HILLSONG

[Willie T]

Why the attitude? Don't you believe in kindness?

Trying to play yourself off as — whatever it is you are trying to do — doesn't deserve any kindness.

 

[kcnalp]

Trying to play yourself off as — whatever it is you are trying to do — doesn't deserve any kindness.

I'm just a Bible believer. What are you?

 

[Willie T]

Maybe you are just senile, and I don't know how to deal with that.

 

[kcnalp]

What you don't seem to know is how to treat others decently.

 

[friend of]

I enjoy the worship music of Hillsong personally

 

[kcnalp]

I enjoy the worship music of Hillsong personally

I have enjoyed it for many years.

 

[friend of]

I think people are making too big a deal about it.

 

[Josho]

I think people are making too big a deal about it.

Yep they are, we were singing some of their songs at Church, don't see anything wrong with Hillsong's music. And "What a Beautiful name it is" is a wonderful song.

 

[DNB]

I am conversant with the phenomenon of Hillsong and the various criticism leveled at it so I thought it might be an idea to start a thread about Hillsong and ask people to post actual evidence (not their ideas or prejudices) to get a perspective on the movement.

I do not want hearsay or theories, but actual evidence such as things you have experienced, seen, or been told by someone who attends Hillsong or has attended Hillsong.

I will start the ball rolling...

Judging by the studies I have done about cults, I believe that Hillsong is a cult.
A cult revolves around one person.
You are not allowed to make any criticism of the cult leader or the senior leaders.
The leaders always do what the cult leader says.
The cult leader is beyond reproach.
You cannot speak to the cult leader. You have to talk to underlings even if they are young enough to be your grandson.
It is not your ministry that promotes you. It is your allegiance to the cult leader.
The women in leadership are beyond reproach and cannot be questioned even if they preach things contrary to the Word of God, (which they often do).
What the cult leader preaches is always right.
There is no freedom to believe the truth.

Apart from my studies, I have been a member of two cults which I did not realize they were until I had joined them. After I had joined them and started seeing a trend I left. One voluntary and the other by secular law when the church had me banned because I questioned what a female leader said because it was complete balderdash.

This church employed an enforcer to remove people that did not submit to their authority. They threatened physical abuse and or calling the police to have me removed from the meeting.

Yes marksman, according to your criteria, I would agree with you. Sorry, my knowledge is not very extensive on hillsong, but because of the hype, i looked them up one day, watched some interviews with the New York guy, and a little of his preaching.
BTW, everyone seems to be commenting on the music, which to me, is neither here or there, ...lyrics are very ambiguous, to the point, these are so generic that they easily appear orthodox, and may as well be so.

But, according to your criteria, yes, the guy's statement-of-faith was so ambiguous, to the point that one can see that it was intended to gather the masses, and not preach self-discipline, sacrifice, and contempt for the world.
I don't like his hipster look, it's too contrived that it reflects a misguided concern for appearances (and the wrong ones at that).
His tats are offensive (maybe he was younger and non-Christian at the time, but I doubt it).
Doing shots with Justin Beiber (or anyone) is a clear indication of his utter stupidity, and contempt for the holiness and sobriety taught in Christian dogma.
I'm sure there are moments during his sermons that he teaches Christian orthodoxy, but too few to mention, and inevitably perverts it with a message of secularism.

Overall cult factor: 75% + (again, i have a very cursory knowledge of the guy and his group)

 

[farouk]

...it would depend on whether you like modern worship songs ...I do xxxx
Rita

@Rita, PS: You would probably grow to like Christian lyrics in hard rock also if you were more accustomed to them. (My guess...)

 

[Rita]

I am conversant with the phenomenon of Hillsong and the various criticism leveled at it so I thought it might be an idea to start a thread about Hillsong and ask people to post actual evidence (not their ideas or prejudices) to get a perspective on the movement.

I do not want hearsay or theories, but actual evidence such as things you have experienced, seen, or been told by someone who attends Hillsong or has attended Hillsong.

I will start the ball rolling...

Judging by the studies I have done about cults, I believe that Hillsong is a cult.
A cult revolves around one person.
You are not allowed to make any criticism of the cult leader or the senior leaders.
The leaders always do what the cult leader says.
The cult leader is beyond reproach.
You cannot speak to the cult leader. You have to talk to underlings even if they are young enough to be your grandson.
It is not your ministry that promotes you. It is your allegiance to the cult leader.
The women in leadership are beyond reproach and cannot be questioned even if they preach things contrary to the Word of God, (which they often do).
What the cult leader preaches is always right.
There is no freedom to believe the truth.

Apart from my studies, I have been a member of two cults which I did not realize they were until I had joined them. After I had joined them and started seeing a trend I left. One voluntary and the other by secular law when the church had me banned because I questioned what a female leader said because it was complete balderdash.

This church employed an enforcer to remove people that did not submit to their authority. They threatened physical abuse and or calling the police to have me removed from the meeting.

Hi Marksman,
Can I ask you something....are you referring to just one church ‘ Hillsong ‘ In Australia that is pastored by Brian Houston, or all of the Hillsong churches.....I was under the impression that a cult was an isolated group, very much kept themselves as a unit run by one person......yet from the original Hillsong church, the church planted other churches , we have some in the UK. These churches are led by different pastors - so it’s not universally run by Brian Houston himself.........they tend to follow the charismatic and Pentecostal churches , which I would also class as movements, not cults -
Rita

 

[OzSpen]

I am conversant with the phenomenon of Hillsong and the various criticism leveled at it so I thought it might be an idea to start a thread about Hillsong and ask people to post actual evidence (not their ideas or prejudices) to get a perspective on the movement.

I do not want hearsay or theories, but actual evidence such as things you have experienced, seen, or been told by someone who attends Hillsong or has attended Hillsong.

I will start the ball rolling...

Judging by the studies I have done about cults, I believe that Hillsong is a cult.
A cult revolves around one person.
You are not allowed to make any criticism of the cult leader or the senior leaders.
The leaders always do what the cult leader says.
The cult leader is beyond reproach.
You cannot speak to the cult leader. You have to talk to underlings even if they are young enough to be your grandson.
It is not your ministry that promotes you. It is your allegiance to the cult leader.
The women in leadership are beyond reproach and cannot be questioned even if they preach things contrary to the Word of God, (which they often do).
What the cult leader preaches is always right.
There is no freedom to believe the truth.

Apart from my studies, I have been a member of two cults which I did not realize they were until I had joined them. After I had joined them and started seeing a trend I left. One voluntary and the other by secular law when the church had me banned because I questioned what a female leader said because it was complete balderdash.

This church employed an enforcer to remove people that did not submit to their authority. They threatened physical abuse and or calling the police to have me removed from the meeting.

marksman,

However, the Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison regards the leader of Hillsong, Brian Houston, as his mentor. ScoMo tried to get Houston to a dinner in the White House involving Trump, ScoMo and others, but failed. See: Scott Morrison confirms he sought White House invite for Hillsong pastor Brian Houston

What do you regard as the cultic theology of Hillsong?

Here's my comparison of Hillsong music with great songs of the faith: Contemporary music in church to the lyrics of spiritual death

Oz

 

[Episkopos]

When I hear the name 'Hillsong' it makes me think of the worship song request...Can you sing...."On a hill far far away"?...please!

 

[marksman]

marksman,

However, the Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison regards the leader of Hillsong, Brian Houston, as his mentor. ScoMo tried to get Houston to a dinner in the White House involving Trump, ScoMo and others, but failed. See: Scott Morrison confirms he sought White House invite for Hillsong pastor Brian Houston

What do you regard as the cultic theology of Hillsong?

Here's my comparison of Hillsong music with great songs of the faith: Contemporary music in church to the lyrics of spiritual death

Oz

I know all that and I have posted my understanding of cults in the first post.

 

[marksman]

Hi Marksman,
Can I ask you something....are you referring to just one church ‘ Hillsong ‘ In Australia that is pastored by Brian Houston, or all of the Hillsong churches.....I was under the impression that a cult was an isolated group, very much kept themselves as a unit run by one person......yet from the original Hillsong church, the church planted other churches , we have some in the UK. These churches are led by different pastors - so it’s not universally run by Brian Houston himself.........they tend to follow the charismatic and Pentecostal churches , which I would also class as movements, not cults -
Rita

Wherever the churches are they are under the control of Brian Houston. The leadership of every church answers to him.

 

[marksman]

Yes marksman, according to your criteria, I would agree with you. Sorry, my knowledge is not very extensive on hillsong, but because of the hype, i looked them up one day, watched some interviews with the New York guy, and a little of his preaching.
BTW, everyone seems to be commenting on the music, which to me, is neither here or there, ...lyrics are very ambiguous, to the point, these are so generic that they easily appear orthodox, and may as well be so.

But, according to your criteria, yes, the guy's statement-of-faith was so ambiguous, to the point that one can see that it was intended to gather the masses, and not preach self-discipline, sacrifice, and contempt for the world.
I don't like his hipster look, it's too contrived that it reflects a misguided concern for appearances (and the wrong ones at that).
His tats are offensive (maybe he was younger and non-Christian at the time, but I doubt it).
Doing shots with Justin Beiber (or anyone) is a clear indication of his utter stupidity, and contempt for the holiness and sobriety taught in Christian dogma.
I'm sure there are moments during his sermons that he teaches Christian orthodoxy, but too few to mention, and inevitably perverts it with a message of secularism.

Overall cult factor: 75% + (again, i have a very cursory knowledge of the guy and his group)

Thank you for your thoughts on the matter. I have to admit that Justin Beiber puts me off totally with his tattoo covered body.

 

[marksman]

Hearsay evidence?

Like, someone told me that they went to a Hillsong church and said it was . . .

Is that actual evidence?

What are we doing exactly?

What I am doing it to find out more about Hillsong from those who know as in people that have been members of the church or are members of the church amongst others. I am doing that because you hear all sorts of stories and at the end of the day it is just an opinion.

 

[FollowHim]

I am conversant with the phenomenon of Hillsong and the various criticism leveled at it so I thought it might be an idea to start a thread about Hillsong and ask people to post actual evidence (not their ideas or prejudices) to get a perspective on the movement.

I do not want hearsay or theories, but actual evidence such as things you have experienced, seen, or been told by someone who attends Hillsong or has attended Hillsong.

I will start the ball rolling...

Judging by the studies I have done about cults, I believe that Hillsong is a cult.
A cult revolves around one person.
You are not allowed to make any criticism of the cult leader or the senior leaders.
The leaders always do what the cult leader says.
The cult leader is beyond reproach.
You cannot speak to the cult leader. You have to talk to underlings even if they are young enough to be your grandson.
It is not your ministry that promotes you. It is your allegiance to the cult leader.
The women in leadership are beyond reproach and cannot be questioned even if they preach things contrary to the Word of God, (which they often do).
What the cult leader preaches is always right.
There is no freedom to believe the truth.

Apart from my studies, I have been a member of two cults which I did not realize they were until I had joined them. After I had joined them and started seeing a trend I left. One voluntary and the other by secular law when the church had me banned because I questioned what a female leader said because it was complete balderdash.

This church employed an enforcer to remove people that did not submit to their authority. They threatened physical abuse and or calling the police to have me removed from the meeting.

You are right to question the authority of the leadership.
They are a publicity machine with great finance through the prosperity gospel behind them. To build such a movement in such a short time takes dedication. The problem is it is just the music. Going to a cinema for massive meetings is like going to a pop concert. Sometimes this is the image people want to create of fellowship and meaning.

Maybe one should call this the cult of electronic music linked to worship. It is great for an emotional high, but when hard times come and you need roots and real reality, it is just hay and stubble. I wonder how long it can go on with this branding, and lack of depth in local communities. A lot are now turning away from this pop culture, to other things. My children have been members of similar groups, and are now disenchanted with them because of a lack of friendship and connection. But on a lot of levels, the worship and praise of Jesus is great. I love some of the songs, as part of my worship life, but then I equally like old hymns which are sung in many different environments. God bless you

 

[Nancy]

I am conversant with the phenomenon of Hillsong and the various criticism leveled at it so I thought it might be an idea to start a thread about Hillsong and ask people to post actual evidence (not their ideas or prejudices) to get a perspective on the movement.

I do not want hearsay or theories, but actual evidence such as things you have experienced, seen, or been told by someone who attends Hillsong or has attended Hillsong.

I will start the ball rolling...

Judging by the studies I have done about cults, I believe that Hillsong is a cult.
A cult revolves around one person.
You are not allowed to make any criticism of the cult leader or the senior leaders.
The leaders always do what the cult leader says.
The cult leader is beyond reproach.
You cannot speak to the cult leader. You have to talk to underlings even if they are young enough to be your grandson.
It is not your ministry that promotes you. It is your allegiance to the cult leader.
The women in leadership are beyond reproach and cannot be questioned even if they preach things contrary to the Word of God, (which they often do).
What the cult leader preaches is always right.
There is no freedom to believe the truth.

Apart from my studies, I have been a member of two cults which I did not realize they were until I had joined them. After I had joined them and started seeing a trend I left. One voluntary and the other by secular law when the church had me banned because I questioned what a female leader said because it was complete balderdash.

This church employed an enforcer to remove people that did not submit to their authority. They threatened physical abuse and or calling the police to have me removed from the meeting.

Hello Marksman! Are you speaking of the Church from Austrailia that originally produced the Hillsong Worship team? I had watched Brooke Fraser (from NZ) on an interview a while back. There was not a thing I heard out of her mouth that sounded suspect to myself as, like @Rita , I too listen to their mucic...

 

[Nancy]

What horrible heresy in these songs !!!

IKR??? Hahahaha!