Isn't this just being vindictive?

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River Jordan

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Yes, most people know that fundamentalist Christians in the US have essentially demonized gay people. Listening to fundie preachers and talk show hosts, you'd think gays will be responsible for the collapse of western civilization and possibly even the end of the world! Ok fine....that's what fundies believe.

But this? To me, this looks like people deliberately going out of their way to harm a specific group of US citizens.

Arkansas Passes Bill Prohibiting Anti-Discrimination Protections for Gays


The House today completed legislative action on Sen. Bart Hester's bill to protect the ability to legally discriminate against gay people. It passed 58-21, with seven voting present, but didn't muster the necessary votes for adoption of the emergency clause.

The bill prohibits local governments from extending civil rights protection to classes not protected in state law. It was a response to the Fayetteville civil rights ordinance that extended protection to LGBT people, who have no protection under state civil rights law. The ordinance was repealed in a referendum. The bill is meant to prevent any other city or county from protecting gay people.

Seriously? These folks are so worked up over teh gay that they're about to make it illegal for any town to say "We don't allow gays to be discriminated against"? Isn't that just another way of saying "We want to live in a state where gays can be fired, denied housing, denied loans, etc., for no other reason than that they're gay"?

And of course, some of the bill's proponents just can't help but make this all about Christianity...


Rep. Mary Bentley seemed to confirm an interest in refusing service when she explained her support for the discrimination bill.

Bentley told lawmakers she is worried about “little businesses out there, a baker or a pastor … that hold a conviction that says gay marriage is wrong.” She added, “That is what we are talking about today.”

“We should be honest and truthful — we like to beat around the bush up here,” she said. “I am concerned about things happening across our state.”

After emphasizing that LGBT stands for “lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender,” Bentley said from the lectern, “A baker who loves the word of God … should not have his or her business destroyed if someone who is transgender is trying to marry somebody else.”

“I am a Christian in the United States of America,” she continued. “It’s time to stand up and say enough is enough. They can do what they want to do, but we don’t have to destroy a business. I think it’s time that business owners have rights as well.”

As the bill’s sponsor, Hester told BuzzFeed News earlier this week that religious business owners should be allowed to fire employees for being gay.

*sigh* <_<
 

heretoeternity

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"Gays"?....a word of the english language perverted to put a positive connotation on the perverted sexual act of sodomy...anal intercourse...God specifically forbids such conduct in the Bible in Leviticus, and destroyed the city of Sodom and it's inhabitants because of this disgusting sexual practice...the name of the perverted sex act of anal intercourse sodomy is derived from that name...
In the beginning God created Man and woman, male and female to populate the earth...that is His master plan...to go against that is to go against God and His master plan for the human race.
Now if you look at the diseases which anal intercourse (sodomy) produces, look at anal cancer, bowel cancer, colitis, IBS, Hiv, Aids, Hepatitis, loss of bowel control (necessitating the submissive one to wear adult diapers their whole lives)....there is more but this is enough for any thinking, rational person to research and learn and condemn the perverted sexual act of anal intercourse...
 

JimParker

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Mar 31, 2015
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River Jordan said:
Yes, most people know that fundamentalist Christians in the US have essentially demonized gay people. Listening to fundie preachers and talk show hosts, you'd think gays will be responsible for the collapse of western civilization and possibly even the end of the world! Ok fine....that's what fundies believe.

But this? To me, this looks like people deliberately going out of their way to harm a specific group of US citizens.

Arkansas Passes Bill Prohibiting Anti-Discrimination Protections for Gays




Seriously? These folks are so worked up over teh gay that they're about to make it illegal for any town to say "We don't allow gays to be discriminated against"? Isn't that just another way of saying "We want to live in a state where gays can be fired, denied housing, denied loans, etc., for no other reason than that they're gay"?

And of course, some of the bill's proponents just can't help but make this all about Christianity...




*sigh* <_<
<<Seriously? These folks are so worked up over teh gay that they're about to make it illegal for any town to say "We don't allow gays to be discriminated against"?>>

Did you say "seriously"? If you were serious you would have read the bill which says absolutely nothing, nada, zippo, about any town being prohibited from saying "We don't allow gays to be discriminated against". Instead you read what opinionated people said about the law. (Just what the oligarchy wants you to do in stead of evaluating the facts.)

Here it is: Please show me where it says that any town is prohibited from saying, "We don't allow gays to be discriminated against."

SENATE ENROLLED ACT No. 101
AN ACT to amend the Indiana Code concerning civil procedure.​
Be it enacted by the General Assembly of the State of Indiana:
SECTION1.IC34-13-9 IS ADDED TO THE INDIANA CODE AS A NEW CHAPTER TO READ AS FOLLOWS [EFFECTIVE JULY 1, 2015]:

Chapter 9. Religious Freedom Restoration

Sec. 1. This chapter applies to all governmental entity statutes, ordinances, resolutions, executive or administrative orders, regulations, customs, and usages, including the implementation or application thereof, regardless of whether they were enacted, adopted, or initiated before, on, or after July 1, 2015.

Sec. 2. A governmental entity statute, ordinance, resolution, executive or administrative order, regulation, custom, or usage may not be construed to be exempt from the application of this chapter unless a state statute expressly exempts the statute, ordinance, resolution, executive or administrative order, regulation, custom, or usage from the application of this chapter by citation to this chapter.

Sec. 3. (a) The following definitions apply throughout this section: (1) "Establishment Clause" refers to the part of the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States or the Constitution of the State of Indiana prohibiting laws respecting the establishment of religion. (2) "Granting", used with respect to government funding, benefits, or exemptions, does not include the denial of government funding, benefits, or exemptions. (b) This chapter may not be construed to affect, interpret, or in any way address the Establishment Clause. (c) Granting government funding, benefits, or exemptions, to the extent permissible under the Establishment Clause, does not constitute a violation of this chapter.

Sec. 4. As used in this chapter, "demonstrates" means meets the burdens of going forward with the evidence and of persuasion.

Sec. 5. As used in this chapter, "exercise of religion" includes any exercise of religion, whether or not compelled by, or central to, a system of religious belief.

Sec. 6. As used in this chapter, "governmental entity" includes the whole or any part of a branch, department, agency, instrumentality, official, or other individual or entity acting under color of law of any of the following: (1) State government. (2) A political subdivision (as defined in IC 36-1-2-13). (3) An instrumentality of a governmental entity described in subdivision (1) or (2), including a state educational institution, a body politic, a body corporate and politic, or any other similar entity established by law.

Sec. 7. As used in this chapter, "person" includes the following: (1) An individual. (2) An organization, a religious society, a church, a body of communicants, or a group organized and operated primarily for religious purposes. (3) A partnership, a limited liability company, a corporation, a company, a firm, a society, a joint-stock company, an unincorporated association, or another entity that: (A) may sue and be sued; and (B) exercises practices that are compelled or limited by a system of religious belief held by: (i) an individual; or (ii) the individuals; who have control and substantial ownership of the entity, regardless of whether the entity is organized and operated for profit or nonprofit purposes.

Sec. 8. (a) Except as provided in subsection (b), a governmental entity may not substantially burden a person's exercise of religion, even if the burden results from a rule of general applicability. (b) A governmental entity may substantially burden a person's exercise of religion only if the governmental entity demonstrates that application of the burden to the person: (1) is in furtherance of a compelling governmental interest; and (2) is the least restrictive means of furthering that compelling governmental interest.

Sec. 9. A person whose exercise of religion has been substantially burdened, or is likely to be substantially burdened, by a violation of this chapter may assert the violation or impending violation as a claim or defense in a judicial or administrative proceeding, regardless of whether the state or any other governmental entity is a party to the proceeding. If the relevant governmental entity is not a party to the proceeding, the governmental entity has an unconditional right to intervene in order to respond to the person's invocation of this chapter.

Sec. 10. (a) If a court or other tribunal in which a violation of this chapter is asserted in conformity with section 9 of this chapter determines that: (1) the person's exercise of religion has been substantially burdened, or is likely to be substantially burdened; and (2) the governmental entity imposing the burden has not demonstrated that application of the burden to the person: (A) is in furtherance of a compelling governmental interest; and (B) is the least restrictive means of furthering that compelling governmental interest; the court or other tribunal shall allow a defense against any party and shall grant appropriate relief against the governmental entity. (b) Relief against the governmental entity may include any of the following: (1) Declaratory relief or an injunction or mandate that prevents, restrains, corrects, or abates the violation of this chapter. (2) Compensatory damages. (c) In the appropriate case, the court or other tribunal also may award all or part of the costs of litigation, including reasonable attorney's fees, to a person that prevails against the governmental entity under this chapter.

Sec. 11. This chapter is not intended to, and shall not be construed or interpreted to, create a claim or private cause of action against any private employer by any applicant, employee, or former employee.


And, just in case you were unaware, the free exercise of religion is a Constitutionally guaranteed right in this country. (See first amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America.)

Forcing someone to participate in what they find contrary to their religious beliefs is NOT a right of any sort, constitutional or otherwise.
 

River Jordan

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Jim,

The OP was about a bill in Arkansas. You posted one from Indiana. Try and pay closer attention.
 

Brother James

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River Jordan said:
Yes, most people know that fundamentalist Christians in the US have essentially demonized gay people. Listening to fundie preachers and talk show hosts, you'd think gays will be responsible for the collapse of western civilization and possibly even the end of the world! Ok fine....that's what fundies believe.

But this? To me, this looks like people deliberately going out of their way to harm a specific group of US citizens.

Arkansas Passes Bill Prohibiting Anti-Discrimination Protections for Gays




Seriously? These folks are so worked up over teh gay that they're about to make it illegal for any town to say "We don't allow gays to be discriminated against"? Isn't that just another way of saying "We want to live in a state where gays can be fired, denied housing, denied loans, etc., for no other reason than that they're gay"?

And of course, some of the bill's proponents just can't help but make this all about Christianity...




*sigh* <_<
I don't know anyone who demonizes gay people. Those pushing an agenda create these strawmen so they can tear them up, but that's par for the course. Until Christians proclaim "the bible doesn't teach that homosexual behavior is a sin", the gay political activists will not be satisfied. So they ascribe horrible hateful attributes to Christians as part of the war on Christianity. That's sad.

We already have a Supreme Court case, Romer v. Evans, that struck down a similar Colorado law. So whatever Arkansas' legislature has done or tries to do, it will be subject to the constraints of that court decision. Gay people already have protection under the Equal Protection Clause of the constitution, so there is really no further need for the laws Arkansas appears to be trying to foreclose.
 

Axehead

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Will Muslim bakeries make a gay wedding cake?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgWIhYAtan4&feature=youtu.be

Please don't tell me that there isn't a concerted war against Christian businesses and churches.

The anti-christian media will not pick up a story like this. What would happen if a Christian said, "No, I won't bake your cake, go get one at Kroger"?
 

River Jordan

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Jan 30, 2014
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Brother James said:
I don't know anyone who demonizes gay people.
Well, let's change that. Go to RightWingWatch's anti-gay webpage. They compile the anti-gay rhetoric on a daily basis. Just a sample from the last few days includes such things as "Gay rights will outlaw Christianity and usher in communist-style totalitarianism", "Conservatives must fight until we die against gay marriage", "Gay marriage will lead to civil war", "Gay marriage is a scheme of Satan", "The gays want to control everything", and so on and so forth. Every single day there's new rhetoric of this type coming from Christians and Christian organizations.

Until Christians proclaim "the bible doesn't teach that homosexual behavior is a sin", the gay political activists will not be satisfied. So they ascribe horrible hateful attributes to Christians as part of the war on Christianity. That's sad.
And here you're doing it yourself. Funny that.

We already have a Supreme Court case, Romer v. Evans, that struck down a similar Colorado law. So whatever Arkansas' legislature has done or tries to do, it will be subject to the constraints of that court decision. Gay people already have protection under the Equal Protection Clause of the constitution, so there is really no further need for the laws Arkansas appears to be trying to foreclose.
These issues definitely need to work their way through the courts. The SCOTUS ruling this summer should set a pretty clear standard.

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Axehead,

So I watched the video. There are some fundamental problems in it, including (but ignoring the juvenile attempts at humor)...

1) The opening scene is of a man asking a Muslim baker for a cake with "Ben loves Steven forever" written on it. This is fundamentally different than the cases involving Christian bakers that have been in the press lately. In those cases, the gay couples didn't request anything special or different, just a standard cake the same as those sold to opposite sex couples. There's a difference between "I want to buy a standard cake from you" and "I want you to make me a special cake with specific writing on it".

2) The narrator repeats the above mistake by saying this is about gays asking for something "like a gay wedding cake". That's not what happened in any of the cases he referred to. Instead, the gay couples merely asked for the same sort of standard cake as everyone else.

3) The narrator keeps pointing out that gays are executed in some Muslim countries. I'm not sure what the point there is.

4) The narrator continues to make the mistake in #1 and 2 above.

5) Now he's actually in the Muslim bakery, and is specifically asking for a cake with a picture and writing on it. Again, that's very different than asking for a generic wedding cake.

This fundamental error (either deliberate or out of ignorance) is repeated throughout.
 

Angelina

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River Jordan said:
Yes, most people know that fundamentalist Christians in the US have essentially demonized gay people. Listening to fundie preachers and talk show hosts, you'd think gays will be responsible for the collapse of western civilization and possibly even the end of the world! Ok fine....that's what fundies believe.

But this? To me, this looks like people deliberately going out of their way to harm a specific group of US citizens.

Arkansas Passes Bill Prohibiting Anti-Discrimination Protections for Gays




Seriously? These folks are so worked up over teh gay that they're about to make it illegal for any town to say "We don't allow gays to be discriminated against"? Isn't that just another way of saying "We want to live in a state where gays can be fired, denied housing, denied loans, etc., for no other reason than that they're gay"?

And of course, some of the bill's proponents just can't help but make this all about Christianity...




*sigh* <_<
No different than other parts of the States where black people are being shot by Police for basically being black... :huh: and they don't have the privilege of hiding in any closet...
 
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Axehead

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Writer and gay activist Frank Bruni wrote that “our debate about religious freedom should include a conversation about freeing religions and religious people from prejudices that they needn’t cling to and can indeed jettison, much as they’ve jettisoned other aspects of their faith’s history, rightly bowing to the enlightenments of modernity.”

Basically, Frank Bruni and others in the gay community are trying to characterize the beliefs of Christians as "prejudices" and they are using the legal system to "free" Christians from their wrong thinking. Full article here.


It's all very interesting, isn't it?

NYT WRITER: CHRISTIANS ‘MUST BE MADE’ TO EMBRACE GAY LIFESTYLE

GAY WOMAN APOLOGIZES TO CHRISTIAN-OWNED INDIANA PIZZERIA, SENDS DONATION

Couple fined for refusing to host same-sex wedding on their farm

Catholic couple fined $13,000 for refusing to host same-sex ‘wedding’ at their farm

Bakeries can refuse bible verses but not gay weddings

Gay Activist Claims 'End of Marriage' Is Near

Should Mom-and-Pops That Forgo Gay Weddings Be Destroyed?
 

River Jordan

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Jan 30, 2014
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Angelina said:
No different than other parts of the States where black people are being shot by Police for basically being black... :huh: and they don't have the privilege of hiding in any closet...
Very true....and so sad. :(