Liberals (anti-Christian folk) are illogical and dangerous

[Naomi25]

I suppose we must agree to disagree on God's leading here. Only time (when Christ returns) will tell...and I pray he does not ask you why you let your friends continue in opposition to him.
You know...most Christians don't really want to see people condemned. I know homosexual people too. I know plenty of unsaved people who are just plain, decent folks...more decent than some Christians I know. I would like, in my human nature, to believe all will be saved. That "love conquers". But the bible is quite clear that our...wishes, don't line up with Gods. That our 'love' is not God's love. We can't really see until we grasp the magnitude of sin against a holy God, and that to be all loving, he also has to be all judging. To let sin stand, he could not be all loving. Not a single one of us (be it a sin of pride, a sin of greed, or theft, or murder, or lust, or gluttony, or lies or homosexuality) could stand before this God. That's the reason we have to be covered by Christ. It's the only way. No matter the sin, it's always in Christ. But how we, after standing at the foot of the cross, then turn around on his extended mercy, and continue on in the behavior he died for? How can we not fight, tooth and nail against our sin? For everything that he gave...isn't it worth it?
I know you don't agree with me, I know you don't see it. But I ask that you set aside your notion that all I say and do is from hate or fear. Well...perhaps fear...I fear for them. I fear for you. But if I hated them, then I would say nothing.

 

[Naomi25]

However: A person I do know is my Asian-born Lesbian friend. To her your claims of loving homosexuals and just hating homosexuality would sound like “I love Asians, I just hate slanty eyes.”

Just a quick question about this....what would you say about Muslims? Do you find the person inextricable from their faith? Do you approve of Islam because you want to love the people? Do you hate the people because of the religion they follow?

 

[junobet]

Just a quick question about this....what would you say about Muslims? Do you find the person inextricable from their faith? Do you approve of Islam because you want to love the people? Do you hate the people because of the religion they follow?

I respect the fact that my Muslim friends hold their faith to be true just as I hold my Christian faith to be true, which is the basis of respectful interfaith dialogue, in which we seek for what we have in common rather than for what separates us.

 

[junobet]

I suppose we must agree to disagree on God's leading here. Only time (when Christ returns) will tell...and I pray he does not ask you why you let your friends continue in opposition to him.
You know...most Christians don't really want to see people condemned. I know homosexual people too. I know plenty of unsaved people who are just plain, decent folks...more decent than some Christians I know. I would like, in my human nature, to believe all will be saved. That "love conquers". But the bible is quite clear that our...wishes, don't line up with Gods. That our 'love' is not God's love. We can't really see until we grasp the magnitude of sin against a holy God, and that to be all loving, he also has to be all judging. To let sin stand, he could not be all loving. Not a single one of us (be it a sin of pride, a sin of greed, or theft, or murder, or lust, or gluttony, or lies or homosexuality) could stand before this God. That's the reason we have to be covered by Christ. It's the only way. No matter the sin, it's always in Christ. But how we, after standing at the foot of the cross, then turn around on his extended mercy, and continue on in the behavior he died for? How can we not fight, tooth and nail against our sin? For everything that he gave...isn't it worth it?
I know you don't agree with me, I know you don't see it. But I ask that you set aside your notion that all I say and do is from hate or fear. Well...perhaps fear...I fear for them. I fear for you. But if I hated them, then I would say nothing.

Please remember: “Beloved, let us love one another, because love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. 8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. 9This is how God’s love was revealed among us: God sent His one and only Son into the world, so that we might live through Him.…” (1 John 4:7-9)
I love my Lesbian friend and her now betrothed wife just the way God made them. I believe He blesses and cherishes their love for each other, and does not want it slandered on the grounds of a superficial Biblical exegesis and/or having given the wrong theological answer to the Euthyphro Dilemma.
However, now that we agreed to disagree on a moral issue that apparently was so much of a side issue to Christ, that He is not recorded as explicitly mentioning it in any of the Gospels, maybe we can talk about what we think the Bible tells us about His views on peace and social justice:
Why should followers of the Lamb want to vote for “hawks” over “doves” in foreign relations?
Why should we see our Muslim brothers and sisters with the eyes of Donald Trump/Geert Wilders/Pauline Hanson etc. rather than with the eyes with which Christ saw the Samaritans?
Why should we want the rich to pay ever lower taxes rather than satisfy the needs of the poor?
Why should we not be on the side of those who hunger and crave for justice? …

 

[ScaliaFan]

Liberal lies:

• We were under sniper fire
• We left the White House dead broke
• I never sent or received Classified emails
• I "bleached" out those emails but they were only about yoga (couldn't have the whole world know i do yoga!! OMG!!!!!!)
• She had no intent to destroy emails (just deleting them does not indicate intent.... uh... hmmm... HUH???)
• I never had sex with that woman
• depends on what the definition of the word "is" is...

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH :wacko:

more liberal lies:

the whole Bergdahl thing

it wasn't a ransom

We are not supporting Iran getting the bomb

 

[Naomi25]

I respect the fact that my Muslim friends hold their faith to be true just as I hold my Christian faith to be true, which is the basis of respectful interfaith dialogue, in which we seek for what we have in common rather than for what separates us.

This was not my point, and you didn't really answer my question.
I have no problem accepting that they hold their faith as true. And I have no problem talking to them with that firmly in view. It shouldn't affect how we treat them or relate to them.
My point was: those people shouting "Allah Akba" and running over children in the name of their god....do you see them as people brainwashed by a false religion (and here I don't particularly care if you want to call extremism 'false Islam' or just Islam, either fits my point), but otherwise people who need Christ's love to break through what they believe and are living. Or do you just shrug your head and say "they were born Islamic, that's just who they are, I need to accept they're damned and say nothing, or tell myself their activities are just part of them, so I'll love them as they are...even when they do something unacceptable.'

Eye colour cannot be changed, but it doesn't require to be acted upon, either. Sexual orientation may be from birth, but so is human pride. It's not a sin to God until people choose it before Him, repeatedly.

 

[junobet]

This was not my point, and you didn't really answer my question.
I have no problem accepting that they hold their faith as true. And I have no problem talking to them with that firmly in view. It shouldn't affect how we treat them or relate to them.
My point was: those people shouting "Allah Akba" and running over children in the name of their god....do you see them as people brainwashed by a false religion (and here I don't particularly care if you want to call extremism 'false Islam' or just Islam, either fits my point), but otherwise people who need Christ's love to break through what they believe and are living. Or do you just shrug your head and say "they were born Islamic, that's just who they are, I need to accept they're damned and say nothing, or tell myself their activities are just part of them, so I'll love them as they are...even when they do something unacceptable.'

Eye colour cannot be changed, but it doesn't require to be acted upon, either. Sexual orientation may be from birth, but so is human pride. It's not a sin to God until people choose it before Him, repeatedly.

I’m afraid I’m still not quite sure what’s your actual question: If my Lesbian friend had been raised by her Vietnamese biological parents rather than by the German Catholic family that adopted her, likelihood is that she’d still be lesbian (created and loved by God as such), but that she’d not be a Christian now. If any of us had been born into a Muslim, Jewish or Buddhist family likelihood is that we’d be Muslim, Jewish or Buddhist now. Do I think that God loves homosexuals less than heterosexuals and adherents of other religions less than Christians? No.

If you wanted to hear my views on radical Islam and terrorism you should have said so, especially after I’ve already told you that I don’t equate Islam as a whole to its radical fringes. Please note that most Muslims despise ISIS's and other terrorists' acts just as much as you and I do and regard terrorism as utterly un-Islamic.

So yes, I think these poor Muslim kids, who joined ISIS etc., have been brainwashed and misled by hate-preachers, their understandable rage and lack of religious education making them easy prey. My heart goes out not only to their victims but also to them and their distraught families. That’s why I very much encourage Islamic religion being taught at German schools in the very way that Protestant and Catholic religion are taught here and want all conceivable support for programms and policies preventing radicalization.

Let me ask you about a case that’s shaking Europe at the moment: Are you ok with French policemen forcing Muslim women to undress on the beach whilst islamophobic bystanders sneer and the women's children cry, or would your Christian compassion never allow you to vote for politicians who support such senseless and counterproductive cruelty?

 

[Naomi25]

I’m afraid I’m still not quite sure what’s your actual question: If my Lesbian friend had been raised by her Vietnamese biological parents rather than by the German Catholic family that adopted her, likelihood is that she’d still be lesbian (created and loved by God as such), but that she’d not be a Christian now. If any of us had been born into a Muslim, Jewish or Buddhist family likelihood is that we’d be Muslim, Jewish or Buddhist now. Do I think that God loves homosexuals less than heterosexuals and adherents of other religions less than Christians? No.

Yeah...you are missing my point! I said: "Eye colour cannot be changed, but it doesn't require to be acted upon, either. Sexual orientation may be from birth, but so is human pride. It's not a sin to God until people choose it before Him, repeatedly.

My point was that comparing being born a homosexual and being born with brown eyes, is not comparable. It's when something becomes acted upon, that it becomes a problem. I was born a heterosexual. If I decided to start sleeping around before I got married, that would have been sinful in God's eyes. Not because of the sexual persuasion I was born to, but because I was acting contrary to his wishes in regards to marriage. I know people can't help who they are attracted to. That's not my point. My point is that actions that follow desire instead of God's word and God's teaching about sex, is a sin. A person can identify as gay, but not pursue relationships that are homosexual...that is righteous in God's eye. Just as a heterosexual needs to wait until marriage to be righteous in his eye.

If you wanted to hear my views on radical Islam and terrorism you should have said so, especially after I’ve already told you that I don’t equate Islam as a whole to its radical fringes. Please note that most Muslims despise ISIS's and other terrorists' acts just as much as you and I do and regard terrorism as utterly un-Islamic.

That was not really my point. The point I was trying to make, as explained above, didn't really have anything to do with Islam. I was just trying to explain that comparing something we DO, regardless of how we are born, is not comparable to just having brown eyes. I was using Islam as an example of how we can lovingly call them out of something. You can't call a person out of having brown eyes!!

But, let's just say you could be right...that having brown eyes is comparable to being born homosexual. Paul says that if your eye causes you to lust then:

If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body go into hell.
(Matthew 5:29-30)

So, if anything...anything, causes you to act in a way that the bible calls sinful...it needs to be given up. Not to gain salvation, but in response to it. A new heart cannot condone continuing behaviour that mocks Christ's sacrifice.

Let me ask you about a case that’s shaking Europe at the moment: Are you ok with French policemen forcing Muslim women to undress on the beach whilst islamophobic bystanders sneer and the women's children cry, or would your Christian compassion never allow you to vote for politicians who support such senseless and counterproductive cruelty?

No. I can, perhaps, understand from a political standpoint why they require to be able to see if it's a man or woman under a burqa...if there's a weapon under it. But from a religious stand point...what's the point? "How dare you dress modestly!"
The women are required to dress that way by their religion, and the men. I think that the reasons they make women wear it is questionable at best and abuse at worst. But a lot of the women want to wear it...it's culturally what they feel comfortable in. I don't think it would matter if a Muslim woman became a Christian and still wanted to wear what she does....the bible is clear that unless cultural norms inhibit or pervert the full acceptance of the gospel, then it is fine. As fine as me choosing to wear jeans. The new covenant gives Christians liberty in many things! I know you think all things. But you have to draw the line somewhere, don't you? I see the bible drawing clear lines...but I suddenly wonder if and where you do. What would you find fine in the pulpit on next to you in the pew? Thieves, adulterers, murderers, embezzlers, physically abusive husbands and fathers? What? And I am using these categories in the terms of people who are open in these actions and don't see "Christian" as any kind of excuse to stop said behaviours. Would you let these people teach you the bible? Tell you that their heart has been made new?

 

[Naomi25]

I feel I should clarify something here....you seem intent on using your lesbian friend as an example of your belief towards homosexuals, and your acceptance of them. And I suddenly found myself wondering if you thought my behaviour to her, should I meet her, would be similar to those horrid, "westbro baptist" people. Talk about hell and those who deserve it...huh?! (sorry, small joke!)
I don't think the gospel message is best served by forever harping on sin. I think it needs to be clearly stated...once. You need to let people know what you believe scripture is saying in regards to certain behaviours, in regards to the default nature of the human heart without Christ. But once they understand that, the best way...the only way, I believe, to speak to them about anything Christian, is to love them. Be their friend, acknowledge your acceptance of who they are now...pray for who they may become with Jesus. Let them enter any conversation about God in their own way and always be upfront about where you're coming from and what you think scripture says...always in love though. Basically....try and emulate Jesus...who was the friend of sinners, but still told them to "go, and sin no more".

I hope that clarifies my position, somewhat....

 

[junobet]

Yeah...you are missing my point! I said: "Eye colour cannot be changed, but it doesn't require to be acted upon, either. Sexual orientation may be from birth, but so is human pride. It's not a sin to God until people choose it before Him, repeatedly.

My point was that comparing being born a homosexual and being born with brown eyes, is not comparable. It's when something becomes acted upon, that it becomes a problem. I was born a heterosexual. If I decided to start sleeping around before I got married, that would have been sinful in God's eyes. Not because of the sexual persuasion I was born to, but because I was acting contrary to his wishes in regards to marriage. I know people can't help who they are attracted to. That's not my point. My point is that actions that follow desire instead of God's word and God's teaching about sex, is a sin. A person can identify as gay, but not pursue relationships that are homosexual...that is righteous in God's eye. Just as a heterosexual needs to wait until marriage to be righteous in his eye.



That was not really my point. The point I was trying to make, as explained above, didn't really have anything to do with Islam. I was just trying to explain that comparing something we DO, regardless of how we are born, is not comparable to just having brown eyes. I was using Islam as an example of how we can lovingly call them out of something. You can't call a person out of having brown eyes!!

But, let's just say you could be right...that having brown eyes is comparable to being born homosexual. Paul says that if your eye causes you to lust then:

If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body go into hell.
(Matthew 5:29-30)

So, if anything...anything, causes you to act in a way that the bible calls sinful...it needs to be given up. Not to gain salvation, but in response to it. A new heart cannot condone continuing behaviour that mocks Christ's sacrifice.

[SIZE=medium]How could I have guessed you are still on about homosexuality after you had already suggested we agree to disagree on that one? You can’t let it go, can you? [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Had you actually read the thread on homosexuality which you commented on, you would have seen how I answer those questions of yours. In an attempt to explain to wormwood why it’s not sexual acts in and of themselves that are sinful but the thoughts and intentions behind them I even referred to Matthew 5:29-30. You may also want to ponder Matthew 15:11. In that thread I also go at length into the question which line I draw to freedom: It is strictly oriented at the one grand commandment that sums up all law that Christians are required to follow: the commandment of love, also phrased “Do to others as you would have them do to you.” (Luke 6:31). "Love does no harm to a neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.” (Romans 13:10).[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium] From my point of view a lot of what you wrote here violates this core Christian principle. And I share the pain that homosexuals and Muslims feel when they are being slandered, be it out of malice or mere thoughtlessness.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]If you are especially interested in the similarities between homophobia and racism you may want to ask somebody who very successfully fought the latter and is still fighting the former. So here’s from Desmond Tutu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQXH2-5mgNI[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]​[/SIZE]

No. I can, perhaps, understand from a political standpoint why they require to be able to see if it's a man or woman under a burqa...if there's a weapon under it. But from a religious stand point...what's the point? "How dare you dress modestly!"
The women are required to dress that way by their religion, and the men. I think that the reasons they make women wear it is questionable at best and abuse at worst. But a lot of the women want to wear it...it's culturally what they feel comfortable in. I don't think it would matter if a Muslim woman became a Christian and still wanted to wear what she does....the bible is clear that unless cultural norms inhibit or pervert the full acceptance of the gospel, then it is fine. As fine as me choosing to wear jeans. The new covenant gives Christians liberty in many things! I know you think all things. But you have to draw the line somewhere, don't you? I see the bible drawing clear lines...but I suddenly wonder if and where you do. What would you find fine in the pulpit on next to you in the pew? Thieves, adulterers, murderers, embezzlers, physically abusive husbands and fathers? What? And I am using these categories in the terms of people who are open in these actions and don't see "Christian" as any kind of excuse to stop said behaviours. Would you let these people teach you the bible? Tell you that their heart has been made new?

[SIZE=medium]I’m glad to hear that we at least agree that every woman should have the right to dress however she wants to dress. Like you I also often wear jeans and I rarely ever cover my hair. Given your stated commitment to follow whatever it is that the Bible ‘plainly says’, I don’t quite get how you consolidate your choice of clothing with Deuteronomy 22:5 and 1 Cor. 11, but of course that’s your personal business.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]As for the case I mentioned: it’s not about Burkas but about ‘Burkinis’: Muslim swimwear that pretty much looks like a loose-fitting diving suit. And the women who were forced to undress on the beach weren’t even sporting a Burkini, just long sleeved shirts and headscarfs: [/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/aug/24/french-police-make-woman-remove-burkini-on-nice-beach[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]The Burka (full veil, covering even the eyes) is another Muslim garment that’s being hotly discussed among conservatives and right-wingers in Europe, even though the percentage of Muslim women in Europe who actually wear it verges against zero. And if I wanted to hide a gun and my identity, I would not even need a Burka: my wide long winter-coat, shawl and woolly hat would utterly suffice. The number of Muslim women in Europe wearing the Niqab (face-veil, excluding the eyes) is also very small. The last time I saw one was in Luton airport, where the problem of passport control was easily solved by letting her lift her face-veil in front of a female officer in a back-room.[/SIZE]


[SIZE=medium]However, seeing that we seem to agree on religious freedom and a woman’s right to wear whatever she wants to wear, again I ask myself, why you think that all Christians should vote for Conservative and right-wing parties. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]It’s not even as if all conservative and right-wing parties oppose equal rights for homosexuals these days, which seems to be what you care about most. Xenophobia and islamophobia is what they are striving on. In their attempt to hurt Muslims many right-wing hypocrites such as Geert Wilders present themselves not just as ‘feminist’ but as utterly gay-friendly. And (as in most other political issues) the American Chameleon Trump frequently changes his statements on LGTB rights to whatever he thinks his audience wants to hear.[/SIZE]

 

[ScaliaFan]

can you believe these liberals. BTW my definition of liberal is Anti-Christ. Think about it: they believe anything goes morally. What better definition of antiChrist can we find?

the lies and corruption just never end... every day (literally) we get more emails from the D candidate that show she used her office for personal gain, to the detriment of national security.. and worse than that, her D cronies protect her from justice... unbelievable

And people want to vote for her?? THAT is something i cannot comprehend... except that most people do not follow the news...

The Dems know this and are always catering and pandering to the low info people.. Unfortunately, a lot of poor people dependent on the gov are also not ones to inform themselves. So they are easily lied to...

liberals are the antichrists among us.. Does anyone doubt that (anyone who loves Jesus, that is)?

 

[Naomi25]

[SIZE=medium]How could I have guessed you are still on about homosexuality after you had already suggested we agree to disagree on that one? You can’t let it go, can you? [/SIZE]

Um. I'm only "still on" about homosexuality because that seemed to be the drum you kept banging....you know, with examples about your friend? But...see...watch me drop it.

[SIZE=medium]​[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]I’m glad to hear that we at least agree that every woman should have the right to dress however she wants to dress. Like you I also often wear jeans and I rarely ever cover my hair. Given your stated commitment to follow whatever it is that the Bible ‘plainly says’, I don’t quite get how you consolidate your choice of clothing with Deuteronomy 22:5 and 1 Cor. 11, but of course that’s your personal business.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]As for the case I mentioned: it’s not about Burkas but about ‘Burkinis’: Muslim swimwear that pretty much looks like a loose-fitting diving suit. And the women who were forced to undress on the beach weren’t even sporting a Burkini, just long sleeved shirts and headscarfs: [/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/aug/24/french-police-make-woman-remove-burkini-on-nice-beach[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]The Burka (full veil, covering even the eyes) is another Muslim garment that’s being hotly discussed among conservatives and right-wingers in Europe, even though the percentage of Muslim women in Europe who actually wear it verges against zero. And if I wanted to hide a gun and my identity, I would not even need a Burka: my wide long winter-coat, shawl and woolly hat would utterly suffice. The number of Muslim women in Europe wearing the Niqab (face-veil, excluding the eyes) is also very small. The last time I saw one was in Luton airport, where the problem of passport control was easily solved by letting her lift her face-veil in front of a female officer in a back-room.[/SIZE]


[SIZE=medium]However, seeing that we seem to agree on religious freedom and a woman’s right to wear whatever she wants to wear, again I ask myself, why you think that all Christians should vote for Conservative and right-wing parties. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]It’s not even as if all conservative and right-wing parties oppose equal rights for homosexuals these days, which seems to be what you care about most. Xenophobia and islamophobia is what they are striving on. In their attempt to hurt Muslims many right-wing hypocrites such as Geert Wilders present themselves not just as ‘feminist’ but as utterly gay-friendly. And (as in most other political issues) the American Chameleon Trump frequently changes his statements on LGTB rights to whatever he thinks his audience wants to hear.[/SIZE]

Um...my comment were on the Burkini's. I briefly mentioned burkas, because I can see why countries are concerned with them (you could hide a bus full of explosives under one!), but all the rest of my comments were on the swim wear.

I think I see an emerging pattern where what I say...what I try and get across, is completely misunderstood by you. Not pointing fingers, it could be as easily my fault as yours. But the result is not at all edifying, so I believe I'll sign off.

 

[junobet]

Um. I'm only "still on" about homosexuality because that seemed to be the drum you kept banging....you know, with examples about your friend? But...see...watch me drop it.

[SIZE=medium]I kept banging on? What a weird perception! Reading back in this thread I see myself desperately trying to stir the conversation in direction of social justice etc. with you ignoring all my questions about it.[/SIZE]

Um...my comment were on the Burkini's. I briefly mentioned burkas, because I can see why countries are concerned with them (you could hide a bus full of explosives under one!), but all the rest of my comments were on the swim wear.

I think I see an emerging pattern where what I say...what I try and get across, is completely misunderstood by you. Not pointing fingers, it could be as easily my fault as yours. But the result is not at all edifying, so I believe I'll sign off.

[SIZE=medium]Must have misunderstood that you were talking about Burkinis, sorry. As for seeing why countries are concerned with burkas, I should have thought that mentioning their virtual non-existence outside Afghanistan and my ‘winter-coat’ argument should have sufficed to show how ridiculous such concern is. But you are from Ausralia, aren’t you? I suppose you never get really cold winters, so there aren’t that many people around who are sensible enough to buy their coats a couple of sizes too big so that - when temperatures drop - they can wear layers of jumpers (or a bus full of explosives) under them. As far as I remember no terrorist attack in Australia or Europe was ever carried out by somebody wearing a Burka. Taking into account how terrorists did carry explosives so far, you could justly ask to ban backpacks and suitcases, and top that with a law that says all of us must wear skin-tight clothes. But that would make most people’s life rather complicated and uncomfortable, so it would not go down as well with the general public as anything that only targets Muslims and feeds irrational fear, mistrust and dischord in our societies. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]As a German I may be more sensitive to these things than you are. But we know that fascism needs hate-figures. When I read some Breitbart-articles I want to vomit: all I have to do is replace the word “Muslim” with “Jew” and I may as well be reading a copy of the “Stürmer”. Trump recently made [/SIZE][SIZE=medium]Breitbart News executive Steve Bannon his new campaign chief. Why should I as a follower of the Prince of Peace want to encourage people to vote for somebody who seems to be a climate-change denying copy-cat of Hitler and who allegedly asked about nuclear weapons "If we have them, why can't we use them?"?[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]http://www.cnbc.com/2016/08/03/trump-asks-why-us-cant-use-nukes-msnbcs-joe-scarborough-reports.html[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]https://thinkprogress.org/graphic-donald-trumps-terrifying-views-on-nuclear-weapons-1ee84d1b8f5c#.uz2op9o4w[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]There are some Christian nut-cases out there (not you of course) who’d love to actively spur on Armageddon, but I dare say most Christians in this world have a very different idea of what it means to be a good steward of God’s creation. [/SIZE]

,I think I see an emerging pattern where what I say...what I try and get across, is completely misunderstood by you. Not pointing fingers, it could be as easily my fault as yours. But the result is not at all edifying, so I believe I'll sign off.

[SIZE=medium]Yes, we do seem to have some serious communication-problems and I, too, wonder why that is. [/SIZE]

 

[ScaliaFan]

it's interesting when people say the antichrist is some CHURCH... Catholic or o/wise...

True, the Church Christ founded (Roman Catholic) has a lot of evil people in it... Masons are infiltrating the Church to try to destroy it from the inside... mason priests.. probably mason bishops... Sometimes i wonder if the pope is one... God knows.

But still, Jesus protects and guides his Church, which of course has more "ordinary" parishioners than it does hierarchy (priests, etc)

Anyway, the anti-Christ is... anti-Christ.. So to me the anti-Christ is SECULAR... a secular "church"

Jesus promised that the very gates of Hell would NOT prevail against His Church.. Mt 16:18

His Church is indestructible...

 

[mjrhealth]

Jesus promised that the very gates of Hell would NOT prevail against His Church.. Mt 16:18

Yes , so therfore your church cannot be His since it is full of heresy and wotks of the devil, as He said

Joh_8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

Since your church is full of the devils works how could it possibly be Christs, was it not the pharisses who said

Joh 8:48 Then answered the Jews, and said unto him, Say we not well that thou art a Samaritan, and hast a devil?

And Jesus resonse

Joh 8:49 Jesus answered, I have not a devil; but I honour my Father, and ye do dishonour me.

So if Christ has no devil how can you church full of the devils works be His???

 

[ScaliaFan]

Yes , so therfore your church cannot be His since it is full of heresy and wotks of the devil, as He said

you are so full of hate... or simple ignorance

in any case, i do agree that there are people who do not walk with Jesus (in His church). But you know, Jesus chose to live among us 2000 years ago and there were far more un-Christian people then than today.. presumably... And why would He choose to live among us THEN but not now?

that wouldn't make sense. Jesus loves us. He is with us now... and He is with us in a tangible way, which can only be found in the Catholic Church... That tangible way cannot be found anywhere else... "I will build My Church and the gates of Hell will not prevail against it" Mt 16:18

 

[mjrhealth]

you are so full of hate...

Hate, oh you mean we dont agree with your lies, if we did we wouild have to agree with teh devil, sorry cant do that not for you or anyman.

Jesus loves us. He is with us now... and He is with us in a tangible way

Oh yes He does, enough to put up with our pride, arrogance and stupidity, enough to watch our false religions grow, sa tha tone day He can say "its Ok God saw it coming". As for Christ what was it tha tDavid said,

Psa 139:7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
Psa 139:8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
Psa 139:9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;
Psa 139:10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
Psa 139:11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me.
Psa 139:12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee.
Psa 139:13 For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb.

Christ said He would be with "US" always, one does not need to be in Church to be with Jesus, He is our teacher and our Guide, our Shepherd and our rock, never to leave us, and I hope one day you will finally figure that out, nothing to do with your or any oter church. He is with us all, some choose to believe Him others choose to ignore Him.

God bless

 

[ScaliaFan]

Hate, oh you mean we dont agree with your lies, if we did we wouild have to agree with teh devil, sorry cant do that not for you or anyman.

Oh yes He does, enough to put up with our pride, arrogance and stupidity, enough to watch our false religions grow, sa tha tone day He can say "its Ok God saw it coming". As for Christ what was it tha tDavid said,

Psa 139:7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
Psa 139:8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
Psa 139:9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;
Psa 139:10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
Psa 139:11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me.
Psa 139:12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee.
Psa 139:13 For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb.

Christ said He would be with "US" always, one does not need to be in Church to be with Jesus, He is our teacher and our Guide, our Shepherd and our rock, never to leave us, and I hope one day you will finally figure that out, nothing to do with your or any oter church. He is with us all, some choose to believe Him others choose to ignore Him.

God bless

amazing how someone who sounds so hateful and petty-minded and accusatory

can quote scripture like he actually believes in it.

i guess u believe in everything except the part about Love your neighbor as yourself..

but gee.. i kinda thought that was the most important part

 

[ScaliaFan]

we see the absolute ugliness of where liberalism leads us

by what we see happening w/ this email scandal, and the Foundation scandal... and what is even creepier is the cover-up... the way the liberals defend their candidate, right or wrong... or even egregiously wrong...

or.. even on her way to Hell...

really creepy.

I hope everyone out there walking with Jesus is praying over this

 

[ScaliaFan]

Liberals are destroying this country.
they never criticize the loony decisions made by courts giving people the right to marry whomever or whatever (it will be marrying animals next?) AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH :blink:

they never think anything done to the unborn in the womb by murderous "doctors" or quacks or whomever is unacceptable, much less horrifying..

they have lost their souls. And if that were not bad enough, they want YOU to lose yours as well... Why do you think it is that they are always trying to FORCE us Christians to believe THEIR way?

homosexuals are usually thuggish in trying to get us to accept their "lifestyle"

baby killers... ditto

It's Satan or Jesus, Folks...

it really is as simple as that... don't let the devil complicate things in your mind