Love Your Enemies

[Butch5]

Hey! Don't throw away the KJV, it is extremely valuable to the serious seeker of truth. I use it constantly to study with. It is critical to know what that translation says instead of what the inspired Originals say. I have been able to clear up alot of wrong-headed thinking about our Father by comparing what is in the Greek and what is in the KJV. In order to unravel the garbage that's keeping out the Light, ya gotta have a KJV to find out what you've been mislead by. Youngs Concordance is cool.
fivesense

Well, said friend. Going to the Greek clears up a lot of confusion.

 

[jiggyfly]

Weak people have to cut down others , or belittle others , all in order to appear superior in their knowledge. Yet behind it all and behind the smokescreen remains a weak person.

Try reading your own post here.

There are a lot of people who can quote scripture. It makes them feel religious. They wear it like a purple robe and make sure everyone sees it. It is an inherited weakness in mankind to always want to appear religious. Jesus did not care much for them in his day and I suspect he feels the same today.

And if that is not enough these folks turn to using super religious words and call Our Lord Yeshua as though it is a badge of honor compared to just using plain old "Jesus" like the rest of us unwashed nobodies.

I find very few people who can shut off the (cut and paste) computer , close the bible , and actually have a decent intelligent conversation about meaningful things in Christianity.

Weak people have to cut down others , or belittle others , all in order to appear superior in their knowledge. Yet behind it all and behind the smokescreen remains a weak person.

Satan quoted scriptures perfectly but it gained him nothing.

A 5 year old child can explain Christianity and gain everything.

Scripture has never saved anyone. Understanding scripture can save a few.

 

[Robinson Crusoe]

well my friend, can you explain why all of those who were taught by Christ and the apostles "ALL" understood the teaching to be that Christians were not to use violence at all. For the first 300 years of Christianity Christians did not use violence. If you believe that this is wrong then please explain how all of these people, thousands, could all misunderstand the teachings the exact same way. Also, what does that say about Christ and the apostles? Would you contend that they were not able to teach the Gospel? IF it is your position that Christ did not preach non violence, please explain how this could have been the understanding of "all" of His disciples.

As far as the Ransom view is concerned, I never claimed to be unique. It is not "My" view, it is the view of the early church. It was the view of western Christianity until around n1100 A.D. at which point a Catholic bishop named Anselm of Canterbury changed it to the satisfaction model, which is the basis of the Penal model which most hold today. So, yes, your model of the atonement has Catholic roots. The eastern branch of Christianity still holds the Ransom view and has from the beginning, so it is not unique to me my friend, and I never said it was.

Your conclusions about ancient Christianity do not seem correct.

Here, Jesus is using violence and a weapon!

Which, by the way, seem completely in character with how He (remember, The Three are One) behaved, when Satan tempted Eve and how He promises to behave on Judgement Day.

In regards to Ransom, you seem to have a strong desire to see all other Biblical Perspectives suppressed, in favor of one Biblical Perspective. This is a common error, made by, what appear to be, immature Christians/immature Heathens. Not surprisingly, you are making the same error, in regards to Pacifism. You seem to have resolved the seemingly contradictory passages in The Bible, by simply choosing the ones that you prefer (for whatever reason) and ignoring the others. That seems like a dishonest way of resolving conflict. Albeit, an all too common way. Of course, that would stifle personal growth. So, it seems cursed, not blessed. Hence, I consider it a bad habit.

~God loves His Own.

Ah, have I said I don't believe in the bible? I believe in the scriptures, but I do not accept translations as being God breathed. Are you a KJVO?

I see, the only translation you accept is your own!

 

[jiggyfly]

Your conclusions about ancient Christianity do not seem correct.

Here, Jesus is using violence and a weapon!

Which, by the way, seem completely in character with how He (remember, The Three are One) behaved, when Satan tempted Eve and how He promises to behave on Judgement Day.

In regards to Ransom, you seem to have a strong desire to see all other Biblical Perspectives suppressed, in favor of one Biblical Perspective. This is a common error, made by, what appear to be, immature Christians/immature Heathens. Not surprisingly, you are making the same error, in regards to Pacifism. You seem to have resolved the seemingly contradictory passages in The Bible, by simply choosing the ones that you prefer (for whatever reason) and ignoring the others. That seems like a dishonest way of resolving conflict. Albeit, an all too common way. Of course, that would stifle personal growth. So, it seems cursed, not blessed. Hence, I consider it a bad habit.

~God loves His Own.



I see, the only translation you accept is your own!

No actually your mistaken , I like Young's, Knoch's, NLT, and several other translations including the Septuagint. I believe the original scripts were inerrant but I do not hold any translation as being inerrant. It is true that I do not hold to the most popular theologies, nor do I agree with many of the doctrines of the christian religious institution.

You seem to have resolved the seemingly contradictory passages in The Bible, by simply choosing the ones that you prefer (for whatever reason) and ignoring the others.

This is exactly what the majority do with the many scriptures that clearly express the restitution, reconciliation, and restoration of ALL things created. There is much more evidence in the scriptures supporting UR than there is of endless torment and annihilation summed together, yet many just want to ignore them.

 

[Robinson Crusoe]

...I like Young's, Knoch's, NLT, and several other translations including the Septuagint. I believe the original scripts were inerrant but I do not hold any translation as being inerrant. It is true that I do not hold to the most popular theologies, nor do I agree with many of the doctrines of the christian religious institution...This is exactly what the majority do with the many scriptures that clearly express the restitution, reconciliation, and restoration of ALL things created. There is much more evidence in the scriptures supporting UR [universal reconciliation] than there is of endless torment and annihilation summed together, yet many just want to ignore them.

I have been using Young's. I quoted a passage to you, in post #27, of this topic, from Revelations, on Universal Reconciliation and I used, Young's Literal Translation (circa 1900). However, you did not respond to it (which, quite frankly, I found unsurprisingly-disappointing). Instead, you asked what appeared to be, a silly question. Then, you went on to explain, that you couldn't believe the passage was true! Hence, it is reasonable to conclude, you, on the whole, do not believe in, The Bible (regardless of what language it is translated into English from, in The King James Version, Young's Literal Translation, The New Living Translation or any other respectable translation of it). So, what is your problem?

{I suppose I should tell you, there is an old topic on Universal Reconciliation, with lots of comments in it and absolutely no contributions from you!}

http://www.christian...0reconciliation

 

[jiggyfly]

I have been using Young's. I quoted a passage to you, in post #27, of this topic, from Revelations, on Universal Reconciliation and I used, Young's Literal Translation (circa 1900). However, you did not respond to it (which, quite frankly, I found unsurprisingly-disappointing). Instead, you asked what appeared to be, a silly question. Then, you went on to explain, that you couldn't believe the passage was true! Hence, it is reasonable to conclude, you, on the whole, do not believe in, The Bible (regardless of what language it is translated into English from, in The King James Version, Young's Literal Translation, The New Living Translation or any other respectable translation of it). So, what is your problem?

{I suppose I should tell you, there is an old topic on Universal Reconciliation, with lots of comments in it and absolutely no contributions from you!}

http://www.christian...0reconciliation

Disagreeing with your interpretation of what scripture means is not necessarily disagreeing with the scriptures. I'm not surprised with your conclusion either but thats ok we don't have to be in agreement or be friends to be polite to each other. God bless.

PS. I think I seen the thread before but didn't reply because it is full of posts that neglect the use of short paragraphs which makes them difficult to read.

 

[Robinson Crusoe]

Disagreeing with your interpretation of what scripture means is not necessarily disagreeing with the scriptures. I'm not surprised with your conclusion either but thats ok we don't have to be in agreement or be friends to be polite to each other. God bless.

PS. I think I seen the thread before but didn't reply because it is full of posts that neglect the use of short paragraphs which makes them difficult to read.

No, I don't think you are disagreeing with interpretation; I think you are in disagreement with The Bible (you just don't believe it). Your problems with it seem to be myriad. Your objections to it are classic. So, you are not unique. However, you seem to employee a fake Christian skin. I like out of the closet anti-Christians better, because they seem more authentic, than you do.

 

[jiggyfly]

No, I don't think you are disagreeing with interpretation; I think you are in disagreement with The Bible (you just don't believe it). Your problems with it seem to be myriad. Your objections to it are classic. So, you are not unique. However, you seem to employee a fake Christian skin. I like out of the closet anti-Christians better, because they seem more authentic, than you do.

Wow you can know all this about me from my posts here? Seems to me that you make judgments concerning others based on your assumptions and opinions. Of course your entitled to your own opinion but it is just that an opinion.

Let me re-confirm I disagree with many of your opinions and interpretations concerning the scriptures.

 

[truthquest]

Luke 6:35 "Love your enemies! Do good to them! Lend to them! And don't be concerned that they might not repay. Then your reward from heaven will be very great, and you will truly be acting as children of the Most High, for he is kind to the unthankful and to those who are wicked.


How does this scripture fit with the common eschatologies of today?

Jesus set the perfect example in all things including love and peace. He didn't just talk about it, He lived it. People were drawn to Jesus and crowds followed him around. He knew how to speak to people. I was so happy when I first learned about Jesus' message and this made me want to be a christian and try to be like Jesus. Although I know, I can't even come close but I make the effort to try.
In today's world, we have politics and the media telling us who our enemies are, brainwashing us, causing us to hate, drawing us away from the word of God. I know these are tools of Satan. And I have to constantly remind myself about what Jesus said, love each other, love your enemies, keep my commandments.
There is much more I could say but these are my immediate thoughts to your post.

 

[jiggyfly]

Jesus set the perfect example in all things including love and peace. He didn't just talk about it, He lived it. People were drawn to Jesus and crowds followed him around. He knew how to speak to people. I was so happy when I first learned about Jesus' message and this made me want to be a christian and try to be like Jesus. Although I know, I can't even come close but I make the effort to try.
In today's world, we have politics and the media telling us who our enemies are, brainwashing us, causing us to hate, drawing us away from the word of God. I know these are tools of Satan. And I have to constantly remind myself about what Jesus said, love each other, love your enemies, keep my commandments.
There is much more I could say but these are my immediate thoughts to your post.

Very good thoughts and in light of this I wonder how do you believe God will treat His enemies?

 

[truthquest]

Very good thoughts and in light of this I wonder how do you believe God will treat His enemies?

I don't pretend to fathom the mind of God but I do know that He loved the world so much that He sent his Son to die for all of us, and not just for some, so that we could have life in abundance. He makes His sun rise on the righteous and the unrighteous and brings rain for all. We are his children and He loves us more than we could ever love our own children. (and I would never burn one of my children)
God is love. His mercy and loving kindness is infinite and beyond understanding.
Jesus possessed and reflected his Father's qualities. So I believe that God has much more love, compassion and mercy for us than we can understand.

 

[jiggyfly]

I don't pretend to fathom the mind of God but I do know that He loved the world so much that He sent his Son to die for all of us, and not just for some, so that we could have life in abundance. He makes His sun rise on the righteous and the unrighteous and brings rain for all. We are his children and He loves us more than we could ever love our own children. (and I would never burn one of my children)
God is love. His mercy and loving kindness is infinite and beyond understanding.
Jesus possessed and reflected his Father's qualities. So I believe that God has much more love, compassion and mercy for us than we can understand.

Excellent, I agree, Father's essence is love.

 

[truthquest]

This was meant as a reply to another post that was very recently deleted. But I thought it would fit this thread as well.

God shows no partiality and is no respecter of persons. He made from one man every nation of men. In every nation anyone who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to him.
Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. If anyone says, "I love God," yet hates his brother, he is a liar. For anyone who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen.
Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, since as members of one body you were called to peace. Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice. Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.
Our fight is not against people on earth but against the rulers and authorities and the powers of this world's darkness, against the spiritual powers of evil in the heavenly world.
Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments." And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.


(Acts 10:34, 35; Acts 17:26, 1John 4:8, 20; Rom. 12:2; Col. 3:15; Eph. 4:31; Eph. 6:12; Matt. 22:37-40; 1Tim. 1:15)

 

[sniper762]

bin ladin is my enemy and i assume is yours. i DO NOT (nor will i ever) love him in any way.

 

[truthquest]

bin ladin is my enemy and i assume is yours. i DO NOT (nor will i ever) love him in any way.

The bible tells us who the enemy is and what kind of warfare we need to be concerned with, which is spiritual warfare.

1 Peter 5:8 Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.
Eph. 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

 

[sniper762]

Eph. 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

i think that the taliban is "all of the above"

 

[truthquest]

Eph. 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

i think that the taliban is "all of the above"

Most likely because you listen to and believe politics and the media. I choose to listen to and believe the word of God.

 

[sniper762]

well, please tell us YOUR view of the taliban. i assume that it is DIFFERENT than that of the media

 

[truthquest]

well, please tell us YOUR view of the taliban. i assume that it is DIFFERENT than that of the media

I will say this. Sometimes we can't see the forest for the trees. As I said, Satan is the enemy and we are involved in spiritual warfare. Satan hates man, he is a manslayer, and a liar, the father of the lie. He wants us to hate each other, kill each other (or support the killing), and to believe lies. He uses many tools to accomplish his purposes. He tries to blind our eyes to the truth. He wants to lead us away from the word of God and worship of the only true God. And every time he is able to do this, he considers it a victory and he celebrates.
This is especially true if he can get Christians to turn against each other. To turn a blind eye to the suffering and killing of fellow Christians, and even to support it, and stand behind it. He considers this a victory.
Most recently, as evidenced in the Middle East, the Christians there are being slaughtered and driven away from the Middle East. The Christian presence there is dwindling, Satan considers this a victory. And the saddest part to me is, that many Christians fully support all this.

 

[sniper762]

i agree that these actions are "satanic". im sorry but i dont see any connection as of how there have been any "lies" that have been spread by the media.
the fact remains that satan influences these killings of christians, the followers of this influence are his deciples, and i do not love satan nor his followers.

if i am blinded by the trees, it must be that you and i are not in the same forest.