And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rising up out of the sea." The sea-- bespeaks the mass of humanity, out of which rises the bestial systems which have placed their mark upon "ALL, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond." The fact is every creature bears this mark of the bestial nature, until such a time as the cross cancels out the old Adamic nature, and we are born anew with the Christ nature, to bear THE MARK OF GOD, being partakers of the divine nature, and conformed to the image of The Son. The Greek word used here for "mark" is "charagma." Eight times, and all in the book of Revelation, it is translated as "mark," and means: an engraving, an impressed mark. Then once it is given as "graven," in Acts 17:29, and it is in this latter reference that we find the explanation or key as to what the MARK involves in its relationship to man, for this mark is brought about by ART and by MAN'S DEVICE. "For as much then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, GRAVEN by art and man's device." The Greek word for "art" is techni" meaning: art, skill, craft, technology; and thus speaks of the work of the hands, or handiwork, and has its correlation to that which is received in "the right hand," as spoken of in Revelation. The word "devices" is from the Greek "enthumesis" meaning: INWARD THINKING, or inner thought, which deals with our mental activity, and pertains to the forehead. Thus we have the ENGRAVING BY HANDIWORK, and the CONTROLLING OF OUR THINKING. That which would seek to place its image upon us, dealing with the work of our hands, and the brainwashing of our minds, to think according to its nature and purpose. Pursuing this a bit further, we find another Greek word closely akin, it is "charakter", translated as "express image." Hebrews 1:3, "Who being the brightness of glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE of His person..." Speaking, of course, of Christ Jesus, and then by extension, of His anointed ones who partake of His divine nature and are conformed to His image, so as to also become expressions, or manifestations of the substance of God, as revealed through His, and our character. Thus, the MARK speaks of that handiwork and the inward thinking which brings forth an expression of character in line with the very source from which the mark comes. Either we will express the character of God, or the character of the bestial system of this world. It is not speaking only of an outward form, which could be covered with a masquerade for a time, but it refers to that INNER QUALITY OF CHARACTER WHICH IS BEING DEVELOPED IN US, which in due time shall be revealed, for "the day shall declare it." The "mark of the beast" is the direct opposite to the "MARK OF GOD," and is an imprint of the nature and character of this world's bestial system. The challenge to OVERCOME this mark of the bestial has been with us a long time-- ever since "The Lord God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to KEEP (guard) it." (Genesis 2:15). There was a beast waiting to place its mark upon the Adam. "The serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made." (Genesis 3:1 ). And in Revelation we again have this charge to guard against the beast, and the system which it represents. We find that the IMPRINT was made when Eve responded to the serpent's argument, which caused her to "take of the fruit," which had been forbidden her. Immediately the mark was in her forehead, and then in her hand. Adam joined her in this receiving of the mark. And having taken the imprint-- they began to manifest the nature, character of the bestial, in selfish, rebellious, minding the flesh behavior. In Revelation, again the hand and the mind are involved with the mark of the beast-- the influence that causes one to think and act according to the ways of the world. It is this flesh nature that identifies us with this world's carnality. "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, sedition, heresies, envying, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: - they that do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." But then in contra-distinction to such negativism, we find that the new Christ nature bears a far different imprint, for "The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance." (Galatians 5:19-23). O, to bear the mark of God! Not only is the bestial mark stamped upon the nature of man, to influence his thinking, and his handiwork, but we live under the mark of the beast by living in this commercialized world order. "That no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name." If we buy a car, a home, clothes, food, pay taxes, etc. it is all under the mark of the beast. Whether we use a barter system, or silver coins, we have to do business according to our culture and order of society.
God revealed who the beast is in Jeremiah 50
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Benoni:Never heard it that way before. After doing lots of study on the subject. I am pretty sure that Mark will not be visible or some computer chip. I could just imagine people thinking that all they have to do is refuse that chip and it's all good with God at that point. More salvation by works again.Be BlessedJesus Is Lord.
Idon't know where this post will end up, but I replied in here just to keep track of all the points hared hehe. Vickie- 1- The Roman Empire/Kingdom, would not be revived, to have some other King of a different past Kingdom come back from the dead to rule it. God and christ were clear about the spirits of dead people, as Christina pointed out, going to and never able to leave, thier appointed holding place, after physical death. 2- No, the clay will not be the "king.anti-christ. Rather, a Scripture declares how this one world Government shall be strong, but not solid, and will have its weaknesses. This is totally unlike the old Roman Empire, which was very strong and very solid, as depicted by fully solid iron legs. Besides, historical evidence proves, they defeated every opponent they ever went against, save one, the other part of the divided "Germania" which existed back then. They conquered the first half they went against, but could never overcome the other part. 3- "fatal wound"- You misinterpretated what I plainly said. But here is Truth from God's Word- God prophecies how this "antichrist" shall have dominion over the earth for "one week"- (Heptad) translated means 7 years. The "wound" that is as unto death, is relating to the anti-christ being killed, not "a" or "the" nation being destroyed. But, when Satan/Dragon is fully cast out of Heaven and unto the Earth at that time, he will then possess the anti-christ's body to revive him. (all the world will wonder after him). Why? Scriptures declare, the anti-christ will make a "peace pact" first, but after 42 months- 3 1/2 years, that "PP" is broken and trouble starts. During the last half of those 7 years, the anti-christ will go to Jerusalem and fully defile the Temple in all manner of ways, including eventually sitting on the Throne, claiming himself god. 4- You've totally misinterpreted the scripture describing the anti-christ in Jer. Why? Over the number of Christian sites I regularly visit, I've found as many other misinterpretations, one claiming its "Obama", another- "George Bush Jr.", another- a present foriegn Country Leader, another- Clinton. You can believe otherwise, fine, thats your choice. But Scriptures taken literally don't lie. God never prophecied ahead of His other prophecy not fulfilled yet, as proclaimed- the anti-christ will not be publicly known until after a "falling away", etc, for when the "man of sin", "son of perdition will be revealed. As Christine averted to, I also suggest you follow your own advice and take God's Word for what It literally says, it means. God would not reveal something before the time He prophecies it will be. So stop trying to push "guesses" here. 5-"Babylon"- Again, If read Scriptures relating to "Babylon" in Revelation, you'd find its used as a representation" of a Kingdon, not the actual one its named after. "Mystery Babylon"- babylon was no mystery. Both Biblical Historical and Secular Historical accounts show it was a "real Kingdom" before. But that this "end time" Kingdom, will only be "like" the original "Babylon" (mystery Babylon), because of its sinful thinking and operating being so identical to the original "Babylon". 6- "falling away"- Again, you misinterprete God's Word, by putting the "falling away, as the reason for the "King's" appearance. A lie. The Scripture declares the "falling away" must HAPPEN FIRST"- (meaning before this antichrist is even revealed). 7- The Roman Empire is not mentioned anywhere in Scriptures- Maybe you should reread God's Word. there was a prophecy God gave, in one of the earliest Old Test. books, about the four Kingdoms He would bring upon the Jews as captors over them, naming each one, including the roman Empire. Secondly- God prophecied not long after that, by the Prophets pleas to God, God held back the present chastisement of the Jews, but prophecied as well, if they did not turn from thier sinful ways, his judgement would come later and worse than would be at that time. And God spoke of the captivity and length it would go, as Daniel showed he understood about how much longer the Jews captivity had to go yet also. 8- "Roman Empire" again- A- Read Scriptures about who the major Kingdom was who lorded over Isreal as a captor- "Rome" and King Herod. B- The statue of King Nebecanezzar shows the "two legs of iron" depicting clearly Rome, because of it having to main HeadQuarters, one in Constantinopal, the other in Rome, the city. C- The "feet" of the Statue were of "Iron"- (Rome), 10 toes- (10 Nations making up that "one world Government"). Mixed with clay- showing it has some strength, but still weakness because of being a number of nations instead of one Governing body alone. D- Your interpretation being"King Nebecanezzar", comes from a form of spiritualizing of Scriptures, instead of taking It literally. Secondly- God declares this "man of sin" won't be revealed- (who he is) until after specific events happen, which have not as yet. 9- 4 Kingdoms of the Kings statue- Yes they are. If you were to pay close attention to Scriptures of the Old Test. books, you'd find references to each of these major Kingdoms who held Isreal captive, and the interactions of main Charactors of God's Word with them, at each one's time of captivity under those kingdoms, clearly spoken of. Some are of the rulers over them which Biblical and Historical evidence proves were rulers over those afore mentioned kingdms, while others clearly reference the Kingdoms themselves. I've read a whole number of false religious teachings, from books that totally spiritualize, or symbolize or fifuratize God's word and fully distort all literal truths God declares, to come up with satanically influenced lies and deceptions. Now, while you claim this "doctrine" of the kingdoms I mentioned started only 200 years ago, try reading the Commentaries of Early Church Leaders of the first 300 years of Christianity. You'd find you are wrong in that statement. 10- Jesus is the only Power who can destroy this Kingdom- Yes my dear, hence the "Stone"- (Jesus' bodily return), falling from the sky in the dream, and hitting upon the "FEET" and destroying them. 11- "This is new to all our ears"- Sorry, not mine. God started me reading studying and researching this subject for more than 15 years, before putting me into Bible Studys and classes on the subject, dealing with so many, many varieties of misinterpretations having popped up over the years. Try spending more than 20 years, going thru the Postal service, gathering more than two full size truck boxes full of paperwork showing the evidence I share on this and all other subjects I share about. Your welcome about my being nice. To date, i'm working with several groups belonging to Cult religions, in discussions about thier misinterpretations of God's Word, thus the false doctrine each Cult teaches. But you are right. We do live a life in this physical world, till we die, constantly learning and growing. I enjoyed this exchange with you. 12- Speaking to mike about II Thess. 2:1-3- 1- "Now we beseech you brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto Him,- (Rapture) 2- That ye not be shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter from us, as that the day of christ is at hand. 3- Let no man decieve you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition." Verse 2, shows the order in which these events must happen. And, when the "man of sin be revealed" was spoken it was mean't, when he is publicly known, not revealed as who he is by Scripture. The "falling away" is to be taken as a literal event, therefore the "revealing" of the antichrist is a "literal" event as well. 2- Again with King Nebecaneezar- The problem we have with your synopsis is, you are interpreting scriptures to claim a false belief of who this anti-christ is. Yet, Both Biblical and Secular Historical ancient documentations prove what I had shared before, of the 4 Kingdoms, and how the last one relates to the roman Empire. and you claimed my beliefs shared, started only 200 years ago, when there is ancient texts from the first 3 centuries, that prove this was taught back in the first 300-400 years of Christianity. 3- "The Beast"- Having 7 heads and 10 horns- The 7 heads represent the 7 main Kings of that Kingdom, which includes the antichrist- Rev. 17:11- "And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, , AND IS OF THE SEVEN, and goeth into perdition. The 10 Horns represent the 10 Kingdoms as a whole, which make up the "one world Government". So, in Rev. 13, the beast comes out demonstrating by its appearance, as being a nation, whose main leader- (antichrist), a head, is wounded as unto death. So, the "Beast", as a whole, represents a Kingdom, while one of the "heads" of the beast represents the anti-christ, who lords over the 10 Horns- (10 Nations). This cannot be disputed, for in Daniel, the 10 Horns are 10 Kings. And speaks of how a smaller 11th horn comes up amongst them- (anti-christ). When searching for the true understanding of this "Beast", we must pay close attention to all details given of it, for each one has its purpose of representation. The 4 beasts seen in the later vision Daniel had, relates to the same 4 nations mentioned in Nebecanezzar's dream, leading up to the last diverse beast, which would be the boldest and strongest to decieve the world. (One world Government with the anti-christ leading it). 4- Satan's kingdom given to the beast- True but false hehe- True, because its the world the "Beast"- (one world government) takes over, since God declares Satan is the god of this world and prince of the air. But actually false- for even tho Satan is known as the god of this world, it is only by influence, since Satan must petition God how far he can go for mischief. Thus, Satan neither owns or has full authority over the earth or people. Second- When Satan tempted Christ by showing all the kingdoms of the earth and offering Jesus authority over them if bowed to Satan, look how Christ responded, you'll find Jesus told Satan to worship only the Lord thy God- (who really is King and Creator of all things), proving, Satan had no "kingdoms" to speak of. And Cain is the perfect example after killing Able. God put a physical mark on him and made him a "vegabond" on the earth, with no home, place to rest, etc. The same as Lucifer and his followers became, when left God's Domain- Jude 6 on thier own. 5- when healed of the wound, the beast was raised out of the grave- Hmmm, I see no description of that. Only that he was wounded unto death, but not put in a grave. Please expound on that. 6- the number of the beast 666- Hehe, well, you got a problem there dear girl. Why? There were claims of the earlier false teachings of those other "so called" antichrists I named, those people showed false figurings in spiritualized or symbolized fashion, to claim 666 for thier anti-christ's too. So please, lets not go into that folly about Nebecanezzar. 7-"When God showed me all these verses..." Yes, very nice. Albeit a very nice fairy tail, tho without true literal biblical foundation, only spiritualized misinterpretations. As I said before, go ahead and believe what you want. Just don't blame anyone else for your choice of believing false interpretations when God's Truth is actually revealed and find yours all wrong. I can see where you are very committed and working hard to learn and understand. I just pray, one day, God will lift the blinders from your eyes to understand honestly, how He mean't for his Word to be understood. On to Christina's responces answered- 1- Reading scriptures again- Yes Vicki, but you need to read them as stated, not interpreted. While God does speak of the anti-christ in Jer. He most certainly does not declare "who" he is. You read that into it. The word- Babylon" mentioned, is not a literal reference, but a symbolic reference. Mikes adress to this- 2- Does King Nebecanezzar fit the synopsis? No. Why? Because, you forget, after God converted him by cursing him to live as an animal for 7 years. When the first King Nebecanezzar came out of that, he was converted. What most people do not realize is, later, the first King Nebecanezzar died and his son/grandson took over reign of the kingdom, also proven thru ancient documented texts of early AD centuries. Some would argue this, but it was the Kings mother/grandmother who came in after so long and warned the young king what happened to his father before him. But, he did not listen and threw a big party anyways, of which another spiritual event then happened to him. So, lets be clear on which "King Nebecanezzar" we are talking about here. And please don't try to claim it was still the first "old man" King. Would you not change permanently too after 7 years cursed acting like an animal and growing parts of them too? Use common sense people. 3- Judas- Devil in human flesh- Yes he was. Why? Jesus declared to the disciples- "Haven't I chosen you 12, and one of you is "Diabolis"- (Translated means- "the devil in human flesh".) Secondly- In one of the 4 Gospel books, theres also a Scripture that declares, right before Judas left to betray Jesus, the devil came into him. Acts 1:25- No, its not strange, because God chose Judas for the reason of betraying Christ, right from the start. And you'll never find all the time Judas was with Christ after chosen, where he spoke anything of believing what Jesus taught, as was eluded to by other Disciples. Thus, judas was always unsaved, and chosen for betraying Christ. As it wasn't till after Satan had entered his unsaved body and betrayed Christ, that now... Judas understood and why hanged himself. Suicide is well known as an unforgiveable sin also, besides the betrayal. A- When the richman died, he lifted up his eyes from Hell. (imediate transfer of spirit to holding place). B- When Lazarus died, angels carried him into the bosom of abraham. (imediate transfer of spirit to holding place.) C- Absent from the body, present with the Lord- (imediate transfer of spirit to holding place). nough said. God Bless!! so... where did Judas go? Hell, where he belonged. "From which Judas, by trangression fell, that he might go to his own place." (Hell). Where he belonged. Rather than seek repentance, Judas hung himself according to scriptures after betraying christ and taking the money for it.
Looks very good Christian Commando. I like the part about Judas and your breakdown of King Neb. I still feel we will not know who the Antichrist is until it's time.
Now what scripture would that be? I never knew that. I have seen it talked about before, but nobody has shown me scripture. Oh well, be blessed.Jesus Is Lord
I beg to disagree The unforgivable sin is written in Mathew12:31-32 among other places (luke and Mark) and it isn't suicide ...Suicide is Murder i.e. the planing and taking of a life of one of Gods Childreneven if its your own .... Suicide is breaking a commandment a sin yes unforgivable no ...And Judas was taken over and possessed by Satan ... the son of perdition spoken of by Christ here to the apostles was Satan who had taken possession of Judas not Judas himself.... There is only one Son of Perdition only one already judged to utter destruction and that is Satan.. Look up the names for used for Satan here or on google ..... he is the Son of perdition the man of sin ... the adversary the destroyer the serpent the Devil ... These are all but names for Satan ...God uses differnt names to depict differnt aspects of ones person ..(Thus for example Christ is both our Lamb slain and King of Kings ...differnt titles to depict what God trying convey to us ) Judas after being released from his possession by Satan .. tried to repent and give back the silver...did he kill himself yes .... but his sin was of Satan's doing Judas was but the conduet Satan used....Futher more it had to be done to bring about our salvation by Christs death. This was predestined from the beginning as it is written and foretold before hand. In fact this very act became Christ's victory over Satan who is also called death.... Satan in his plan to possess Judas and engineer Christs death... did in fact seal his own fate by his own plan/hand ...because Christs death gave him the victory over Satan .... So only God can judge how responsible Judas was. No one has been prejudged to utter destruction but Satan .. However this has nothing to do with the unforgivable sin ...Post #5 will explain the unforgivable sin http://www.christianityboard.com/showthread.php?t=8386&highlight=unforgivable
What Scriptures speak of suicide? "Thou shalt not kill." If you kill yourself, you are now in spirit. At that point, you cannot seek forgiveness of God for it. All forgiveness, as God teaches us, comes from decisions we make while alive in this physical world. this is why people who believe in a place spirits of dead people can go, who are marginally good, to await God's choice if they are allowed into Heaven or not are wrong. Secondly- Since King Saul of Old Test. died by suicide, you'll not find his name listed amongst the great Old Test. Patriarchs talked about by the Apostles. Even tho God chose, anointed and appointed Saul as King. Suicide is an action intentionally taken and cannot be reversed or forgiven of, because if carried out, the result is physical death, thus, too late then to repent and seek forgiveness of God after that. You can claim different by reason of repenting and seeking forgiveness before doing it. But theres a problem with that. "Repentance" means a turning away from a sin. You can't "repent" of suicide, then do it and expect God to forgive you of it. Repent means to turn away from and stop sin(s) done. You cannot "repent" of a sin your thinking of doing, seeking forgiveness, then turn around and do it and be forgiven. If God forgives you thru repentance and seeking forgiveness of a sin, its for the thought of it and considering doing it. But.. if you hold to it and carry it thru, you have not truely "repented" of it, therefore you cannot be forgiven of it by God. God never shows, nor ever speaks of, how anyone is ever "forgiven" of any sin after physical death. Its always while we are still physically alive on earth. Plus, even tho Satan came into Judas, in order to betray Jesus for crucifixtion, afterwards, its clear Satan left Judas' body, because Judas then hung himself- (suicide.) And God, thru the Apostles, declares Judas went to "his own place"- (Hell). Neither Saul nor Judas could "repent" after thier suicides, thus, look where both went. Yes, Judas had been possessed by Satan to betray Jesus, but clearly left him afterwards, to feel the remorse of his actions enough to kill himself. Please, please, forget "Google". Look up Lucifer's name in the oldest Bible Concordances you can find. "Google" is like most other sites, who take whatever sources they can readily find. They are not true "researchers". BTW- The "man of sin", "son of Perdition", yes are "related" to Satan, but the true definition is the "anti-christ", a physical man displaying the powers and abilities of Satan/Dragon. This definition is from the old ancient words used for those two phrases. I beg to differ about "prejudged"- God declares those whose names are not written in the "Book of Life" are destined for "eternal death"- (eternal seperation and torment from God). thats what God means by "utter destruction", the "Lake of fire", the very last and only, "eternal death" place all unsaved, including unsaved spirits of people and the fallen Angels will go. God declares, Satan comes to steal, kill and destroy man. If Satan can "steal" us from God thru negative thinking and actions, to stay unsaved or walk away from God for good, he can then kill us, if can do this with us away from God, he takes us with him in the end, to "utter destruction" in the Lake of Fire. God declares, once we are saved, He will chastise us as required. but... if we develope a contrite heart, He will let us go so long in that sin, before turning us over to Satan, and a premature grave. Yes again about Judas, but... remember, he did not "repent', he only tried to give money back, but never saught God for forgiveness, did he? Rather, he killed himself. Yes, in judas' case it was for Christ's Glory in being sacrificed for our sins. Thats not the point here. Why? Saul ended up the same way and in Hell, like Judas, and he was not an instrument for such reasons. Right? Cult religions such as Mormons and others, believe the living, can pray to God for the forgiveness of thier dead relatives, so they can enter Heaven. the Parable of Christ about the richman and Lazarus show exactly the opposite. Question for all of you- Ok, at the Great white throne Judgement, God declares all people, small and great, free and bond, saved and unsaved, will come before the Throne to be judged. Some to everlasting life, while others, to eternal damnation. At that Judgement, the "Books" will be opened. 1- Book of Life, 2- "Books of works." God declares the sheep will be divided from the goats on that day. And those whose names are not written in the Book of Life, shall suffer eternal death- (seperation and torment from God). Also, after Death, Hell, the sea and all other grave spots give up thier dead, Death and Hell are cast into the Lake of Fire. Ok now, my question- if the unsaved are not cast into the "Lake of Fire", where else does God declare they go- (what place), if not into the "Lake of Fire"? In Old Test., God declares He originally created Hell only for Satan and his Demons. But, He enlarged the boundaries later, to take on the lost souls of men as well. Rev. 20:14-15-- 14- "And death and Hell were cast into the Lake of Fire. This is the second death- (Lake of fire). 15- And whosoever WAS NOT FOUND written in the book of Life, WAS CAST INTO THE LAKE OF FIRE." Clearly this declares, anyone whose name is not found in the "Book of Life", is cast into the Lake of fire. How can anyone miss that? Again, people are speaking of only specifically "chosen" Scriptures, but not including all related ones. ~~~~~~~~~~~ Back at age 16, i tried to kill myself. God prevented that from happening. Despondant and irritated nothing was working, I returned to find the father of my closest friend waiting to talk to me. As we talked, he picked up how I was feeling. we started talking about God. For 4 years before I was 16, I'd become an athiest, convincing people God did not exist. God, in one night, thru this friend's father, convinced me enough God was real and His Word true, so that I had to know for sure. It impressed me enough, I spent reading, studying and researching God's Word the next 4 years, to find the proof I needed to believe. By Age 20, God had proven without a doubt for me, He was real and Word true. Little did I realize, I'd read, studied and researched It so intensely, I had memorized more than 90 % of my old KJV of the bible. Also, it opened up the start of learning more and more places holding old ancient documents from nearly 2 Milleniums ago and more, for gaining more Christian and Secular docummented proofs concerning Scripture, biblical charactors and Christ's Life and Ministry. God Bless!!
This is the problem with a lot of brother's and sister's today is there is a spiritual message here not a literal. God hides His deepness for thouse who have ears to hear (singular).
Brother Mike;71557 said:
Satan is antichrist .... He the only one that ever wanted to be God/Christ God himself tells you Satan is the man ... This is God speaking to lucifer/Satan after his return 12How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! 13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. 15Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. 16They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms Satan has never made the world and nations tremble he has attacked believers, caused sin tried to destroy Christ but he has never made the nations of the world shake ...but he will as Antichrist he will copy Christs second coming pretend to be christ ... He will appear as a man just as God says ... And your ideas about suicide are incomplete there is a whole 1000 year milliuem where some are taught and will be tested when Sayan is loosed for a short time after the 1000 years then comes judgement so a person comitting suicide has 1000 years to repent ... God flat out tells you the unforgivable sin is Blasphemy of the Holy spirit you have not got a single verse that says its suicide ...because its not written 31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. tell me What do think not be forgiven means ?? if not unforgivable ?
Antichrist in the Bible 5 times, in four scriptures. It is not in the book of Daniel and not in the book of Revelations.Strongs #500 = anti-cristos = alterative, instead ofDoctrine of Anti Christ was in the 1st CenturyJohn did not say there was an antichrist coming, he said you heard. 1John 2:18 Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. 19They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us. (Notice all the plurals, (the church is teaching he)What is driving the 22,000 doctrines of the religious realm, the spirit of the antichrist. If you read this book very clearly Christ will rule the world, He is a reigning King now. 1John:2: 22Who is the liar? It is the man who denies (literally rejects with words) that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist--he denies (literally denies with words) the Father and the Son. 23No one who denies (literally rejects with words) the Son has the (not) Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also. (Before words in orange were add later)24See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father. 25And this is what he promised us--even eternal life. (The ageless life)26I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray. (astray or error means wondering, roaming, mental stain, wrong opinion, wrong action, deceit and fraud) all comes out of that one word. Spirit of Christ or Antichrist? 27As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit--just as it has taught you, remain in him. 28And now, dear children, continue in him, so that when he appears we may be confident and unashamed before him at his coming. 29If you know that he is righteous, you know that everyone who does what is right has been born of him.1John 4:1Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets (literally religious imposters) have gone out into the world (Kosmos, orderly arrangement). 2This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has (is) come in the flesh is from God, 3but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the (the word spirit is not in language) spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world. 4You, dear children, are from God and have overcome them, because the one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world. 5They (not he) are from the world and therefore speak from the viewpoint of the world, and the world listens to them. 6We are from God, and whoever knows God listens to us; but whoever is not from God does not listen to us. This is how we recognize the SpiritA of truth and the spirit of falsehood. 7Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. 8Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. 9This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only SonB into the world that we might (added later) live through him. 10This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning (To reconcile things for offences) sacrifice forC our sins. 11Dear friends, since God so loved us, we also ought (we are obligated) to love one another. 12No one has ever seen God; but if we love one another, God lives in us and his love is made complete in us. 13We know that we live in him and he in us, because he has given us (to us) of his Spirit. 14And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be (not suppose to be there) KJV always has God in the future. the Savior (Deliver not savior (Gk.) Sotar) of the world (Kosmos). 15If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in him and he in God. 16And so we know and rely on the love God has for (in) us. God is love. Whoever lives (dwells continually (Gk)in love lives in God, and God in him. 17In this way, love is made complete among us so that we will have confidence (boldness) on the day (now) of judgment (Krisis) (Gk.), because in this world (Kosmos) we are like him. 18There is no fear in love. But perfect (or fulfilled love) love drives (cast) out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love. 19We love because he first (He was the protos or prototype loved us. 20If anyone says, "I love God," yet hates his brother, he is a liar. For anyone who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen. 21And he has given us this command: Whoever loves God must also love his brother.2 John 7 Many (religious imposters) deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the (imposter) deceiver and the antichrist. 8(look at your selves) Watch out that you do not lose what you have worked for, but that you may be rewarded fully. 9Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. 10If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him. (look at verse 5, doctrine of love)11Anyone who welcomes him shares in his wicked work. Anti Christ: Would God that Christians could be awakened to the glory of Him who is! The same John who in spirit beheld the glory of the many-membered Son of man on Patmos, penned these significant words to the children of God: "Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: but he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also" (I Jn. 2:22-23). Now what does John mean when he speaks of denying the Father and the Son? Let us make no mistake about this! A little further on John enlarges on this statement so that we need not be left in the dark. "Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they be of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: EVERY SPIRIT THAT CONFESSETH THAT JESUS CHRIST IS COME IN THE FLESH IS OF GOD: and every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and now already is in the world" (I Jn. 4:1-3).Now let us get these statements clear in our minds! We have heard many wild speculations about who the antichrist will be, but John declares the antichrist to be one who denies that Jesus is the Christ, which is denying the Father and the Son. But how does he do this? BY NOT CONFESSING JESUS CHRIST HAVING COME IN THE FLESH! But what does this mean? It states that we know the Spirit of God by His confessing Jesus Christ having come in the flesh. Does this mean that Roman Catholicism is the Spirit of God? It confesses that Jesus Christ was a man, born of a virgin. It confesses that He came in the flesh as a babe in Bethlehem. They even parade Him before the world hanging upon a cross, crucified. Millions of others around the world, representing every kind of religion and false cult existing admit the same historical facts. Do all of these represent the Spirit of God?These verses have a deeper meaning! They are not speaking of the fact of Jesus Christ having lived on earth as a man. Almost anyone will admit that! But the profound truth which all of popular religion has missed, is the fact of the Christ actually coming into this flesh, my flesh, your flesh, and becoming an eternal and inseparable part of us! Millions confess Him who was, but very few in this dark age confess Him who is! "And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ IS (NOW) COME in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist...ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them (the antichrists): because GREATER IS HE THAT I-S IN YOU (your flesh), THAN HE THAT I-S IN THE WORLD" (I Jn. 4:3-4). Every spirit that confesses not that Jesus Christ IS come in your flesh and in my flesh, beloved, - is antichrist! Why? Because Greater is He (Jesus Christ) that IS IN YOUR FLESH than he (the spirit of antichrist) that IS IN THE ADAMIC FLESH OF THE WORLD! Our very own natural, human consciousness would deny that the Almighty God of the universe dwells, and lives, and in all things triumphs in us! So don't worry about poor old Mussolini or Henry Kissinger being the antichrist - truly he is enthroned in our own carnal minds!He that is in you will never leave you nor forsake you! This is the Christ from whose love no power nor creature in heaven or earth can separate us! Paul preached not himself, but Christ Jesus the Lord. After stating this himself, he follows on to say, "But this treasure (Christ) we have in earthen vessels" (II Cor. 4:7). Christ is now being formed in our earthen vessels! Just as God was formed in Jesus within the womb of Mary, so is Christ being formed in the womb of our mortal flesh! Only the complete, mature formation of Christ within us will bring us to manifestation as sons of God. Sonship is the actual quickening of the Christ life who has become the new man within. Great is the mystery of God-like-ness! Christ in us is both ageless and deathless, the actual Son of the God of heaven. He is being formed in all His nature, wisdom, glory and power in this human frame, even as He was formed in the firstborn Son, Jesus, to perform His mighty works. By personal application, if my spirit does not confess that Christ is come in my flesh, I am antichrist. The confession of my spirit is a much stronger confession than might be made by my mouth. With the mouth confession is made unto salvation, but with the spirit confession is made unto sonship. The confession of one's spirit bespeaks an expression arising from an inner state of being, not merely a belief of the mind. If my spirit is confessing that Christ is come in my flesh, it is confessing it by a living manifestation! As I live out Christ in the nitty-gritty of every day experience, in every situation and circumstance, doing all the will of my heavenly Father upon this earth, I am confessing with my spirit that Christ is come in my flesh! Ah, I might say with my mouth that Christ is come in my flesh, that I am a son of God, ready to walk on water and glow in the dark, but my spirit speak just the opposite, as the fountain of my life sends forth polluted waters. Multitudes have a mouth confession of the presence of Christ within whose "spirit confesseth not that Christ is come" in their flesh!Oh, that men might believe it! Truly, Christ in us is our only hope of glory! HE IS the glory! But antichrist will hear of no such hope of glory. His hope does not rest wholly in the Christ within, but in his own ability and works, his own faithfulness or endurance. He is cluttered about with laws, regulations, creeds, ordinances, observances, rituals, ceremonies, programs, traditions, and religious exercises of this order and that, all of which are designed to assure his right standing with God. He is thus denying the Father and the Son, for the living Christ alone is not his life! Anything that adds something to the Christ life within, to fill some place or function in our lives that is not filled by THE LIFE OF CHRIST ALONE, - is antichrist! The word "antichrist" is made up of the Greek preposition anti and the word for Christ. Anti bears the meaning of that which is "opposed to" by "supplanting" or being "instead of." During the Middle Ages, a man who was considered a hostile, self-substituted, usurping Pope - one occupying the Pope's place and receiving his honors and exercising his functions - was called an "antipope." This term is commonly used in history in this connection. Such a "Pope" was not merely a person who was against the Pope. Martin Luther was against the Pope, but he was not an antipope because he never went to Rome and usurped the Pope's seat, making himself the Pope! An antipope was a person who was against the Pope by attempting to take the Pope's place. This happened on occasion in previous centuries. In like manner, the antichrist is that spirit, mind, nature, personality, consciousness, activity, enterprise, work, function, method, program or any other thing that comes TO TAKE THE PLACE OF CHRIST in our lives - and by so doing opposes Christ!
Satan is not Lucifer.
Christina;71635]Satan is antichrist .... He the only one that ever wanted to be God/Christ God himself tells you Satan is the man ... This is God speaking to lucifer/Satan after his return [B]12[/B]How art thou fallen from heaven said:
That is just plain not true I have heard this before and its poppycock false doctine and not supported in scriptureLucifer and Satan and the devil and the serpent are all the same personage and if you dont believe that fine .. How many times it is used means nothing its what is said ...God created an Angel Lucifer he was perfect in his ways until he fell and became Satan ..If you dont get that you will never fully understand the scriptures read Isa. 14 now who do you think is going to the pit?? Satan the same Lucifer they are the same alway were always will be one name before his fall another afterBenoni;71637 said:
I just posted this on another thread; problem is men look to tradition an ignore God’s Word and what it is saying. Too many doctrines are based on assumption with no depth.Notice scriptural support I am posting. You accuse me of "false doctrine", we will see who base their beliefs on the creeds and doctrines of Rome and not God's Word.Let us stop looking at the doctrines of Rome and look what God’s Word has to say. Tradition tells us that Satan is Lucifer. Let me ask you one simple question? How can Satan be a arch angel; in his beginning seeing God’s Word declares he was a liar from his beginning? Let us look a little closer with eyes wide open? Is 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven O Lucifer, son of the morning!------13 For thou hast said in thine heart (mind) I will ascend into heaven, ---- 14 I will belike the most High, 15 yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit, -----16----Is this the MAN that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms Did Satan fall; or did God create Satan as a liar?Now the religious system teaches that Ez 28:13 and Is 14:12 are speaking of Satan and the KJ Bible is the only version that uses the word Lucifer. It is not even a Hebrew word.Moffat translation says "What a fall from heaven O Shining star of the dawns" Rotherham"How hast thou fallen from heaven, O shining One, son of the dawn!"Amplified "how are you fallen from heaven O light-bearer and day star, son of the morning!"2 Pet 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts.Rev 22:16 I JESUS have sent mine angel to testify unto you these thing sin the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.The word Lucifer in the Strong's Concordance says it is a title applied to the king of Babylon. The word itself means the morning star. The word MAN means a mortal, an individual, a male person. I could rest my case on just that one verse alone, but why would Peter under the direction of the Holy Spirit compare Jesus as the Day star with Lucifer the Devil? It is the erroneous translation of the KJ that infers such.Lucifer was never an Arc Angel, he was a MAN. (Satan is a spirit.) Is14:15 says he was brought down to hell, (sheol, place of the dead) the side of the pit. Satan is never thrown in the grave because he has no part in a natural death as he is a spiritual being. Only MAN dies and is placed in a grave. Evil spirits only go to a place called Tartarus and Satan the high ranking one is sent to the lake of fire.( which is not hell)Isaiah 54:16 Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his works; and I have created the waster to destroy. [/COLOR](See God created Satan as a waster a distroyer not an arch angel) Jesus in Jn 8:44 Said Ye are of your father, the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the BEGINNING and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar and the father of it. John writes in 1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the BEGINNING. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil..I cannot see that Satan had two beginnings. The word beginning in the Greek means beginning of source. Not first he was an angel, second he was a murder and liar. Which one was he? Do we take the RCC's translation or do we take the correct translation from God's Word not my opinion of the word Lucifer? Satan was full of darkness. God is not working on a plan B. He has had a plan and a purpose from the beginning and Satan was a part of that plan. Simply a tool. Never an angel.
Christina;71638 said:
I forgot what this Thread was suppose to be about. We have many teachers and no students. Benoni is correct in the understanding of the Hebrew. Lucifer is only referred to one time. There is no Hebrew for Lucifer. Hell and the Lake of fire are also different. Hell being located in the Center of the Earth. Also referred to as a pit, and grave. When Reading the Word we are told to compare like things. Hos 12:10 I have also spoken by the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and used similitudes, (Like things) by the ministry of the prophets. Isa 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: The Word Lucifer translated Morning Star is a Latin Word. It does not refer to a name of a person as some think. It means light bringer or bearer. Isa 14:12 How have you fallen from heaven, O light-bringer and daystar, son of the morning! How you have been cut down to the ground, you who weakened and laid low the nations [O blasphemous, satanic king of Babylon!] AmplifiedGod never gave us the Name of Satan as being Lucifer. The Latin Translation gave us that name, and it kind of stuck around. Now who is this scripture talking about? King of Babylon? Possible, but we have to look at the other scriptures.The being described in Isaiah fell from Heaven. No man did that but someone else did.Luk 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. This is someone that went down to the sides of the pit. (Hell)Isa 14:15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. Isa 14:16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms; Well, no man made the Earth tremble or had the ability to shake Kingdoms.Rev 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. Comparing scriptures as we are told, Satan is locked up in the pit as an angel brought a Key and chain so that Satan could not get out. People look how really pathetic Satan is and ask, Is the the man that made all this mess. Kings of Kingdoms. That who ruled over the Kingdoms where devils. Called the prince of the Kingdom. The spiritual side of a kingdom. Dan 10:13 But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia. 1Co 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
2Pe 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; It's the same Hell people are sent to.Eze 28:12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty. Eze 28:13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created. Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub (Angel) that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Eze 28:8 They shall bring thee down to the pit, and thou shalt die the deaths of them that are slain in the midst of the seas. Satan will have the same death as a normal man and treated the same though God gave him favor and great ability at the start. Evil was found in him. HE WAS NOT CREATED EVIL!!! Nothing God created was designed to Fail, His design failed HIM.We are told to compare line upon line. Like things with like things. God never said we get our understanding of the Word by looking up something he already translated for us. And why did Satan get the name of the light bearer. A title reserved for Jesus In Peter?The same reason He accused Satan of wanting to exalt his throne above his own. 2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. line upon line. Not the break down of Greek and Hebrew. It only causes confusion.Jesus Is Lord
The context of Luke 10 shows clearly that Satan's fall from heaven as lightning did not occur during some distance eon of the past; but it was at the very time when He saw by the Spirit the 70 casting out demons in His name. Satan lost his hold, he lost his footing, he lost his power, he lost his kingdom in those people's lives -- and he fell from heaven as quickly as a flash of lightning. That is how quick any spiritual battle is won in the name of Jesus Christ. If they are not won with such speed, then we have to wonder if they are truly being fought in the name of Jesus. Revelation 12, of course, speaks not of the past, but just the opposite. The whole course of the book is set to what would transpire AFTER John received the Revelation. None of these passages refer to a pre-adamic war between God and Satan, as well as many others, that it should no longer be necessary to expound upon the obvious. My point has been Satan cannot have two beginnings; WHEN God created Satan God created a waster a destroyer not an angel.
2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. The word angel simply means messenger; many time there are heavenly messengers as well as in some cases earthy messenger, you must weigh each verse closely. NT:32aggelos (ang'-el-os); from aggello [probably derived from NT:71; compare NT:34] (to bring tidings); a messenger; especially an "angel"; by implication, a pastor:This was not a translation from the Greek, but instead the transliteration took the Greek word “aggelos” and concocted the word angel which simply means messenger. Yes Satan fought the Arch Angel Michael; but if you notice Satan was referred to as Satan, the devil or the dragon never and arch angel or Lucifer.
OK, Satan was created by God to be a destroyer. So if we need any testing or destroying, then Here comes the mad Dog to bite us. This is the purpose He was created because He was liar from the beginning. The problem is Jesus Saw him fall from Heaven in the spirit the moment the 70 were casting out devils, and Gods plans became thwarted because Jesus gave us authority over the devil. That will show God a thing or two Hugh?? So God must have kept Satan around mucking up Heaven and the throne room until Jesus started doing his stuff to the devils on earth, then Bam!!! Satan falls out of Heaven. Now Angels could be humans because even though the bible never refers to Humans as Angels, the Greek clearly means just a messenger. So, Satan is transformed into a "Messenger of light" Not an Angel as we must know the difference. aggelosThayer Definition:1) a messenger, envoy, one who is sent, an angel, a messenger from God
So, God had Michael beat up Satan for being such a clumsy goof ball, for slipping and falling out of Heaven. God figured He messed up when he Made Satan so Evil, so He had him disposed of with a hit contract from Michael the Arch Angel, even though that has yet to happen but we don't care about paradox's at this point.Benoni: Thank you for explaining all that to me. What was I thinking. It all makes sense now. I mean it's so clear! I should have seen it.Jesus Is Lord
Well you guys keep telling yourselves that You quote this word means this and that right ... but you give it no context How does angel meaning messenger prove or disprove anything Hebrew and Greek to a lesser degree are picture languages the word often paints a picture Just giving a simple meaning from a concordance without proper context is nothing better than using a dictionary it means nothing with out understanding of the language Your Applying no context to the story God gives us... The Name Lucifer is not used alot because the Bible is the story of what happens after his fall ......If you don't understand how God uses names to teach ...You are stuck with no wisdom to understand ... Abram to Abraham ...Jacob to Israel ...Lucifer to Satan but go ahead and deny who he is because your playing right into his hands ... And you will be caught unaware without your spiritual armour on Your father fore told you all things applying your own interpretation or that of men and not hearing it with the awe an wonder of a child ...Gets you nothing but an opinion without basis in scripture ..but in your own thought ... You have nothing in scripture that tells you the Satan is a concept NOT of the physical nature ....you have decided what should and should not be literal without basis in scripture .... Its simply psychology of men opinion/conclusion applied to scripture ... not the Word of God .... And I pray no one is listening to this .. There may well be to many teachers here but from what Ive seen many have no right to the claim... It takes many years and Language studys and knowing how all scripture must fit together with out causing a contradiction some where else it takes understanding how God teaches ..It takes knowing when you say a thing it can not be disproved in scripture ...You can disagree in opinion only ...But you had better not be able to be proved wrong in the Word ..Ask yourself can you honestley make this claim ???? But before one claims teacher they better have intamate knowlegde of what they speak ..Because if you are wrong and mislead one its on your head ...You will pay the price ..So you better have a scripture to prove your point ...Not your an opinion or that someone said it ..... You will stand alone before God he wont take that as an excuse ..He will ask did you not read.. MY WORDS The only person I see here in this thread that has some real education and basic understanding of the scripture is Christain Commando and he is close but strays here and there .... As he has forgotten to use scripture first as his guide on occasion ..... Instead he goes off the path by depending on his own mind to draw conclusions.Not written Good luck to you all ...but Im outta here ... 
I know I stepped all over you're pet doctrine but bottom line God is sovereign and Satan is nothing more then a tool in the hands of a mighty and all powerful God. Satan never pulled the wool over God's eyes (if God had eyes). Satan was always a liar and a murderer, never an arch angel.Satan has no power unless God ordains it; God is in control of all things. You said “Gods plans became thwarted because Jesus gave us authority over the devil” what are you talking about? God’s plan are never compromised and if you think for a moment they were you’re God is a god. There are heavenly messenger’s and earthly messengers. Again, it is God who controls good and evil not Satan who is a dog on a leash. Do you really thing God would ordain someone like Satan to control anything? God figured He messed up when he Made Satan so Evil, so He had him disposed of with a hit contract from Michael the Arch Angel, even though that has yet to happen but we don't care about paradox's at this point.By the way it was God who caused the fall and Adam had no choice. [quote name='Brother Mike;71708]OK' date=' Satan was created by God to be a destroyer. So if we need any testing or destroying, then Here comes the mad Dog to bite us. This is the purpose He was created because He was liar from the beginning. The problem is Jesus Saw him fall from Heaven in the spirit the moment the 70 were casting out devils, and Gods plans became thwarted because Jesus gave us authority over the devil. That will show God a thing or two Hugh?? So God must have kept Satan around mucking up Heaven and the throne room until Jesus started doing his stuff to the devils on earth, then Bam!!! Satan falls out of Heaven. Now Angels could be humans because even though the bible never refers to Humans as Angels, the Greek clearly means just a messenger. So, Satan is transformed into a "Messenger of light" Not an Angel as we must know the difference. aggelosThayer Definition:1) a messenger, envoy, one who is sent, an angel, a messenger from GodSo, God had Michael beat up Satan for being such a clumsy goof ball, for slipping and falling out of Heaven. God figured He messed up when he Made Satan so Evil, so He had him disposed of with a hit contract from Michael the Arch Angel, even though that has yet to happen but we don't care about paradox's at this point.Benoni: Thank you for explaining all that to me. What was I thinking. It all makes sense now. I mean it's so clear! I should have seen it.Jesus Is Lord[/QUOTE']
For someone who claims to be such a Bible scholar how about using God’s Word instead of you is opinion. If Satan is Lucifer or a Arch angel prove it with God’s Word. There are far too many religious opinions out there.
Christina;71711 said:Well you guys keep telling yourselves that You quote this word means this and that right ... but you give it no context How does angel meaning messenger prove or disprove anything Hebrew and Greek to a lesser degree are picture languages the word often paints a picture Just giving a simple meaning from a concordance without proper context is nothing better than using a dictionary it means nothing with out understanding of the language Your Applying no context to the story God gives us... The Name Lucifer is not used alot because the Bible is the story of what happens after his fall ......If you don't understand how God uses names to teach ...You are stuck with no wisdom to understand ... Abram to Abraham ...Jacob to Israel ...Lucifer to Satan but go ahead and deny who he is because your playing right into his hands ... And you will be caught unaware without your spiritual armour on Your father fore told you all things applying your own interpretation or that of men and not hearing it with the awe an wonder of a child ...Gets you nothing but an opinion without basis in scripture ..but in your own thought ... You have nothing in scripture that tells you the Satan is a concept NOT of the physical nature ....you have decided what should and should not be literal without basis in scripture .... Its simply psychology of men opinion/conclusion applied to scripture ... not the Word of God .... And I pray no one is listening to this .. There may well be to many teachers here but from what Ive seen many have no right to the claim... It takes many years and Language studys and knowing how all scripture must fit together with out causing a contradiction some where else it takes understanding how God teaches ..It takes knowing when you say a thing it can not be disproved in scripture ...You can disagree in opinion only ...But you had better not be able to be proved wrong in the Word ..Ask yourself can you honestley make this claim ???? But before one claims teacher they better have intamate knowlegde of what they speak ..Because if you are wrong and mislead one its on your head ...You will pay the price ..So you better have a scripture to prove your point ...Not your an opinion or that someone said it ..... You will stand alone before God he wont take that as an excuse ..He will ask did you not read.. MY WORDS The only person I see here in this thread that has some real education and basic understanding of the scripture is Christain Commando and he is close but strays here and there .... As he has forgotten to use scripture first as his guide on occasion ..... Instead he goes off the path by depending on his own mind to draw conclusions.Not written Good luck to you all ...but Im outta here ...
Notice it was God who asked Satan about Job; God had a hedge around job.Job 1:8And the LORD said to Satan, "Have you(N) considered my(O) servant Job , that there is none like him on the earth,(P) a blameless and upright man, who fears God and turns away from evil?" 9Then Satan answered the LORD and said, "Does Job fear God for no reason? 10Have you not put(Q) a hedge around him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have(R) blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. 11But(S) stretch out your hand and(T) touch all that he has, and he will(U) curse you(V) to your face." 12And the LORD said to Satan, "Behold, all that he has is in your hand. Only against him do not stretch out your hand." So Satan went out from the presence of the LORD.God is in control of all things; sure He limited what Satan could do; for a reason because God is always in complete control of all things to include Satan. But it was God who was the one who introduced Satan to Job “Have you(N) considered my(O) servant Job”. It was God who took down the hedge from around Job so Satan to do his work on job. It was the process of tribulation and trial God was after; to prove Job.Just like the Children of Israel: The Children of Israel could of taken 9 days to cross the wilderness. BUT No God led them for forty years. Now we are walking in this wilderness of life for the same reason: Deut 8:1-2 All the commandments which I command thee this day shall ye observe to do, that ye may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the LORD sware unto your fathers. 2 And thou shalt remember all the way which the LORD thy God led thee these forty years in the wilderness, to humble thee, and to prove thee, to know what was in thine heart, whether thou wouldest keep his commandments. (KJV)In His great victory over the power of Satan He was a sign that pointed unerringly to another company of overcoming sons. In all the churches of Revelation there were two classes of people — those who were overcomers and those who were not. It is to the overcomers that the glorious promises are given, for they follow the Lamb whithersoever He goeth, have partaken of His mind and of His will, and thus are equipped to reign in His kingdom. Thus to them it is said: "To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life which is in the midst of the paradise of God." Rev. 2:7. "He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death." Rev. 2:11. "To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and I will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it." Rev. 2:17. "He that overcometh and keepeth My works to the end, to him will I give/wnw over the nations, and he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessel of the potter shall they be broken to shivers even as I received of My Father, and I will give him the morning star." Rev. 2:26-28. "He that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God and he shall go no more out and I will write upon him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God which cometh down out of heaven from my God and I will write upon him my new name." Rev. 3:12, 13. "To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with Me in My throne even as I overcame and am set down with My Father in His throne." Rev. 3:21. "He that hath an ear let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches."Not he who will excape the fire; but he that will go thought the fire.So yes Satan is there for a purpose of trial and tribulation.
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