Impediments to Spiritual Growth in Christ.

[Episkopos]

This is the time to take the "red pill" if you dare: There have never been so many impediments to a spiritual growth in Christ as in our time. The solution to this predicament is both too easy and too hard for us to wrap our minds around. This is by God's design. Pride stops us from discovering the "easy" way of mercy towards others and a childlike righteousness that God approves. We tend to overshoot the target in this regard. On the other hand, a lack of real faith, understanding, and knowledge, prevents us from discovering what is presently beyond us, namely, holiness. This episode seeks to clear the rubble and redirect the paths that have gone astray, as well hold out the standard we need to raise up as we call on the name of the Lord for His life and salvation.

 

[shepherdsword]

I watched the whole video. I guess the one of the parts that confuses me (and probably indicates where I am at) is what you say about the lack of necessity to believe in gospel facts. Doesn't salvation start at the point where we believe that Jesus is the Son of God? How would you address this:

Ro 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

There were also exhortations against false doctrine as well:

2 Pe 2:1-3 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not

2 Jn 7-10
For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward. Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:

 

[Episkopos]

I watched the whole video. I guess the one of the parts that confuses me (and probably indicates where I am at) is what you say about the lack of necessity to believe in gospel facts. Doesn't salvation start at the point where we believe that Jesus is the Son of God? How would you address this:

Ro 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Hi Shep! :) Thanks for watching. I think it's a question of depth. Believing with the mind (as mere facts) vs believing with or from the heart (into truth). God is the one who translates the believer into the kingdom realm...and the New Covenant is with the heart. So He decides how deep we will go into eternal understanding....and truth.

Remember that God said "I swore in My wrath that they will not enter My rest." A superficial acknowledgment can be an obstacle to any deeper faith.

However, even if we begin with a superficial belief, it doesn't mean we have to remain there. I maintain that it isn't how we begin a race that counts, but how we finish. The point is to question and not to jump to our own conclusions.

There were also exhortations against false doctrine as well:

2 Pe 2:1-3 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not

2 Jn 7-10
For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward. Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:

Here again abiding in THE doctrine of Christ means that you are abiding in the truth....on 2 levels...by taking seriously what Jesus said and putting it into practice (on the level of righteousness)...AND... by means of having gone through the gate of salvation (the narrow door) INTO holiness.

Hence the divine balance of fulfilling both kinds of love....a natural love that is informed by a supernatural love.

 

[shepherdsword]

Hi Shep! :) Thanks for watching. I think it's a question of depth. Believing with the mind (as mere facts) vs believing with or from the heart (into truth). God is the one who translates the believer into the kingdom realm...and the New Covenant is with the heart. So He decides how deep we will go into eternal understanding....and truth.

Remember that God said "I swore in My wrath that they will not enter My rest." A superficial acknowledgment can be an obstacle to any deeper faith.

However, even if we begin with a superficial belief, it doesn't mean we have to remain there. I maintain that it isn't how we begin a race that counts, but how we finish. The point is to question and not to jump to our own conclusions.

Here again abiding in THE doctrine of Christ means that you are abiding in the truth....on 2 levels...by taking seriously what Jesus said and putting it into practice (on the level of righteousness)...AND... by means of having gone through the gate of salvation (the narrow door) INTO holiness.

Hence the divine balance of fulfilling both kinds of love....a natural love that is informed by a supernatural love.

Heb 6:3...And this will we do, if God permit.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

This is the time to take the "red pill" if you dare: There have never been so many impediments to a spiritual growth in Christ as in our time. The solution to this predicament is both too easy and too hard for us to wrap our minds around. This is by God's design. Pride stops us from discovering the "easy" way of mercy towards others and a childlike righteousness that God approves. We tend to overshoot the target in this regard. On the other hand, a lack of real faith, understanding, and knowledge, prevents us from discovering what is presently beyond us, namely, holiness. This episode seeks to clear the rubble and redirect the paths that have gone astray, as well hold out the standard we need to raise up as we call on the name of the Lord for His life and salvation.

Yes, Brother Episkopos, Great message again, by us following His Steps is the only way to His Kingdom. My Brother, before I viewed this video, Last night, 1-30-26, I received these revealed words in my spirit: It is a spiritual awakening, Arise, Shine, For Thy Light Is Come: Isaiah 60 KJV, 1 Peter 2 KJV

Love, Walter and Debbie

 

[Episkopos]

The biggest impediment to growth in Christ is the flesh, and people's attachment to it.

Any deeper teaching about God's way in Christ will be deeply unpopular since the Spirit wars against the flesh. We are not to side with the flesh against the Spirit. We are to have no confidence in the flesh and certainly not defend the flesh. Light exposes darkness. And the darkness will make people avoid the light since it exposes the darkness.

Don't be deceived and make a separate peace with the flesh. The Spirit wars against the flesh...and the flesh against the Spirit. Too many seek to avoid the cross by honouring resistance to it, and by so doing stand against the truth.

 

[Lizbeth]

Remember that God said "I swore in My wrath that they will not enter My rest." A superficial acknowledgment can be an obstacle to any deeper faith.

The experience of going from death to life, from darkness to light, from being separated from God (and therefore unable to perceive Him) to being reconciled to Him and knowing Him heart to heart, having Him revealed to your spirit, and going from no faith to genuine faith is hardly a superficial thing. That seems to negate or diminish the earth-shattering, life-changing work of God in saving a soul, and Christ's great sacrifice to do so....an unspeakable gift!. Unless you are talking about those who have a head faith only...? (mere mental belief as opposed to the miraculous faith that is not of our own)...could you please clarify?

I wonder also what do you make of where it says "we who believe HAVE entered His rest"...?

In my observation it isn't faith in the foundational truths pertaining to the gospel that is an obstacle to holiness....don't we need that foundation..? But isn't it more such things as first of all a lack of receiving the Holy Spirit after believing, along with a lack of teaching and awareness of the need to follow/obey Christ......that we need to keep growing and "go on to perfection". In other words it is an impediment to just continue camping out forever in the initial experience and first principles instead of following Christ and thereby growing (moving on with Him in following the cloud and pillar of fire). I think Hebrews 6 warns us of the danger of not doing that....one is more likely to fall away if they don't grow.

 

[bdavidc]

This episode seeks to clear the rubble and redirect the paths that have gone astray, as well hold out the standard we need to raise up as we call on the name of the Lord for His life and salvation.

The foundational error of this entire post is the dichotomy between “facts” and “truth.” Scripture never presents truth in that manner. God’s truth reveals what is true about Christ. Doctrine is essential. Doctrine is not the frivolous pursuit of church historians. “Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee” ~1 Timothy 4:16.

To assert that someone can deny that Jesus is the Son of God or refute essential truths about Him and still “walk in truth together” is absurdly anti-scriptural. “Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father” ~1 John 2:23. Truth is not some mystical plane higher than revealed doctrine. Truth has been revealed in Christ, and it has been codified in Scripture. “Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth” ~John 17:17.

The continued vitriol aimed at creeds, doctrine, and the gathered church disregards direct scripture. Believers are commanded not to stop assembling with other believers. “Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is” ~Hebrews 10:25. We are not one in some nebulous spirituality. We are one in our devotion to the teaching of the apostles. “They continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship” ~Acts 2:42.

This post’s opposition to progressive growth in holiness is also unbiblical. While believers are holy in Christ through Scripture, Scripture also commands believers to walk in holiness. “Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord” ~Hebrews 12:14. “Grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ” ~2 Peter 3:18. This growth is not self-improvement gimmicks; it is commanded, it is real, and it is progressive.

Last of all, the implication that our salvation has anything to do with believing some inner “reality” as opposed to the objectively revealed truth is perilous. Jesus didn’t say, “You shall feel the truth.” He said, “If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free” ~John 8:31-32.

Scripture never commands believers to abandon doctrine, church, or clarity to “walk in the Spirit.” We are commanded to abide in Christ by staying in His Word. Anything that downplays the authority and sufficiency of Scripture will not draw believers deeper into Christ. It will drive them away from Him and it is false teaching use to deceive people.

 

[Episkopos]

The foundational error of this entire post is the dichotomy between “facts” and “truth.” Scripture never presents truth in that manner.

The bible is not written as a news report. Facts are involved...but people confuse facts as truth. Jesus said I am the truth. Jesus is not the facts. There is no relationship to facts beyond a mental assent. Hence the superficiality of much of Christendom.

God’s truth reveals what is true about Christ.

God indeed reveals facts about Jesus...calling Him the truth. Calling Jesus the truth is a fact. But salvation into God's kingdom is about a supernatural translation into another realm...to walk where Jesus is, in His resurrection power and perfection. Only those who KNOW the truth will agree with this as fact.

Doctrine is essential. Doctrine is not the frivolous pursuit of church historians. “Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee” ~1 Timothy 4:16.

But doctrine is about resurrection life....the EXPERIENCE of it...not just believing that Jesus was raised from the dead. Believing ABOUT Jesus is not the same as believing INTO Jesus.

To assert that someone can deny that Jesus is the Son of God or refute essential truths about Him and still “walk in truth together” is absurdly anti-scriptural.

You are going too far out of balance here. I never said that someone who walks in truth denies Jesus. What I said was that people have a different understanding of the Jesus they believe in and walk in. It takes time to formulate an accurate doctrine in all regards. And it takes real prophets and teachers to inform newer believers of what would otherwise take a lifetime to know.

In the end all disciples will believe the same thing as they experience the truth together...as it is written in the bible. :Till we all come to the unity of the faith. But not everyone begins on the same page. You can't judge a race until it is finished.

“Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father” ~1 John 2:23.

A strawman.

Truth is not some mystical plane higher than revealed doctrine.

Yes it is. It is to be where Jesus is. You obviously don't have experience of these things as very very few people do in today's religious environment. The truth is only revealed to a church within the church. A remnant.

Truth has been revealed in Christ, and it has been codified in Scripture. “Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth” ~John 17:17.

By the Spirit and power from heaven...not just in word. Read Paul. You need to learn a lot more before making such comments.

The continued vitriol aimed at creeds, doctrine, and the gathered church disregards direct scripture.

What I disregard is the traditions of men. Read what Jesus says... We are to gather together into spiritual communities that meet daily...not religiously. We are to partake of the same life...a life that is from heaven...a resurrection life.

Believers are commanded not to stop assembling with other believers. “Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is” ~Hebrews 10:25. We are not one in some nebulous spirituality. We are one in our devotion to the teaching of the apostles. “They continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship” ~Acts 2:42.

We are told to come out of Babylon and to meet around the Lord.

This post’s opposition to progressive growth in holiness is also unbiblical. While believers are holy in Christ through Scripture, Scripture also commands believers to walk in holiness. “Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord” ~Hebrews 12:14. “Grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ” ~2 Peter 3:18. This growth is not self-improvement gimmicks; it is commanded, it is real, and it is progressive.

You are not seeing the difference between holiness and maturity of character. Maturity is progressive. Holiness is a gift by grace through faith. It is instantaneous. Not by human effort. Read Paul and Peter.

Last of all, the implication that our salvation has anything to do with believing some inner “reality” as opposed to the objectively revealed truth is perilous. Jesus didn’t say, “You shall feel the truth.” He said, “If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free” ~John 8:31-32.

You don't understand the power of God that translates a spirit into the kingdom realm. Having a form of godliness but denying the power thereof..

Scripture never commands believers to abandon doctrine, church, or clarity to “walk in the Spirit.” We are commanded to abide in Christ by staying in His Word. Anything that downplays the authority and sufficiency of Scripture will not draw believers deeper into Christ. It will drive them away from Him and it is false teaching use to deceive people.

The letter kills...the Spirit gives life. The bible testifies of the Spirit of God that acts in the life of the one who has believed INTO Christ. You are an example of this very thing. ...the letter kills... about a human reading of the bible while trying to interpret something that is fully beyond a human grasp. And to the extent where there is a way that seems right but ends in death.

 

[Episkopos]

The experience of going from death to life, from darkness to light, from being separated from God (and therefore unable to perceive Him) to being reconciled to Him and knowing Him heart to heart, having Him revealed to your spirit, and going from no faith to genuine faith is hardly a superficial thing. That seems to negate or diminish the earth-shattering, life-changing work of God in saving a soul, and Christ's great sacrifice to do so....an unspeakable gift!. Unless you are talking about those who have a head faith only...? (mere mental belief as opposed to the miraculous faith that is not of our own)...could you please clarify?

I wonder also what do you make of where it says "we who believe HAVE entered His rest"...?

In my observation it isn't faith in the foundational truths pertaining to the gospel that is an obstacle to holiness....don't we need that foundation..?

While facts are good....they can make someone think they have grasped more than they actually have. Facts don't set people free. The power of God (grace) does that...and only the truth has that power...the power IS of the truth. It is what we experience OF the truth...that we are transported to walk in His resurrection life.

But isn't it more such things as first of all a lack of receiving the Holy Spirit after believing, along with a lack of teaching and awareness of the need to follow/obey Christ......that we need to keep growing and "go on to perfection". In other words it is an impediment to just continue camping out forever in the initial experience and first principles instead of following Christ and thereby growing (moving on with Him in following the cloud and pillar of fire). I think Hebrews 6 warns us of the danger of not doing that....one is more likely to fall away if they don't grow.

One has already fallen away by trying to improve oneself into perfection. Holiness is a gift of grace by faith. Anything else is a lie.

 

[Lizbeth]

While facts are good....they can make someone think they have grasped more than they actually have. Facts don't set people free. The power of God (grace) does that...and only the truth has that power...the power IS of the truth. It is what we experience OF the truth...that we are transported to walk in His resurrection life.

One has already fallen away by trying to improve oneself into perfection. Holiness is a gift of grace by faith. Anything else is a lie.

Ah well, we do see things differently still. The truth is that those who have received genuine faith that is of God and from Him (not of our own) HAVE been made holy and HAVE entered His rest. That is Truth. Yes, a gift. "Facts" have to do with whether or how much we are apprehending and walking in that Truth....walking in the Spirit, as opposed to waking after the flesh.

 

[Episkopos]

Ah well, we do see things differently still. The truth is that those who have received genuine faith that is of God and from Him (not of our own) HAVE been made holy and HAVE entered His rest. That is Truth. Yes, a gift. "Facts" have to do with whether or how much we are apprehending and walking in that Truth....walking in the Spirit, as opposed to waking after the flesh.

That comes from the doctrines of men...to name and claim "positionally" what no one actually experiences or that God notices. Jesus said that many claim Him as Lord but Jesus says "I never knew you:...and that should strike fear in the hearts of shallow religionists. But a shallow religionist is happy with the idea that the bible is full of hyperbole and figurative language. No need to humble oneself or fear God. No, what replaces wisdom in these is hubris and religious certainty that buries any potential of actually knowing the Lord. Are people listening to God or men.....the Spirit or their own hearts?

 

[Lizbeth]

That comes from the doctrines of men...to name and claim "positionally" what no one actually experiences or that God notices. Jesus said that many claim Him as Lord but Jesus says "I never knew you:...and that should strike fear in the hearts of shallow religionists. But a shallow religionist is happy with the idea that the bible is full of hyperbole and figurative language. No need to humble oneself or fear God. No, what replaces wisdom in these is hubris and religious certainty that buries any potential of actually knowing the Lord. Are people listening to God or men.....the Spirit or their own hearts?

The scripture says "we who believe HAVE entered His rest." And that our "new man HAS been created in righteousness and true holiness".....which is why we are admonished to "put on the new man". We can't put on or walk in what we haven't received. It's not figurative or hyperbole, it is simply TRUTH. God is graciously "calling those things which be not as though they are"....and what He says is TRUTH and is no lie....when He calls a thing something, it simply IS what He calls it, because HE is the measure of Truth, not we. and what we see with our natural eyes. It is like when He created the earth by the word of His mouth, not out of what was SEEN......that is a picture of how He creates the new man. And our old man HAS been crucified with Christ because God SAYS so and because Jesus bore our old man and its sins on the cross, by proxy because God SAID so, not because it was a concrete literal thing. Abraham believed God, that He was able to perform what He had SAID. it is by FAITH that we believe what God says in His word, not by sight.

But I'm well aware and acknowledge that there is a distinction between what one has received and what one may be walking in. That is why scripture is always teaching, instructing, admonishing and exhorting believers to make it our goal to live up to and walk in what we have ALREADY RECEIVED. We need to turn our "knowledge" into reality where the rubber hits the road. All this is why, conversely, unbelievers have not entered His rest and do not have a new man to put on...their old man has not been crucified with Christ.

I'd like you to address all those scriptures and more, but I'm guessing that as usual, you will just keep sticking to your script and avoid addressing them. And I will as usual have to keep assuming that it is because you can't.

 

[amigo de christo]

The foundational error of this entire post is the dichotomy between “facts” and “truth.” Scripture never presents truth in that manner. God’s truth reveals what is true about Christ. Doctrine is essential. Doctrine is not the frivolous pursuit of church historians. “Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee” ~1 Timothy 4:16.

To assert that someone can deny that Jesus is the Son of God or refute essential truths about Him and still “walk in truth together” is absurdly anti-scriptural. “Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father” ~1 John 2:23. Truth is not some mystical plane higher than revealed doctrine. Truth has been revealed in Christ, and it has been codified in Scripture. “Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth” ~John 17:17.

The continued vitriol aimed at creeds, doctrine, and the gathered church disregards direct scripture. Believers are commanded not to stop assembling with other believers. “Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is” ~Hebrews 10:25. We are not one in some nebulous spirituality. We are one in our devotion to the teaching of the apostles. “They continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship” ~Acts 2:42.

This post’s opposition to progressive growth in holiness is also unbiblical. While believers are holy in Christ through Scripture, Scripture also commands believers to walk in holiness. “Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord” ~Hebrews 12:14. “Grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ” ~2 Peter 3:18. This growth is not self-improvement gimmicks; it is commanded, it is real, and it is progressive.

Last of all, the implication that our salvation has anything to do with believing some inner “reality” as opposed to the objectively revealed truth is perilous. Jesus didn’t say, “You shall feel the truth.” He said, “If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free” ~John 8:31-32.

Scripture never commands believers to abandon doctrine, church, or clarity to “walk in the Spirit.” We are commanded to abide in Christ by staying in His Word. Anything that downplays the authority and sufficiency of Scripture will not draw believers deeper into Christ. It will drive them away from Him and it is false teaching use to deceive people.

and many are gonna pay a deep and heavy price for having made void the very fact that one MUST beleive on CHRIST .
in fact , as you reminded us , that cometh NOT of GOD but of that which is of anti c hrist . Many have no idea
what spell their inclusivism had led them too . JESUS is being DENIED , the one true gospel IS being denied .
And that cometh NOT OF GOD but of the sepernt who always desired the death of humanity
and tis why he even had eve to eat of the tree in the f irst place . And its why HE desires for man NOT to BLEIEVE
one has TO BELIEVE JESUS is the CHRIST , the SON of GOD . Oh the devil do lie . and he sure can say
GOD is love but he gonna twist this and by his version of love will lead them all into the greatest hour of rebellion
Against the very GOD and HIS CHRIST and his saints . And right to the day of their own perdition as well .

 

[Episkopos]

The scripture says "we who believe HAVE entered His rest."

You are holding the statement from the wrong end. If you had faith the size of a mustard seed you would move mountains. So will you claim to move mountains too? All because you figure you have the same kind of faith as provides the eternal rest of God?

The truth sets us free...from sin...fully. Truth comes with the power of the eternal reality of life in the Spirit...resurrection life. You are conflating beliefs with faith. Just as people confuse facts with truth.

There is no truth in this world. One must leave this world to be where Jesus is to experience the truth.

The carnal mind must lower the standard to everyday reality...in order to avoid the POWER of the gospel.

And that our "new man HAS been created in righteousness and true holiness".....which is why we are admonished to "put on the new man". We can't put on or walk in what we haven't received.

Human logic...that has a bad reasoning. What you SHOULD think is...since I am not walking in holiness and the power of the life to come...then I must NOT have entered into God's rest yet. I must not have put on the new man yet. And from there apply humility and the fear of the Lord...and wait at His gate.

It's not figurative or hyperbole, it is simply TRUTH. God is graciously "calling those things which be not as though they are"....and what He says is TRUTH and is no lie....when He calls a thing something, it simply IS what He calls it, because HE is the measure of Truth, not we.

Clever...but God doesn't lie, so your reasoning is carnal.

and what we see with our natural eyes. It is like when He created the earth by the word of His mouth, not out of what was SEEN......that is a picture of how He creates the new man. And our old man HAS been crucified with Christ because God SAYS so and because Jesus bore our old man and its sins on the cross, by proxy because God SAID so, not because it was a concrete literal thing. Abraham believed God, that He was able to perform what He had SAID. it is by FAITH that we believe what God says in His word, not by sight.

But I'm well aware and acknowledge that there is a distinction between what one has received and what one may be walking in. That is why scripture is always teaching, instructing, admonishing and exhorting believers to make it our goal to live up to and walk in what we have ALREADY RECEIVED. We need to turn our "knowledge" into reality where the rubber hits the road.

You can't. Holiness is NOT attained by human effort. It is the foolish doctrine that men can enter into holiness progressively that has beguiled those who don't know or want to...seek the Lord.

All this is why, conversely, unbelievers have not entered His rest and do not have a new man to put on...their old man has not been crucified with Christ.

I'd like you to address all those scriptures and more, but I'm guessing that as usual, you will just keep sticking to your script and avoid addressing them. And I will as usual have to keep assuming that it is because you can't.

You have a far too shallow appreciation of the gospel...lowering the standard instead of raising it up. Very typical of the times.

What all human reasoning does is miss the scale of God's power. You are trying to put an aircraft carrier into a car garage.

 

[Episkopos]

and many are gonna pay a deep and heavy price for having made void the very fact that one MUST beleive on CHRIST .
in fact , as you reminded us , that cometh NOT of GOD but of that which is of anti c hrist . Many have no idea
what spell their inclusivism had led them too . JESUS is being DENIED , the one true gospel IS being denied .
And that cometh NOT OF GOD but of the sepernt who always desired the death of humanity
and tis why he even had eve to eat of the tree in the f irst place . And its why HE desires for man NOT to BLEIEVE
one has TO BELIEVE JESUS is the CHRIST , the SON of GOD . Oh the devil do lie . and he sure can say
GOD is love but he gonna twist this and by his version of love will lead them all into the greatest hour of rebellion
Against the very GOD and HIS CHRIST and his saints . And right to the day of their own perdition as well .

A strawman and utterly self-aggrandizing. You are arguing that a puddle is wetter than a lake. As usual your content is laughable and with evil intent. Such shallowness can only come from a deceiver.

The devil believes Jesus is the Christ too..the demons called out to Him. Your spirit is wrong...you are trying to destroy the depth of the truth in favour of a religious mental assent. Who would do that? I tell you that the devil has infiltrated the churches to such an extent, it is a wonder that we find anyone that can tolerate sound doctrine anymore.

 

[Episkopos]

I preach and teach the truth, and I get cat-callers who respond with theories and platitudes. I write, not for the doubters...but for a potential truth-seeker that is ready to humble himself/herself, and be ready to fear the Lord. But wisdom is in very short supply these days. Religious hubris rejoices in the superficialities that make it seem that God has made peace with the carnal flesh. A rude awakening awaits.

 

[Episkopos]

Don't be fooled by the foolish purveyors of fiction. These would say...I still sin although I have already been delivered from sin. These same thinkers would say that they have raised the dead but that the dead have not yet realized it yet. A fictional belief system.

When someone claims something to be true that isn't true...we call that person a liar. A fictionalist thinks they can lie because they claim to be like God who calls things into existence that weren't there before. But God is an actual Creator. A liar is NOT like God. These create LIES. They don't change eternal reality...or even temporal reality. All they do is deny reality. Much of what these superficial thinkers and dreamers teach as doctrines has to do with making believe....the realm of make believe. Or as the bible calls it...turned aside unto fables.

Will these dreamers awaken from their sleep?

 

[bdavidc]

The bible is not written as a news report. Facts are involved...but people confuse facts as truth. Jesus said I am the truth. Jesus is not the facts. There is no relationship to facts beyond a mental assent. Hence the superficiality of much of Christendom.


God indeed reveals facts about Jesus...calling Him the truth. Calling Jesus the truth is a fact. But salvation into God's kingdom is about a supernatural translation into another realm...to walk where Jesus is, in His resurrection power and perfection. Only those who KNOW the truth will agree with this as fact.


But doctrine is about resurrection life....the EXPERIENCE of it...not just believing that Jesus was raised from the dead. Believing ABOUT Jesus is not the same as believing INTO Jesus.


You are going too far out of balance here. I never said that someone who walks in truth denies Jesus. What I said was that people have a different understanding of the Jesus they believe in and walk in. It takes time to formulate an accurate doctrine in all regards. And it takes real prophets and teachers to inform newer believers of what would otherwise take a lifetime to know.

In the end all disciples will believe the same thing as they experience the truth together...as it is written in the bible. :Till we all come to the unity of the faith. But not everyone begins on the same page. You can't judge a race until it is finished.


A strawman.


Yes it is. It is to be where Jesus is. You obviously don't have experience of these things as very very few people do in today's religious environment. The truth is only revealed to a church within the church. A remnant.


By the Spirit and power from heaven...not just in word. Read Paul. You need to learn a lot more before making such comments.


What I disregard is the traditions of men. Read what Jesus says... We are to gather together into spiritual communities that meet daily...not religiously. We are to partake of the same life...a life that is from heaven...a resurrection life.


We are told to come out of Babylon and to meet around the Lord.


You are not seeing the difference between holiness and maturity of character. Maturity is progressive. Holiness is a gift by grace through faith. It is instantaneous. Not by human effort. Read Paul and Peter.


You don't understand the power of God that translates a spirit into the kingdom realm. Having a form of godliness but denying the power thereof..


The letter kills...the Spirit gives life. The bible testifies of the Spirit of God that acts in the life of the one who has believed INTO Christ. You are an example of this very thing. ...the letter kills... about a human reading of the bible while trying to interpret something that is fully beyond a human grasp. And to the extent where there is a way that seems right but ends in death.

You throw around buzzwords from mysticism to dodge denying what God actually wrote. That is not deep, that is deceit. Jesus did not elevate truth above facts. He claimed to be the truth God revealed. He prayed, “Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.” ~John 17:17 If His Word is truth then facts God reveals are not optional mental ascent. They are literally how God saves, sanctifies, and protects His children.

You claim doctrine is concerned with experience. Scripture says doctrine comes from teaching that we are to believe, hold, and obey. Timothy was told to “hold fast the form of sound words” and men who turn from doctrine will shipwreck their faith. ~2 Timothy 1: 13 ~1 Timothy 1:19 Experience never produces truth. Real truth produces fruit.

You try to split believers into categories of “those who know” and those who do not. Scripture calls that pride. “Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.” ~1 Corinthians 8:1 You write of an invisible remnant who possess secret knowledge. Paul directly condemns that arrogant attitude when he talks about men being “vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind” because they believe they have access to mysteries that were never written ~Colossians 2:18.

You elevate prophets and teachers that have revelations that build upon or go beyond what Scripture cannot teach us. God said that already. “All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine…that the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.” ~2 Timothy 3: 16–17 If God’s Word thoroughly equips us for every good work your extra realm, extra biblical language of reveling, and invisible church aren’t necessary at best and counterfeit at worst.

You use the superficial meaning of “the letter kills” to throw out the Bible. Paul was attacking the use of the law as a means of justification, not the inspired Word of God. He was contrasting it with the Spirit who gives life through the gospel. ~2 Corinthians 3. Peter warned that distorting Paul’s words would destroy you ~2 Peter 3:16. You are doing this.

You say believers are made instantly holy but growing in maturity is optional. Scripture says justification and sanctification flow from our union with Christ and produce observable obedience. “Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord.” ~Hebrews 12: 14 Grace does not nullify obedience it produces obedience in us. ~Titus 2:11–12

You speak of those who don’t know Jesus as lacking experience. Scripture never commands us to test truth by our experiences. It says we are to test every spirit by the apostles doctrine. ~1 John 4:1 When someone claims superior insight, secret power, or access beyond the plain Word, the warning lights should be flashing.

This is not an issue of learning to embrace both depth and discipleship. This is realizing you have made an idol of your subjective experience over the written Word while taking verses out of context to support it. That is ancient heresy. “Hath God said?” ~Genesis 3:1

The gospel is not believing into some mystical realm that only a select few will ever tap into. The gospel is that Jesus Christ died for our sins, was buried, was raised again, and whoever believes that message will be saved. ~1 Corinthians 15: 1–4 Believers are then called to grow in that grace by abiding in the Word, not rising above it. ~Colossians 2:6–8

The Bible doesn’t point us into ourselves to find some hidden mystical knowledge. It points us to Christ.

False teachers always offer more than God gave. Hidden knowledge, secret power, deeper realms. Scripture calls that pride, not maturity.

 

[bdavidc]

I preach and teach the truth, and I get cat-callers who respond with theories and platitudes. I write, not for the doubters...but for a potential truth-seeker that is ready to humble himself/herself, and be ready to fear the Lord. But wisdom is in very short supply these days. Religious hubris rejoices in the superficialities that make it seem that God has made peace with the carnal flesh. A rude awakening awaits.

You are a false teacher. You say you speak truth, yet you regularly place yourself over God’s written Word. You speak of being “corrected” as “cat-calling”, yet James plainly says that every teacher is to be tested by Scripture, NOT how highly he thinks his message should be received ~1 John 4:1.

You talk a lot about being humble, but your message oozes spiritual elitism. James says God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble ~James 4:6. If a man teaches that he has some kind of special revelation for the few “who are searching” while calling others carnal and shallow he is NOT being humble, he’s lifting himself up.

You claim you only write for those who are “ready” to hear truth. The apostles preached the truth openly and plainly to the public. Paul said that he refused to “handle the Word of God deceitfully” by hiding behind secret and mysterious teachings ~2 Corinthians 4:2. Truth isn’t “hidden” or couched in mysticism.

You call men out for trusting in the flesh while you put experience, “inner knowledge”, and spiritual “awareness” above Scripture. Scripture already says this. “If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God” ~1 Peter 4:11. The moment Scripture is looked at as inadequate or “unkind”, you have opened the door for error.

There is no lack of wisdom because people hold fast to the Word. There is a lack of wisdom in places men claim to know more than what is already in it. “Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar” ~Proverbs 30:6.

This is spiritual arrogance posing as bold truth. Repent. Submit to Scripture and stop putting yourself above it as if you are the gatekeeper for God’s truth. He has already spoken, and His Word doesn’t need you trying to change it.