It is not in the bible.....sola scripture

[OzSpen]

Make no mistake - we are saved BY Jesus, but we are saved THROUGH His Church.
Jesus set it up this way - not men.

Jesus is the one who gave His Church complete and supreme earthly Authority (Matt. 16:18-19, Matt. 18:15-18, Luke 10:16).
Jesus is the one who left it up to his Church to write, compile and declare the Canon of Scripture with the guidance of the Holy Spirit (John 16:12-15).
Jesus is the one who gave the leaders of His Church the power to forgive or retain sins (John 20:21-23).
The Church is the fullness of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).
The Church is the pillar and foundation of Truth (1 Tim. 3:15).
Jesus equates His very self with His Church (Acts 9:4-5).

Without His Church being guided by the Holy Spirit - we are orphans - and Jesus said He would not leave us as orphans (John 14:18).

BoL,

When you write about His Church and The Church, are you referring to the Body of Christ or do you refer to the Roman Catholic Church?

Oz

 

[amadeus]

My only agenda here is to stamp out misinformation and to expose lies.
I never called you a liar - not did I say that you were an anti-Catholic. I said that there are SOME ex-Catholics who lie about what the Church teaches in order to justify leaving the Church.

After reading your posts - I honestly believe that you were simply ignorant about what the Church taught and have no malice.
Too bad there aren't more honest Protestants like yourself on this forum.

Give God the glory for what He has given us and and what we have!

 

[BreadOfLife]

BoL,

When you write about His Church and The Church, are you referring to the Body of Christ or do you refer to the Roman Catholic Church?

Oz

Jesus only established one Church (Matt. 16:18-19, John 17:20-23). He didn't establish the tens of thousands of disjointed and perpetually-splintering Protestant sects that all teach different doctrines and all claim to have the "truth."

This doesn't mean that those who have been baptized in the Trinitarian formula are not Christians. It simply means that they are separated from the Church and in need of return.

There is no such thing as the "Roman Catholic Church" - only the "Catholic Church."
"Roman" simply refers to 1 of over 20 Rites of the Catholic Church.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I don't believe some posters lie about the CC in order to justify their leaving it.

If they had to justify it, they never would have left because it would mean they're sorry.

I also don't like calling persons a liar because they are expousing a different POV or what they believe to be correct.

As I've said before and will repeat, there is no teaching in the CC.
Most members of that church do not even know what doctrine they're supposed to believe.

Sorry - but this is either a lie or extreme ignorance.
Unless you are an involved, practicing Catholic - how would you possibly know that there is "no teaching" within the Church??

I am an involved, practicing Catholic and there is PLENTY of teaching in the Church.
The laziness of some who refuse to learn more or absorb what they've been taught cannot be blamed on the Church - but on them.

As for your statement that some people don't lie about the Church to justify leaving it - you are wrong there as well.
I have not only debated some of them - but I am related to some of them and have had MANY conversations with them.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I didn't get an alert for this. Came upon it by chance...Wonder how much else I've missed...

You've capitalized Church.
So I agree with all you've said.

I always capitalize "Church" unless I am speaking about a locale. Make no mistake, however, I am referring to the ONLY Church that Jesus established - not the tens of thousands of perpetually-splintering Protestant sects who all teach different doctrines.

I refer to the "Church" as a whole and the "churches" in a particular location.
As St. John Paul II indicated in Dominus Iesus, these tens of thousands of Protestant groups are not "churches" in the fullest sens - but ecclesial communities in need of return to the ONE Church.

 

[BreadOfLife]

A perpetual virgin can't have other brothers for Jesus.

'"Isn't this the carpenter's son? Isn't his mother's name Mary, and aren't his brothers James, Joseph, Simon and Judas?' (Matt 13:55 NIV). Here these 4 males are called 'his brothers' and the context includes 'his mother's name Mary'.

Oz

As I told bbyrd in post #688 -
Why do you cling to verses like this one that only work to prove the Catholic position??
As YOU and everybody here has already been shown - these are the children of the "other" Mary standing near the cross:

Matt. 27:56 says, "among whom were Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James and Joseph, and the mother of the sons of Zebedee".

Mark 15:40 states, "There were also women looking on from afar, among whom were Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of JAMES THE YOUNGER and of Joses, and Salome".

Finally, John 19:25 tells us, "But standing by the cross of Jesus were his mother, and his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene".

A comparison of these accounts of the crucifixion shows the mother of James and Joseph (Joses) to be Mary, the wife of Clopas (also called, Alphaeus) – not Mary, the Mother of Jesus. She is obviously a relative of the Blessed Mother. James the Younger is the one called "brother of the Lord."

 

[GodsGrace]

Sorry - but this is either a lie or extreme ignorance.
Unless you are an involved, practicing Catholic - how would you possibly know that there is "no teaching" within the Church??

I am an involved, practicing Catholic and there is PLENTY of teaching in the Church.
The laziness of some who refuse to learn more or absorb what they've been taught cannot be blamed on the Church - but on them.

As for your statement that some people don't lie about the Church to justify leaving it - you are wrong there as well.
I have not only debated some of them - but I am related to some of them and have had MANY conversations with them.

Maybe I know because I am involved?

 

[BreadOfLife]

Maybe I know because I am involved?

From our conversations, it doesn't sound like you are involved.

If you were a Catholic, then you would investigate the fact that there are COUNTLESS resources for you. As Christians, we are not supposed to just sit around and wait for the Church to teach us. WE must get involved and seek out instruction. There is an endless ocean of Bible studies, ministries, instruction and catechesis within the Church at your disposal.

Don't blame the Church if you're not taking advantage of it . . .

 

[GodsGrace]

From our conversations, it doesn't sound like you are involved.

If you were a Catholic, then you would investigate the fact that there are COUNTLESS resources for you. As Christians, we are not supposed to just sit around and wait for the Church to teach us. WE must get involved and seek out instruction. There is an endless ocean of Bible studies, ministries, instruction and catechesis within the Church at your disposal.

Don't blame the Church if you're not taking advantage of it . . .

Ok.
I'm not Catholic anymore.
I've taught in the CC.
Catechism, 8 to 12 years old.
Book of Mathew to adults.
The CCC.

I'm still involved.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Ok.
I'm not Catholic anymore.
I've taught in the CC.
Catechism, 8 to 12 years old.
Book of Mathew to adults.
The CCC.

I'm still involved.

The fact that you taught the Catechism and ran a Bible study within the Church means that your comment that there is "no teaching" in the Church is rendered null and void.

I don't know how you can say with a straight face that there is "no teaching" going on - when YOU were teaching them.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

The fact that you taught the Catechism and ran a Bible study within the Church means that your comment that there is "no teaching" in the Church is rendered null and void.

I don't know how you can say with a straight face that there is "no teaching" going on - when YOU were teaching them.

Why don't you slap her wrist with a ruler

 

[BreadOfLife]

Why don't you slap her wrist with a ruler

Why don't you give an intelligent response instead of bad one-liners?
So far, you haven't been able to refute one single thing I've presented . . .

 

[GodsGrace]

The fact that you taught the Catechism and ran a Bible study within the Church means that your comment that there is "no teaching" in the Church is rendered null and void.

I don't know how you can say with a straight face that there is "no teaching" going on - when YOU were teaching them.

You know very well that catechism is taught.
Kids forget everything. My goal was to impress the love of Jesus to them.
I found no problem in teaching them.

Mathew was done on MY initiative and my priest's ok.
The Ccc didn't work out so well ...

I repeat...
There is hardly any teaching in the CC.
I have an idea regarding the Mass but my priest friends said NO.
Frankly, I don't understand the problem, but they rule.

 

[GodsGrace]

The fact that you taught the Catechism and ran a Bible study within the Church means that your comment that there is "no teaching" in the Church is rendered null and void.

I don't know how you can say with a straight face that there is "no teaching" going on - when YOU were teaching them.

PS what I say is always with a straight face because I know of what I speak.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Why don't you give an intelligent response instead of bad one-liners?
So far, you haven't been able to refute one single thing I've presented . . .

I thought what I said was quite appropriate for the way you are talking.
You don't see yourself as others see you.
And since you have no friends, no one ever tells you .

My talk with you on this thread has never been a debate.
All you do is yell and insult, and you do it to everyone.
You're like a big bully with words that no one takes seriously.

 

[BreadOfLife]

You know very well that catechism is taught.
Kids forget everything. My goal was to impress the love of Jesus to them.
I found no problem in teaching them.

Mathew was done on MY initiative and my priest's ok.
The Ccc didn't work out so well ...

I repeat...
There is hardly any teaching in the CC.
I have an idea regarding the Mass but my priest friends said NO.
Frankly, I don't understand the problem, but they rule.

The Catechism "didn't work out so well?"
Again, by reading your posts - I have to assume that you are ignorant of what the Church teaches and HOW it teaches.

The Catechism has virtually every verse in Scripture as references. Most of the Bible is read aloud during Mass in a three-year cycle.
Most of the prayers and responses in the Mass come directly from Scripture.
There are the Sacraments including Confession, Holy Communion and Confirmation - and classes for each one.
Most parishes offer counseling groups and apologetics groups.
There is an RCIA (Rite of Christian Initiation) class in every parish across the country.
There are Bible studies in virtually every parish across the country.
There are ministries in every parish, including Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion and Adult Faith Formation.

To say that there is "hardly any" teaching in the Catholic Church is to walk around with your eyes and ears covered.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I thought what I said was quite appropriate for the way you are talking.
You don't see yourself as others see you.
And since you have no friends, no one ever tells you .

My talk with you on this thread has never been a debate.
All you do is yell and insult, and you do it to everyone.
You're like a big bully with words that no one takes seriously.

If you've been on the wrong end of my posts - it's because you've been lying and spreading falsehoods.
I've proven you wrong on every lie you've told but you have no valid response.

As I've said many times - I'm here for ONE reason: To squash lies and myths about the Catholic Church so that those who come here seeking honest answers won't be seduced by the lies.

There are FAR too many of you wallowing in complete ignorance about what the Church teaches, yet you behave like "experts" - all the while, exposing your ignorance. You make MY job easy.

You wanna have a "nice" talk?
Can the lies and leave the snarky anti-Catholic attitude at the door . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

PS what I say is always with a straight face because I know of what I speak.

Apparently not - judging by your posts.
Just out of curiosity - what is your "idea" about the Mass that your priest friends rejected?

 

[GodsGrace]

Apparently not - judging by your posts.
Just out of curiosity - what is your "idea" about the Mass that your priest friends rejected?

1. Did you ever notice where I live?
No. You're too busy yelling at everyone.
It would behoove you and your mission to calm down and be nicer to people.
Know you must get frustrated due to many misunderstandings about the CC. Otoh, some of them exist Within the church.

If you're really interested in my idea, ask again in a few days.
I have seen it done by Pacwah btw.

 

[GodsGrace]

Apparently not - judging by your posts.
Just out of curiosity - what is your "idea" about the Mass that your priest friends rejected?

You're such an insulting person.
And I just noticed that you put the word idea in quotation marks.
...so forget what I just posted above and let's end our conversation right here.