Maybe you should try reading [ Matt.25: 31-46 ] that is' good works'. Jesus requires those works along with accepting all of His Teachings both the apostolic teachings [ Luke 10: 16 ] and Holy Scripture.
Lawless Ones subverting the truth in Christ.
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Maybe you should try reading [ Matt.25: 31-46 ] that is' good works'. Jesus requires those works along with accepting all of His Teachings both the apostolic teachings [ Luke 10: 16 ] and Holy Scripture.
You are correct, Matt 25:31-46 shows being saved by works. So then, add that to the 10 commandments, and all the other laws . . . do you do all of these?
As is written in the law, he do does these will live by them. Keep the Law, and live. Don't keep the Law, and don't live.
Good luck!!!
As is written in the law, he do does these will live by them. Keep the Law, and live. Don't keep the Law, and don't live.
Good luck!!!
Thanks for the encouragement. Very few indeed will walk in the Spirit of God in order to do the will of the Father.
Here are some works that we are commanded to do: (these are not suggestions)
Rom 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Rom 6:12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
Rom 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
So, now grace gives us the power to walk in these commandments and righteous works of God.
And another commandment and righteous work to walk in.
Heb_12:14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:
Axehead
Rom 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Rom 6:12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
Rom 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
So, now grace gives us the power to walk in these commandments and righteous works of God.
And another commandment and righteous work to walk in.
Heb_12:14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:
Axehead
Hi Episkopos,
Christ is the Shepherd/Bishop/Overseer of our souls (1Pet 2:25).
Your claim of being an overseer (Episkopos) over the church is merely your own fantasy, just as is your claim that you are one of the very few with understanding of scriptures. I say this out of recognizing that you claim to know Him but you deny Him through your disobedience of His commandments (1John 3:23) with your false gospel of works of the law.
Christ is the END of the law, for righteousness (Rom 10:4). But your false gospel denies this by judging righteousness by works of the law. And as many here have recognized, your own admitted lawlessness (sin) condemns you under your own false doctrine.
As this is a open forum for all to see I continue confronting your works of the law gospel with the gospel of grace. You have been admonished several times for your divisive false gospel and had it been face to face I would not have continued with you, as scripture instructs.
Titus 3:9-11
"But avoid foolish disputes, genealogies, contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and useless.[sup] [/sup]Reject a divisive man after the first and second admonition,[sup] [/sup]knowing that such a person is warped and sinning, being self-condemned."
Hi Axehead,
You misunderstand the scriptures you quoted.
I'm curious whether you keep the 10 commandmants perfectly like Episkopos claims we should do if we abide in Christ?
:blink:
I'm sorry, but are you aware of just how bizarre that sounds? Only those who are seen and 'inspected' by God can become overseers of the Church? But doesn't God see all, know all and judge all? And aren't we told in 2 Peter 3:9 that the Lord is patient towards all, not wishing that anyone should perish?
If He has such mercy and patience towards those who deny him still, why would you think that he would then rush to judge those of us who call him Lord? In fact that whole idea is biblically fallacious. We are told again and again that when we are redeemed, in the moment of judgement Christ steps in and says 'I paid for it all'. In fact we are told that that is already happening...Christ is our advocate.
We also see in Philippians 3:9 that 'in him (that is Christ), not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which comes through faith in Christ, the righteousness from God that depends on faith.'
We are also told in Galatians 5:3 that if we rely on the law in any way, we must uphold all of it...perfectly.
Paul never tells us that the law becomes unimportant...just unnecessary for salvation. Salvation comes through faith in Christ alone. But once saved the law becomes, as David says, a sweetness to us. God is not after our grudging submission to these rules, but woos us towards them knowing that in putting the old nature to death and pursuing these 'new' things in Christ, it's our ultimate joy and pleasure. Can you imagine? Not doing something because we know we 'have to', but doing it instead because we get to, and that doing it will bring us joy and God glory.
The Greek word Episkope means visitation..as in "they did not know the hour of their visitation." All authority from God is based on such visitation. The Hebrew is Pekoudah. Is it so strange that God would oversee His people?
[quote name='mark s' timestamp='1341864159' post='155928']
You are correct, Matt 25:31-46 shows being saved by works. So then, add that to the 10 commandments, and all the other laws . . . do you do all of these?
As is written in the law, he do does these will live by them. Keep the Law, and live. Don't keep the Law, and don't live.
Good luck!!!
[/quote]
Christians are bound to the law of Christ which, of course, includes the natural law.
Old Testament law contains elements of natural law—e.g., the condemnation of homosexual activity—to which Christians are bound for that reason, not because of their inclusion in the Old Testament. Christians do not have liberty on these issues.
Also, Christians are not and have never been bound by Old Testament law for its own sake, and those elements of Old Testament law which are not part of the natural law—e.g., the obligation to worship on Saturday —were only ever binding on the Jews. Christians do have liberty on those issues.
From staff member of Catholic Answers
You are correct, Matt 25:31-46 shows being saved by works. So then, add that to the 10 commandments, and all the other laws . . . do you do all of these?
As is written in the law, he do does these will live by them. Keep the Law, and live. Don't keep the Law, and don't live.
Good luck!!!
[/quote]
Christians are bound to the law of Christ which, of course, includes the natural law.
Old Testament law contains elements of natural law—e.g., the condemnation of homosexual activity—to which Christians are bound for that reason, not because of their inclusion in the Old Testament. Christians do not have liberty on these issues.
Also, Christians are not and have never been bound by Old Testament law for its own sake, and those elements of Old Testament law which are not part of the natural law—e.g., the obligation to worship on Saturday —were only ever binding on the Jews. Christians do have liberty on those issues.
From staff member of Catholic Answers
If everything I've read about your position is true then none but Messiah are abiding in Messiah.
I don't say this to insult but in despair if your interpretation is true, for, even Peter sinned after the pentecost. Paul had to rebuke him for hypocrisy, a sin of the Saducees and Pharisees. Paul, also, was in no better of a situation. After his conversion and mmersion into the spirit of truth, Paul saw a war going on between his flesh and mind. Paul found himself in that exact predicament you describe serving the law of God with his mind and serving the law of sin in the flesh, serving two different masters.
Oh such despair for me! I'm neither a Paul nor a Peter and yet they couldn't keep the commandments perfectly, they couldn't abide in Messiah. If this is true then all I can do is throw myself at the mercy of Yahweh.
Amen! We cannot make a pat system of forgiveness that excludes a broken humility and reverence for God. The modern gospel shuts God out...taking what they need from Him. But God has a holy standard to uphold.
If sin were seen as normal then there would be no need for rebuke! The standard of God has been reduced so much these days that most are too afraid to hurt the feelings of others in order to point out sin. I'm not advocating a critical spirit...but rather a more accurate following of the ways of God.
Let's get one thing straight even though Paul was justified rebuking Peter’s conduct at Antioch, where he refused to eat with Gentile Christians in order not to offend certain Jews from Palestine (Gal. 2:11–16). For this Paul rebuked him. Did this demonstrate papal infallibility was non-existent? Not at all. Peter’s actions had to do with matters of discipline, not with issues of faith or morals.
Furthermore, the problem was Peter’s actions, not his teaching. Paul acknowledged that Peter very well knew the correct teaching (Gal. 2:12–13). The problem was that he wasn’t living up to his own teaching. Thus, in this instance, Peter was not doing any teaching; much less was he solemnly defining a matter of faith or morals.
Peter was stuck between a rock and a hard place. He was bound to offend one group or the other. The real problem was not so much with Peter but the immaturity of either group. Why didn't the Jews eat with Gentiles? Should Peter have ignored the Jews? Paul was thinking of the Gentiles to whom he was sent. Maybe Peter should have eaten with both groups????
Please refrain from inserting Catholic interpretations onto the biblical account. If someone wishes to make Peter their Pope, or spirit traveller or whatever else the New Age movement is coming up with...that is not our concern. Stick with the biblcal narrative. Please!!!
I was only refuting your 16th century man-made Protestant interpretation of Holy Scripture.The Catholic Church has not any connection to any New Age religion, New Age comes out of Protestanism. All cults ,including Mormonism, JWism and New Age all split off some man-made Protestant church, while proclaiming the KJV of the Holy Bible as their sole rule for salvation. Jesus formed His Apostolic Church not any KJV bible church.
Hi Sr.Bandon,
As you can see from Episkopos' response to your post above, his is a false gospel trying to deceive others away from the "mercy of Yahweh", as you said.
Scripture offers many warnings that those like Episkopos would come trying to deceive others away from the grace of God.
Gal 2:4,5
[sup] "[/sup]And this occurred because of false brethren secretly brought in (who came in by stealth to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage),[sup] [/sup]to whom we did not yield submission even for an hour, that the truth of the gospel might continue with you".
LOL. I'm sorry if I cannot support the Cosmic Candy Man theory that is preached today. The truth is far more glorious...although far more difficult. Did Jesus say...Come on folks...the narrow way is easy and anyone can do it????
The problem lies with the shallowness and temporal thinking of people in these end times. Many cannot hear the truth so they turn aside to the enticing gospel of a free salvation for a simple nod from our heads. Saying..peace peace when there's no peace.
But the peace of Christ comes at a cost to us. That cost it just too high for a consumer minded person.
Mat_7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
I wonder how many in this generation have resisted the lies that are preached today and persevered in order to seek the Lord and actually find Him (or be found of Him). Few indeed!
God looks at the heart. He decides where a person is at because He can truly see our condition. Those who think that God is blinded by a so called imputed righteousness of Christ really have no knowledge of God at all. He can help us BECAUSE He sees us so well.
When God starts to fashion us according to His will it HURTS!!!! But if we trust Him we will hang in there. But so very few do this...have faith in God. People get sold on a salvation scheme that animates their imagination but all this without true faith.
"Without true faith", one of those "sweeping generalizations".
"Animates their imagination" . . . More like, believes the Bible.
"Animates their imagination" . . . More like, believes the Bible.
Hi Episkopos,
God's free gift is clearly a big problem for the likes of you who are in the flesh. Christ is a stumbling stone for you just as he was for Israel.
But for others here God's FREE gift is understood and thankfully received, giving praise to God for His love for us.
Rom 5:15-18
[sup]"[/sup]But the FREE gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man’s offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to many. And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification.[sup] [/sup]For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)
Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the FREE gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life."
Sadly for those like you, in your determining righteousness by works of the law, you yourself show yourself up to be transgressor of the law (which you admit to).
Gal 2:18
"For if I build again those things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor."
As you continue under the law, thus making yourself a transgressor/sinner, you are rejecting the knowledge of the truth of life in Christ. The following scriptures applies to the likes of you under the law.
Heb 10:26-29
"For if we sin (being under the law thus making yourself a transgressor) willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth (Christ), there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,[sup] [/sup]but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.[sup] [/sup]Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?"
For the works crowd here on this forum, scripture calls for you to repent of your dead works and turn to God.
No, it's not strange that God would oversee his people. What is strange is that you are apparently appointing yourself into a position of 'knowing' that not many other people have. You obviously think that your 'revelation' of scripture is superior to everyone else's. And that concerns me, because much of what you say is just incorrect. We know from scripture that God does indeed appoint teachers and pastors, and we are told that they will be held to a higher standard of judgement. So you had want to be very, very certain about your doctrines before you go about trying to sway people with them. It's all well and good to go the 'I'm right, you're wrong...here's what the bible says to back me up' path, but the very big problem you have with it is this: other people can read. Other people have the Holy Spirit guiding and revealing to them, and many other people have the brains for sound exegesis and hermeneutics. And any other person with the above can plainly see for themselves that there are some gaping holes in your doctrines. Sorry...but it true. You may mean very well, but perhaps you should just take a step back for a moment and consider how you will be held accountable for any poor soul you may be leading astray. Stating your opinion is not a problem, but when you claim to be a teacher...when you claim that "all authority from God" has been given to you, you need to make sure what you're teaching is in line with what scripture teachers. If not, you're just a false prophet or one of the 'circumcision clan'...and the bible is fairly clear about those. The bible is our authority...not 'visitations'...and any 'visitation' that does not marry it's message perfectly with scripture, well, it was not from God.
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