God Does Not Live in Your Church Building

[bdavidc]

God actually showed up in the Temple as smoke.

God Appeared in the Temple as Smoke — The Manifest Presence​

When Solomon dedicated the Temple, something happened that stunned the priests:


And again:


This wasn’t symbolic. This wasn’t metaphor. This wasn’t imagination.

God literally manifested Himself as a thick, overwhelming cloud of glory — smoke filling the Temple.

This was the same presence that:

• led Israel by cloud and fire
• descended on Sinai
• filled the Tabernacle
• appeared in the Most Holy Place

The Hebrew word is “kavod” — weight, heaviness, glory.

God’s presence was so real, so heavy, so overwhelming that the priests physically could not stand.

MatthewG, I agree that the glory of the LORD filled the temple. The Scripture says that plainly, and I am not denying it. The cloud was real. The glory was real. The priests could not stand to minister because of it.

But that actually proves the point I was making, not the opposite. God manifested His glory there, but He was never contained there. Even Solomon knew that when he prayed, “But will God indeed dwell on the earth? behold, the heaven and heaven of heavens cannot contain thee; how much less this house that I have builded?” ~1 Kings 8:27.

That is the difference I am trying to make clear. There is a biblical difference between God manifesting His glory in a place and God being confined to that place. Stephen was not denying the tabernacle or the temple. He mentioned both. But he still said, “Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands” ~Acts 7:48.

So yes, God showed His glory in the temple. No argument there. But the New Testament does not teach that God now dwells in church buildings. It teaches that His people are the temple of God. “Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?” ~1 Corinthians 3:16.

That is the issue. I am not denying what happened under Solomon. I am saying we need to follow the whole Bible forward to Christ and the new covenant. God is not locked in a building. The born-again believer is indwelt by the Spirit of God, and that is far greater than calling a church building “God’s house.”

 

[bdavidc]

God Does Not Live in Your Church Building​

Does He live in the heart of the guy who sleeps in the stairwell?

If the man in the stairwell is born again, then yes, the Spirit of God dwells in him. If he is not born again, then he still needs Christ like every other sinner does.

The Bible does not teach that God lives in every person automatically. Paul said, “Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his” ~Romans 8:9. So the question is not whether the man is poor, homeless, inside, outside, clean, dirty, noticed, or ignored. The question is whether he belongs to Christ.

But that does not give anyone permission to step over him like he is nothing. He is still made in the image of God. He still has a soul. He still needs mercy, truth, and the gospel. James 2:15-16 warns about seeing someone in need and giving religious words while doing nothing to help.

So yes, I get the point. If we are calling a church building “God’s house” while ignoring the hurting man at the door, something is badly wrong. Under the New Testament, God’s people are His temple, not the brick, carpet, pulpit, or sign out front.

 

[MatthewG]

Okay

 

[amigo de christo]

God Does Not Live in Your Church Building​

Does He live in the heart of the guy who sleeps in the stairwell?

Only if that one believes in HIS CHRIST . then of course His spirit dwells within such a one .
But mark my words , if any hears and rejects HIS CHRIST , beleive you me They have NOT the SPIRIT of GOD within them .
FOR BY THE SPIRIT THEY WOULD CALL HIM LORD
and no man b y the SPIRIT would call HIM accursed , to seperate HIM out .
SO lets please keep that in mind my friends . For there is a spirit of error and there is the spirit of Truth .
And they do not coexist together as one . ITS EITHER ONE or the other one has .
SO lets sum that up .
JOHN said , as JESUS said it first ,
HE who hears us hears GOD . Aka the gospel of beleive ye IN JESUS
but he who hears not us , is not of GOD .
THIS is that spirit of error .

 

[amigo de christo]

If the man in the stairwell is born again, then yes, the Spirit of God dwells in him. If he is not born again, then he still needs Christ like every other sinner does.

The Bible does not teach that God lives in every person automatically. Paul said, “Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his” ~Romans 8:9. So the question is not whether the man is poor, homeless, inside, outside, clean, dirty, noticed, or ignored. The question is whether he belongs to Christ.

But that does not give anyone permission to step over him like he is nothing. He is still made in the image of God. He still has a soul. He still needs mercy, truth, and the gospel. James 2:15-16 warns about seeing someone in need and giving religious words while doing nothing to help.

So yes, I get the point. If we are calling a church building “God’s house” while ignoring the hurting man at the door, something is badly wrong. Under the New Testament, God’s people are His temple, not the brick, carpet, pulpit, or sign out front.

man you dont know how happy that made my heart to hear it . SEEING most speak nothing of having to have to BELIEVE ON JESUS .
man i read this post , RIGHT after i had left mine , and it brought joy and rejoicing
to my soul to see another one POINT ING TO THE DIRE NEED of JESUS
rather than making excuse for UNBELIEF as many now do . PREACH JESUS to the last breath my friend .
WE march on IN CHRIST and we shall offer up NO false hope , no false love to this world ,
WE OFFER UP the ONLY T RUTH , ONLY LOVE , AND ONLY HOPE there is , JESUS THE GLORIOUS RISEN CHRIST
who was delivered for our offences and raised again for our justification . that indeed
we who do beleive have been made the RIGHTEOUSNESS of GOD IN JESUS CHRIST . TO the trenches david for the hour
grows only later by the day and by the hour . THE TIME will come and will surely
come WHEN the master of the HOUSE rises up and closes the door . AND on that day and in that hour
known to no man but GOD ALONE , ALL outside shall wail and wail .
All inside are those whose faith be IN JESUS CHRIST , all outside rejected HIM .

 

[bdavidc]

That's well said. A complimentary parable is that of the ten virgins, a woman also being used in scripture as a symbol of God's people, but again depending on context. Babylon the Great is representative of a church, but one would not suggest that church is God's church, although He does have people in it. As for the term virgins, they were all waiting in expectation of the Bridegroom and to be taken to His Fathers house. All were asleep, all were His, but only 5 were prepared by having the Holy Spirit as their Light in the midst of darkness. Isaiah 60:2. Sadly half the church were locked out.
In the midst of his inability to hear the voice of God, spiritual silence, David in Psalm 88:18 NIV declares that darkness had become his only friend.
In Isaiah 58 darkness and light is held in stark contrast with one another with God's people living in light only by reason of their obedience to God's calling on His people to represent Him and express His character in serving others.
Your candlestick reference is a perfect depiction of a church living in the light and glory of a merciful gracious God. And the candlestick itself is sanctuary language reminding one of the candlestick in the OT temple. The temple of the NT is God's people, but is only relevant inasmuch as they have the Holy Spirit lighting their way and providing power to walk as He walked, in loving self- sacrificial service to the orphan, the widow, the homeless, the addicted, the naked, echoing your statement above...
That is why the issue is not whether we can defend our religious system. The issue is whether we are hearing and obeying Christ according to Scripture.

I agree with the warning. A religious name, an outward place among God’s people, and the appearance of waiting for the Lord do not save anybody. Matthew 25 is a serious passage. But I would be careful saying “all were His” and “half the church were locked out.” Jesus does not say that. He says the foolish virgins were shut out, and when they cried, “Lord, Lord, open to us,” He answered, “Verily I say unto you, I know you not” ~Matthew 25:11-12.

That matters. That does not sound like Christ losing His own. That sounds like false profession being exposed. All ten had lamps. All ten looked like they were waiting. All ten fell asleep. But only five were ready. That lines up with what Jesus said in Matthew 7:21, “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven.”

I agree that God’s people are His temple, and I agree that the Holy Spirit is not just something to talk about. If a man does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His ~Romans 8:9. So yes, the warning stands. A church can have a name and still be judged. A person can carry a lamp and still be shut out. But we need to say it the way Scripture says it. The issue is not Christ losing His own. The issue is whether we truly belong to Him.

 

[amigo de christo]

I agree with the warning. A religious name, an outward place among God’s people, and the appearance of waiting for the Lord do not save anybody. Matthew 25 is a serious passage. But I would be careful saying “all were His” and “half the church were locked out.” Jesus does not say that. He says the foolish virgins were shut out, and when they cried, “Lord, Lord, open to us,” He answered, “Verily I say unto you, I know you not” ~Matthew 25:11-12.

That matters. That does not sound like Christ losing His own. That sounds like false profession being exposed. All ten had lamps. All ten looked like they were waiting. All ten fell asleep. But only five were ready. That lines up with what Jesus said in Matthew 7:21, “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven.”

I agree that God’s people are His temple, and I agree that the Holy Spirit is not just something to talk about. If a man does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His ~Romans 8:9. So yes, the warning stands. A church can have a name and still be judged. A person can carry a lamp and still be shut out. But we need to say it the way Scripture says it. The issue is not Christ losing His own. The issue is whether we truly belong to Him.

and do you mind if i finish that .
You wrote that if a man has Not the SPIRIT of CHRIST HE is none of us .
And if a man has the SPIRIT then the body is dead because OF SIN . so again
i must now ask us all , as i am sure you already know the answer , WHY am i seeing so many
LIVING IT UP IN SIN when BY THE SPIRIT we should be dead to sin and liv ing UNTO RIGHTEOUSNESS
by and POWER OF THE HOLY GOD .
In other words why o why am i seeing many holding rainbows and saying GOD is love and i bleeive in jesus .
And now a word to explain why i said jesus and Not JESUS .
As again i am sure you know this .
BECAUSE , JESUS IS NOT THE MINSTIR OF SIN . and anyone coming to a jesus who is , came to the WRONG one
and has NOT the SPIRIT at all .
FOR IF they had come TO THE JESUS they had been sealed by THE SPIRIT
and the FRUIT OF THE SPIRIT is in all RIGHTEOUSNESS , GODLINESS and TRUTH with a captial T .
Proving what is acceptab le TO GOD ALL MIGHTY .
AND I THINK WE both know SIN AND LIES are not acceptable WITH THIS GOD ALL MIGHTY .

 

[marks]

There is no place where God is not, the Bible is clear on that.

Nor is God contained within His creation, that would be nonsensical.

For me, the important fact is, God lives here with me, which is what makes my life liveable.

Do you really think that any of the one's reading your threads believe God's presence is limited to their church meeting rooms?

Much love!

 

[marks]

Fair enough but when I read the title and the posts the impression was to some extent negative.

If you look at his other threads I think you will see a pattern . . .

Much love!

 

[marks]

I agree with the warning. A religious name, an outward place among God’s people, and the appearance of waiting for the Lord do not save anybody. Matthew 25 is a serious passage. But I would be careful saying “all were His” and “half the church were locked out.” Jesus does not say that. He says the foolish virgins were shut out, and when they cried, “Lord, Lord, open to us,” He answered, “Verily I say unto you, I know you not” ~Matthew 25:11-12.

That matters. That does not sound like Christ losing His own. That sounds like false profession being exposed. All ten had lamps. All ten looked like they were waiting. All ten fell asleep. But only five were ready. That lines up with what Jesus said in Matthew 7:21, “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven.”

I agree that God’s people are His temple, and I agree that the Holy Spirit is not just something to talk about. If a man does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His ~Romans 8:9. So yes, the warning stands. A church can have a name and still be judged. A person can carry a lamp and still be shut out. But we need to say it the way Scripture says it. The issue is not Christ losing His own. The issue is whether we truly belong to Him.

Consider whether this parable was given for the church or for Israel, to whom it was spoken. Much confusion can result from the failure to "rightly divide".

Much love!

 

[amigo de christo]

There is no place where God is not, the Bible is clear on that.

Nor is God contained within His creation, that would be nonsensical.

For me, the important fact is, God lives here with me, which is what makes my life liveable.

Do you really think that any of the one's reading your threads believe God's presence is limited to their church meeting rooms?

Much love!

While GOD SEES and knows ALL that goes on , even in the darkness you can rest assured there is a place
HE will never be found . IN A LIE . in anything contrary to HIS WORDS , HIS GOSPEL
HIS TRUTH .
THINK inclusivism , THINK ecumeincalism , FOR IT IS ALL A LIE that many now love and embrace .
This inclusive god , who is none other than SATAN and NOT GOD , has captivated the hearts of even
a lot within christendom .
AND it dont seem to matter what side of the aisle their politics is on .
WHILE ITS TRUE they are dogmatically opposed to the other ones politics
WHAT IS JUST AS TRUE IS , THEY are all under the spell of that one same inclusive god and his ecumiencal whore .
SO let that sink in my friend . WE are ALL being lied too . LIED TOO i say , LIED TOO .
BUT GOD IS NOT MAN that he can lie . so i highly and heavily and with upmost urgency
beg , warn and plead for all TO GET INTO THAT BIBLE again for themselves
and to stop trusting in any govt , in any poltician , in the TRUMP or in the nar realm or in the RCC
or etc . IT JESUS TIME folks . IT IS JESUS TIME .

 

[MatthewG]

God lives in all people I believe. But whether or not they interact with him is totally subjective.x