Jesus' Crucifixion and Death, and Burial, were on consecutive days

[GerhardEbersoehn]

So now, like a faithful Pharisee, you are straining at gnats!

Yes, the Scripture said no 'servile work', which means only things involving the feast were allowed, like serving the table, etc. It's still a high sabbath, with that exception, and it still does not change anything I have said. Nice attempt at trying to create a cause swatting at gnats though.

It is hundreds, in fact EVERY time any of the WCs argue for their Wednesday Crucifixion, that their ONLY PRINCIPLE OR BASIS OR MOTIVE why Jesus' Burial could not be on the great day sabbath of the passover, is this narrow-minded straining at a gnat pharisaic supposed 'law', that <NO WORK> was allowed on such 'holy' sabbaths, while, on the contrary, this passover yearly great day of sabbaths WAS PACKED WITH MOST STRENUOUS OF EFFORT to comply with, as, that Israel had to "MOVE OUT WITH ALL YOUR MIGHT", had to CARRY on their shoulders all their belongings including their unleavened dough and the bones of Joseph and MAKE FIRE on it to "burn that which remained" of the passover sacrifice which also they had to bring along, roasted with entrails; and they had to pitch tent and break down and again pitch -- all on the High Sabbath of the passover specifically!

 

[Davy]

Jesus did not rise <<after 3 days and 3 nights>>, but, "on the third day".
Jesus also did not say <<in Matthew 12:40>> nor does <<Matthew 12:40 reveal He would rise on Sunday which began at sunset right after Saturday>>.

So all only you will ever be able to do, <<is count 3 days and 3 nights backwards from Sunday sunset (per Hebrew reckoning), and it comes to Thursday at sunset when His time in the tomb began>> whatever it means.

Where is that "on the third day" written??? I cannot find it written anywhere in my Bible.

Jesus The Christ did... say the following:

Matt 12:40
40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
KJV

Might as well get used to hearing that verse, because the more you mess around trying to change it, the more you'll hear it quoted by me.

 

[Davy]

Re: <<Matt 28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre. KJV That shows the timing when Mary Magdalene came to visit Jesus' tomb, around dawn on Sunday, the first day of the week.>>

On the contrary, Matthew 28: 1 shows it was not <<the timing when Mary Magdalene came to visit Jesus' tomb>> because Matthew 28:1 shows it was "Mary Magdalene AND the other Mary". And many more indications showing you confuse Matthew 28:i and John 20:1 which different Scriptures tell of different events and different personae and different <timing>, and isn't it funny, totally different words and grammar and structure and subject and object and context ad infinitum so you're spinning through your neck!

Straining at a gnat again I see. You well understood what I said, you white-washed wall.

 

[rstrats]

Davy,
re: "Where is that 'on the third day' written???"

Young's Literal Translation 1 Corinthians 15:4:
"...and that he was buried, and that he hath risen on the third day, according to the Writings..."

 

[GodsGrace]

Re: '~What do you do with the fact that the Manna was preserved over the Sabbath, and Jesus' body was "preserved from corruption" over the Sabbath?~'


Yes, the Manna was preserved over the Sixth Day and the Sabbath, like Jesus' body, was '~preserved from corruption~' over the Sixth Day and the Sabbath.

But the manna was also eaten on the Sabbath, and in the bellies of the eaters, although it corrupted, nevertheless preserved their lives on the Sabbath, as fore-shadowed it the Resurrection of Life of the Christ, the heavenly Manna "eaten" and buried "in the flesh", only "not to see corruption", but The Resurrection of Life "in the Last Day", "on the Sabbath".


Re: '~He died and was buried before the Sabbath~'

Christ died '~before the Sabbath~', but before the sabbath-of-the-passover, though. Therefore Jesus DIED on "the Preparation OF THE PASSOVER" John 19:14, "the first day they always had to KILL the passover and REMOVE leaven on" John 13:1 Mark 14:12 Matthew 26:17 Luke 22:7 -- "the fourteenth day of the First Month".


But Jesus was not '~buried before the Sabbath~' the same day! '~He was buried before the Sabbath~' on "The Preparation WHICH IS The Fore-Sabbath .. because That Day was great-day-of-sabbath-of" THE PASSOVER its first "Feast-Day-Sabbath-of-Unleavened-Bread" EATEN -- "the fifteenth day of the First Month". Which day began with its "evening" starting after sunset, Mark 15:42 Matthew 27:57 John 19:31,38 Luke 23:50.


So Joseph "evening" after sunset after the day Jesus died on, obtained the body "in order TO bury (Him) according to the ethics, custom, LAW of the Jews to bury", viz., the passover-Scriptures in the Torah, e.g., Exodus 12:6,8 Leviticus 23:5,6.


Re: '~arose sometime after the sun went down and Sabbath became the first day of the week - probably just before dawn "as the day was dawning".~'


No, "Late ON SABBATH being in the mid-afternoon before / towards / against the First Day of the week." "THEREFORE I (the LORD) COMMAND YOU THIS DAY" -- in the Fourth Commandment.

From what you've written above, it makes me wonder if we shouldn't be "eating" the body of Christ like the Catholics believe.

Interesting point.

 

[Lady Crosstalk]

It is hundreds, in fact EVERY time any of the WCs argue for their Wednesday Crucifixion, that their ONLY PRINCIPLE OR BASIS OR MOTIVE why Jesus' Burial could not be on the great day sabbath of the passover, is this narrow-minded straining at a gnat pharisaic supposed 'law', that <NO WORK> was allowed on such 'holy' sabbaths, while, on the contrary, this passover yearly great day of sabbaths WAS PACKED WITH MOST STRENUOUS OF EFFORT to comply with, as, that Israel had to "MOVE OUT WITH ALL YOUR MIGHT", had to CARRY on their shoulders all thei belongings including their unleavened dough and the bones of Joseph and MAKE FIRE on it to :burn that which remained" of the passover sacrifice which also they had to bring along, roasted with entrails; and they had to pitch tent and break down and again pitch -- all on the High Sabbath of the passover specifically!

That is incorrect that the Pharisees put that rule into effect. ALL Sabbaths were to be marked by doing no work--that is Torah. Look at Leviticus 23:7 among other references.

 

[Phoneman777]

What you are setting off with whenever a proper answer from you is due, is not the subject of discourse now. Period!

Man o man, who is talking and keeps on talking about Sunday sacredness but you the Sabbatarian(s)! You who do not - who cannot, DISCERN that I am talking about: the sacredness, blessedness and completeness "GOD .. in these last days .. BY THE SON .. thus, concerning the Seventh Day SPAKE: And God the day The Seventh Day from ALL, HIS, WORKS, RESTED".

Yes, and if you keep reading, in Hebrews 4:9 we read, "It is therefore the duty of the people of God to keep the Sabbath" according to Lamsa's correctly rendered Pishitta version.

The passage is clear if we're resting inwardly in Jesus, we'll evidence that by resting outwardly on the Sabbath from our work.

Those who love Jesus will keep His Sabbath commandment, and conversely, those who claim to love Him but refuse to obey His commandments reveal they are not His saints.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Ohhh! lol I see you guys are still flinging scripture arrows and being rude to one another. Getting you anywhere? No it is not! You think with this process that the Grace of the Holy Spirit is anywhere in sight? Keep it up, very entertaining! There are some pretty smart guys here...still Einstein's definition of insanity applies. Doing the same thing over and over again, expecting a different result.

To the glory of God, let the Word of God be honoured, to dismay and insult and squash every creepy insect of the night.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

John gives a little bit more info on the timing. Mary came to the tomb while it was still dark, so dawn was just arriving, on the 1st day of the week, Sunday, and the tomb was found already open, meaning Jesus arose sometime after sunset Sunday to that time near dawn.

Mary Magdalene HAD HAD seen "the stone away from the tomb" already "on the First Day whilst being early of dark" = DUSK early evening of Saturday night [prohï skotias eti ousehs].

John doesn't mention one word about <the timing the tomb was found already open>, he mentions the first discovery by Mary Magdalene ONLY who "saw the stone (was) away from the grave THEN RAN" back to where Peter and John were at that time of night indoors while she had gone out of town to the tomb. It is Luke who recorded that "women" - not Mary only - <found the tomb was already open> - actually that "the women found the tomb, opened" JUST AS Mary must have TOLD them EARLIER, in fact between 6 and 5 hours earlier before they, "deepest morning" [orthou batheohs] got to also see what Mary HAD 'seen' from some distance away, already.

All this meant for an established FACT that Jesus arose BEFORE sunset Saturday and NOTHING NEAR 'after sunset Sunday sometime near dawn' maintained by Sunday worshippers for the sake of SUNDAY IDOLATRY, AND TO DO DISHONOUR TO THE SABBATH DAY OF THE LORD GOD.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Then it's a simple matter to keep to the 3 days and 3 nights, and start with Sunday sunset which ended the 3 days and 3 nights period. You did not do that! You even miss-stated what the Luke 24:1 Scripture is about! You instead defaulted to the Luke 24:21 verse about the 3rd day in order to cast DOUBT upon the timing of those above Scripture proofs I show.

You are not really interested in the Truth from Scripture on this. You are only seeking to create doubt. You cannot honestly count the 3 days and 3 nights back from Sunday sunset.

Sure, I cannot count the 3 days and 3 nights back from Sunday sunset OR I MUST BE DISHONEST to my own disgrace and undoing! You think I'm that stupid?

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

The Hebrew calendar reckoning MUST be used to determine what day our Lord Jesus was crucified on.

Everyone knows He rose on the 1st day, some time between Sunday sunset and dawn. It doesn't matter if He rose immediately after sunset, or sometime before dawn; He arose some time in that night. (Again, don't mistake a calendar day, you have to use a sunset to sunset reckoning for a 24 hr period).

Sunday, the 1st day of the week. At dawn was when Mary came to visit the tomb and found Jesus had risen.

Sunday sunset, this was the sunset prior to dawn when Mary went to visit the tomb. The daytime prior was Saturday, and it ended at sunset, and that started Sunday. This is when the 3 days and 3 nights count ended, on Sunday at sunset.

Saturday dawn to Saturday sunset = 3rd day in the tomb
Saturday sunset to Saturday dawn = 3rd night
Friday dawn to Friday sunset = 2nd day
Friday sunset to Friday dawn = 2nd night
Thursday dawn to Thursday sunset = 1st day
Thursday sunset to Thursday dawn = 1st night
Wednesday at evening = the passover sacrifice killed, the time of our Lord Jesus' death on the cross.

<<Everyone knows He rose on the 1st day, some time between Sunday sunset and dawn.>>
Yes, everyone under the same deception as you.

<<Sunday, the 1st day of the week. At dawn was when Mary came to visit the tomb and found Jesus had risen.>>
You forgot to tell everyone you wish that.

<<Sunday sunset, this was the sunset prior to dawn>>
HUH!!! what the freak'n frikkadel!

<<Sunday sunset, this was the sunset prior to dawn when Mary went to visit the tomb. The daytime prior was Saturday, and it ended at sunset, and that started Sunday. This is when the 3 days and 3 nights count ended, on Sunday at sunset.>>

HUH? Now which is your <third day> the Saturday or the Sunday?

Sorry pal. I can't stomach any more of this stuff, must go to relieve myself.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Yes, and if you keep reading, in Hebrews 4:9 we read, "It is therefore the duty of the people of God to keep the Sabbath" according to Lamsa's correctly rendered Pishitta version.

The passage is clear if we're resting inwardly in Jesus, we'll evidence that by resting outwardly on the Sabbath from our work.

Those who love Jesus will keep His Sabbath commandment, and conversely, those who claim to love Him but refuse to obey His commandments reveal they are not His saints.

To which all I can only say, AMEN. Amen on one condition : THE MOTIVE, THE GROUNDS, THE ESSENCE AND SUBSTANCE for, in the subordinate position, one's obedience however weak and incomplete; and for, in the FIRST place in rank and importance far above the true believer's best obedience, THE SABBATH'S GROUNDS, ESSENCE AND SUBSTANCE WHICH IS CHRIST RESURRECTED FROM THE DEAD. Not and no longer the Law the Fourth Commandment and Israel's rising from the Red Sea except for edification and instruction and contemplation and everything that is good UNDER CHRIST RESURRECTED "on the weekly Sabbath before the First Day of the week" Matthew 28:1.

Or the Law-motivated Seventh Day Sabbath of the best of the best of the obedient is in VAIN and in truth, to the dishonour of Christ.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Visits at the tomb “on the First Day”


1) “Mary sees the stone removed”, “while being early darkness still”, dusk. Then Peter and John go to the tomb to see what Mary has told them. (Jn20:1-10)


2) “Earliest morning- darkness”, just after midnight, “the two women” (variant – the two Marys), “and certain others with them”, for the first time, “came to the sepulchre, bringing the spices they had prepared”. (Lk24:1) “They returned from the sepulchre, and told all these things to the eleven and to all the rest.” (“Then Peter stood up and ran to the tomb; and bending low over, he saw the linen clothes. He went back, wandering by himself about that what had happened.” (Lk24:9-12) Cf. John's account in 20:1-10. Luke talks of another visit by Peter, because for one thing, he doesn't mention John.)


3) These women to make sure, a second time came to the tomb “very early before sunrise”. (Mk16:2)


4) Mary from after the others had fled in fear (Mk16:8) “had had stood after without at the grave” (Jn20:11). At the time a gardener should begin work, about sunrise, Jesus “early … first appeared to Mary”. (Mk16:9)


5) Soon after – after they a third time have visited the tomb and “the angel explained” to them what had happened during the Resurrection – Jesus appears to the other women “as they went to tell his disciples”. (Mt28:5, 9)


Mary went to the tomb, three times, Jn20:1, Lk24:1, Mk16:2, and Mk16:9 when she “had remained standing behind” until, Jn20:11, Jesus appeared to her, “first”, Mk16:9, and alone, “at the grave”, Jn20:16.

The other women also went to the tomb, three times, Lk24:1, Mk16:2, and Mt28:5 when “the angel explained” to them what had happened during the Resurrection, and Jesus, as “they went to tell his disciples”, appeared to them. (Mt28:5, 9)

The answer to the ‘Easter enigma’ (John Wenham) is simple: Each Gospel contributed to the whole with one of several sources; each added a personal part that, put together, will bring the whole story of the Resurrection into proper perspective.

Tradition – that is, the Sunday-resurrection approach – makes of these several stories of several visits, the one and simultaneous occasion of Jesus’ resurrection. Contradictions, discrepancies and total confusion are the inevitable result! It was bad enough that this ‘solution’ to a self-created ‘riddle’ was ever offered just to protect Sunday’s presumed status of being the day of the Resurrection. It became a comedy of tragic proportions when Sunday-protagonists began to defend their presumptuousness through unlawful improvements on the Scriptures.

Visits to the tomb

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

I by the grace of God answer for the Faith that in me is, that

Like their God, Christians – “True Believers” – have their exclusive day for worship—“the day The Seventh Day Sabbath OF - NONE OTHER THAN - THE LORD THEIR GOD” by reason of its exclusive reason for being unto them “The Lord’s Day”, namely, the RESURRECTION of their Lord, our, Lord and Saviour God, Christ, Jesus, Son of God, Son of Man, Keeper of God’s Sabbath Day. So help us God

 

[Davy]

<<Everyone knows He rose on the 1st day, some time between Sunday sunset and dawn.>>
Yes, everyone under the same deception as you.

<<Sunday, the 1st day of the week. At dawn was when Mary came to visit the tomb and found Jesus had risen.>>
You forgot to tell everyone you wish that.

<<Sunday sunset, this was the sunset prior to dawn>>
HUH!!! what the freak'n frikkadel!

<<Sunday sunset, this was the sunset prior to dawn when Mary went to visit the tomb. The daytime prior was Saturday, and it ended at sunset, and that started Sunday. This is when the 3 days and 3 nights count ended, on Sunday at sunset.>>

HUH? Now which is your <third day> the Saturday or the Sunday?

Sorry pal. I can't stomach any more of this stuff, must go to relief myself.

Your hanging on a third day idea, which actually isn't even written, doesn't make you look very smart. It is time for you to relieve yourself.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Davy said: ↑

Where is that "on the third day" written??? I cannot find it written anywhere in my Bible.

Jesus The Christ did... say the following:

Matt 12:40
40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
KJV

Might as well get used to hearing that verse, because the more you mess around trying to change it, the more you'll hear it quoted by me.

Click to expand...

Davy said: ↑

#135
Your hanging on a third day idea, which actually isn't even written, doesn't make you look very smart. It is time for you to relieve yourself.

Thanks for your posts. I really appreciated it as well as assessed it, and found it of less weight than the electron in a hydrogen atom. It compares though favourably with most Doctor's degrees for sale on internet nowadays.

<<Where is that "on the third day" written??? I cannot find it written anywhere in my Bible.>>
Really unanswerable, incomprehensible and frankly unbelievable to me, Boer se plaasjapie uit kees se Waterberg.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Straining at a gnat again I see. You well understood what I said, you white-washed wall.

Thanks, RStrats.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

That is incorrect that the Pharisees put that rule into effect. ALL Sabbaths were to be marked by doing no work--that is Torah. Look at Leviticus 23:7 among other references.

Leviticus 23:7 KJV has "no servile work". I wouldn't know which translation you are referring to; probably one since the 1900's?
"Servile" means 'submissive' or 'slave work'. Interestingly Young's Analytical does not have the word "servile" listed. The "works" of the holy days were works specially for God's People. Slaves were not allowed to do it for them. Hebrew 'melakah' in Exodus 12:6 e.g., in KJ is "no manner of work" but the majority of texts simply have "work". Nevertheless KJV has "servile work" for 'ceremonial sabbaths' and 'feasts' NATURALLY BECAUSE OF THE CEREMONIAL CHARACTER of such days (and years even). The KJV, NOTEWORTHY, does not use "servile work" for the weekly "Sabbath OF THE LORD", e.g., Leviticus 23:3 Exodus 20:10 where it says "thou shalt not do any work" 'servile' or not 'servile'.

So the Bible is its OWN INTERPRETER (as made clear in #112) so that the Scriptures clearly <show> that 'strenuous WORK' was not only permitted but commanded on and for 'holy days' SUCH AS implied and presupposed in John 19:31 as FAITHFUL "service to the Lord" "IN TIMES PAST" BUT NO LONGER "in these last days"!

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Yes, the Scripture said no 'servile work', which means only things involving the feast were allowed, like serving the table, etc. It's still a high sabbath, with that exception, and it still does not change anything I have said. Nice attempt at trying to create a cause swatting at gnats though.

Here you say <<Yes, the Scripture said no 'servile work', which means only things involving the feast were allowed, like serving the table, etc.>>
But here,
<<Davy said: ↑
Per John 19, they then rushed to bury Jesus' body because at sunset would begin the "high day" sabbath>>, you DENIED Exodus 12:8,10 and further demanding the 'servile work' involved in the INTERMENT - BURIAL - of the passover sacrifice as well as the "goings out" and other commanded things like the pitching of tents ON THE FIFTEENTH DAY of the First Month, THE, <high sabbath> of the entire OT.

 

[Davy]

Here you say <<Yes, the Scripture said no 'servile work', which means only things involving the feast were allowed, like serving the table, etc.>>
But here,
<<Davy said: ↑
Per John 19, they then rushed to bury Jesus' body because at sunset would begin the "high day" sabbath>>, you DENIED Exodus 12:8,10 and further demanding the 'servile work' involved in the INTERMENT - BURIAL - of the passover sacrifice as well as the "goings out" and other commanded things like the pitching of tents ON THE FIFTEENTH DAY of the First Month, THE, <high sabbath> of the entire OT.

So burying a body is like serving at table??? You definitely are more confused now, because you just cannot create a crack in what I've said, so now you're trying to make one up, thus bearing false witness. God rebuke you.