How is it that you cannot see?

[Wrangler]

You can disagree, but that's what it is.

I agree in a sense but not in another sense.

People stomp and say it's "God's Word" without even a nod to John 1 where we get a glimpse of what that means. It has nothing to do with a book that people bound together. From there the errors in thinking gets compounded to the degree that people assign also God's attributes to "God's book"

It has nothing to do with pretending a person's word is another person. Mr E's words are not Charlie Brown. So, in that sense God's word is exactly the contents of a book that people bound together.

Do you deny the 10 Commandments are God's words?

 

[Wrangler]

It's more of the same kind of confusion....

The 10 Commandments, written by the finger of God, is the most extreme example in human history of clarity.

Isaiah 45, Thus says the LORD

Only those who want to be confused, see confusion - as God's word says.

Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.
Isaiaih 5:20

 

[Matthias]

“All scripture is inspired by God …”

(2 Timothy 3:16)

No?

 

[Mr E]

I agree in a sense but not in another sense.

It has nothing to do with pretending a person's word is another person. Mr E's words are not Charlie Brown. So, in that sense God's word is exactly the contents of a book that people bound together.

Do you deny the 10 Commandments are God's words?

Your word is spoken. It can be recorded by someone else, but then it's just a record of what you said. If you write your word down, it can be your written word, but if someone else writes what you (previously wrote (or said)) it's again merely a record of your word, or a quote. It's not complicated.

Moses was in spirit-- when God "wrote" the 10 comandments..... in spirit. God is spirit. He doesn't actually write on stone with his finger.

 

[Mr E]

“All scripture is inspired by God …”

(2 Timothy 3:16)

No?

See above. Inspired = in spirit. It's what's inside that counts.

 

[Matthias]

I agree YHWH alone is the Creator ….

I’d like to quickly revisit this with you. My daily reading this morning includes Hezekiah’s prayer.

An excerpt from his prayer:

“O Yahweh, Almighty God of Israel, you are enthroned between the mighty cherubim! You alone are God of all the kingdoms of the earth. You alone created the heavens and the earth.”

(Isaiah 37:16)

”O Yahweh, God of Israel, you are enthroned between the mighty cherubim! You alone are God of all the kingdoms of the earth. You alone created the heavens and the earth.”

(2 Kings 19:15)

I presume that you think that Hezekiah could have agency in mind when he says that Yahweh alone created the heavens and the earth.

Do you think that Hezekiah could have agency in mind when he says that Yahweh alone is God of all the kingdoms of the earth?

 

[Wrangler]

I presume that you think that Hezekiah could have agency in mind when he says that Yahweh alone created the heavens and the earth.

Do you think that Hezekiah could have agency in mind when he says that Yahweh alone is God of all the kingdoms of the earth?

Yes. Creator of "heaven and earth" is a euphemism meaning 'all that exists.' We might use the word 'universe' today - or even 'all multiverses.' Many people fail to realize how figurative the cultures communicated that the people came from who authored the books of the Bible. Another great example I read yesterday from 1 Kings was having as many children as "grains of sand on the beach."

To say something is 'too many to count' is another euphemism for there is a difference between uncountable and too many to conveniently count with precision. So, what humans tend to do is change the scale. Rather than speak in terms of 'grains of sand' today we talk in terms of miles of beach.

YHWH is the Creator of all things yet I composed this post. How do you explain this paradox? Agency.

There are heads of state (kings in those days) who rule over their territory (kingdom). They are gods of their kingdom. So, how is it they these gods have a god? It is as common as night following day. The question is, do you suppose anyone who commands is commanding on their own authority OR do they command at the discretion of the Creator? Once understood from this perspective, it is silly to suppose it could be any other way than Hezekiah said, Yahweh alone is God of all the kingdoms of the earth. Yet, everywhere, YHWH commands through his agents. Is this not so?

 

[Matthias]

Yes. Creator of "heaven and earth" is a euphemism meaning 'all that exists.' We might use the word 'universe' today - or even 'all multiverses.' Many people fail to realize how figurative the cultures communicated that the people came from who authored the books of the Bible. Another great example I read yesterday from 1 Kings was having as many children as "grains of sand on the beach."

To say something is 'too many to count' is another euphemism for there is a difference between uncountable and too many to conveniently count with precision. So, what humans tend to do is change the scale. Rather than speak in terms of 'grains of sand' today we talk in terms of miles of beach.

YHWH is the Creator of all things yet I composed this post. How do you explain this paradox? Agency.

Yahweh isn’t the author of your post. You are; alone, by yourself. He didn’t use you to write your post. I’m responding to you alone, not to Yahweh.

There are heads of state (kings in those days) who rule over their territory (kingdom). They are gods of their kingdom. So, how is it they these gods have a god? It is as common as night following day. The question is, do you suppose anyone who commands is commanding on their own authority OR do they command at the discretion of the Creator? Once understood from this perspective, it is silly to suppose it could be any other way than Hezekiah said, Yahweh alone is God of all the kingdoms of the earth. Yet, everywhere, YHWH commands through his agents. Is this not so?

They command at the discretion of Yahweh.

Yahweh and his agents are the God of all the kingdoms of the earth?

 

[Matthias]

When we speak to someone who is acting as the agent / shaliach of Yahweh it is as if we are speaking to Yahweh himself.

The shaliach doesn’t act on his own. The shaliach’s words are not his own. The shaliach’s will is not his own.

 

[Wrangler]

Yahweh isn’t the author of your post. You are; alone, by yourself. He didn’t use you to write your post.

Who is the creator of the post you responded to?

 

[VictoryinJesus]

”God said let there be …” and what previously had existed only in his mind was literally brought into being.

Love this…”And God said let there be…”
With; Philippians 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

With also; and what previously had existed only in his mind was literally brought into being.

More importantly not regarding the literal things but as flesh brings forth flesh, Spirit brings forth Spirit. “And God said let there be…” “Light.”

… “what was previously had existed only in his mind was literally brought into being?” Who has known the mind of God? That he should instruct Him?
Romans 7:21-25 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me. [22] For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: [23] But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. [24] O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? [25] I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

What you say about which existed only previously in the mind of God, was literally brought into being. Consider that with “so then with the mind I myself serve the law of God” with;
2 Corinthians 4:11-15 For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also(what had only previously existed in the Mind of God)of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh. [12] So then death worketh in us, but life in you. [13] We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak; [14] Knowing that he which raised up the Lord Jesus shall raise up us also by Jesus, and shall present us with you. [15] For all things are for your sakes, that the abundant grace might through the thanksgiving of many redound to the glory of God.

2 Corinthians 4:16 For which cause (God, Life in you) we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.

Thinking about it is what is in the mind …whether the mind is flesh …or the mind of Spirit that is made manifest. Makes me think of the verses of it is not that which a man eats but what comes out from the heart and that which is spoken that makes unclean.

 

[Matthias]

Who is the creator of the post you responded to?

You are. The point is that when you wrote your post you were not acting as the shaliach of Yahweh.

 

[Matthias]

Who is the creator of the post you responded to?

I wasn’t acting as the shaliach of Yahweh when I responded to your post. The words I wrote to you were mine, not his. He didn’t give me the words to speak to you. When you responded to me you responded to me alone, not to Yahweh.

 

[Wrangler]

You are. The point is that when you wrote your post you were not acting as the shaliach of Yahweh.

NOTE: I am the creator (of the post you replied to).

Like a king of his kingdom, I can only create when the Creator, YHWH, allows it, yes?

 

[Matthias]

NOTE: I am the creator (of the post you replied to).

Like a king of his kingdom, I can only create when the Creator, YHWH, allows it, yes?

Yes. He allowed it but you did it on your own, not as his agent.