Is your pastor deceiving you, or is he just ignorant?

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Barrd

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Jul 27, 2015
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FHII said:
I may be wrong, but it sounds like you believe OSAS can't coexist with any kind of warning about being damned. Is that the case with you?

Personally, I don't associate with OSAS, but my belief is close in that I do believe in predestination. But the point that there are warnings doesn't make predestination , or OSAS, not so.
FHII.....OSAS is the belief that once a person accepts Christ, he or she cannot be damned.
OSAS cannot coexist with any kind of warning that a Christian might be damned.
Yes, the point that there are such warnings does make OSAS not so.

I don't believe in predestination, either....but that's a whole other debate. :p
 

FHII

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The Barrd said:
FHII.....OSAS is the belief that once a person accepts Christ, he or she cannot be damned.
OSAS cannot coexist with any kind of warning that a Christian might be damned.
Yes, the point that there are such warnings does make OSAS not so.

I don't believe in predestination, either....but that's a whole other debate. :p
No, thats not was the doctrine teaches. Please read more than the first paragraph of the wikipedia article.
 

Jun2u

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The Barrd said:
OSAS is the belief that once a person accepts Christ, he or she cannot be damned.
Here lies the error of your understanding of scriptures.

The Bible no where teaches that a person accepts Christ. Not only is he in violation of Romans 3 but he is also spiritually dead, that is dead in his sin. It is impossible for a dead person to do anything.

Salvation is NOT the process of accepting, believing, or confessing Christ...etc.

Scripture tells us that except a man be born again he cannot see the kingdom of God. Can a man make himself be born again? The answer is obvious.

Salvation is a free gift and eternal in character. When God saves a person He gives that person eternal life at the moment of conversion and a brand new soul that do not want to sin again, he has become a brand new creature.

OSAS is for real and well taught in Scripture!!! The proof is found in 2Co 5:8 which reads:

to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord”.

Jesus told the thief, today you will be with me in heaven.

When a born again Christian dies his soul goes to heaven and his body returns to the dust.
But a person who is not a OSAS, both his body and soul go to hell to await judgment day.

Although God knows we can't keep His laws perfectly, He gives us hope as we read Paul's exhortation in Ro 7:14-25:

14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

To God Be The Glory
 

KingJ

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Zachary said:
Sorry, there ARE many passages written to the churches (and you) that warn of ...
losing eternal life
gaining eternal death
not entering into the kingdom of God (heaven)
etc.
As there are many scriptures from Paul on OSAS. We need to take all the scripture together. When we do this you will see the first paragraph of my post #18 makes the most sense. Unless you are attempting to play God.

Extreme OSAS is just as bad as extreme Arminiasm. God knows, we don't. End of story.
 

Barrd

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Jul 27, 2015
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Jun2u said:
Here lies the error of your understanding of scriptures.

The Bible no where teaches that a person accepts Christ. Not only is he in violation of Romans 3 but he is also spiritually dead, that is dead in his sin. It is impossible for a dead person to do anything.

Salvation is NOT the process of accepting, believing, or confessing Christ...etc.

Scripture tells us that except a man be born again he cannot see the kingdom of God. Can a man make himself be born again? The answer is obvious.

Salvation is a free gift and eternal in character. When God saves a person He gives that person eternal life at the moment of conversion and a brand new soul that do not want to sin again, he has become a brand new creature.

OSAS is for real and well taught in Scripture!!! The proof is found in 2Co 5:8 which reads:

to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord”.

Jesus told the thief, today you will be with me in heaven.

When a born again Christian dies his soul goes to heaven and his body returns to the dust.
But a person who is not a OSAS, both his body and soul go to hell to await judgment day.

Although God knows we can't keep His laws perfectly, He gives us hope as we read Paul's exhortation in Ro 7:14-25:

14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

To God Be The Glory
Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Rev 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

Joh 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

Act 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1Th 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ

Act 2:21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

1Pe 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
1Pe 1:4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
1Pe 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
1Pe 1:6 Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations:
1Pe 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
1Pe 1:8 Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:

Act 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.


These are just a few of the scriptures that talk of coming to Christ for salvation. There are many, many more.
 

Zachary

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The Barrd said:
FHII.....OSAS is the belief that once a person accepts Christ, he or she cannot be damned.
OSAS cannot coexist with any kind of warning that a Christian might be damned.
Yes, the point that there are such warnings does make OSAS not so.
I don't believe in predestination, either....but that's a whole other debate. :p
IMO, all of the many dire warnings are ONLY for God's elect ...
so they will be sure to get their acts together ... unto their ultimate salvation.
They are the ONLY ones who do this ... to God's satisfaction.
God elected these ones before the foundation of the world
... because He saw everything in advance.
He saw who would co-operate with the precious Holy Spirit.