In the book of Revelation it mentions 'a little season' twice.

[Ronald D Milam]

I don't care whether you have been preaching 140 years, you are wrong. You have nothing to bring to the table. That is why you cannot address any single rebuttal.

Sure, but you guys will be in Heaven scratching your head as to why you were all wrong on everything END TIMES, and the reason is simple, stay on your lane, find your calling, prophesy is not your calling, or you would not be wrong on everything end times.

 

[ewq1938]

Right, but that’s the whole point I’m trying to make. In the Premil view, statements just like you’re making now will also be made to deceive people during Satan’s little season.

Place yourself in Satan’s little season for a moment, what would your counter argument be to someone who said “The actual second coming with the resurrection of the saved dead from all human history happens before the Mill starts, and none of that has happened. It's impossible to be in satan's little season. Just as impossible that we are living in the eternal age in Rev 21-22”?

Keep in mind that if you argue it’s impossible for someone to be deceived about a millennium that just happened then you are also arguing that Satan can’t deceive people in the same manner as is currently happening with all the different views on the millennium.

Sorry, but the dead not being resurrected and immortal and ruling here means we cannot be in satan's little season. Massive events that change humanity and the world forever simply have not happened yet.

Also consider what happened after Jesus arose in Matthew 28.

Why? That was a small event, clearly before the Resurrection at the second coming. Why consider something that is not valid evidence?

This verse directly applies to this conversation:


2Ti_2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

If the second coming happened, then the resurrection happened and it didn't happen but teaching the second coming happened means you re teaching the resurrection happened and that harms people's faith. That is a serious thing.

 

[Berean]

The question is, is the little season recorded in A) meaning the same little season recorded in B)? Because if it is, it would be absurd for any Premil to insist that this does not prove Amil in that case.

They are the same words, meaning a limited time, but they do not refer to the same thing. Rev 6:11 speaks of the death and resurrection of the Church. Rev 20:3 speaks of the time between Satan is let loose to deceive the nations.

 

[WPM]

Sure, but you guys will be in Heaven scratching your head as to why you were all wrong on everything END TIMES, and the reason is simple, stay on your lane, find your calling, prophesy is not your calling, or you would not be wrong on everything end times.

You are full of pride and ignorance.

 

[WPM]

.. and the other guy has 40 years experience teaching the Word of God. But you have learned nothing in 25 years. Nothing to brag about. At least the guy whose been a preacher for 40 years has learned something. Your modus operandi is avoidance to a far greater extent than anyone else's. Your mind is closed until further notice. In other words, until the millennium begins Till then your mind is closed to any truthful interpretation of scripture regarding the Kingdom of God and of His Christ. As though claiming there is no objectivity with anyone else means you do not lack the objectivity you claim they lack. (I can just shake my head).

This reinforces my last post.

 

[Zao is life]

In the 5th Trumpet of Revelation 9, the “falling star” symbolizes the unfaithful church — the fallen messenger — who opens the bottomless pit because of her rebellion. This ties directly to God's warning in Revelation 2, where He says that if the Church does not remember from where she has fallen, judgment will come.

By opening this “bottomless pit,” the fallen church unleashes spiritual chaos — a symbolic Pandora’s box. The “smoke” that rises from the pit represents false doctrine, which darkens the “sun” (symbolizing Christ) and the “air” (the Holy Spirit). This false teaching clouds spiritual truth and leads to widespread deception. Righteousness becomes unrighteousness. The one ruling this pit is Satan himself, not in angelic form, but as a spirit. He is Apollyon (Greek) or Abaddon (Hebrew), both meaning destruction. He doesn't send Apollyon — he "is" Apollyon and Abaddon. He is the king over this demonic host and brings spiritual death to the unsealed, unfaithful within the congregation as he is going to force them to receive his mark - the mark of the beast.

Most of what you say in this post I don't agree with, but I partially agree with the above part, because the metaphor in scripture is always constant:

THE SUN

The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork. Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge. There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard. Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun, Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race. His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof. (Psalms 19:1-6)

For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name shall be great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense shall be offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name shall be great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts. (Malachi 1:11)

The mighty God, even YHWH, hath spoken, and called the earth from the rising of the sun unto the going down thereof. Out of Zion, the perfection of beauty, God hath shined. (Psalms 50:1-2)

But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall. (Malachi 4:2)

THE SUN AND THE MOON

Psalms 89:3-4 & 35-37
I have made a covenant with my chosen, I have sworn unto David my servant, Thy seed will I establish for ever, and build up thy throne to all generations. Selah. Once have I sworn by my holiness that I will not lie unto David. His seed shall endure for ever, and his throne as the sun before me. It shall be established for ever as the moon, and as a faithful witness in heaven. Selah.

Isaiah 30:26 (Metaphor and Hyperbole):
Moreover the light of the moon shall be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun shall be sevenfold, as the light of seven days, in the day that the LORD bindeth up the breach of his people, and healeth the stroke of their wound.

THE STARS

And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be. And he believed in YHWH; and he counted it to him for righteousness. (Genesis 15:5-6)

That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies; And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice. (Genesis 22:17-18).

And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me. And he told it to his father, and to his brethren: and his father rebuked him, and said unto him, What is this dream that thou hast dreamed? Shall I and thy mother and thy brethren indeed come to bow down ourselves to thee to the earth? (Genesis 37:9-10)

And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars. (Revelation of John 12:1)

Zebulun and Naphtali were a people that jeoparded their lives unto the death in the high places of the field. The kings came and fought, then fought the kings of Canaan in Taanach by the waters of Megiddo; they took no gain of money. They fought from heaven; the stars in their courses fought against Sisera. (Judges 5:18-20)

And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. (Daniel 12:3)

TRIBULATION COMING UPON THE SAINTS

Daniel 8:9-10
"And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land. And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them."

It's talking about Antiochus IV Epiphanes' and his war against the saints, i.e the Jews of his time, and the apostasy ("falling from the heavens") of many Jews which took place at the time: Antiochus IV Epiphanes placing an abomination of desolation in the holy place is the chief biblical type of the man of sin of 2 Thessalonians Chapter 2.

Revelation 6:13-14
And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casts her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled. And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. (Revelation 6:11-13)

Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it. For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine. (Isaiah 13:9-10)

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: (Matthew 24:29)

THE AIR

The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. John 3:8

So likewise ye, except ye utter by the tongue words easy to be understood, how shall it be known what is spoken? for ye shall speak into the air. (1 Corinthians 14:9)

Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: (Ephesians 2:2)

And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. (Revelation 9:2)

And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon. (Revelation 9:11)

 

[Zao is life]

Sure, but you guys will be in Heaven scratching your head as to why you were all wrong on everything END TIMES, and the reason is simple, stay on your lane, find your calling, prophesy is not your calling, or you would not be wrong on everything end times.

Says another person who's not right about everything end times.

If someone thinks prophecy (prophecy, not prophesy) is his calling then he may not even find himself scratching his head in heaven. We all have only one calling, and it's not prophecy, but when it comes to biblical prophecy, for much of the interpretations the preacher has of various prophetic portions of scripture there is another preacher with as much experience with a different - and possibly correct - interpretation, i.e one that disagrees with yours.

No one needs to be a preacher to discover that great tribulation is not called "the" great tribulation (o megas thlipsis) in any one of the only three times Jesus mentioned megas thlipsis - it's never preceded by the definite article - and each time it was Jesus Himself speaking about great tribulation, i.e Jesus Himself talking about a coming megas thlipsis - not the preacher who interprets (and in your case misinterprets) His words.

You want to be sure you know what message HE is giving HIS SAINTS (NOT YOUR SAINTS) before you continue to preach prophecy.

Once you have searched for how many times the word thlipsis in the New Testament is talking about a tribulation that is the experience of apostles or of Christians and compared it with how many times it isn't, then you can ask yourself why each one of the only three times it's adjective is megas, it was Jesus talking about a coming great tribulation.

I'll help the preacher who in 40 years has probably never done an exercise he should have done before he started preaching and regarding himself as "called" to teach prophecy:

Persecution of Jesus: John 5:16

Persecution of Christians: Matthew 5:10-12; John 15:20; Acts 22:4; Acts 26:11; 1 Corinthians 4:12; 1 Corinthians 15:9; 2 Corinthians 4:9; Galatians 1:13 & 23; Galatians 4:29; Galatians 5:11.

Persecution of "the woman" who gave birth to the Messiah: Revelation 12:13.

Tribulation: There are only two verses in the New Testament referring to tribulation experienced by non-Christians:-

1. Of all who do evil: Romans 2:9.
2. Of the world as repayment for bringing tribulation upon the saints: 2 Thessalonians 1:6.

TRIBULATION OF APOSTLES OR CHRISTIANS:-

Matthew 13:21 (Parallel: Mark 4:17); Matthew 24:9 & 29 (Parallel Mark 13:24); John 16:33; Acts 11:19; Acts 14:22; Acts 20:23; Romans 5:3; Romans 8:35; Romans 12:12; 2 Corinthians 1:4, 6 & 8; 2 Corinthians 2:4; 2 Corinthians 4:8; 2 Corinthians 4:17; 2 Corinthians 6:4; 2 Corinthians 7:4-5; 2 Corinthians 8:2; Ephesians 3:13; Philippians 1:16; Philippians 4:14; Colossians 1:24; 1 Thessalonians 1:6; 1 Thessalonians 3:3-4 & 7; 2 Thessalonians 1:4, 6-7; 2 Timothy 1:8; 2 Timothy 3:11; 2 Timothy 4:5; Hebrews 10:32-33; 1 Peter 5:9; Revelation 1:9; Revelation 2:9-10, 22; Revelation 7:14.

GREAT TRIBULATION
[Greek: mégas thlîpsis]​

Mentioned only three times in the New Testament (each time Jesus spoke of it):-

Third mention: "After these things I looked, and lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, out of all nations and kindreds and people and tongues, stood before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palms in their hands. And they cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God sitting on the throne, and to the Lamb.

And one of the elders answered, saying to me, Who are these who are arrayed in white robes, and from where do they come? And I said to him, Sir, you know. And he said to me, These are the ones who came out of great tribulation [mégas thlîpsis] and have washed their robes, and have whitened them in the blood of the Lamb.

Therefore they are before the throne of God, and they serve Him day and night in His temple. And He sitting on the throne will dwell among them. They will not hunger any more, nor thirst any more, nor will the sun light on them, nor any heat. For the Lamb who is in the midst of the throne will feed them and will lead them to the fountains of living waters. And God will wipe away all tears from their eyes." -- Revelation 7:9-10, 13-15.

First mention: "For then shall be great tribulation [megas thlipsis], such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened." -- Matthew 24:21-22

Second mention: "Behold, I will cast her (Jezebel) into a bed, and them (those Christians) that commit adultery with her into mégas thlîpsis (great tribulation), except they repent of their deeds." -- Revelation 2:21

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* Luke 21:23 uses the word wrath [orgḗ] to describe what was to come upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem (not the word tribulation):

"But woe to those who are with child, and to those suckling in those days! For there shall be great distress [anánkē] in the land and wrath [orgḗ] on this people."

* The Revelation uses the words orge and thumos (wrath) to describe what is to come upon the nations at the hand of an angry God (not the word tribulation).

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