I'm Pretty Sure That Jesus Wasn't Talking About This

[quietthinker]

Oh okay that explains it I have him on ignore.

My dear A_R, the ignore feature was ideally designed to block out active harassment not those who have your interest at heart by shooting straight.

 

[mailmandan]

Here's even bigger proof that Kamala is a devil woman. She won't even salute the US military figuratively or literally!!!!

Kamala Harris Is The Ultimate Dishonor

She is a communist who continuously brings up America's past to turn Americans against America!

Kamala Harris denounces European explorers for ushering in 'wave of devastation' for Native Americans

Kamala Harris denounces European explorers for ushering in 'wave of devastation' for Native Americans

Is this supposed to justify the 'wave of devastation' the Democratic party is bringing to America? Hypocrites!

 

[Randy Kluth]

She is a communist who continuously brings up America's past to turn Americans against America!

Kamala Harris denounces European explorers for ushering in 'wave of devastation' for Native Americans

Kamala Harris denounces European explorers for ushering in 'wave of devastation' for Native Americans

Is this supposed to justify the 'wave of devastation' the Democratic party is bringing to America? Hypocrites!

Yes, liberal education over the last several decades have emphasized European abuses in the New World, focusing on the "silliness" of the Pilgrims, including their "superstitions," the abuses of colonialism (I'm sure "imperialism" exists in all cultures), forced conversion (the Inquisition and witch trials, etc.), and forced migrations or exterminations of native peoples.

Let's look at the true picture. Indian cultures were often as corrupt as some of the European groups, replete with attempted exterminations of the Europeans, inter-tribal rivalry, murder, torture, theft, etc. Do you really "own" the North American continent if you spread a number of people the size of the Seattle metropolis across all 50 states? That would be like saying the US owns the moon for putting its flag there, or Mexico owns Texas because it had a few missions set up over so many hundreds of miles there!

On the other hand, Europe was largely Christian in nominal fashion, in form, in law, but often not in substance. And pagan peoples would not be much different in their behavior, having no Christian laws at all!

Those Christians who were real did a lot of good in their efforts at evangelizing and civilizing peoples who had no spiritual experience and no hope for eternity. Christians brought a Gospel of truth, law, and experience, changing things from bad to good. This was ignored by those promoting a liberal education in opposition to Christianity.

No, this is all an attempt, in Enlightenment fashion, of undoing belief in supernatural Christianity and standing in opposition to the idea of a real God with real laws. People want to be independent of religion, but until the established churches were delegitimized, there was fear in doing so.

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

Christ didn't retaliate or "defend" Himself when people assaulted Him. Neither did Paul. Matter of fact, Paul and Stephen didn't even "defend" themselves or retaliate when people stoned them. I also don't recall any of the Christians of the 1st-4th centuries "defending" themselves from the horrible things Roman emperors, Catholics, and Orthodox Jews did to them. Practicing biblical Christianity may sound crazy to "Christians" who want to be like everyone around them, but God is looking for people who are crazy enough to believe and do what He says.

Christ said "whoever tries to save their life will lose it". If choosing to believe Him means i'm crazy, then i'll gladly wear that hat. True Christianity calls for someone to be radically different from the people who are being led into following Satan's way of life. True Christianity never makes sense to anyone who are following Satan because it means having to do things God's way. Christ never promised Christianity didn't require anybody to be different or that it wasn't going to inconvenience their carnal nature. Christ said His followers are to be harmless as doves, and Paul said Christians are to be harmless in a crooked and perverse world. No true Christian can possibly misunderstand what God requires from them when reading those 2 statements.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Christ didn't retaliate or "defend" Himself when people assaulted Him. Neither did Paul. Matter of fact, Paul and Stephen didn't even "defend" themselves or retaliate when people stoned them. I also don't recall any of the Christians of the 1st-4th centuries "defending" themselves from the horrible things Roman emperors, Catholics, and Orthodox Jews did to them. Practicing biblical Christianity may sound crazy to "Christians" who want to be like everyone around them, but God is looking for people who are crazy enough to believe and do what He says.

Christ said "whoever tries to save their life will lose it". If choosing to believe Him means i'm crazy, then i'll gladly wear that hat. True Christianity calls for someone to be radically different from the people who are being led into following Satan's way of life. True Christianity never makes sense to anyone who are following Satan because it means having to do things God's way. Christ never promised Christianity didn't require anybody to be different or that it wasn't going to inconvenience their carnal nature. Christ said His followers are to be harmless as doves, and Paul said Christians are to be harmless in a crooked and perverse world. No true Christian can possibly misunderstand what God requires from them when reading those 2 statements.

You need to look at it from a broader perspective. Yes, Jesus didn't advocate taking vengeance out on others personally, without God's support. But did God encourage military defense against pagan enemies? Of course!

The OT is replete with examples of true believers taking military action to defend themselves or theirs. You can start with Abraham fighting on behalf of Lot's people. You can look at David fighting to restore his captured people. You can look at how Moses commanded Israel to not just defeat but *exterminate* pagans who had become so thoroughly pagan that God gave up on them.

Military defense is *not* satanic. It can certainly be "in the flesh," but it can also be "in the Spirit." It depends on if the military and political leaders are consulting with God, or with their conscience. When the kings of Israel did not consult with God, or when they compromised their spirituality, they failed.

The teaching of Jesus was given while he was still under the system of Mosaic Law. He did not revoke anything that had been in the OT Scriptures a legitimate practice! NT teaching doesn't try to re-make God's character in the OT either. There are not two gods!

Many early Christians were pacifistic because initially Rome was pagan and fought many unjust wars, or fought just wars in an unjust way. This did not mean that Christians did not later support their government. When Rome was Christianized, Christians could be state officers without shame.

 

[bbyrd009]

The only reason that Jesus took it is because He was taking our punishment. He probably would have fought back otherwise.

No son of man may die for another's sins...

America was founded on Christianity

lol
ok

 

[michaelvpardo]

Whoa, whoa, whoa wait!!! Hold on a second and rewind back to the first part you said. The only reason that Jesus took it is because He was taking our punishment. He probably would have fought back otherwise. Second of all,.. that makes it sound like God wants us to be in abusive relationships and what about children who are abused by their parents? Also, the government is currently pushing for communism. Does that mean that we're just supposed to sit back and let them have the absolute power over us? I don't think so!!! That's why I'm going to be writing to my congressman next week and fighting back even if I have to do it all on my lonesome,.. even if nobody on here believes that I can. God wouldn't stand for all of this and tagging @JohnDB because I'm really curious what his comments are about this. America was founded on Christianity, so if it were against God to have the right to bear arms,.. I'm pretty sure that wouldn't be stated in the US Constitution and we wouldn't have our military. God bless our troops!!!

We like to think that America was founded on Christianity because some of the early colonies were formed by Christians fleeing religious persecution in Europe, but most Christians were not in favor of rebellion against the king of England. The Boston Tea Party was carried out by the Boston Masonic lodge and they remain proud of their rebellion to this day. Most of the signers of the declaration of independence and the framers of the constitution were also free Masons, and Free Masonry is by no means Christian in origin and practice.
George Washington, first president of the United States, was sworn into office, with his hand on a Masonic bible and by the grandmaster of the New York City lodge, in front of the trinity church in lower Manhattan, which still stands just a few blocks from the World Trade center property. Every president from Washington to at least Garfield was a member of the Knights Templar, a masonic order.
Rebellion to authority was never taught by Christ. He and the Apostle Paul were both careful to teach obedience to the authority as God's representatives of justice upon the Earth.
The only legitimate excuse given in scripture for rebellion against authority is the imposition of that authority in opposition to God's laws.
With regard to self defense, Jesus taught that we should not return evil for evil, but rather, to love our enemies. I don't think he meant that we should bare our necks to those who would cut them, but even when he told His disciples to obtain swords just prior to His arrest, it was to fulfill the scripture that He would be counted with the transgressors.

36 Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one. 37 For I say to you that this which is written must still be accomplished in Me: ‘And He was numbered with the transgressors.’ For the things concerning Me have an end.”

38 So they said, “Lord, look, here are two swords.”

And He said to them, “It is enough.” Luke 22:36-38

God is a defender of the helpless, so it is godly to be a defender of those incapable of defending themselves. Some of us are just built that way and end up in law enforcement or some other public safety type work. However there's a fine line between self defense and aggression. The way of Christ is the way of peace, and the beatitudes express the fruit of the Spirit in righteous living.
Martyrdom is not something we should seek, but many faithful Christians have been martyred for refusing to deny Christ when they could have resisted religious persecution from the first century even to this day.

 

[michaelvpardo]

You need to look at it from a broader perspective. Yes, Jesus didn't advocate taking vengeance out on others personally, without God's support. But did God encourage military defense against pagan enemies? Of course!

The OT is replete with examples of true believers taking military action to defend themselves or theirs. You can start with Abraham fighting on behalf of Lot's people. You can look at David fighting to restore his captured people. You can look at how Moses commanded Israel to not just defeat but *exterminate* pagans who had become so thoroughly pagan that God gave up on them.

Military defense is *not* satanic. It can certainly be "in the flesh," but it can also be "in the Spirit." It depends on if the military and political leaders are consulting with God, or with their conscience. When the kings of Israel did not consult with God, or when they compromised their spirituality, they failed.

The teaching of Jesus was given while he was still under the system of Mosaic Law. He did not revoke anything that had been in the OT Scriptures a legitimate practice! NT teaching doesn't try to re-make God's character in the OT either. There are not two gods!

Many early Christians were pacifistic because initially Rome was pagan and fought many unjust wars, or fought just wars in an unjust way. This did not mean that Christians did not later support their government. When Rome was Christianized, Christians could be state officers without shame.

“Awake, O sword, against My Shepherd,
Against the Man who is My Companion,”
Says the Lord of hosts.
“Strike the Shepherd,
And the sheep will be scattered;
Then I will turn My hand against the little ones.
8 And it shall come to pass in all the land,”
Says the Lord,
“That two-thirds in it shall be cut off and die,
But one-third shall be left in it:
9 I will bring the one-third through the fire,
Will refine them as silver is refined,
And test them as gold is tested.
They will call on My name,
And I will answer them.
I will say, ‘This is My people’;
And each one will say, ‘The Lord is my God.’ ” Zechariah 13:7-9

“For My sword shall be bathed in heaven;
Indeed it shall come down on Edom,
And on the people of My curse, for judgment.
6 The sword of the Lord is filled with blood,
It is made overflowing with fatness,
With the blood of lambs and goats,
With the fat of the kidneys of rams.
For the Lord has a sacrifice in Bozrah,
And a great slaughter in the land of Edom.
7 The wild oxen shall come down with them,
And the young bulls with the mighty bulls;
Their land shall be soaked with blood,
And their dust saturated with fatness.” Isaiah 34:5-7
Its interesting to note that while Bozrah was the name of a place, it also means "sheepfold", which is by no means coincidental.

 

[dev553344]

“Awake, O sword, against My Shepherd,
Against the Man who is My Companion,”
Says the Lord of hosts.
“Strike the Shepherd,
And the sheep will be scattered;
Then I will turn My hand against the little ones.
8 And it shall come to pass in all the land,”
Says the Lord,
“That two-thirds in it shall be cut off and die,
But one-third shall be left in it:
9 I will bring the one-third through the fire,
Will refine them as silver is refined,
And test them as gold is tested.
They will call on My name,
And I will answer them.
I will say, ‘This is My people’;
And each one will say, ‘The Lord is my God.’ ” Zechariah 13:7-9

“For My sword shall be bathed in heaven;
Indeed it shall come down on Edom,
And on the people of My curse, for judgment.
6 The sword of the Lord is filled with blood,
It is made overflowing with fatness,
With the blood of lambs and goats,
With the fat of the kidneys of rams.
For the Lord has a sacrifice in Bozrah,
And a great slaughter in the land of Edom.
7 The wild oxen shall come down with them,
And the young bulls with the mighty bulls;
Their land shall be soaked with blood,
And their dust saturated with fatness.” Isaiah 34:5-7
Its interesting to note that while Bozrah was the name of a place, it also means "sheepfold", which is by no means coincidental.

Love these verses! Thanks!

 

[GodsBeloved11]

@April_Rose

Jesus was silent when the abuse was against him personally. He only opened his mouth when the high priest pressed Jesus before God:

"But Jesus held his peace. And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God" Matt 26:63

Then Jesus responded. As to laying down his life, he did that because it was what God wanted him to do.

How many of us know just what God wants us to do? We are free to go our own way and do whatever pleases us first in this world of men, but if that causes us to miss what God really wants us to do, we may find ourselves on the outside of God's camp.

I do agree it's right to walk away peacefully and not fight back. I am thinking that Jesus meant we don't get into a rage and hit back.

 

[GodsBeloved11]

I think it's best not to engage with people whisked being abusive if possible but to remove self from situation. Of course it isn't always possible

 

[Curtis]

1. Romans 13 says to obey governors and rulers as they fight against evil - it does not say to obey rulers who are doing evil or who support evil

2. Peter was ordered by the leaders of the Jews to shut up and stop preaching about Jesus - his reply was we must obey God rather than men.

3. While Jesus was with the apostles daily, He told them to have no swords, but as He was about to be arrested and then crucified and would no longer be with them, He told them it was time to get some swords - obviously for self defense - no one hunted game with a sword:

Luk 22:36 He said to them, “But now let the one who has a moneybag take it, and likewise a knapsack. And let the one who has no sword sell his cloak and buy one.