Kenosis heresy

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Regarding Phil 2:6-7

  • Do you believe Jesus remained fully God with all the Divine Attributes

    Votes: 7 63.6%
  • Do you believe Jesus emptied Himself of His Divine Attributes - kenosis theory

    Votes: 4 36.4%

  • Total voters
    11

101G

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I think that I still have to disagree with you, @101G, and say that to take part and partake are one and the same thing...they mean the same thing....while it seems that you almost base your entire doctrine on there being a difference between the two.
GINOLJC, to all.
first thanks for the reply, second we must disagree with you here, and here's why. "Partake" is the Greek word, G2844, koinonos, an adjective, signifying "having in common". now justbyfaith tell us who is the Lord Jesus, the ETERNAL ONE, Biological father and mother. (remember having in common, so we humans have mothers and fathers), so book chapter and verse please of the Lord Jesus biological father and mother?. for he is without mother or father. he is eternal. and that NATURAL flesh that came out of Mary was not Biologically connected to no HUMAN, Mary was only the birth mother to it, she was only a birth mother or surrogate mother to the flesh he, (the spirit), came in. for that flesh was prepared by him before he shared himself in it, supportive scripture, Hebrews 10:5 "Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:" so if you have book chapter and verse stating other wise please post the names of father and mother who conceived that flesh in Mary's womb. and I will call that statement into check because it is the Holy Ghost, Jesus himself as the ordinal First who prepared that body of flesh in mary's womb, scripture, Matthew 1:20 "But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost." see, justbyfaith, no woman can conceive a spirit, and the Lord Jesus is before his flesh, not even you and my spirit is concieved by any woman, but are given by God. the only thing a man and a woman can re-produce is NATURAL flesh, and the baby produce it's OWN blood. and the body that the Lord Jesus came in had nothing to do with Joseph nor Mary, or any other human in conceiving it.

when one have a mother and father NATURALLY then one is a "Partaker" in flesh and blood, just as Hebrews 2:14 clearly states, listen "Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;" see the difference, "Partaker" and "Took part". now lets see the "took part"

Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:"
Philippians 2:7 "But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:" LIKENESS, LIKNESS, for the WORD was "MADE" Flesh, see John 1:14. he was truly a MAN, with the G2758 κενόω kenoo Spirit, but he is the TRUE man to COME, without sin. the Last Adam who is God's, the Lord Jesus, the ordinal First, own Image to come. (see Genesis 1:26, and Romans 5:14b). this is the the US, the OUR .... the "IMAGE"... that was to come, the ordinal Last.

see justbyfaith, by "TAKING" on flesh in the LIKENESS of man, he have no biologial father, or mother, so he had to "MAKE" or prepared his own body of flesh to come in. Mary only birth it, that flesh which God made in her.

so the difference between "Partake" in flesh and blood is to have Human biological parents, (which the Lord Jesus do not have). and "taking part, or "Took Part", is being in the LIKENESS of flesh and blood but, ( withouit human biological parents). THIS IS THE DEFINITION OF THE immaculate conception, BINGO, understand now.

side note: just in case if you have any doubts about where your spirit and everyone else "spirit" come from, is from God, who upon Natural death, the first death, returnes back to God who gave it, supportive scripture, Isaiah 42:5 "Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:"

see justbyfaith, your spirit in you don't come from your biologial father, or mother, they cannot produce a spirit, for a spirit is only GIVEN by God. and if God give not that FLESH a "spirit". excuse my expression to any mother who may have had experience this, the baby is "STILL BORN".... DEAD, naturally. for no "spirit" was given, just ask king David about that.

so I hope you now understand the difference between "Partake", (with parents), and "Took Part", (without Parents) concering flesh and blood reporduction.

PICJAG.
 

justbyfaith

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@101G,

I believe that we have hashed this out before that you do not believe in the doctrine of the hypostatic union; which to every degree is sound doctrine.

If you do indeed deny this doctrine, we have nothing further to discuss.

But I will set before you a scripture, you can take it or leave it:

Tit 1:9, Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.
 

101G

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@101G,

I believe that we have hashed this out before that you do not believe in the doctrine of the hypostatic union; which to every degree is sound doctrine.

If you do indeed deny this doctrine, we have nothing further to discuss.

But I will set before you a scripture, you can take it or leave it:

Tit 1:9, Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.
thanks for the reply, I'll take the scripture, but leave your doctrine... to YOU :D and yes, I do not believe in any hypostatic union, it's NOT sound doctrine, according to the scriptures.

and I will leave a scripture with you, since we're in the Last days... Revelation 22:11.

PICJAG.
 
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ChristisGod

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thanks for the reply, I'll take the scripture, but leave your doctrine... to YOU :D and yes, I do not believe in any hypostatic union, it's NOT sound doctrine, according to the scriptures.

and I will leave a scripture with you, since we're in the Last days... Revelation 22:11.

PICJAG.
can you define for us the meaning of " the son of man " ?
 

101G

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can you define for us the meaning of " the son of man " ?
A. the Son of man is not Born, but Given, or sent, or came.

B. the Son of man is the equally "SHARED" Spirit of God, "Diversified" in flesh, in a G2758 κενόω kenoo state on Earth, better known as the "offspring"... after his death of the flesh, (the first death), now Resurrected in the new body, but no blood, in a glorified state. (smile). do you understand this? yes, "diversified" in natural flesh and bone. scripture, Revelation 22:16 "I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star."
the Greek term for "OFFSPRING" is ,
G1085 γένος genos (ǰe'-nos) n.
kin.
{abstract or concrete, literal or figurative, individual or collective}
[from G1096]
KJV: born, country(-man), diversity, generation, kind(-red), nation, offspring, stock
Root(s): G1096

see how the KJV can translate "Offspring"..... diversity,... BINGO. the Lord Jesus is the "diversity" of himself in natural flesh on earth in the likeness of a man. who is a "Kinsman as the definition states, to REDEEM man to his Spirit. hence, God in Flesh, the Kinsman Redeemer.... simple enough.

now one needs to understand the "EQUAL" share of the Spirit as Phil 2:6 points out.

PICJAG.
 

ChristisGod

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A. the Son of man is not Born, but Given, or sent, or came.

B. the Son of man is the equally "SHARED" Spirit of God, "Diversified" in flesh, in a G2758 κενόω kenoo state on Earth, better known as the "offspring"... after his death of the flesh, (the first death), now Resurrected in the new body, but no blood, in a glorified state. (smile). do you understand this? yes, "diversified" in natural flesh and bone. scripture, Revelation 22:16 "I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star."
the Greek term for "OFFSPRING" is ,
G1085 γένος genos (ǰe'-nos) n.
kin.
{abstract or concrete, literal or figurative, individual or collective}
[from G1096]
KJV: born, country(-man), diversity, generation, kind(-red), nation, offspring, stock
Root(s): G1096

see how the KJV can translate "Offspring"..... diversity,... BINGO. the Lord Jesus is the "diversity" of himself in natural flesh on earth in the likeness of a man. who is a "Kinsman as the definition states, to REDEEM man to his Spirit. hence, God in Flesh, the Kinsman Redeemer.... simple enough.

now one needs to understand the "EQUAL" share of the Spirit as Phil 2:6 points out.

PICJAG.

"Son of man" is a common term in the Psalms, used to accentuate the difference between God and human beings. As in Ps. viii. 4 (A. V. 5), the phrase implies "mortality," "impotence," "transientness,"as against the omnipotence and eternality of God. Yhwh looks down from His throne in heaven upon the "children," or "sons," of "man" (Ps. xi. 4, xxxiii. 13). The faithful fail among them (Ps. xii. 2 [A. V. 1]); the seed of Yhwh's enemies will not abide among the "children of men" (Ps. xxi. 10). "Children of men" is thus equivalent to "mankind" (Ps. xxxvi. 8 [A. V. 7], lxvi. 5).

"Sons of men," or "children of men," designates also the slanderers and evil-doers in contrast to the righteous, that is, Israel (Ps. lvii. 5 [A. V. 4], lviii. 2 [A. V. 1]). It occurs most frequently, however, as a synonym for "mankind," "the human race" (Ps. xc. 3, cvii. 8, cxv. 16, cxlv. 12); it has this sense also in the passage in which wisdom is said to delight with the "sons of men" (Prov. viii. 31). Job(xvi. 21) employs the expression in the passionate plea for his rights while he is contending against God and against his neighbors. But Bildad insists that the "son of man," who is a mere worm, can not be justified with God (Job xxv. 4-6). In the same spirit the prophet (Isa. li. 12) censures Israel for being afraid of "the son of man which shall be made as grass" when Yhwh is their Comforter; but in Isa. lvi. 2-3 the Sabbath is extolled as making the "son of man" (i.e., any man, regardless of birth) blessed; indeed, God has His eyes "open upon all the ways of the sons of men: to give every one according to his ways" (Jer. xxxii. 19). Jewish Encyclopedia


Son of man
— (1.) Denotes mankind generally, with special reference to their weakness and frailty (Job 25:6; Ps 8:4; 144:3; 146:3; Isa 51:12, etc.).


(2.) It is a title frequently given to the prophet Ezekiel, probably to remind him of his human weakness.


(3.) In the New Testament it is used forty-three times as a distinctive title of the Saviour. In the Old Testament it is used only in Ps 80:17 and Dan 7:13 with this application. It denotes the true humanity of our Lord. He had a true body (Heb 2:14; Luke 24:39) and a rational soul. He was perfect man.

(from Easton's Bible Dictionary, PC Study Bible formatted electronic database Copyright © 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)

hope this helps !!!
 

ChristisGod

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A. the Son of man is not Born, but Given, or sent, or came.

B. the Son of man is the equally "SHARED" Spirit of God, "Diversified" in flesh, in a G2758 κενόω kenoo state on Earth, better known as the "offspring"... after his death of the flesh, (the first death), now Resurrected in the new body, but no blood, in a glorified state. (smile). do you understand this? yes, "diversified" in natural flesh and bone. scripture, Revelation 22:16 "I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star."
the Greek term for "OFFSPRING" is ,
G1085 γένος genos (ǰe'-nos) n.
kin.
{abstract or concrete, literal or figurative, individual or collective}
[from G1096]
KJV: born, country(-man), diversity, generation, kind(-red), nation, offspring, stock
Root(s): G1096

see how the KJV can translate "Offspring"..... diversity,... BINGO. the Lord Jesus is the "diversity" of himself in natural flesh on earth in the likeness of a man. who is a "Kinsman as the definition states, to REDEEM man to his Spirit. hence, God in Flesh, the Kinsman Redeemer.... simple enough.

now one needs to understand the "EQUAL" share of the Spirit as Phil 2:6 points out.

PICJAG.
now can you define the meaning of " the Son of God " ?
 

101G

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now can you define the meaning of " the Son of God " ?
yes,
A. Son of God is Born, Flesh, bone and Blood. the outward Man that took on the Name and the identity of the Spirit that is in it. scripture, Luke 1:34 "Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?" this is called the MANIFESTATION of GOD in FLESH....BINGO.
Luke 1:35 "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."

Just remember, the Son of God is the outward man, (flesh, tabernacle, or House), born of woman. the Son of Man, the INWARD man, spirit, shared equally with the Spirit, never Born, but Given, who came? the Son of Man, John 3:31 "He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.". understand now?

so the Son of God came out of Mary... Born, FLESH, the Outward man. the Son of Man, came from heaven, spirit, the "EQUALLY SHARED" Spirit of God, that was G2758 κενόω kenoo when sent to EARTH, Diversified in natural flesh ... that Mary birthed.... (smile). got that?

PICJAG.
 

ChristisGod

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yes,
A. Son of God is Born, Flesh, bone and Blood. the outward Man that took on the Name and the identity of the Spirit that is in it. scripture, Luke 1:34 "Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?" this is called the MANIFESTATION of GOD in FLESH....BINGO.
Luke 1:35 "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."

Just remember, the Son of God is the outward man, (flesh, tabernacle, or House), born of woman. the Son of Man, the INWARD man, spirit, shared equally with the Spirit, never Born, but Given, who came? the Son of Man, John 3:31 "He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.". understand now?

so the Son of God came out of Mary... Born, FLESH, the Outward man. the Son of Man, came from heaven, spirit, the "EQUALLY SHARED" Spirit of God, that was G2758 κενόω kenoo when sent to EARTH, Diversified in natural flesh ... that Mary birthed.... (smile). got that?

PICJAG.
You missed the definition of "the son of man" just the same as you missed the definition of " the Son of God"

The Son of man means having the nature of man, human kind which is a human nature.

The Son of God means having the nature of God, a Divine nature.

So Jesus has both natures a human nature and a Divine nature hence the Hypostatic Union, the Incarnation- God in the flesh as we read in Johns Prologue and Colossians chapter 1 and 2. All the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form.( Col 2:9 ) For it was the Father’s good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him. ( Col 1:19 ) And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.( 1 Tim 3:16). The Word was God, the Word became flesh. ( John 1:1, 14).

FYI- Absolutely no man can say the following:

He who has seen Me has seen the Father ( John 14:9)

Unless that Person just so happens to be God.

Dismantling your argument was a piece of cake.

2 Cor 10:4-5
The weapons we fight with are not the weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. 5 We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ.

hope this helps !!!
 
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101G

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You missed the definition of "the son of man" just the same as you missed the definition of " the Son of God"

The Son of man means having the nature of man, human kind which is a human nature.

The Son of God means having the nature of God, a Divine nature.

So Jesus has both natures a human nature and a Divine nature hence the Hypostatic Union, the Incarnation- God in the flesh as we read in Johns Prologue and Colossians chapter 1 and 2. All the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form.( Col 2:9 ) For it was the Father’s good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him. ( Col 1:19 ) And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.( 1 Tim 3:16). The Word was God, the Word became flesh. ( John 1:1, 14).

hope this helps !!!

Lets take this one step at a time, you said, "The Son of man means having the nature of man, human kind which is a human nature". ok what is man's NATURE?

your answer please.

PICJAG.
 

101G

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My God how hard is it to answer, oh well I'll help you out. Genesis 3:19 "In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return."

but the Son of man is from Heaven..... :eek: now do you really want to contuine? what you saw is the term "MAN" in Son of Man, or you see the word "God" in son of God. well let me tell you we walk not by sight but by Faith... open your real eyes.

PICJAG.
 

101G

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but since you don't know or understand. the Lord Jesus have ONLY "ONE" NATURE, he "TOOK ON" another Nature. BINGO ... understand NOW?

Know the difference between "TOOK PART" in our humanity vs "being a "PARTAKER" in it. see the difference. you have a lot to learn, this is basic bible study, you should know these things. but as I said, the Holy Ghost will teach you comparing Spiritual things with Spiritual.

so get the Holy Ghost as your TEACHER, and drop all those ZERO.... ok... now one other thing..... "Ye have not because ye ask NOT".

PICJAG.
 

ChristisGod

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looks like you REJECT the TRUTH from the Scriptures in my previous post regarding His Divinity( the Son of God) and His humanity(the son of man)= 2 natures a Divine and human nature in the Person of Christ.

hope this helps !!!