love and friendship from us who ARE HIS OWN, through our being born again of His Holy Spirit.

Ummm... okay, yes, fellowship of the saints is an important thing, sure... And yeah, as Jesus says in Matthew 22, we should "love the Lord God with all (our) heart and with all (our) soul and with all (our) mind..." and "love (our) neighbor as (ourself)... On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets," which you know, I'm sure, so, yeah.

In Psalm 22:3, God is not about seeking after mantras of empty praise, but rather caring, loving and friendly communication between his Saints and Himself.

Again, fellowship of the saints, sure. But Psalm 22:3... yeah see above.

is not about that...

The people of the world love those who ARE of the world.

Well, if by "love" here you mean conform to and give approval to, then sure.

God doesn't call to repentance those who are satisfied and self righteous in their own eyes.

All are called to repentance and belief; this is the general call of the Gospel, and it goes out to everyone.

Instead of unraveling what I say, and telling me how to say it, for how you want to hear it, how about just a simple acknowledgement of hitting the "like" icon.

Well, just hitting the "like" button conveys ~ to me, at least ~ that I agree with everything there... If it deserves a bit of scrutiny, and possibly a bit of clarification and/or correction, then so it shall be. <smile> If you are offended, then I apologize, but that's really kind of a you thing.

Grace and peace to you, Earburner.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Well? That's good!

How do you reconcile this?

1 Corinthians 15:51-52
Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be "changed", In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be "changed."

That's the rapture speaking of those who are here when Jesus removes His faithful from the earth and in that moment they receive their glorified bodies and is also referring to those who's bodies are still in the ground and they are reunited with their body and it is a glorified body.

Those that don't believe in the catching away of God's faithful don't need to worry about this because they gonna be left behind.

According to their faith it will be done unto them ya know.

 

[Earburner]

Hmmm, well, sure, I guess, but if we are really worshiping Him in spirit and truth, in which case God really is inhabiting our praises... enthroned on them ~ Psalm 22:3 ~ then it's certainly not any kind of "empty mantra.' And just to say, you may think so, and if so then fair enough, but I'm not really arguing with you here. I'm kind of wondering what you would call an empty mantra of worship and praise." Do you mean, emotionless, without "feeling"...? Because I would say that even just a simple statement about and/or acknowledgement of God and His greatness and holiness and Who He is certainly not empty. Even Psalm 22:3 is a simple acknowledgment of what is true about God. And Jesus quotes from Psalm 22 on the cross, you know... <smile> ...and you can actually feel the despair in it, but it is at the same time praise and worship of and hope in God.


Ummm... okay, yes, fellowship of the saints is an important thing, sure... And yeah, as Jesus says in Matthew 22, we should "love the Lord God with all (our) heart and with all (our) soul and with all (our) mind..." and "love (our) neighbor as (ourself)... On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets," which you know, I'm sure, so, yeah.


Again, fellowship of the saints, sure. But Psalm 22:3... yeah see above.

is not about that...

Well, if by "love" here you mean conform to and give approval to, then sure.


All are called to repentance and belief; this is the general call of the Gospel, and it goes out to everyone.


Well, just hitting the "like" button conveys ~ to me, at least ~ that I agree with everything there... If it deserves a bit of scrutiny, and possibly a bit of clarification and/or correction, then so it shall be. <smile> If you are offended, then I apologize, but that's really kind of a you thing.

Grace and peace to you, Earburner.

See what I mean? You just can't let people have their say, without you "hitching a ride" to make sure that it all goes in the right direction, according to YOUR liking.
Mat. 9
[13] But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but [rather] sinners to repentance.

 

[RepentingChristian]

I'm just hoping that Jesus lets me accompany him into Hell to help torture the bad people.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

I'm just hoping that Jesus lets me accompany him into Hell to help torture the bad people.

Meh, that's just demonic thinking from the devils who are mocking the Truth Jesus spoke about hell being real and people suffering there for eternity

Those allowing this sort of thoughts in to their thinking are receiving demonic "revelations" aka lies of the devil.

 

[PinSeeker]

See what I mean? You just can't let people have their their say...

Not without debate, if there's debate to be had, which is the case here, Earburner. What you say here seems a bit hypocritical... At any rate, yeah, this is a debate forum. So the issue is just participation, really or... not. If you don't like it, then you probably shouldn't be here. The issue seems to be all you, man.

, without you "hitching a ride" to make sure that it all goes in the right direction, according to YOUR liking.

It's about right and wrong. Or, in this case, right and... maybe somewhat right, but poorly stated. <smile> Again, you're certainly your own person, and if you don't like it, you can always choose to, you know, not participate. <smile>

Mat. 9
[13] But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but [rather] sinners to repentance.

Hm. Seems kind of non sequitur... I mean, certainly not to downplay anything Jesus said, of course, but yeah...

Grace and peace to you, Earburner.