IS THERE A DIFFERENCE IN BELIEVING GENTILES?

[CoreIssue]

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

You said......But no one inherits eternal life.....Scripture says...And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life. Matthew 19:29

You said......Peter also did not have a Gospel that was different from that of Paul....Scripture says.....But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter; Galatians 2:7

Good! Very good!

 

[Doug]

Doug,

Since no one inherits eternal life, you should have dug into this a little deeper. So the meaning is clarified in Thayer's Greek Lexicon, which is "to partake of eternal salvation":

Thayer's Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 2816: κληρονομέω (kléronomeó)
2. universally, "to receive the portion assigned to one, receive an allotted portion, receive as one's own or as a possession; to become partaker of, to obtain" (cf. English inherit) (as φημην, Polybius 18, 38 (55), 8; τήνἐπ' εὐσέβεια δόξαν, 15, 22, 3); in Biblical Greek everywhere with the accusative of the thing; so very frequent in the O. T. in the phrase κληρονομουν γῆνand τήν γῆν, of the occupation of the land of Canaan by the Israelites, as Leviticus 20:24; Deuteronomy 4:22, 26;Deuteronomy 6:1, etc. But as the Israelites after taking possession of the land were harassed almost perpetually by their hostile neighbors, and even driven out of the country for a considerable period, it came to pass that the phrase was transferred to denote the tranquil and stable possession of the holy land crowned with all divine blessings, an experience which pious Israelites were to expect under the Messiah: Psalm 24:13 (); Psalm 36:9, 11, 22, 29, 34 () Alex.; Isaiah 60:21; Tobit 4:12; ἐκ δευτέρας κληρονομήσουσι τήν γῆν,Isaiah 61:7; hence, it became a formula denoting to partake of eternal salvation in the Messiah's kingdom: Matthew 5:5 (4) (from Psalm 36:11 ()), where see Bleek. ζωήν αἰώνιον, Matthew 19:29; Mark 10:17;Luke 10:25; Luke 18:18;...

Here all you had to do was study the book of Acts. All that means is that Paul was appointed to be the apostle to the Gentiles, whereas Peter was appointed to be the apostle to the Jews.

That did not mean two DIFFERENT Gospels but the same Gospel going to two different groups of people. God already knew that Peter would not be very comfortable ministering to Gentiles, whereas Paul was totally suited to that ministry.

Hello

I decided to alter my reply after some thought

I quoted Matthew 19:29 because it says inherit everlasting life

I wrote this off the cuff to answer a question posed to me and this phrase was in my head....I normally do not use that phrase because Paul never did, but I looked into and found that inherit also was translated as heir in Galatians 4:30

By the use of heirs in Titus 3:7 saying inherit eternal life could be used by virtue of us being joint-heirs in Christ. The Jew could well use this phrase as well.

Titus 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

In regard to Galatians 2:7 .......Yes you are right Paul was appointed Apostle to Gentiles as was Peter to the Jews (Galatians 2:8), however to say the same gospel was going to two different groups is not conveyed by the text.

Galatians 2:7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;

This clearly does not say they have the same gospel if it did it would read something like........
when they saw the gospel of xyz was committed to me and Peter......and it does not....the gospel of the uncircumcision is not the same as the gospel of the circumcision....it is conveying two distinct gospels being committed to two different individuals

 

[Davy]

Doug, you well know that Paul said in Galatians 3 that there is neither Jew nor Gentile ("Greek"), but all in Christ are ONE Body, and children of Abraham, and thus heirs per God's Promise by Faith to Abraham.

Gal 3:28-29
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
KJV

You are on men's doctrines of a Pre-trib Rapture, and man's theory of Hyper-Dispensationalism. John Nelson Darby started his Dispensationalist theory to support the pre-trib rapture idea, and it included the theory of a separation between the nation of Israel and Christ's Church after Jesus' 2nd coming.

But Hyper-Dispensationalism was started later by men who began preaching there also was TWO different Gospels to fit Darby's Dispensationalism ideas, one for Israel, and another for Gentiles. That was your basis in your original post.

Both the pre-trib rapture theory and Dispensationalism are false. There is only ONE Gospel of Jesus Christ, and it is for BOTH believing Israel, and believing Gentiles, as ONE BODY in Christ Jesus! What you are preaching is a separation of Christ's Church that is NOT written of anywhere in God's Word. Your idea only happened because of a previous false doctrine that John Darby created in the 1830's in Great Britain.

 

[Doug]

Doug, you well know that Paul said in Galatians 3 that there is neither Jew nor Gentile ("Greek"), but all in Christ are ONE Body, and children of Abraham, and thus heirs per God's Promise by Faith to Abraham.

Gal 3:28-29
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
KJV

You are on men's doctrines of a Pre-trib Rapture, and man's theory of Hyper-Dispensationalism. John Nelson Darby started his Dispensationalist theory to support the pre-trib rapture idea, and it included the theory of a separation between the nation of Israel and Christ's Church after Jesus' 2nd coming.

But Hyper-Dispensationalism was started later by men who began preaching there also was TWO different Gospels to fit Darby's Dispensationalism ideas, one for Israel, and another for Gentiles. That was your basis in your original post.

Both the pre-trib rapture theory and Dispensationalism are false. There is only ONE Gospel of Jesus Christ, and it is for BOTH believing Israel, and believing Gentiles, as ONE BODY in Christ Jesus! What you are preaching is a separation of Christ's Church that is NOT written of anywhere in God's Word. Your idea only happened because of a previous false doctrine that John Darby created in the 1830's in Great Britain.

Hi Davy
There being neither Jew or Greek in Galatians 3:28 is in the body of Christ and was only revealed to Paul.

 

[Davy]

Hi Davy
There being neither Jew or Greek in Galatians 3:28 is in the body of Christ and was only revealed to Paul.

Dispensationalism is a doctrine from man, not from Apostle Paul. Per Acts 9, Jesus called Apostle Paul to preach The Gospel to...
1. Gentiles
2. to the children of Israel,
3. and to kings.

Maybe you ought to look that Acts 9 Scripture up and ask Jesus about it, because your thinking has strayed to men who deceive.

The Gospel of Jesus Christ is the same... Gospel Message that Peter and all the Apostles preached. And after Christ's crucifixion, Paul was not the only... Apostle who preached The Gospel to Gentiles outside the holy land!

Also, there is NO Scripture proof of a pre-trib rapture of the Church. There is no Bible evidence of the Church ruling from Heaven while Israel has a kingdom on earth.

There is only ONE Gospel of Jesus Christ, because the only other 'gospel' is a false gospel, as Paul said was "no gospel". By claiming there is more than one Gospel, is to push that other false gospel.

 

[Doug]

Dispensationalism is a doctrine from man, not from Apostle Paul. Per Acts 9, Jesus called Apostle Paul to preach The Gospel to...
1. Gentiles
2. to the children of Israel,
3. and to kings.

Maybe you ought to look that Acts 9 Scripture up and ask Jesus about it, because your thinking has strayed to men who deceive.

The Gospel of Jesus Christ is the same... Gospel Message that Peter and all the Apostles preached. And after Christ's crucifixion, Paul was not the only... Apostle who preached The Gospel to Gentiles outside the holy land!

Also, there is NO Scripture proof of a pre-trib rapture of the Church. There is no Bible evidence of the Church ruling from Heaven while Israel has a kingdom on earth.

There is only ONE Gospel of Jesus Christ, because the only other 'gospel' is a false gospel, as Paul said was "no gospel". By claiming there is more than one Gospel, is to push that other false gospel.

Hello

You said: Dispensationalism is a doctrine from man, not from Apostle Paul.

1 Corinthians 9:17 For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.

 

[Davy]

Hello

You said: Dispensationalism is a doctrine from man, not from Apostle Paul.

1 Corinthians 9:17 For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.

Why don't you bother to LOOK UP that English KJV word "dispensation" in the NT GREEK TEXTS and find out what Apostle Paul actually said?


NT:3622
oikonomia (oy-kon-om-ee'-ah); from NT:3623; administration (of a household or estate); specifically, a (religious) "economy":

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright (c) 1994, Biblesoft and International Bible Translators, Inc.)


Do you know what the word administration means?

That is the idea Apostle Paul used. He wasn't speaking of two different gospel messages. He was speaking of two different ADMINISTRATIONS of the one Gospel of Jesus Christ! An Administration of The Gospel does not... two gospels make!

 

[Doug]

Why don't you bother to LOOK UP that English KJV word "dispensation" in the NT GREEK TEXTS and find out what Apostle Paul actually said?


NT:3622
oikonomia (oy-kon-om-ee'-ah); from NT:3623; administration (of a household or estate); specifically, a (religious) "economy":

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright (c) 1994, Biblesoft and International Bible Translators, Inc.)


Do you know what the word administration means?

That is the idea Apostle Paul used. He wasn't speaking of two different gospel messages. He was speaking of two different ADMINISTRATIONS of the one Gospel of Jesus Christ! An Administration of The Gospel does not... two gospels make!

Hello

I don't know of any verse that says that Paul was made steward of the same gospel as you say. If that was the case, why would Paul need to go Jerusalem and communicate the gospel he was preaching if it was the same gospel they already knew and preached?

Galatians 2:2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.

 

[Davy]

Hello

I don't know of any verse that says that Paul was made steward of the same gospel as you say. If that was the case, why would Paul need to go Jerusalem and communicate the gospel he was preaching if it was the same gospel they already knew and preached?

Galatians 2:2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.

The Apostles did not reveal The Gospel to Paul, Jesus did. The Apostles discovered that Paul already had The Gospel (again, simply because Jesus Himself showed Paul). That doesn't give men the right to create a whole other gospel for Paul, and that is exactly what the false doctrine you're trying to push is about. It's basis began with Darby's ideas of Dispensationalism which pushes a pre-trib rapture theory, and a separation between Israel and Christ's Church after Jesus' return, ideas that are NOT written in God's Word.

 

[Doug]

The Apostles did not reveal The Gospel to Paul, Jesus did. The Apostles discovered that Paul already had The Gospel (again, simply because Jesus Himself showed Paul). That doesn't give men the right to create a whole other gospel for Paul, and that is exactly what the false doctrine you're trying to push is about. It's basis began with Darby's ideas of Dispensationalism which pushes a pre-trib rapture theory, and a separation between Israel and Christ's Church after Jesus' return, ideas that are NOT written in God's Word.

Hello

You said:The Apostles discovered that Paul already had The Gospel
What verse says that?

 

[Davy]

Hello

You said:The Apostles discovered that Paul already had The Gospel
What verse says that?

Acts 9:26-28
26 And when Saul was come to Jerusalem, he assayed to join himself to the disciples: but they were all afraid of him, and believed not that he was a disciple.

27 But Barnabas took him, and brought him to the apostles, and declared unto them how he had seen the Lord in the way, and that he had spoken to him, and how he had preached boldly at Damascus in the name of Jesus.

28 And he was with them coming in and going out at Jerusalem.
KJV

 

[Doug]

Acts 9:26-28
26 And when Saul was come to Jerusalem, he assayed to join himself to the disciples: but they were all afraid of him, and believed not that he was a disciple.

27 But Barnabas took him, and brought him to the apostles, and declared unto them how he had seen the Lord in the way, and that he had spoken to him, and how he had preached boldly at Damascus in the name of Jesus.

28 And he was with them coming in and going out at Jerusalem.
KJV

Hello

Paul preached Christ.

Paul preached Christ as the Son of God from the law and the prophets.

Paul also preached the cross to all for the salvation of all not just for the new testament (the covenant made only with Israel and Judah) as Peter.

 

[Davy]

Hello

Paul preached Christ.

Paul preached Christ as the Son of God from the law and the prophets.

Paul also preached the cross to all for the salvation of all not just for the new testament (the covenant made only with Israel and Judah) as Peter.

The New Covenant is for believing Israel and believing Gentiles, together, as ONE BODY. That is what Apostle Paul taught (Gal.3; Rom.4).