Jesus: our Rest, Truth, and Reward

[Phoneman777]

"Jesus is my rest, so I can disregard the commandment to keep holy the seventh day."

"Jesus is my Truth, so I can disregard the commandment to not lie."

Jesus is my Reward, so I can disregard the commandment to not steal."

"Consistency, thou art a jewel" said Shakespeare, so inconsistency must be anything but.

 

[shnarkle]

"Jesus is my rest, so I can disregard the commandment to keep holy the seventh day."

"Jesus is my Truth, so I can disregard the commandment to not lie."

Jesus is my Reward, so I can disregard the commandment to not steal."

"Consistency, thou art a jewel" said Shakespeare, so inconsistency must be anything but.

Jesus is the groom so I can divorce my wife.

Jesus fulfilled the law so the law is done away with. With no law, everything is permitted.

All of creation was created by and for Christ, and all who are in Christ receive the world with Christ. I can't steal what is rightfully already mine. I can't covet what is already rightfully mine.

 

[Phoneman777]

Jesus is the groom so I can divorce my wife.

Jesus fulfilled the law so the law is done away with. With no law, everything is permitted.

All of creation was created by and for Christ, and all who are in Christ receive the world with Christ. I can't steal what is rightfully already mine. I can't covet what is already rightfully mine

So, people who go to church by day and kill prostitutes by night are heaven bound, right?

 

[Phoneman777]

Jesus is the groom so I can divorce my wife.

Jesus fulfilled the law so the law is done away with. With no law, everything is permitted.

All of creation was created by and for Christ, and all who are in Christ receive the world with Christ. I can't steal what is rightfully already mine. I can't covet what is already rightfully mine.

I don't think for a second that you actually believe you are free to violate the 1st commandment and make Satan your god, and still go to heaven. There's obviously a different meaning to Paul's words about "all things are lawful".

 

[shnarkle]

So, people who go to church by day and kill prostitutes by night are heaven bound, right?

Of course. Why wouldn't they be? To condone trespassing one law is to condone trespassing all of God's law. We know that the weightier matters of the law are more important than tithing mint and cumin, but Christ himself points out that they all must be kept to establish righteousness. Since this is impossible for anyone without Christ, no one can be made righteous by keeping the law.

You said yourself that the 4th commandment is effectively irrelevant, but there is no reason to stop there. They're all irrelevant, and for the same reason.

 

[shnarkle]

I don't think for a second that you actually believe you are free to violate the 1st commandment and make Satan your god, and still go to heaven. There's obviously a different meaning to Paul's words about "all things are lawful".

Who said anything about making Satan my god? Satan is just one of many of the gods. The commandments explicitly point out that we are to have no other gods "before" Yahweh. As long as Satan or any of the other gods are not placed in a position before Yahweh, there is no problem.

The same argument holds with regards to Christ's point that one must "forsake all", but this only holds for those who have had the kingdom revealed to them in the first place. Selling all of one's possessions and giving the proceds to the poor is pointless if one hasn't already discovered the kingdom. Forsaking all is not a means to an end. It is a consequence of discovering the kingdom.

There is no obligation to keep any of God's commandments. Only those who have discovered the kingdom are even going to want to in the first place.

 

[Phoneman777]

Of course. Why wouldn't they be? To condone trespassing one law is to condone trespassing all of God's law. We know that the weightier matters of the law are more important than tithing mint and cumin, but Christ himself points out that they all must be kept to establish righteousness. Since this is impossible for anyone without Christ, no one can be made righteous by keeping the law.

You said yourself that the 4th commandment is effectively irrelevant, but there is no reason to stop there. They're all irrelevant, and for the same reason.

Got it

 

[Phoneman777]

Who said anything about making Satan my god? Satan is just one of many of the gods. The commandments explicitly point out that we are to have no other gods "before" Yahweh. As long as Satan or any of the other gods are not placed in a position before Yahweh, there is no problem.

The same argument holds with regards to Christ's point that one must "forsake all", but this only holds for those who have had the kingdom revealed to them in the first place. Selling all of one's possessions and giving the proceds to the poor is pointless if one hasn't already discovered the kingdom. Forsaking all is not a means to an end. It is a consequence of discovering the kingdom.

There is no obligation to keep any of God's commandments. Only those who have discovered the kingdom are even going to want to in the first place.

That was a hypothetical.

 

[shnarkle]

That was a hypothetical.

So was my response.

 

[Enoch111]

So, people who go to church by day and kill prostitutes by night are heaven bound, right?

Who teaches this?

 

[amadeus]

So, people who go to church by day and kill prostitutes by night are heaven bound, right?

Who teaches this?

The "teachers" of this should be those who are walking with Jesus and are also in the process of killing the old man still, are killing their own "prostitutes", the parts within themselves that still work to sell that which is not theirs to the merchants of the flesh:

"He must increase, but I must decrease." John 3:30

 

[Phoneman777]

Who teaches this?

apparently shnarkle believes "all things are lawful" means we can do anything we want and still go to heaven

 

[Enoch111]

apparently shnarkle believes "all things are lawful" means we can do anything we want and still go to heaven

As you and others may have noticed, shnarkle is seriously confused about many things. He should read, study, and meditate on Titus 2:11-14.

 

[marks]

"Jesus is my rest, so I can disregard the commandment to keep holy the seventh day."

"Jesus is my Truth, so I can disregard the commandment to not lie."

Jesus is my Reward, so I can disregard the commandment to not steal."

"Consistency, thou art a jewel" said Shakespeare, so inconsistency must be anything but.

Hi Phoneman,

I keep the Sabbath by resting in Jesus. If I were to try to supplant that with my supposed 7th day observation, that would be, to me, to disregard the true Sabbath, of which the day is but a shadow.

Jesus is Truth, and Jesus in me will be true. Now, I could think to follow the commandment, but that to me would be to disregard the Lawgiver Who now lives in my, in seeks to conform me, not adjucate me by a code of law.

Jesus is my reward, and my provider, so to steal would be to disregard Him.

Just some thoughts . . .

Much love!

 

[Phoneman777]

Hi Phoneman,

I keep the Sabbath by resting in Jesus. If I were to try to supplant that with my supposed 7th day observation, that would be, to me, to disregard the true Sabbath, of which the day is but a shadow.

So, would keeping "Thou shalt not steal" supplant Jesus as our Reward? Or, would keeping "Thou shalt not lie" supplant Jesus as our Truth?

BTW, the weekly Sabbath of the fourth commandment is not a "shadow" of anything: it's a memorial. The Sabbath day was created at the end of Creation Week, when all was LIGHT and there were no shadows...until later when Eve decided to entertain the serpent.

But the ceremonial yearly "sabbaths" and sacrificial laws, to which Colossians "shadows" refer, were indeed "shadows of things to come" and met their fulfillment in Christ. The weekly Sabbath, however, will "stand fast forever and ever" and will be kept for all eternity :)

 

[marks]

So, would keeping "Thou shalt not steal" supplant Jesus as our Reward? Or, would keeping "Thou shalt not lie" supplant Jesus as our Truth?

To me this would mean, instead of drawing near to Jesus, it becomes pushing away against sin, which is not to me the same thing.

If I focus on drawing near to Jesus, then this is what keeps me from sin.

BTW, the weekly Sabbath of the fourth commandment is not a "shadow" of anything: it's a memorial. The Sabbath day was created at the end of Creation Week, when all was LIGHT and there were no shadows...until later when Eve decided to entertain the serpent.

That's a good point, though, just the same, grace was given us in Christ Jesus from before the world was.

I want to ponder on this one!

Much love!

 

[marks]

So, would keeping "Thou shalt not steal" supplant Jesus as our Reward? Or, would keeping "Thou shalt not lie" supplant Jesus as our Truth?

BTW, the weekly Sabbath of the fourth commandment is not a "shadow" of anything: it's a memorial. The Sabbath day was created at the end of Creation Week, when all was LIGHT and there were no shadows...until later when Eve decided to entertain the serpent.

But the ceremonial yearly "sabbaths" and sacrificial laws, to which Colossians "shadows" refer, were indeed "shadows of things to come" and met their fulfillment in Christ. The weekly Sabbath, however, will "stand fast forever and ever" and will be kept for all eternity :)

Do you keep the Sabbath? I mean, actually keep it?

Much love!

 

[Phoneman777]

To me this would mean, instead of drawing near to Jesus, it becomes pushing away against sin, which is not to me the same thing.

If I focus on drawing near to Jesus, then this is what keeps me from sin.




That's a good point, though, just the same, grace was given us in Christ Jesus from before the world was.

I want to ponder on this one!

Much love!

To me, it's pushing Jesus away when we intentionally forget to obey any of His commandments, including the only one that begins with the word "remember". Peace!

 

[Phoneman777]

Do you keep the Sabbath? I mean, actually keep it?

Much love!

Of course! At my job, if we accumulate more than 9 hours of OT, the overtime rate changes from time and a half to double time for the remainder of the week. There are plenty of times when my fellow employees would go on to work a double time Saturday and bank $700,$800, or $900 just on Saturday alone, and they don't understand why I concern myself with "in it thou shalt not work", and deny myself that extra cash, which is understandable to me, seeing that most of them are in the world or in antinomianist churches.

What I can't understand is why so called CHRISTIANS don't understand what is so elementary, even a child can't get it wrong: that if we're not free to break ALL the Ten Commandments, then we're not free to break ANY of the Ten Commandmetns.

 

[marks]

Of course! At my job, if we accumulate more than 9 hours of OT, the overtime rate changes from time and a half to double time for the remainder of the week. There are plenty of times when my fellow employees would go on to work a double time Saturday and bank $700,$800, or $900 just on Saturday alone, and they don't understand why I concern myself with "in it thou shalt not work", and deny myself that extra cash, which is understandable to me, seeing that most of them are in the world or in antinomianist churches.

What I can't understand is why so called CHRISTIANS don't understand what is so elementary, even a child can't get it wrong: that if we're not free to break ALL the Ten Commandments, then we're not free to break ANY of the Ten Commandmetns.

OK, just to be clear, no yard work, no doing the dishes, cooking travel, making fires, all that?

Much love!