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Five Smooth Stones

Discussion in 'Bible Study Forum' started by jsarber, Aug 23, 2007.

  1. jsarber

    jsarber New Member

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    I've discussed this topic with friends in the past but I'd love to hear more thoughts on it. Why did David take with him five stones to face Goliath? Why not one? There may not be a proven answer to this question but it's interesting I think.1 Samuel 17:40And he took his staff in his hand, and chose him five smooth stones out of the brook, and put them in a shepherd's bag which he had, even in a scrip; and his sling was in his hand: and he drew near to the Philistine.
     
  2. Wakka

    Wakka Super Member

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    Good question. I don't have an answer, but I really want to see where this discussion goes. [​IMG]
     
  3. Joyful

    Joyful New Member

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    I've discussed this topic with friends in the past but I'd love to hear more thoughts on it. Why did David take with him five stones to face Goliath? Why not one? There may not be a proven answer to this question but it's interesting I think.1 Samuel 17:40And he took his staff in his hand, and chose him five smooth stones out of the brook, and put them in a shepherd's bag which he had, even in a scrip; and his sling was in his hand: and he drew near to the Philistine.
    I don't think this verse is as complicated as people put it. All we can do is just guess and everyone's guess is as good as anyone elses.I think David thought he may need 5 stones to kill the enemy.love, hitomi
     
  4. ÐøÞÞlégäñgèr

    ÐøÞÞlégäñgèr New Member

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    Because Goliath had Brothers!2 Samuel 21:16-22 ------------------2Sa 21:16 And Ishbibenob, which was of the sons of the giant, the weight of whose spear weighed three hundred shekels of brass in weight, he being girded with a new sword, thought to have slain David.2Sa 21:17 But Abishai the son of Zeruiah succoured him, and smote the Philistine, and killed him. Then the men of David sware unto him, saying, Thou shalt go no more out with us to battle, that thou quench not the light of Israel. 2Sa 21:18 And it came to pass after this, that there was again a battle with the Philistines at Gob: then Sibbechai the Hushathite slew Saph, which was of the sons of the giant.2Sa 21:19 And there was again a battle in Gob with the Philistines, where Elhanan the son of Jaareoregim, a Bethlehemite, slew the brother of Goliath the Gittite, the staff of whose spear was like a weaver's beam.2Sa 21:20 And there was yet a battle in Gath, where was a man of great stature, that had on every hand six fingers, and on every foot six toes, four and twenty in number; and he also was born to the giant.2Sa 21:21 And when he defied Israel, Jonathan the son of Shimea the brother of David slew him. 2Sa 21:22 These four were born to the giant in Gath, and fell by the hand of David, and by the hand of his servants. http://fireinsideministries.tripod.com/sec...lestudies3.htmlSo actually David got five stones in case Goliath's brothers or sons showed up for a fight! Then he would be ready for them. How accurate was David?A good slinger (the name of one's who used slingshots) hurled a stone as far and as accurate as an archer. Slingers are known to hurl their stones as far as 440 yards (quarter of a mile). And David was the most famous of slingers so he must have been pretty accurate.
     
  5. Joyful

    Joyful New Member

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    thank you dapple for your information:)love, hitomi
     
  6. jsarber

    jsarber New Member

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    I've heard the four-brothers idea before. I've also thought those four extra stones might have represented David, the lowly mortal. He had the incredible faith in God to stand before this champion of the Phillistines with nothing but stones but in his own doubt of his own abilities, he carried with him extra stones, in fear that he may fail. Just another thought.
     
  7. n2thelight

    n2thelight Well-Known Member

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    I think this may be a good answer for youI Samuel 17:40 "And he took his staff in his hand, and chose him five smooth stones out of the brook, and put them in a shepherd's bag which he had, even in a scrip: and his sling was in his hand:"Stop and consider this armor that David it taking into battle. David took the wooden stick called his staff that he had tended his sheep with, and he selected five smooth stones from the brook that ran through the valley. Remember that the trenches of the troops are at the top of the hill, and the brook is down in the valley. David moved out of the trench and down into the valley to prepare for the warfare. David moved with the faith that God would see him through, and provide those stones for his battle with Goliath. David selected these five smooth stone and put them in his shepherd's bag that he was carrying.Even though David only used one stone to do the job, He selected five stones. This starts the understanding of "the key of David", for the number five represents "grace". It is through the grace of the Father, and through His Son, Jesus Christ, the offspring of David that we find salvation. He is the hidden manna that we read of in Revelation 2:17. Revelation 2:17 "He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches. To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it:"Meaning those that partake of this Word and truth, in a Spiritual sense, God would give a "white stone" with a new name written thereon. And that Greek word used for "stone", is a similar word for the word "count", in Revelation 13:18. The two verses are tied together for to have the white stone is to be able to count the number of the beast. The "hidden manna" is the truths from the Word of God that only those with ears to hear with understanding will know their meaning. Revelation 13:18 "Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six."This is God's way of teaching his elect as to how they were to "count the number of their enemy". Goliath as seen here in I Samuel was only a type of the enemy. Though the enemy may look like a giant to many in our day, they are not to you when you understand God's Word. So lets go to Strong's Greek dictionary for the correct translation from the Greek to English, as used here in the Scripture. #5585; "Psephizo, psay-fid'-zo; from 5506; to use pebbles in enumeration, i.e. to compute:-to count." So lets go to the root word to understand the full meaning of this word in $5586; "Psephos, psay'-fos: from the same as 5584: a pebble (as worn smooth by handling), i.e. (by impl. of use as a counter or ballot) a verdict (of acquittal) or ticke (of admission); a vote: stone, voice."This is simply saying, the elect are to keep up with the identity of the children of Cain down through the many generations of time to be able to identify them and their activity. To be able to identify the evilness that they bring with them on the peoples that they have mixed with. When you know where these Kenites are, you will understand that where they, they will be promoting their father, the false messiah, which is the devil himself. The Kenites are those smooth stones worn smooth over a very long period of time, and even in our generation, when you see their way of doing things and the things they are saying, it is to promote the ways of Satan. So to have the "key of David", is to be able to identify the true from the false, to be able to identify the things of God, from the twisted truth, that have become nothing but lies and do not come from the Word of God. When you have the "key of David", you will be able to know when the truth from God's Word is being made into a lie by the word smiths that like to twist the truth to make it a lie. Do you have the "white stone", for that white stone is your weapon, in a spiritual sense. The church in the latter times that had the key of David are those that taught as the church of Philadelphia. Revealtion 3:7 And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; `These things saith He That is Holy, He That is true, He That hath the key of David, He That openeth, and no man shutteth, and shutteth, and no man openeth."It gives you an advantage in these final days of this earth age, and even David had this advantage. The advantage was not because of the stone that he selected, but because He knew our Heavenly Father. David knew the things of the Father from those things of the world. David knew that what was about to happen was in accordance with God's plan, and that God would protect him. After all Samuel had just anointed him king, and David had faith.http://www.theseason.org/1Samuel/1Samuel17.htm
     
  8. ÐøÞÞlégäñgèr

    ÐøÞÞlégäñgèr New Member

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    This is a Perfect Example Post that God's Word can be Taught on 3 Different Levels of Meaning. Good Posts, Good Topic! Thanx!
     
  9. HammerStone

    HammerStone Well-Known Member Staff Member

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    The simple answer is that five is the Biblical number for Grace. David was a lowly shepherd boy called of YHVH to do something the manliest man could not.
     
  10. Faithful

    Faithful New Member

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    40.And he took his staff in his hand, and chose him five smooth stones out of the brook, and put them in a shepherd's bag which he had, even in a scrip; and his sling was in his hand: and he drew near to the Philistine. When David came to face Goliath he said,43.And the Philistine said unto David, Am I a dog, that thou comest to me with staves? And the Philistine cursed David by his gods. 44.And the Philistine said to David, Come to me, and I will give thy flesh unto the fowls of the air, and to the beasts of the field. 45.Then said David to the Philistine, Thou comest to me with a sword, and with a spear, and with a shield: but I come to thee in the name of the LORD of hosts, the God of the armies of Israel, whom thou hast defied. 46.This day will the LORD deliver thee into mine hand; and I will smite thee, and take thine head from thee; and I will give the carcases of the host of the Philistines this day unto the fowls of the air, and to the wild beasts of the earth; that all the earth may know that there is a God in Israel. 47.And all this assembly shall know that the LORD saveth not with sword and spear: for the battle is the LORD's, and he will give you into our hands. If your going to use your hands to throw stones but did not know the distance or height you would need to throw the stone. Then you would take several stones. But clearly David was not relying on himself or his abilities.He clearly showed that God was delivering him into his hand.Note it says hand not hands. David knew it was as good as done. David knew it was not his hand or skill David may have aimed the stone with skill and precision having never killed a human it would of taken God to let the stone hit where necessary to allow David to cut of his head etc.
     
  11. BoranJarami

    BoranJarami New Member

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    It is very easy for us to underestimate God, David was no different. It would have been hard for him to think that one stone would be enough to kill a giant so why not take a few extra stones just in case? This doesn't mean he had no faith. Standing before a giant with one stone or five, it still takes alot of faith.Each of us has at some point has also picked up extra stones in our walk with God, whether it be extra money, extra time, or a plan B for what God has asked us to do. Just as Davids extra stones proved to be uneeded so does our extra gathering. Stooping to pick up a few extra stoned may not have made much of a difference in Davids situation, but often in ours it can mean alot, possibly even te lives of sinners. We need to keep this in mind the next time we want a few extra stones before faceing the giant.
     
  12. Faithful

    Faithful New Member

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    I like this thread because like when studying the bible, we discuss all possibilities about the particular passage of scripture.And when we read the word of God we know David was a man after Gods own heart. I believe David as his words confirmed already knew the victory was his. Once Goliath dead he knew the enemy armies would flee. Being a shepherd he knew he still had to return at that point to the sheep God had not revealed his plan there and then for him. So he still had sheep to protect so why not take more than one pebble for wolves could still attack his sheep.I think David was sure of his victory even the armour he left behind, no quaking in his boots and he spoke out very clearly to Goliath. Even cut his head off which is really Gory stuff. Looking at God and looking at David, I believe he had no fear.And like any good shepherd he would have ensured he had enough stones for all enemies he might encounter that day.We sometimes do that, have you noticed. We set our mind on one particular goal forgetting how may other goals, God maybe fulfilling at the same time. Then afterwards we see what other things God brought out of the situation for us.[​IMG]
     
  13. jsarber

    jsarber New Member

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    Amen. Another thought about the number five is that on occasion it may represent something incomplete. For instance, Matthew 25 talks of the 10 virgins, five were wise and five were foolish. Which if there's any validity to that then it makes sense that even though David was a good and faithful servent he was still a sinful man and would not be satisfied with a single stone. He might have taken five based on his own ability but all while having such a faith in God that he only took stones to face Goliath.
     
  14. ÐøÞÞlégäñgèr

    ÐøÞÞlégäñgèr New Member

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    Remember, though that the 5 stones represent the 5 brothers of Goliath and Goliath was 6 cubits high.
     
  15. BoranJarami

    BoranJarami New Member

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    Remember, though that the 5 stones represent the 5 brothers of Goliath and Goliath was 6 cubits high.
    I know that the Bible mentions the brothers of Goliath and that the Bible mentions five stones, but where does it say that the stones represent the brothers?
     
  16. ÐøÞÞlégäñgèr

    ÐøÞÞlégäñgèr New Member

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    It doesn't, its implied, if 5 represents grace, and it does, it would also represent his brothers. No Israeli went down to meet Goliath. It could be assumed that if David Killed Goliath, his brothers would sooon follow to avenge his death. But the Site of It scared them so bad they fled. Also Jewish traditions mention this was a ploy or a plan by Saul and Joab to use David as a distraction to out flank the enemy at the time.
     
  17. BoranJarami

    BoranJarami New Member

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    I can see that.But it also brings up another question. You, and a couple others in this thread, mentioned that five represents grace. Where does this come from?
     
  18. Christina

    Christina New Member

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    I can see that.But it also brings up another question. You, and a couple others in this thread, mentioned that five represents grace. Where does this come from?
    There are whole books written on the numers in scripture. 5 is always grace7 is completness, 6 Man ect. If you notice there is alot of repeat numbers in scripture and they tell a story or give you a deeper understanding of Gods word and how he works. for example 40 is testing or probation Forty days Moses was in the mount, Exo 24:18; and to receive the Law, Exo 24:18.l Forty days Moses was in the mount after the sin of the Golden Calf, Deut 9:18,25.l Forty days of the spies, issuing in the penal sentence of the 40 years, Num 13:26, 14:34.l Forty days of Elijah in Horeb, 1 Kings 19:8.l Forty days of Jonah and Nineveh, Jonah 3:4.l Forty days Ezekiel lay on his right side to symbolize the 40 years of Judah's transgression.*l Forty days Jesus was tempted of the Devil, Matt 4:2.One of the best is books on this by Bulinger can be downloaded here in PDF format at the link below. http://www.christianityboard.com/number-scripture-t1821.html
     
  19. TallMan

    TallMan New Member

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    Ex:13:18: But God led the people about, through the way of the wilderness of the Red sea: and the children of Israel went up harnessed (heb. by five in a rank) out of the land of Egypt.Ex:14:8: And the Lord hardened the heart of Pharaoh king of Egypt, and he pursued after the children of Israel: and the children of Israel went out with an high hand. . . . "high five!"The Stone Kingdom in Daniel's vision was the 5th, it supercedes all the others.
     
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