Message in Tongues

[rockytopva]

I make the same claim against your position, merely the traditions of men in clinging to what was lost but will one day be returned.

And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. - Mark 16: 17, 18

Taking the scripture in context... People quit believing!

 

[biggandyy]

It's funny that you claim context... let's look at the context of the Great Commission Passage you have clipped, in it's entirity.

14 Afterward he appeared to the eleven themselves as they were reclining at table, and he rebuked them for their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they had not believed those who saw him after he had risen. 15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation. 16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up serpents with their hands; and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will recover.”

19 So then the Lord Jesus, after he had spoken to them, was taken up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God. 20 And they went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them and confirmed the message by accompanying signs.

The context is quite clear, those gifts were given to those present with him, not every believer they encounter. The signs are accompanying those who are going out who believe, not those who are gathered by those believers as evidenced in verse 20... the them there are the ones sent by Christ who are accomapnied by the signs.

 

[Lively Stone]

A lot of this hangs on the definition of what a Spiritual Gift IS. I'll give you my working definition:

A true Spiritual Gift (unique for the individual member of the Body of Christ) is a special gift to be used in edifying, uplifting, encouraging, enhancing, and furthering the Body of Christ. That special gift is one that can be consciously exercized at the sole discression of the recipient of that special gift.

That is to say, if a person must wait for the Holy Spirit to come on them in order to begin praying or singing in a different tongue then it is, by definition, NOT a spiritual gift, but a monergistic work of the Holy Spirit upon that person. That person is not exercizing a gift of their own free will but a subserviant vessel being used by the Holy Spirit.

Spiritual Gifts oft times are mundane, like Organization, or Fellowship, yet our greedy spirit yearns for the glamor and glitz of the gifts denied us at this present age. Just like a child wanting to use the scissors before they are ready. When they get hold of them everything looks like it needs cutting and many times they end up cutting themselves.

When we are ready for the sharpness of the Miracle Gifts the Lord will return them.

No one who has the gift of speaking in tongues has to wait on the Holy Spirit. when we have the ability, we use it whenever we wish. As in every gift, the responsibility is upon the one with the gift to use it or to hold back from using it. Wisdom is part of that. Where wisdom in its use may be lacking, we have the method for order given to us ins cripture, and we also have leaders to rein in those who misuse it. Biblical.



Furthermore:

17 And these signs will accompany those who believe:


'Those who believe' means everyone who would ever believe! Don't rope yourself into the false belief that everything Jesus said to the disciples was only for them. Taking on that stance is like painting yourself into a corner. It's a trap.



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[biggandyy]

Sorry, verse 14 says this: ..."and he rebuked them for their unbelief and hardness of heart..." Christ was addressing those whom He just rebuked and was telling only they would bear the power He granted them since they now believe because they could see Him.

 

[Lively Stone]

Sorry, verse 14 says this: ..."and he rebuked them for their unbelief and hardness of heart..." Christ was addressing those whom He just rebuked and was telling only they would bear the power He granted them since they now believe because they could see Him.

He continues to rebuke those who pick and choose what they will receive from His word.

[sup]17[/sup] These miraculous signs will accompany those who believe:


Everyone who believes should expect Holy Spirit power to work in and through them. It is only unbelief that will guarantee that He won't.

 

[biggandyy]

Accompany means to go along with... those who were travelling to deliver the word, those He was commanding at that time.

It's clear, that passage is for those in the scene only.

 

[Lively Stone]

Accompany means to go along with... those who were travelling to deliver the word, those He was commanding at that time.

It's clear, that passage is for those in the scene only.

Accompany means what it says...all the signs He mentions: commanding demons, speaking in tongues, performing healings (raising the dead!) and divine protection follow those who put their faith in Jesus Christ. All those who do, no matter who. It is all-inclusive!

Every command He gives in His word is for us today. Believe it or miss out on some phenomenal blessings of God!


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[rockytopva]

Well, then, I got something no one else has! hallelujah!

Accompany means to go along with... those who were travelling to deliver the word, those He was commanding at that time.

It's clear, that passage is for those in the scene only.

I thank God that all that is a lie.

 

[Lively Stone]

Well, then, I got somethi


I thank God that all that is a lie.

Yes... a big one.

 

[rockytopva]

Who hath directed the Spirit of the LORD, or being his counsellor hath taught him? - Isaiah 40:13

The Spirit of God is a free Spirit in the sense that he does not follow the dictates of men. It is important that he leads and we follow.

 

[Lively Stone]

Who hath directed the Spirit of the LORD, or being his counsellor hath taught him? - Isaiah 40:13

The Spirit of God is a free Spirit in the sense that he does not follow the dictates of men.

Now, THAT should be an eye-opener for some!

 

[biggandyy]

So now I am a liar, Satan, going to Hell, deceiver, etc... all because I disagree with a minor issue??? No wonder the skeptics look at what passes as Christian Scholarship and love and belly-laugh.

 

[Lively Stone]

No one is calling anyone a liar. Satan is the great deceiver and liar. Often believers will fall victim to his lie concerning something or other. It is his way to hold King's kids back from achieving and having all that Jesus died to give them.

His greatest desire is to cause us to be deceived just enough to keep us from being effective in ministry. When a person denies the gifts of the Holy Spirit, he is as good as set aside as a formidable soldier for Christ, leaving the real spiritual warfare for those who accept the anointing of those same gifts that he denies.

 

[veteran]

In preparing for this disputation I came across a very succinct and easy to read pre-prepared disputation and apology for Cessationism (the entire point of the discussion). I will reprint it here for your thoughtful consideration. The direct link appears below:



>> LINK <<

Good dissertation.

That is also confirmed by the fact that when the cloven tongue Christ's Apostles spoke on Pentecost, everyone present understood in the very language dialect of their birth. The "new tongues" of Mark 17:16 is kainos glossa in the Greek, meaning 'new languages'.

That idea of new languages is not about some unknown mystical language, but foreign languages of the world new to one's mother tongue, which is exactly... how the cloven tongue on Pentecost manifested per Acts 2. It's true sign today would be if you only speak one language and went to preach to a foreign people that didn't know your own language. It would manifest in their language dialects of all those present, not as some form of gibberish that they could not understand.

 

[IanLC]

There is nothing wrong with believing that Christ through the Holy Spirit endows gifts and power to man. Yes there are some heretical and demonic beliefs on spiritual gifts, but growing up and currently being a Christian of the pentecostal-holiness persuasion I believe and from my personal relationship with the Lord Jesus that the charismata and gifts of the Holy Spirit are given and needed for the believer, church, and witnessing to the world. I focus more son on becoming whole in Jesus, living in a holy and wholly life. Your life witnesses of Christ more than any spiritual gift the fruit of the Spirit are more important than the gifts. Christ first, fuit second, gifts third!

 

[rockytopva]

Good stuff there UHCAlan and Lively Stone!