I believe in Hebrew roots.... And feel VERY alone in that belief.

[Groundzero]

This pagan paranoia is a form of bondage as far as I am concerned. Certain Protestant sects have outlawed the celebration of Christmas distrusting the human values and human joy which Christmas both represents and fulfills. It's really sad.
I feel sorry for the children of these wacko cults who get nothing on Christmas morning.

So let's think this through, THIS JOYOUS SEASON!

Crime rates typically JUMP during the MERRY season. No, they don't jump down, they jump UP!

Now how about retail? Well I read that the AVERAGE american spends $750! And in Australia wide, it's apparently something like 30 billion dollars! Is this the season of giving, or greed? I work in the fast food industry, and I can tell you right now, there's nothing merry about Christmas. When I go to the shops, do i see happy people? NO! I see stressed out people, working their butts off, or I see people spending their money on useless stuff, merely because 'tis the season.

And how about that fat jolly fellow called Santa? Rearrange the words and you'll get SATAN. Is that a coincidence? But hang on, there's more. What attributes does Santa have? He knows whether you've been good or bad (omniscient), he's all over the world in the same night (omnipresent), and he can do pretty much anything (omnipotent). Now I would venture to say, that this 'jolly' old chap is NOT so jolly after all.

What's so fantastic about lying to your child about Santa? What's so fantastic about teaching your children, that they get gifts only if they're good, but they eventually work out, that even if they're bad, they'll get gifts cause tis the season? What's so good about the Christmas tree? and holly? and tinsel? and mistletoe? I suppose you have great explanations for all these and why we should celebrate them?

http://rcg.org/books/ttooc.html

And how about Krampus? Now he really makes this season jolly!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krampus
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=Krampus&hl=en&safe=off&tbo=u&tbm=isch&source=univ&sa=X&ei=13HEUIOQC7GTiAf484DQAg&ved=0CDsQsAQ&biw=1366&bih=653


Anyway, happy holidays, to those of you whose spirits aren't vexed by the riotous living, the drunkenness, the debauchery, the crime, the death, and the sorrow that this 'merry' season brings.

 

[Raeneske]

I disagree with this 'mentality' totally. It is based on the false assumption that Christians who recognize the Christmas holidays as being pagans practicing paganism. That kind of reasoning is nothing but superstition. I fail to see how someone with that kind of mindset can even make it through a whole day, since so many things we use in our daily lives have non-Christian origins. You might as well start your own monastery somewhere and separate yourself from the world.

There's a difference between living in this world vs. being OF this world. In Christ Jesus we have 'liberty', and that even applies to eating food sacrificed to idols IF we are hungry, and IF it does not influence a weaker brother, because we know an idol is nothing (1 Cor.8 through 1 Cor.10).

You're supposed to be seperate from the World. Not in the sense of starting a Monastary, but from being unstained by their traditions.

Superstitious. Everyone with a competant knowledge of Christmas knows of its origins. The difference is, some choose to obey the Lord, in not adding Pagan infleunces to their worship, and others really couldn't care less. If you continue to celebrate it, that's your choice. Sorry, but following the Lord calls for a seperation.

Amen Raeneske
This is very true and one of the things that is wrong with modern day Christianity I was told by one pastor that it is what you make out of it. With who I replied "what can you make out of poop but manure"? All of the works of pegan flesh is manure in the sight of God. This is why: in the covenant of the spirit we do not walk in the flesh but in the Spirit of God.

Romans 8
1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.

Galatians 5
16 I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.


And don't worry my friend The Lord will soon destroy all of the pagan rituals and practices along with those who find pleasure in them.


We will pray for them, before it's to late, because they still know not what they do.

We should be prayerful indeed.

So let's think this through, THIS JOYOUS SEASON!

Crime rates typically JUMP during the MERRY season. No, they don't jump down, they jump UP!

Now how about retail? Well I read that the AVERAGE american spends $750! And in Australia wide, it's apparently something like 30 billion dollars! Is this the season of giving, or greed? I work in the fast food industry, and I can tell you right now, there's nothing merry about Christmas. When I go to the shops, do i see happy people? NO! I see stressed out people, working their butts off, or I see people spending their money on useless stuff, merely because 'tis the season.

And how about that fat jolly fellow called Santa? Rearrange the words and you'll get SATAN. Is that a coincidence? But hang on, there's more. What attributes does Santa have? He knows whether you've been good or bad (omniscient), he's all over the world in the same night (omnipresent), and he can do pretty much anything (omnipotent). Now I would venture to say, that this 'jolly' old chap is NOT so jolly after all.

What's so fantastic about lying to your child about Santa? What's so fantastic about teaching your children, that they get gifts only if they're good, but they eventually work out, that even if they're bad, they'll get gifts cause tis the season? What's so good about the Christmas tree? and holly? and tinsel? and mistletoe? I suppose you have great explanations for all these and why we should celebrate them?

http://rcg.org/books/ttooc.html

And how about Krampus? Now he really makes this season jolly!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krampus http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krampus
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=Krampus&hl=en&safe=off&tbo=u&tbm=isch&source=univ&sa=X&ei=13HEUIOQC7GTiAf484DQAg&ved=0CDsQsAQ&biw=1366&bih=653


Anyway, happy holidays, to those of you whose spirits aren't vexed by the riotous living, the drunkenness, the debauchery, the crime, the death, and the sorrow that this 'merry' season brings.

Well, I must say, Amen.

 

[veteran]

You're supposed to be seperate from the World. Not in the sense of starting a Monastary, but from being unstained by their traditions.

What you're actually pulling from is the superstitious ideas of old. We're not talking about pagan idol worship used in ceremonial pagan ritual worship, that's not what Christmas or Easter is about for Christians. I know a lot of people who don't normally go to Church that attend Church during the Christmas holidays, will you say that is following pagan tradition too?

Superstitious. Everyone with a competant knowledge of Christmas knows of its origins. The difference is, some choose to obey the Lord, in not adding Pagan infleunces to their worship, and others really couldn't care less. If you continue to celebrate it, that's your choice. Sorry, but following the Lord calls for a seperation.

I'm not talking about bringing pagan ritual into the Church. I'm talking about Christians who enjoy the Christmas holidays to be together with family and friends, and with many people using that time to further... The Gospel of Jesus Christ, because that's exactly what Christ's Church has done historically during this season, and is still doing.

Likewise with Easter, it was originally the name of a pagan observance of rites of spring involving ceremonial rituals, etc. But it no longer represents that now. Many Christian brethren now recognize it as passover timing per Jewish tradition, but who is it that still believes in removing all leaven yeast out of one's house and eating bitter herbs in a ritualistic keeping of passover? Not Christians, but mainly orthodox Jews. And does orthodox Judaism have holidays that The LORD did not give? Yes! So why are they following days The LORD did not give?

The more you point against Christians and what we observe and fail to see the same among the Jews, the more of a hypocrite you make yourself.

 

[Raeneske]

What you're actually pulling from is the superstitious ideas of old. We're not talking about pagan idol worship used in ceremonial pagan ritual worship, that's not what Christmas or Easter is about for Christians. I know a lot of people who don't normally go to Church that attend Church during the Christmas holidays, will you say that is following pagan tradition too?


I'm not talking about bringing pagan ritual into the Church. I'm talking about Christians who enjoy the Christmas holidays to be together with family and friends, and with many people using that time to further... The Gospel of Jesus Christ, because that's exactly what Christ's Church has done historically during this season, and is still doing.

Likewise with Easter, it was originally the name of a pagan observance of rites of spring involving ceremonial rituals, etc. But it no longer represents that now. Many Christian brethren now recognize it as passover timing per Jewish tradition, but who is it that still believes in removing all leaven yeast out of one's house and eating bitter herbs in a ritualistic keeping of passover? Not Christians, but mainly orthodox Jews. And does orthodox Judaism have holidays that The LORD did not give? Yes! So why are they following days The LORD did not give?

The more you point against Christians and what we observe and fail to see the same among the Jews, the more of a hypocrite you make yourself.

And who made these heathen traditions acceptable to Christians? Certainly not God. Who subtly brings in heresy, until it is commonly accepted as the norm? Certainly not God. Has Christmas lost it's paganism?

Tell me if it's still celebrated on December 25th, if gifts are still placed under the tree, if they still decorate the Christmas tree, still have conections with the mistletoe.

Tell me who sanctified all that. Was it God? Certainly not. Man has done it, and man claims it is acceptable. The Word of God is plain.

This is no different than churches who bring Paganism into the Christian church, and call it acceptable, because they've "sanctified" it. Does removing the fact that they chose not to worship trees change anything? Does giving Pagan idolatry, Christian names change that it is from the heathen who incorporated it in their worship?

 

[veteran]

And who made these heathen traditions acceptable to Christians? Certainly not God. Who subtly brings in heresy, until it is commonly accepted as the norm? Certainly not God. Has Christmas lost it's paganism?

Tell me if it's still celebrated on December 25th, if gifts are still placed under the tree, if they still decorate the Christmas tree, still have conections with the mistletoe.

Tell me who sanctified all that. Was it God? Certainly not. Man has done it, and man claims it is acceptable. The Word of God is plain.

Tell me who sanctified all the Jewish traditional holidays which Jews today still observe that our Heavenly Father did NOT give to Israel, and then I'll answer your question.

 

[Raeneske]

Tell me who sanctified all the Jewish traditional holidays which Jews today still observe that our Heavenly Father did NOT give to Israel, and then I'll answer your question.

Sorry, can't tell you that. I can tell you however, they don't come from Pagan roots though (well some of them at least).

 

[mfreeman]

Hold the phone, there are celebrations that YHWH directly told us to celebrate I don't care if it's "Jewish" or not if YHWH said it then I'm doing it! And if He said not to then I'm not! And I don't care about my feelings because right now Christmas would be so much easier than not participating. And if YHWH even remotely says not to do celebrate something or follow a practice and the excuse is "but it doesn't mean that now" well, if that's your thoughts you have more confidence in mans ability and right standing with Him than I do. I'd rather follow what He said than man and their "intentions" (which is not concrete) an YHWH's word is concrete!

 

[veteran]

If one thinks we must keep the OT Israelite feasts and festivals to be a Christian, then they have GONE BACK TO SEEKING TO BE JUSTIFIED BY FOLLOWING THE LAW.

That's what some here are pushing, not Christianity per the New Covenant, but Judaism and law-keeping per the Old Covenant.

 

[aspen]

Hi, everyone. I just joined recently mainly to see if there was anyone out there who believes in the Hebrew roots of the Bible? For instance I have recently decided to not celebrate Christmas because of the pagan roots and the fact that YHWH never tells us to celebrate it. I don't understand why YHWH is taking me this way.. I feel isolated and alone often, my family does not agree, they think I'm "trying to be Jewish" Which is NOT the case I just think the old testament especially the Torah is relevant an YHWH's way of telling us how to live and I feel that scripture supports this.
A little background, I've honestly been asking for this. I have prayed and prayed and prayed fervently to really know what it means to follow Yeshua an how to love Him and this is the route He had taken me. There's no denying it. I can't deny what is plainly in front of me.
But did I think this is how my "Christian walk" would go. NO. Not even a little bit. I'm glad it's going somewhere but I would NEVER have thought to go this way EVER it's so far out side my personality.
I just want to know.. Are there others like me? Others that have felt that hunger and need for truth? Who are going down this path too? If so i would love to hear from you...
If your just going to tell me I'm wrong, I suppose that's fine, but just know it won't phase me or hange my mind because YHWH is the one who change it in the first place.
Sorry for the long post! May our loving Adonai bless you all!!!

It would seem that you are making Christianity harder than it needs to be, but that is just my observation. I don't see anything wrong with connecting with the Jewish roots of Christianity, but a greater emphasis needs to be on Christ's command to love God and one another.

 

[epostle1]

So let's think this through, THIS JOYOUS SEASON!

Crime rates typically JUMP during the MERRY season. No, they don't jump down, they jump UP!

Now how about retail? Well I read that the AVERAGE american spends $750! And in Australia wide, it's apparently something like 30 billion dollars! Is this the season of giving, or greed? I work in the fast food industry, and I can tell you right now, there's nothing merry about Christmas. When I go to the shops, do i see happy people? NO! I see stressed out people, working their butts off, or I see people spending their money on useless stuff, merely because 'tis the season.

And how about that fat jolly fellow called Santa? Rearrange the words and you'll get SATAN. Is that a coincidence? But hang on, there's more. What attributes does Santa have? He knows whether you've been good or bad (omniscient), he's all over the world in the same night (omnipresent), and he can do pretty much anything (omnipotent). Now I would venture to say, that this 'jolly' old chap is NOT so jolly after all.

What's so fantastic about lying to your child about Santa? What's so fantastic about teaching your children, that they get gifts only if they're good, but they eventually work out, that even if they're bad, they'll get gifts cause tis the season? What's so good about the Christmas tree? and holly? and tinsel? and mistletoe? I suppose you have great explanations for all these and why we should celebrate them?

http://rcg.org/books/ttooc.html

And how about Krampus? Now he really makes this season jolly!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krampus
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=Krampus&hl=en&safe=off&tbo=u&tbm=isch&source=univ&sa=X&ei=13HEUIOQC7GTiAf484DQAg&ved=0CDsQsAQ&biw=1366&bih=653


Anyway, happy holidays, to those of you whose spirits aren't vexed by the riotous living, the drunkenness, the debauchery, the crime, the death, and the sorrow that this 'merry' season brings.

VATICAN CITY | Sat Dec 24, 2011 6:24pm EST


(Reuters) - Pope Benedict ushered in Christmas for the world's 1.3 billion Roman Catholics on Saturday, urging humanity to see through the superficial glitter and commercialism of the season and rediscover the real significance of the humble birth of Jesus.

"... let us strip away our fixation on what is material, on what can be measured and grasped. Let us allow ourselves to be made simple by the God who reveals himself to the simple of heart," he said.

"God has appeared - as a child. It is in this guise that he pits himself against all violence and brings a message that is peace," he said.
"At this hour, when the world is continually threatened by violence in so many places and in so many different ways, when over and over again there are oppressors' rods and bloodstained cloaks, we cry out to the Lord..." he said.

"...we suffer from the continuing presence of violence in the world, and so we also ask you: manifest your power, O God. In this time of ours, in this world of ours, cause the oppressors' rods, the cloaks rolled in blood and the footgear of battle to be burned, so that your peace may triumph in this world of ours."

"And let us also pray especially at this hour for all who have to celebrate Christmas in poverty, in suffering, as migrants, that a ray of God's kindness may shine upon them, that they - and we - may be touched by the kindness that God chose to bring into the world through the birth of his Son in a stable," he said.

source

 

[justaname]

This is an interesting topic. My question about celebrating Christmas is are you celebrating the birth of Jesus or are you observing pagan beliefs?

Truly God knows the intention of your heart. If it is you can celebrate Christmas with a clear conscience let no man judge you, but if it is you cannot, let no man judge you.

Now when you speak of Hebraic roots, are you a Jew inwardly? If the answer is yes do you believe you need to be one outwardly also? To pose the question another way are you seeking to establish your own righteousness or are you trusting in God's righteousness?

It is the great Shema we are to live, this is definitely scriptural. By doing this we fulfill the Law. Romans 13:8

Please do not see this as me attempting to discourage you in the direction that you feel you are being led, but you speak of being separate. How is it you are attempting to be separate or better put holy?

I submit that if it is not a circumcision of the heart that separates you from the rest of humanity you are lumped in with the rest no matter what you do.

 

[Raeneske]

This is an interesting topic. My question about celebrating Christmas is are you celebrating the birth of Jesus or are you observing pagan beliefs?

Truly God knows the intention of your heart. If it is you can celebrate Christmas with a clear conscience let no man judge you, but if it is you cannot, let no man judge you.

Now when you speak of Hebraic roots, are you a Jew inwardly? If the answer is yes do you believe you need to be one outwardly also? To pose the question another way are you seeking to establish your own righteousness or are you trusting in God's righteousness?

It is the great Shema we are to live, this is definitely scriptural. By doing this we fulfill the Law. Romans 13:8

Please do not see this as me attempting to discourage you in the direction that you feel you are being led, but you speak of being separate. How is it you are attempting to be separate or better put holy?

I submit that if it is not a circumcision of the heart that separates you from the rest of humanity you are lumped in with the rest no matter what you do.

Well, ask Israel who worshipped the Golden Calf. They clearly said it was a "feast to the Lord" did they not? The Lord God, who brought them out of Egypt. They attributed the Lord, to the calf, but this was clearly idolatry.

The Pagan festival, which we now have people observing as Christmas, is still just that. Pagan. And God said not to do such a thing like that. Besides, Jesus wasn't even born around this time, or even in winter for that matter. What Christians are doing is no different than Israel did. They are taking a Pagan belief, and attributing Jesus to it. This is sin, for God so clearly said, "Do not do it". As I stated before, I never had the problem with just a tree. Pine trees are good for you. No one has a problem with the Date December 25th, or even receiving gifts for that matter. It's the Pagan influences that make it sin, when you combine the tree, the decorations, the presents, december 25th, misltetoe, stockings, yule tide, yule log, etc, when you do all that you are clearly copying the Pagan beliefs and worshipping God in that way, and He specifically said do not do that.

I know your comment was towards the OP, but this is a warranted response.

 

[teamventure]

Wow I am overwhelmed with everyone's responses and grateful. So grateful! Some of your responses really shine to me (tim_from_pa, zebrahug) Oh and raeneske thank you for your response! You're very encouraging. Honestly I know not everyone agrees which is to be expected but for those of you who have had the same convictions, I suppose you understand this challenge more than I do, and maybe see how awkward it is... And difficult. I don't even want to think about Easter, by the way I go to a church that celebrates these holidays. And I am literally.... The only person who doesn't. Tim_from_pa I really like what you said about how Elohim did not remove the law but rather paid the price for breaking it! Beautifully said! I will have to quote that, explains my thoughts and feelings on this subject so perfectly!

i don't celebrate easter either. oh and i have a jewsih flag hanging in my room and a manora. i hope that's an encouragement.

 

[veteran]

Well, ask Israel who worshipped the Golden Calf. They clearly said it was a "feast to the Lord" did they not? The Lord God, who brought them out of Egypt. They attributed the Lord, to the calf, but this was clearly idolatry.

The Pagan festival, which we now have people observing as Christmas, is still just that. Pagan. And God said not to do such a thing like that. Besides, Jesus wasn't even born around this time, or even in winter for that matter. What Christians are doing is no different than Israel did. They are taking a Pagan belief, and attributing Jesus to it. This is sin, for God so clearly said, "Do not do it". As I stated before, I never had the problem with just a tree. Pine trees are good for you. No one has a problem with the Date December 25th, or even receiving gifts for that matter. It's the Pagan influences that make it sin, when you combine the tree, the decorations, the presents, december 25th, misltetoe, stockings, yule tide, yule log, etc, when you do all that you are clearly copying the Pagan beliefs and worshipping God in that way, and He specifically said do not do that.

I know your comment was towards the OP, but this is a warranted response.

Recognizing Christ Jesus during the Christmas holidays, getting together with family, giving each other gifts, and having a nice dinner, is a LONG WAYS OFF from WORSHIP OF A GOLDEN CALF as old Israel did!!!

You're being a HYPOCRITE, because the very Jewish traditions YOU'RE suggesting to follow instead CONTAIN holidays that our Heavenly Father did NOT command for Israel! Yet you have said NOTHING... about that fact, but only continue your attack upon CHRISTIANITY and a traditional Christian Christ-mas(s). You're like the white-washed wall of the blind scribes and Pharisees which Christ Himself rebuked.

 

[Raeneske]

Recognizing Christ Jesus during the Christmas holidays, getting together with family, giving each other gifts, and having a nice dinner, is a LONG WAYS OFF from WORSHIP OF A GOLDEN CALF as old Israel did!!!

You're being a HYPOCRITE, because the very Jewish traditions YOU'RE suggesting to follow instead CONTAIN holidays that our Heavenly Father did NOT command for Israel! Yet you have said NOTHING... about that fact, but only continue your attack upon CHRISTIANITY and a traditional Christian Christ-mas(s). You're like the white-washed wall of the blind scribes and Pharisees which Christ Himself rebuked.

Pardon?

And you're right, it's not idolatry. I was merely giving an example. But, giving Christmas a "Christian" feel to it won't make it Christian. It's Pagan, and that's all there is to it.