I'm a Christian and I support the legality of same-sex marriage

[BarneyFife]

What does God think on this issue?

We all know what God thinks. It's been discussed at length. Right now we're talking about the OvH decision. Why do you ask?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

sing it with me evabody;
TOOOOOO-MORROW, tomorrow...

no offense ok but Jesus surely is not, ever, "returning"
(which is why you cannot Quote that, among other problems)

Well then won't you be surprised when He does! And what is it that I cannot Quote? We have been living in the last days since May 14, 1948 and jesus will return at the appropriate time and even gave us a generic road map of events that will take place in the world from 1948 till He physically returns!

 

[Grailhunter]

Well then won't you be surprised when He does! And what is it that I cannot Quote? We have been living in the last days since May 14, 1948 and jesus will return at the appropriate time and even gave us a generic road map of events that will take place in the world from 1948 till He physically returns!

I disagree. The apostles were certain that they were living in the last days.
The mind set that this is all about the prophesied end of time and Christ return, causes Christian to hunker down. Thinking there is nothing that they can do about it. There is a lot we can do and should do. Oppose evil at every turn. If He does return in the midst of all this, He know what side you have picked.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

And what is our father's business? Making trite statements does not enhance in-depth discussion.

And which statement do you find trite?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I disagree. The apostles were certain that they were living in the last days.
The mind set that this is all about the prophesied end of time and Christ return, causes Christian to hunker down. Thinking there is nothing that they can do about it. There is a lot we can do and should do. Oppose evil at every turn. If He does return in the midst of all this, He know what side you have picked.

Well the answer to show your error is a very long and detailed answer.

Yes the Apostles did think that Jesus would come back fairly soon and establish the Kingdom promised to Israel! the rapture is imminent, but the physical retrurn of Jesus to earth has many detailed SCriptures to show what must take place prior.

AS for hunkering down. People who wish to hunker down, will find any reason to do so! I have known we have been living in the end times for most of my 45 years of following Christ. And I have sought to serve Him actively.

I have taught eschatology not only in Adult Sunday schools and Bible studies, but on TV and Radio and in Bible College. I have never encouraged anyone to hunker down, but to shine brightly and be th ecity set on a hill! I have read many books on eschatology over the years ( many very wierd BTW) and I think I saw only one book that taught believers to hunker down.

Hunkering down is a condition of the heart and one will find any excuse to disobey if they are not interested in serving actively. That should never stop anyone from preaching truth!

 

[Grailhunter]

Well the answer to show your error is a very long and detailed answer.

Yes the Apostles did think that Jesus would come back fairly soon and establish the Kingdom promised to Israel! the rapture is imminent, but the physical retrurn of Jesus to earth has many detailed SCriptures to show what must take place prior.

AS for hunkering down. People who wish to hunker down, will find any reason to do so! I have known we have been living in the end times for most of my 45 years of following Christ. And I have sought to serve Him actively.

I have taught eschatology not only in Adult Sunday schools and Bible studies, but on TV and Radio and in Bible College. I have never encouraged anyone to hunker down, but to shine brightly and be th ecity set on a hill! I have read many books on eschatology over the years ( many very wierd BTW) and I think I saw only one book that taught believers to hunker down.

Hunkering down is a condition of the heart and one will find any excuse to disobey if they are not interested in serving actively. That should never stop anyone from preaching truth!

Well the answer to show your error is a very long and detailed answer.
Yes the Apostles did think that Jesus would come back fairly soon and establish the Kingdom promised to Israel! the rapture is imminent, but the physical retrurn of Jesus to earth has many detailed SCriptures to show what must take place prior.

Dead wrong. Everything they said was soon and days not millenniums. Everything they did had a sense of urgently due to the impending quick return of Christ. No scripture to the effect that...and Christ will return in the distant future...what do ya say grass hopper! Guess you do not actually read the Bible?

AS for hunkering down. People who wish to hunker down, will find any reason to do so! I have known we have been living in the end times for most of my 45 years of following Christ. And I have sought to serve Him actively.
And the people in the next millennium may “feel” the same way…and still not “know” when His return will be.
I have taught eschatology not only in Adult Sunday schools and Bible studies, but on TV and Radio and in Bible College. I have never encouraged anyone to hunker down, but to shine brightly and be th ecity set on a hill! I have read many books on eschatology over the years ( many very wierd BTW) and I think I saw only one book that taught believers to hunker down.
Hunkering down is a condition of the heart and one will find any excuse to disobey if they are not interested in serving actively. That should never stop anyone from preaching truth!

Good do not hunker down, challenge evil.

 

[Triumph1300]

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FeaturedI'm a Christian and I support the legality of same-sex marriage
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Tell that to Sodom and Gomorrah.

 

[bbyrd009]

Well then won't you be surprised when He does! And what is it that I cannot Quote? We have been living in the last days since May 14, 1948 and jesus will return at the appropriate time and even gave us a generic road map of events that will take place in the world from 1948 till He physically returns!

you may certainly believe that if you like, but wadr i would not be looking for a kingdom that comes by observation, such as you are doing
you might also note the satan's dialectic there, the insistence upon facts as truth?
he who says he knows, doesnt

 

[jimmiec]

As I said in my OP, stealing and murder adversely affects an innocent third-party, wherein same-sex marriage only affects the same-sex couple and they enter into voluntarily.

For the record, I personally find same-sex relations to be revolting, but I also believe in the rights of others to live their lives free of me.

If you support living under a theocracy, then let me ask you a question. How would you feel if, for instance, Muslims becoming the majority and then imposing Sharia Law on all of us?

I'd call on my Redneck, Christian, friends in Miss, LA, Geo, Ala, etc and go Under God [ most Rednecks are Christians. Most anti Christians are Jesus killers] and converse these boyz. Maybe harvest a squirrel or two on the way. Good eating!

 

[jimmiec]

Well, I admire your willingness to take a stand in the face of what most assuredly will be opposition at a site like this. But about the above, just because two people are consenting does not make something moral in the eyes of God, or even man for that matter. An adult male and a 10 year old girl can both be 100% consenting, but it still be illegal, not to mention other forms of sexual behavior that would be labeled as sinful in the eyes of God, including among other things adultery.

The standard, you see, has to be God's word, not anyone's attempts at gauging morality outside of it.

So your approach would need to be based on the word itself to have any merit to it. Is that something you wish to discuss? I'm assuming so or you wouldn't have started a thread on it. What do you do with the scriptures on the issue of homosexuality?

Unmarried sex is Unlawful Under God. He dies not deal in legal-ism or any kinds of ism. Ism, = "religions hated by God." KJv

 

[marksman]

And which statement do you find trite?

It is in the post.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Well the answer to show your error is a very long and detailed answer.
Yes the Apostles did think that Jesus would come back fairly soon and establish the Kingdom promised to Israel! the rapture is imminent, but the physical retrurn of Jesus to earth has many detailed SCriptures to show what must take place prior.

Dead wrong. Everything they said was soon and days not millenniums. Everything they did had a sense of urgently due to the impending quick return of Christ. No scripture to the effect that...and Christ will return in the distant future...what do ya say grass hopper! Guess you do not actually read the Bible?

AS for hunkering down. People who wish to hunker down, will find any reason to do so! I have known we have been living in the end times for most of my 45 years of following Christ. And I have sought to serve Him actively.
And the people in the next millennium may “feel” the same way…and still not “know” when His return will be.
I have taught eschatology not only in Adult Sunday schools and Bible studies, but on TV and Radio and in Bible College. I have never encouraged anyone to hunker down, but to shine brightly and be th ecity set on a hill! I have read many books on eschatology over the years ( many very wierd BTW) and I think I saw only one book that taught believers to hunker down.
Hunkering down is a condition of the heart and one will find any excuse to disobey if they are not interested in serving actively. That should never stop anyone from preaching truth!

Good do not hunker down, challenge evil.

Well the Apostle Paul knew that many events had to take place before the physical return of the Lord. He was an OT super scholar, so he knew the events from Ezekiel, and the Minor prophets.

But as for the Day of the Lord? That is a different subject. Paul told them that that time (it is not a day) would not happen until the man of sin entered the temple and declared himself God! they did not know when and so they always warned to be prepared! Now many "Christians" are asleep thinking the same way the world does:

2 Peter 3:3-5
King James Version

3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

By the time John wrote the Revelation, Nero had come and gone and the church was under a new emperor. the 7 letters were addressed as happening quickly, then the next vision which starts in chapter 4 has no sense of time to it!

Even Johns closing statement: Rev. 22: 20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

When parsed out shows that John had a sense by the end that this would take time!

 

[Grailhunter]

Well the Apostle Paul knew that many events had to take place before the physical return of the Lord. He was an OT super scholar, so he knew the events from Ezekiel, and the Minor prophets.

But as for the Day of the Lord? That is a different subject. Paul told them that that time (it is not a day) would not happen until the man of sin entered the temple and declared himself God! they did not know when and so they always warned to be prepared! Now many "Christians" are asleep thinking the same way the world does:

2 Peter 3:3-5
King James Version

3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

By the time John wrote the Revelation, Nero had come and gone and the church was under a new emperor. the 7 letters were addressed as happening quickly, then the next vision which starts in chapter 4 has no sense of time to it!

Even Johns closing statement: Rev. 22: 20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

When parsed out shows that John had a sense by the end that this would take time!

Now this will do you good. Comb through the entire NT and list all scriptures that refer to the last days, last times, the time is short, the time has been shortened, and Christ's return is to occur quickly.

You will never find that even months or years are mentioned, much less centuries or millenniums.
Everything listed that was suppose to occur before His return was suppose to occur quickly.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Now this will do you good. Comb through the entire NT and list all scriptures that refer to the last days, last time, the time is short, the time has been shortened, and Christ's return is to occur quickly.

You will never find that even months or years are mentioned, much less centuries or millenniums.
Everything listed that was suppose to occur before His return was suppose to occur quickly.

Jesus never taught of an imminent return.

Peter implied patience on Gods part.

Paul taught a sense of urgency, but that was more for the day of the Lord than the Lords return. but then again He wasn't given Johns REvelation 35-40 years before God gave it to John.

The rapture has always been imminent and Paul encouraged believers to live ready lives in light of that!

2 Thessalonians 2
King James Version

2 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


1 Thessalonians 5
King James Version

5 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.

2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.

6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.


No sense of imminent urgency here! Just to be watchful and ready for when the day will come. I will offer an opinion and say I believe that many many believers thought it would occur in the first century given the roman and Jewish persecution.

People have always been watching for the rapture until after Constantine legitimized the church and slowly but steadily false doctrines came in and Augustine popularized among teh clergy the allegorical method of interpretation and the rapture went by the wayside!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

you may certainly believe that if you like, but wadr i would not be looking for a kingdom that comes by observation, such as you are doing
you might also note the satan's dialectic there, the insistence upon facts as truth?
he who says he knows, doesnt

Last line- cute but irrelevant.

And sorry but truth is fact and facts form truth!

I live in the mystery form of the Kingdom now! And the Bible does declare the fact that when Jesus physically returns as He said He will, He will establish a 1,000 year kingdom on planet earth as Scripture declares! I will reign with Jesus for 1,000 years as part of the His bride consort!

Teaching truth is teaching truth about an issue and the Scripture is truth!

 

[Grailhunter]

Jesus never taught of an imminent return.

Peter implied patience on Gods part.

Paul taught a sense of urgency, but that was more for the day of the Lord than the Lords return. but then again He wasn't given Johns REvelation 35-40 years before God gave it to John.

The rapture has always been imminent and Paul encouraged believers to live ready lives in light of that!

2 Thessalonians 2
King James Version

2 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


1 Thessalonians 5
King James Version

5 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.

2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.

6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.


No sense of imminent urgency here! Just to be watchful and ready for when the day will come. I will offer an opinion and say I believe that many many believers thought it would occur in the first century given the roman and Jewish persecution.

People have always been watching for the rapture until after Constantine legitimized the church and slowly but steadily false doctrines came in and Augustine popularized among teh clergy the allegorical method of interpretation and the rapture went by the wayside!

The whole NT is based on imminent urgency! That is one of the reasons that there was not a focus on the family.
So no, you are wrong. They did not know when it was going to occur but it was all based on the belief that the time was short....never that the time would be millenniums.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

It is in the post.

Well you had one in mind otherwise you would not have made that comment. So instead of me guessing- why don't you just tell me what statement I made you consider trite? I could guess but I could be wrong. And as you made the accusation- it is incumbent upon you to show the statement.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

The whole NT is based on imminent urgency! That is one of the reasons that there was not a focus on the family.
So no, you are wrong. They did not know when it was going to occur but it was all based on the belief that the time was short....never that the time would be millenniums.

Show me five verses where a sense of the imminent physcical return of Jesus is explicitly or even strongly implicitly declared!

 

[Grailhunter]

Show me five verses where a sense of the imminent physcical return of Jesus is explicitly or even strongly implicitly declared!

You have to be kidding me.
Read the NT. Only five scriptures you have to be kidding me!

The times, they are a changing….But when did the times change? When will they change?

Hebrews 1:1-2
God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.

1st Peter 1:20
For He was foreknown before the foundation of the world, but has appeared in these last times for the sake of you.

Matthew 24:34
Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.

1st Corinthians 7:29
But this I say, brethren, the time has been shortened, so that from now on those who have wives should be as though they had none;

2nd Thessalonians 2:2
that you not be quickly shaken from your composure or be disturbed either by a spirit or a message or a letter as if from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come.

1st John 2:18
Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour.

Revelation 1:1-3
The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show to His bond-servants, the things which must soon take place; and He sent and communicated it by His angel to His bond-servant John, who testified to the word of God and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, even to all that he saw. Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of the prophecy, and heed the things which are written in it; for the time is near.

Revelation 22:20
He who testifies to these things says, “Yes I am coming quickly.” Amen. Come, Lord Yeshua.

 

[YeshuaFan1]

Show me five verses where a sense of the imminent physcical return of Jesus is explicitly or even strongly implicitly declared!

James thought that His half brother was right at the door!