Lets Get It On, Mystery Babylon.

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Trekson

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Hi Ridgerunner, Here is Rev. 1;19 from the AMP - "So write the things which you have seen [in the vision], and the things which are [now happening], and the things which will take place after these things."

You can see from this that the book doesn't contain the past from John's pov. The "hast" just means the vision which began before vs. 19 and continues on until the end of the book.

Your words - "If it was only talking about those slain in the 70th week, the verse would have to be rewritten and the words “of all” changed to - part of those. In addition if it is only referring to those in 70th week and the 70th week is future then how does she contain the blood of the prophets? Weren’t most of the prophets that were slain, slain in Jerusalem 1900+ years ago."

No, the wording wouldn't have to change if it means "all" those who have been slain within the 70th week. There are still prophets today. It is a common spiritual gift just not to the extent that it was in the OT, but it is not impossible that God could move that way again in the latter days. Also the two witnesses can be considered as prophets by what the bible describes them as doing in Rev. Another thing to consider is that the evil that was prevalent in the past will still be prevalent in the future so it would be the same evil (the devil) controlling the reins which if you get right down to it is responsible for all the deaths from creation until Christ returns.
 
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brakelite

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Isa 14:12-14 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, that didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; and I will also sit upon the mount of congregation, in the uttermost parts of the north; I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
I will be like the Most High.
Here we have a revelation into the heart and mind of Satan. We are here given insight into his most cherished ambition, to be like God, therefore to receive the worship, adoration and fidelity of his subjects. If anyone has doubt as to whether Satan still cherishes this particular ambition, one need look no further than the temptation of Christ in order to confirm this. Satan offered Jesus all the kingdoms of the earth and their glory, if only Jesus would fall down and worship him. Imagine, the Creator worshiping His creation!!! Although Satan failed in that particular exercise, he has not failed when it comes to enticing man to worship him. I am not speaking here of those who are involved in the occult, or in Satanic rites. No, no. I am speaking of people who consider themselves Christians, those who sincerely believe and are convinced they are worshiping God. Allow me to explain.
Satan can not enter the church of course and introduce himself and make a polite request that the congregation worship him. He knows that will not work; we know that will not work; such an attempt would be met with a less than favourable response. Therefore, in order to gain the advantage over those who believe in God, he must use deception. The apostle Paul alluded to this very thing when he wrote: 2 Thess. 2:3-10. Let no man deceive you by any means; for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. Remember ye not, that when I was with you, I told you of these things? And now ye know what with-holdeth, that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work; only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the Spirit of His mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of His coming.
Reading to this point, one might think that Satan has competition. Someone else vying for the adoration of man. But let us read further;….. Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, and with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish, because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
“Whose coming is after the working of Satan!!?” Not competition, but his own child! Here is Satan’s baby. Here is that creation of his which enters the church and in his place accepts man’s worship by proclaiming himself God, but it is in fact Satan who receives the ultimate glory.
Satan could not himself enter the church, but he could very easily use someone else to do that for him, and through him, receive the worship he desires. By misrepresenting God, and introducing a counterfeit God and a counterfeit religion to worship that God, Satan has deceived millions. Allow me to make a point regarding deception, using counterfeit money as an example. People are not deceived into believing that it is acceptable in the eyes of the authorities to use counterfeit money. The deception operates by way of blinding the people that it is a counterfeit. It is fake, but they believe it to be real. It is the same with religion. Satan would deceive very few into thinking that it is acceptable to God for man to worship Satan. But he has had resounding success in deceiving many into thinking they are worshiping God, when in fact they are worshiping Satan.
How does this work? Jesus explained it very clearly throughout His ministry, warning us repeatedly of false Christs and false prophets. Important to notice that if there be a false Christ then his followers must be false Christians. The expression ‘antichrist’ means that precisely; “one who stands in the place of Christ”. Therefore the followers of antichrist must also be professing Christians, the antichrist being the counterfeit of the true Christ, and his followers deceived into believing they are worshiping the true.
Jesus alluded to this very thing here; Matt. 15:9. But in vain do they worship Me, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men.
Notice here that Jesus was not saying these people were not worshiping, they were just not worshiping Him!
Most would be also familiar with the following; Matthew 7:21-23 Not every one that saith unto Me Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? And in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity.
Now if Jesus didn’t know them, it would be fairly safe to conclude that they didn’t know Him. They were doing all manner of religious stuff, including one would presume worship, but it certainly wasn’t Jesus they were worshiping, even though they believed it was, and when they came face to face with Him, called Him Lord!!!!
So who was it they were worshiping? Let us look at Romans 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey…
According to this text, we are servants to whoever we obey. Regardless of our profession, it is in our acts that we define who we worship. As Jesus said, in vain do they worship Him, when they obey the commandments of men which override the commandments and doctrines of God. And later, as we just saw, only those who do the will of the Father will be entering the kingdom of heaven. How eternally important is doctrine! How essential it is to understand truth!!! How critical it is that we be absolutely assured that what teachings we follow are based on sound Biblical truth rather than the teachings, interpretations, or traditions of man.
Doctrine is an integral part of worship. Jesus is here telling us that the creator of the doctrine is the object of our worship, regardless of the intent, sincere or otherwise, of the worshiper. It is through false doctrine that Satan has deceived millions into believing they are worshiping God when in fact they are worshiping him. It is through false teaching- doctrines that are the invention of Satan and taught by man, that Satan has established his counterfeit God, and his counterfeit religion of worshiping that god.
The book of Revelation reveals this to us clearly.
The true things of God have Satanic counterparts. There is a false trinity; the dragon, sea-beast (antichrist) and false prophet. This false trinity has a false message (Revel 16:13) – a counterfeit of the true 3 angels messages of Revel. 14:6-12. The false trinity is associated with a false city, Babylon. This city, like the New Jerusalem, has a river, and is called ‘great’. (18:10). The antichrist himself is a counterfeit Christ. Jesus proclaimed His threefold ministry in Matthew 12:6,41,42. He proclaimed Himself as the ultimate Priest, Prophet, and King, and rightly so. However, there is an entity living upon the earth as we speak who also claims, falsely, these very same prerogatives, and claims them to be his universal right. By claiming to be the sole arbiter and interpreter of scripture, by claiming the power to forgive sin, by claiming universal authority in religious matters, (thus subverting Christ’s ministry of High priest); by claiming the power to change God’s times and laws,and claiming the sole right to speak upon the earth as God’s representative, and claiming the right to judge who does or does not enter the kingdom of God, (thus subverting role as Prophet), by claiming the right and seeking secular authority over all the earth,(thus subverting Christ’s role as King) the Catholic Church has indeed “opposed and exalted himself above all that is called God, or that is worshiped, so that he as God sits in the temple of God, (the church), showing himself that he is God.”

There are two levels to every secret society. Take the Freemasons for example. There is an esoteric truth revealed only to the upper levels...Luciferian doctrine and worship. This esoteric religion can be readily seen in plain sight, in the pagan occult symbols of freemasonry, and these symbols can be traced back to the "Mystery" chaldean religion of ancient Babylon, and even earlier, but Babylon was its prime advocate in the ancient world, and continues today in the philosophies and practices of not only Freemasonry, but other secret societies as well. The lower level of doctrine and teachings of these societies, are 'protestant', exoteric , and are for the uninitiated...the goyim.
Roman Catholicism is no different. The symbols of occult 'mystery' Babylon is readily seen throughout the church all over the world. The esoteric doctrines are for the elites, the upper echelons only, and is pure Luciferian. The exoteric teachings, Catholicism, is for the goyim, the lower levels who believe they are worshiping God. The elites of Catholicism, the top Jesuits and upper levels of the Knights of Malta and Knights of Columbus, all share the same interests, the same worship principles, and the same ambitions as the 33rd Mason...world dominion. The Jesuits themselves have infiltrated freemasonry, all Protestant theological seminaries, Bible colleges, all secret societies, and are the principal people guiding the modern day version of "Mystery" Babylon the Great into power. The woman, riding the beast, is a metaphor for a church riding upon a state power receiving from the state support and legislative power. We see the popes of the last few decades intent on promoting themselves, and their church, at the head of the coming NWO. This rise to power, while inevitable, is for only a short time. The second coming puts permanent destruction to their ambitions.
Before the reformers, many considered the papacy as the Antichrist. All the reformers agreed. Some also still hold to that belief. But today, as a direct result of Jesuit intrigue and counter-reformation teaching, the vast majority of Christendom no longer hold to that view. This will be for them a fatal mistake, as the entity they are now returning to gains power and they suddenly realize that once again, the reformation is going to have to be fought all over again, with more blood spilt than ever before.
The next 2 years , particularly with 2017 being proclaimed as the Kabbalistic Roman jubilee year extraordinaire, I believe are going to be very very interesting ones. To say the least.
 

BjornFree

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Members probably won't like what I have to say.
I see John as a man who was imprisoned on Patmos with a stone 'cave' and a bed hewn out of rock for his only habitat (I have visited the spot).
For this to have happened, over an extended period, at such an old age, would likely cause anyone to hallucinate with much emphasis on whatever was deeply ingrained into their psyche.
John, in his hallucinations, was obviously harking back to his ingrained Jewish background and culture.
The 'Lake of Fire', for instance, comes from the Jewish belief/myth re 'Gehenna', and much else is by direct or indirect reference to the OT books such as Daniel and others that refer to Babel/Babylon.
With that in my mind I have as much difficulty with regard to how to view 'Revelation', as did many Ecclesiastical scholars throughout the centuries that followed 'canonisation' (Luther included prior to his ultimate acceptance of the book).
However, if Revelation is to be used for any understanding of what constitutes 'Babylon the Great' then surely a careful read has to recognise that commercialism plays as great a part as does religion.
And from that I conclude that the core factor of Babylon the Great is that of ''Idolatry' (any thing that is worshipped rather than 'God himself, in spirit and in truth').
That then would be the composite from which believers are called to depart before its final overthrow/destruction.
Sabbatarian interpretations are nothing more than the product of denominationalism.
 

heretoeternity

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Oneoff said:
Members probably won't like what I have to say.
I see John as a man who was imprisoned on Patmos with a stone 'cave' and a bed hewn out of rock for his only habitat (I have visited the spot).
For this to have happened, over an extended period, at such an old age, would likely cause anyone to hallucinate with much emphasis on whatever was deeply ingrained into their psyche.
John, in his hallucinations, was obviously harking back to his ingrained Jewish background and culture.
The 'Lake of Fire', for instance, comes from the Jewish belief/myth re 'Gehenna', and much else is by direct or indirect reference to the OT books such as Daniel and others that refer to Babel/Babylon.
With that in my mind I have as much difficulty with regard to how to view 'Revelation', as did many Ecclesiastical scholars throughout the centuries that followed 'canonisation' (Luther included prior to his ultimate acceptance of the book).
However, if Revelation is to be used for any understanding of what constitutes 'Babylon the Great' then surely a careful read has to recognise that commercialism plays as great a part as does religion.
And from that I conclude that the core factor of Babylon the Great is that of ''Idolatry' (any thing that is worshipped rather than 'God himself, in spirit and in truth').
That then would be the composite from which believers are called to depart before its final overthrow/destruction.
Sabbatarian interpretations are nothing more than the product of denominationalism.
Wrong...Sabbath keeping comes from Genesis 2 in the Bible when God created the the seventh day of the week, He rested, blessed it and sanctified the day (set it aside for Holy purposes)...so it is as much as part of Creation as people are...this was before any denominational influence...no other day of the week was given such glorification by our Creator..NONE!
 

blessedhope

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Babylon will be rebuilt and it will be the center of the anti_christ seat of power, all false things came from Babylon and will return to Babylon
[SIZE=10pt]Babylon from the time of Genesis was the spark of rebellion against God, when humanity was one tribe, it was at the tower of Babel, located in Babylon, man rebelled against God.Its at the Second Coming, the revived Kingdom of Babylon will oppose the kingdom of God.According to Revelation chapters 17 and 18, here Satan will make his last stand.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt] Revelation presents two Babylons, in chapter 17 there is spiritual Babylon, which has corrupted the world with sin, through religion. For this reason, she is called “Mystery”, because she uses religion to deceive the world and lead people astray. The second Babylon is economic Babylon, who through commerce pollutes the world with material goods. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=8pt]Re 18:1 After these things I saw another angel coming down from heaven, having great authority, and the earth was illuminated with his glory. Re 18:2 And he cried mightily with a loud voice, saying, "Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and has become a dwelling place of demons, a prison for every foul spirit, and a cage for every unclean and hated bird! Re 18:3 "For all the nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth have become rich through the abundance of her luxury." Re 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven saying, "Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues. Re 18:5 "For her sins have reached to heaven, and God has remembered her iniquities.
Revelation 18:1-5
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]According to a literal reading of Revelation and Daniel, in the end of days, coming world leader will establish Babylon as his base of operation as he establishes a world government. The women in the basket is taken to Babylon. In Babylon a base, then a house will be made ready for her, in the end of days, she will be fully established in the world. [/SIZE]
 

blessedhope

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And Then I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a flying roll.
2 And he said unto me, What seest thou? And I answered, I see a flying roll; the length thereof is twenty cubits, and the breadth thereof ten cubits.
3 Then said he unto me, This is the curse that goeth forth over the face of the whole earth: for every one that stealeth shall be cut off as on this side according to it; and every one that sweareth shall be cut off as on that side according to it.
4 I will bring it forth, saith the LORD of hosts, and it shall enter into the house of the thief, and into the house of him that sweareth falsely by my name: and it shall remain in the midst of his house, and shall consume it with the timber thereof and the stones thereof.
5 Then the angel that talked with me went forth, and said unto me, Lift up now thine eyes, and see what is this that goeth forth.
6 And I said, What is it? And he said, This is an ephah that goeth forth. He said moreover, This is their resemblance through all the earth.
7 And, behold, there was lifted up a talent of lead: and this is a woman that sitteth in the midst of the ephah.
8 And he said, This is wickedness. And he cast it into the midst of the ephah; and he cast the weight of lead upon the mouth thereof.
9 Then lifted I up mine eyes, and looked, and, behold, there came out two women, and the wind was in their wings; for they had wings like the wings of a stork: and they lifted up the ephah between the earth and the heaven.
10 Then said I to the angel that talked with me, Whither do these bear the ephah?
11 And he said unto me, To build it an house in the land of Shinar: and it shall be established, and set there upon her own base.
 

blessedhope

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And
[SIZE=10pt]Scripture says Babylon will be completely destroyed and no one will ever live there again. It will be a place for creatures of the night. This prophecy has never been fulfilled. People have lived there and are still living there today. The complete prophetic fulfillment apparently is still in the future.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]According to Bible prophecy the city of Babylon is destroyed near the end of the age just before the return of Jesus Christ. Many scholars question whether Babylon in prophecy is actually a physical place or if it should just represent the religious or economic systems of the world. Today it would appear to many that spiritual Babylon is in Rome and economic Babylon is New York City. Nevertheless, Bible prophecy is quite clear that there will be an actual Babylon on the plains of Shinar (Iraq) in the end times. This city will become the headquarters for the end time world system led by the Beast Antichrist and his Kingdom that will rule the world. Scholars question how this poor insignificant place can someday become the Babylon that is expressed in the book of Revelation. The likely answer is oil, the Antichrist, and Satan.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]The city of Babylon still exists at the same location as the ancient city of Babylon and it is located in south Iraq. Saddam Hussein had been quietly rebuilding the ancient ruins of Babylon for decades. Saddam had even had his name engraved on the stones of some of the buildings along with Nebuchadnezzar. The gulf wars did disrupt the rebuilding of Babylon. There was damage done to the ancient ruins in the gulf war so the United States and other nations recently pledged to develop Babylon into a international world center and possibly a theme park based on her ancient wonders.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]The only thing that is holding up the rebuilding of Babylon Iraq from emerging into a world class tourist center for the rich and famous is stability in Iraq and development of their oil. Some now think that Iraq has larger oil reserves than Saudi Arabia[/SIZE]
 

blessedhope

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[SIZE=10pt]Babylon was where all organized false religions of the world got started and it is where they will end. There soon will be a world war between the forces of the pseudo-Christian West and the radical Islamic nations. The war against terrorism that we are now seeing is only the warm up.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]The Western forces will eventually be led by the [/SIZE] [SIZE=10pt]emerging Beast out of Europe[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] mentioned in Daniel and the book of Revelation. The West will defeat the Islamic nations and/or convince Islam to join the pluralistic world church. Under a peace agreement the city of Jerusalem will become an international religious center for 42 months. When the 42 months are up the Antichrist will stop all customary religious worship, enter the rebuilt temple in Jerusalem and claim to be above anything called God. He will demand to be worshiped by all. He will then move his headquarters to Babylon and those that support him will war against all those that will not bow their knee to him.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]He will find Babylon Iraq to be an ideal spot because [/SIZE][SIZE=10pt]Allah has the same characteristics of Satan[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt]. He will be readily accepted by Muslims when he becomes known, although he will not identify with Allah of Islam. He will claim to be above anything called God. The worldwide power base of Islam and the Roman Catholic Church will be the foundations for the worship of Himself but he will soon turn on all religion that confess that God is in heaven. From that power base he will bring in a new political and economic system. Soon after, his supporters will seek to kill all who confess Jesus/Jehovah as Lord. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]As his crusade against the God of Heaven develops and prospers this city will become the center of world government and religion. Riches of all the nations will pour into Babylon. It will again become a great city in a very short time. [/SIZE][SIZE=10pt]Zechariah 5:7-11 tells us that in these end times wickedness will be brought to a house built for it on the plains of Shinar (this is located in Iraq). [/SIZE] [SIZE=10pt]Many other great cities of the world may not even exist at this point due to prior wars that brought this leader into power.[/SIZE]
 

blessedhope

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Some say that Babylon has to be on the sea and must be a sea port! Yes it is not on the sea but it is very close and what does the bible really say, a lot of people gloss over the word of GodJeues or just hear say!!! For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off, 18And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city! They saw what???? the smoke not the city>>>> very interesting.
 

blessedhope

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You might find this very interesting, They are building a super port in Basrah just where> you got it just south of Babylon>>>>MMMMM<<<<<< Building the future and business in IRAQ with Basrah Building Exhibition
Basrah enjoys being in an area of geographical importance to Iraq and the world. It is in neighbor with three states Kuwait, the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and Iran and command to top of Gulf. It is the only port city of Iraq and most secure route in order to reach Baghdad, Najaf and Karbala. Basrah is supported by an extensive and relatively inexpensive labor market and is considered the gateway to access the whole country to provide goods and services.
 

BjornFree

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heretoeternity said:
Wrong...Sabbath keeping comes from Genesis 2 in the Bible when God created the the seventh day of the week, He rested, blessed it and sanctified the day (set it aside for Holy purposes)...so it is as much as part of Creation as people are...this was before any denominational influence...no other day of the week was given such glorification by our Creator..NONE!
It seems to me that all denominational specialities, including those which contradict one another, are based parts of the bible, and that includes my particular non-denominational denomination, with its own unique creedless creed.
Catholicism, being based on Catholicism, is perhaps an exception, although it nevertheless claims to be 'bible compliant'.
 

heretoeternity

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It seems to me that all denominational specialities, including those which contradict one another, are based parts of the bible, and that includes my particular non-denominational denomination, with its own unique creedless creed.
Catholicism, being based on Catholicism, is perhaps an exception, although it nevertheless claims to be 'bible compliant'.


You should know it is not good to drink and drive, or drink and post...lol
 

blessedhope

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0 have a thick skin and don't let it bother you, enjoy the forum and threads! "Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee." Titus 2:13-15
 

BjornFree

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blessedhope said:
0 have a thick skin and don't let it bother you, enjoy the forum and threads! "Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee." Titus 2:13-15
It's your thread blessedhope and one response to your initial request for thoughts has been to relate 'Babylon the Great' to a denominational departure from the 4th commandment (which lead to my questioning of that response). Do I have your permission to take that further by explained how that the 4th commandment has not been violated but has, under the New Covenant, been raised to a higher level of spiritual application whereby every day (including the 7th) is now equally 'Holy'?
 

BjornFree

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[SIZE=9pt]Worshipping God on other than the 7th day of the week has been suggested as a major factor identifying those who constitute ‘Babylon the Great’.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]For me to respond to such a misunderstanding necessitates me abandoning my preference to simply trust and worship God with childlike faith, and revert to biblical text proofing, but here goes if needs must.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]Several passages from the bible can be taken to suggest that we now live under a New Covenant, and one of the most poignant is that of Matthew chapter 5, where one of Christ’s very first teachings clearly addresses the need for the Jews to grasp the fundamental change that would characterise God’s New Covenant. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt](But only after taking care to emphasise that, far from nullifying anything required under the Old Covenant, the changes would demand full observance whilst lifting each to a new and higher level of spiritual application.)[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]In doing so Christ takes six typical examples from the Old Covenant requirements and says of each “ye have heard that it was said of old ….. but I say unto you.”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]Christ then references the most extreme examples of those who obeyed the Mosaic commandments and says of them “except your righteousness shall exceed that of the scribes and the Pharisees you shall in no way enter the Kingdom of Heaven”.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]For instance it will no longer to be sufficient to refrain from ‘acts’ of adultery, you must now even refrain from adulterous and lustful ‘thoughts’.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]Now, since the six examples quoted by Christ where only typical examples one must, by extrapolation, apply the same principle of lifting the required level of compliance to each of the Mosaic commandments, including that of the 4th.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]For example “Ye have heard it said of old that thou shalt remember the Sabbath day to keep it Holy, but I say unto you, thou shalt keep every day Holy”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]And if anyone needs me to quote the other passages from the New Testament in support of keeping every day ‘Holy’, before they will accept that the 4th commandment was not exempt from the need to be lifted to a new and higher level of spiritual requirement, then nothing that I say will sink in.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, and last but not least 1st/8th ….. all Holy unto the Lord. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]Babylon the Great determined by making a special case of strict observant of the 4th commandment?[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]Sheer SDA/Herbert Armstrong denominationalism.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]QED [/SIZE]
 

Trekson

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Good post Oneoff. Heb. 4 confirms that thought-line and I have written the same before.
 

Eoreris

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If you live under a prehistoric rock and believe God still hangs out in the middle east then you will be disappointed. God has always involved himself with Superpower nations. God is not stuck on some destroyed temple with a small piece of a wailing wall somewhere with the hope the people there will accept his Son. No, he has moved on.. and with a new nation.. A super power.. He will send his other Son to it soon.. This (New city now fully built) is the mystery Babylon (The hometown of the Beast and his many buildings and towers). Christ will give his brother the (Rod of iron) and he will break the Nations of Earth into submission.
 
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brakelite

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Oneoff said:
[SIZE=9pt]Worshipping God on other than the 7th day of the week has been suggested as a major factor identifying those who constitute ‘Babylon the Great’.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]For me to respond to such a misunderstanding necessitates me abandoning my preference to simply trust and worship God with childlike faith, and revert to biblical text proofing, but here goes if needs must.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]Several passages from the bible can be taken to suggest that we now live under a New Covenant, and one of the most poignant is that of Matthew chapter 5, where one of Christ’s very first teachings clearly addresses the need for the Jews to grasp the fundamental change that would characterise God’s New Covenant. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt](But only after taking care to emphasise that, far from nullifying anything required under the Old Covenant, the changes would demand full observance whilst lifting each to a new and higher level of spiritual application.)[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]In doing so Christ takes six typical examples from the Old Covenant requirements and says of each “ye have heard that it was said of old ….. but I say unto you.”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]Christ then references the most extreme examples of those who obeyed the Mosaic commandments and says of them “except your righteousness shall exceed that of the scribes and the Pharisees you shall in no way enter the Kingdom of Heaven”.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]For instance it will no longer to be sufficient to refrain from ‘acts’ of adultery, you must now even refrain from adulterous and lustful ‘thoughts’.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]Now, since the six examples quoted by Christ where only typical examples one must, by extrapolation, apply the same principle of lifting the required level of compliance to each of the Mosaic commandments, including that of the 4th.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]For example “Ye have heard it said of old that thou shalt remember the Sabbath day to keep it Holy, but I say unto you, thou shalt keep every day Holy”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]And if anyone needs me to quote the other passages from the New Testament in support of keeping every day ‘Holy’, before they will accept that the 4th commandment was not exempt from the need to be lifted to a new and higher level of spiritual requirement, then nothing that I say will sink in.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, and last but not least 1st/8th ….. all Holy unto the Lord. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]Babylon the Great determined by making a special case of strict observant of the 4th commandment?[/SIZE]
[SIZE=9pt]Sheer SDA/Herbert Armstrong denominationalism.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9pt]QED [/SIZE]
Your very first line, quote: Worshiping God on other than the 7th day of the week has been suggested as a major factor identifying those who constitute ‘Babylon the Great, is utter nonsense. Sorry to be so blunt, but such a false declaration, whether deliberate or from ignorance, I must refute. If deliberate, it is a lie...if from ignorance, I wonder why you would dare comment having not studied the teachings of those who keep the Sabbath and maintain the observance of Sunday as constituting Babylon. Might I suggest you do some more homework and come back? What you are claiming is that Seventh Day Adventists and other Sabbath keepers not only don't worship God on any day other than Sabbath, but teach that if others do, they are a part of Babylon. Can you offer a reference to substantiate that claim?