New Covenant only for Jews?

[Ronald Nolette]

As this thread has been hijacked by numerous false accusations and personal attacks, I would like to direct it back to the original question.

Is the New Covenant as speeled out in its entirety in Jer. 31:31-34 only for ehtnnic Israel at a point in the future as the number is defined by other Scriptures?

Here is the New covenant as God spoke it:

Jeremiah 31:31-34
King James Version

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


I have made my position very clear. this passage only mentions ethnic Israel and that God WILL make a covenant with them.

I also with several verses showed this will happen after god brings them back in th eland, judges them, purgesd the unbeliever4s and that the remaining 1/3 of ethnic Israel will get saved and fulfill this passage.

All who disagree and say this passage now refers tot eh church- you have yet to show one verse that shows the transference of this passage to the body of Christ.

And after repeated requests and now over 380 answers on this thread, not one person has shown historically the fulfilment of this passage as they say it has been fuflilled.

Show fro history the fulfilment and show form Scripture the transference from future national Israel to the church and you win.

 

[Keraz]

The Church is Israel:

Just as the Gentile Ruth, an ancestor of Israel's Messiah: Matthew 1:5-16, could say to the Israelite Naomi: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God. Ruth 1:16, so Gentiles in the church have been grafted into Israel. Romans 11:17,24, Ephesians 2:12-19, Galatians 3:29

That is: all genetic Jews in the church remain members of Judah or Benjamin, the tribes they were born into. Romans 11:1 And all genetic Gentiles in the church have been grafted into Israel and so will be assigned into its tribes, as per: Ezekiel 47:21-23, Isaiah 66:21 and as seen by John in Revelation 7:9

So the entire church represents the 12 tribes of Israel. This is necessary, for all those in the church are saved by the New Covenant, which is to be made only with the Israelites of God. Hebrews 8:10

John 10:16 refers to the "other sheep" of believers who are Gentiles being brought into "this fold" of Israel, which is the "one fold" of the church. God knows who His people are, Amos 9:9, and every believer will be placed in the tribe suited to their abilities and characteristics. Revelation 7:9-14

Also, all those in the church, no matter whether they are ethnic Jews, Acts 22:3 or ethnic Gentiles, Romans 16:4b, have become spiritually-circumcised Israelites, if they have undergone the spiritual circumcision of water-immersion (burial) baptism into Jesus. Romans 2:29, Philippians 3:3, Colossians 2:11-13

The books of James and Peter are addressed to the twelve tribes, which is the same as addressing people in the church, people with faith in Christ , James 1:3, that is: Christians, people who have been born again in Jesus and who anticipate His Return.

All those in the church, from every tribe, race, nation and language, are spiritually Abraham's seed, by their faith. Galatians 3:29 And Abraham's seed is Israel. Isaiah 41:8-10 So the entire church membership are Israelites of God. Galatians 6:16

This literally means we are the ‘Overcomers for God’, or ‘God’s Victorious people’. Seen in each of the seven Church’s of Revelation and in Isaiah 56:1-8

Not just the Jews in the church, but also the Gentiles in the church, are all spiritually Abraham's seed of promise as Isaac was and as Jesus is the one and only true Seed. And so the peoples of the church, Jews and those from every race, nation and language, every faithful believing Christian is an heir of all the as yet, unfulfilled promises made by God to Israel in all of the Bible: Romans 8:16-18, Ephesians 1:11-14


Zechariah 8:7-8 The Lord says: I am going to rescue My people from wherever they are in the world and I will bring them back into the holy Land, to Jerusalem. They will be My people and I shall be their God in truth and righteousness.

The Prophesies are clear; it is a people that God foreknew whom He will rescue, redeem, restore and forgive their sins and misdeeds. No other than the Northern tribes of the House of Israel, scattered among the nations and ‘lost’ to our knowledge, but not to God.
Now; they form the majority of the Christian peoples, the one Church of God.

I have made my position very clear. this passage only mentions ethnic Israel and that God WILL make a covenant with them.

Your position and the belief of a separate Church and Israel, is wrong.
There is only ONE people of God. John 17:20-23, Ephesians 2:11-18, Romans 2:10-11

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Just as the Gentile Ruth, an ancestor of Israel's Messiah: Matthew 1:5-16, could say to the Israelite Naomi: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God. Ruth 1:16, so Gentiles in the church have been grafted into Israel. Romans 11:17,24, Ephesians 2:12-19, Galatians 3:29

I am not going to address the rest of your post because this is so wrong!

Yes Ruth said that, but that did not make her an Israeli. One can be part of a people without having the ethnic makeup.

And Gentiles in the church have not been grafted in to Israel, we have been grafted into jesus! Sloppy reading skills produce sloppy conclusions.

Jesus is the vine we are grafted into not Israel! Do you need me to post the verses that show Israel is not the vine?

 

[Keraz]

Do you need me to post the verses that show Israel is not the vine?

Isaiah 5:7 The vine of the Lord of Hosts is Israel....

 

[Jay Ross]

Isaiah 5:7 The vine of the Lord of Hosts is Israel....

As is usual, Keraz uses his own "translation" and comes up with the wrong understanding. This is what the NET Bible renders for this one verse.

Isaiah 5:7: - 7 Indeed Israel is the vineyard of the Lord who commands armies,

the people of Judah are the cultivated place in which he took delight.
He waited for justice, but look what he got - disobedience!
He waited for fairness, but look what he got - cries for help!​

Oh well he is not the only misguided member on this forum.

 

[Keraz]

John 15:5-6 I am the Vine and you are the branches......Abide in Me and bear much fruit,

The point is that we Christians, who belong to Jesus, are the peoples who bear the fruit of the Spirit.

The new Covenant will be made between the Lord and the Christian people: peoples from every tribe, race, nation and language.
When we go to live in all of the holy Land. Ezekiel 34:11-31 Read carefully and understand verse 25.

 

[Mark51]

Why does it say the "New Covenant" Jesus made is only for the Jews?

Hebrews 8:8 - But God found fault with the people and said: “The days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah.

This new covenant discussed at Hebrews 8;&-13 is not referring to fleshly Israel/Judah-as a nation/religion-but to "spiritual" Israel. Furthermore, it is referring to the 144.000 anointed for a heavenly reward. Compare only a few supporting scriptures: Luke 12:32; 14:16-24; John 10:16; 14:2, 3; Acts 10:1-48; Romans 2:28, 29; 8:14-17; 2 Corinthians 5;16-18; Galatians 3:28; 4:5-7; 6:16; 1 Peter 2:7-10.

 

[Johann]

Oh well he is not the only misguided member on this forum.

Then why not direct them in the right path Jay?
Which Bible are you reading from and what tools are you using? Surely there are members here who would give their right arm to know what you are using?
Talking about serious students of the scriptures.

 

[amigo de christo]

Then why not direct them in the right path Jay?
Which Bible are you reading from and what tools are you using? Surely there are members here who would give their right arm to know what you are using?
Talking about serious students of the scriptures.

I , for one , and that by grace , DO . But most hated i am for doing so . It dont seem to matter
what group it is , SDA , JW , protestant realm the CC . THe right or the left .
WHEN the sins and errors of any group is identified they often dont come with smiles and with hugs .
And yet all i ever did was try and point folks back into the bible to read it for themselves .
And the only goodness i have cometh of GOD cause it sure dont come from the flesh , nor the carnal mind of man .
To a liberal i am cheered when i speak against the deadly dangers of the conservative and to the conservative i am cheered
when i point out the deadly dangers of the liberal agenda . YET when i speak against their sin , I become enemy number one .
I have actually watched both liberals and conservatives fast become friends to speak against folks like me .
And the same goes within the protestant realm as it does within the catholic realm . BUT BE THAT AS IT MAY ,
HOLD NOT THY BREATH waiting for me to repent . I POINT to THE REAL JESUS and by that I MEAN THE ONE IN THE BIBLE .
THE VERY JESUS that scholars of all groups KNOW NOT . The very JESUS , however , that even a small child can grasp .
I come today as i have come in times past to declare all out war against the false love and false unity
the false sensual movment that has overtaken every group known to man within even the realm of christendom .
And by grace have come to point folks back into bibles , WITHOUT the scholars , without interpretations of men gone wrong
without the mindset that one has to sit under a particular group or its scholars to know the things of the LORD .
CALL ME FOD . FLEA OF DOG for that is all that i am and i am fully content with that title . FLEA of a dog .
LET GOD get the glory even if it costs me all , LET CHRIST get the glory EVEN if it costs me all
For i am but man and this man was saved ONLY BY the GRACE OF GOD , changed only by the grace o GOD
BUT THIS FLEA IS GONNA EXPOSE the works of men even if my reward on earth is but prison , suffering and a horrible death .
Today is September the thirteenth in the year two thousand and twenty two and i still refuse the ways of men gone wrong
and i still say after all these years that the leaders have failed the people . TIME to abandon the ways of men gone wrong .
TIME to open the bible and make sure ITS THAT JESUS folks are following . Cause ANY JESUS
that is and has become the author of trangression , AINT JESUS , no matter how often it uses the words love . PEROID .
TIME for folks to make a decision . KEEP IT REAL , cause i do . I Dont fear my enemies
what a man sees IS what he gets . We cant be double minded . ONE WAY on a certain day
or one way when we are in the comforts of friends . WE MUST BE ONE WAY ALL THE TIME .
and that way HAS TO BE JESUS .

 

[Ronald Nolette]

This new covenant discussed at Hebrews 8;&-13 is not referring to fleshly Israel/Judah-as a nation/religion-but to "spiritual" Israel. Furthermore, it is referring to the 144.000 anointed for a heavenly reward. Compare only a few supporting scriptures: Luke 12:32; 14:16-24; John 10:16; 14:2, 3; Acts 10:1-48; Romans 2:28, 29; 8:14-17; 2 Corinthians 5;16-18; Galatians 3:28; 4:5-7; 6:16; 1 Peter 2:7-10.

No the 144,000 are Jews who become followers long after the church is gone.

Hebrews 8 is referring to fleshly Israel. It is quite clear that in the last 7 years of history before Jesus returns, 2/3 of all fleshly Jews will be killed, and the 1/3 that survive will have the veil lifted at the reading of Moses and those 1/3 will be saved and cause jesus to return- it is to these 1/3 that survive the tribulation that the new covenant refers to! the church because we are grafted into Jesus like believing Jews are natural branches, we receive the blessings othe New Covenant but we are not a spiritual Israel or spiritual Jews, we are the body of Christ made up of Jews and gentiles into one body!

 

[amigo de christo]

the unbeliving in JESUS jews as well as the CC , as well as poiticians of both the right and the left
are gonna lead all right to the beast . PEROID .
no unbeliever can point anyone in the right direction . ONLY JESUS CAN and DOES .
Folks are about to get and are already BEING DECIEVED .
The unbeleiving state of israel and the jews WONT BE LEADING THE WORLD TO PARADIES
THE CC wont
nor most of all christendom .
THEY WILL LEAD US AS ONE RIGHT TO THE BEAST . TAKE THIS TO THE BANK , to the celestial bank
cause most folks aint gonna make it . RETURN TO THE BIBLE and MAKE SURE you are following THAT JESUS

 

[amigo de christo]

Too many folks are falling in LOVE with a star on a flag , BUT KNOW NOT that the ONLY STAR OF DAVID
COMETH BY FAITH IN JESUS . MANY AINT GONNA MAKE IT . The day of the LORD
IS gonna be a NIGHTMARE FOR MANY . That is a fact .
BUT remember this , i never pointed us to any denomination , not to the jew or the CC or any politician .
I DID , by grace , point to JESUS , the JESUS OF THE BIBLE . MANY AINT GONNA MAKE IT .

 

[Ronald Nolette]

John 15:5-6 I am the Vine and you are the branches......Abide in Me and bear much fruit,

The point is that we Christians, who belong to Jesus, are the peoples who bear the fruit of the Spirit.

The new Covenant will be made between the Lord and the Christian people: peoples from every tribe, race, nation and language.
When we go to live in all of the holy Land. Ezekiel 34:11-31 Read carefully and understand verse 25.

You are misled. that is what you say, but is not what the bible says!

As for Ezekiel? Once again you reinterpret Gos Word and spiritualize it to make it your word! that passage was written for for fleshy Israel. Only the Jewish people were scattered among the peoples. We gentiles who are in the body of Christ were never scattered among the nations. we were saved out from among the nations!

Stop reinterpreting teh bible to fit your agenda and start reinterpreting your agenda to fir the bible as is!

 

[covenantee]

You are misled. that is what you say, but is not what the bible says!

As for Ezekiel? Once again you reinterpret Gos Word and spiritualize it to make it your word! that passage was written for for fleshy Israel. Only the Jewish people were scattered among the peoples. We gentiles who are in the body of Christ were never scattered among the nations. we were saved out from among the nations!

Stop reinterpreting teh bible to fit your agenda and start reinterpreting your agenda to fir the bible as is!

Fleshly Israel is/are not the children of God. (Romans 9:8)

How do you identify "fleshly Israel"? Do you carry and use a DNA spit kit?

Israel was never comprised of "only the Jewish people". It was comprised of Israelites, and was ethnically diverse from its birth and throughout its entire history. (Genesis 17:12; Exodus 12:48-49; Leviticus 19:34; Leviticus 24:22)
All were scattered.

Stop defiling and contaminating the Word of God with your dispensational apartheid racism.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Fleshly Israel is/are not the children of God. (Romans 9:8)

How do you identify "fleshly Israel"? Do you carry and use a DNA spit kit?

Israel was never comprised of "only the Jewish people". It was comprised of Israelites, and was ethnically diverse from its birth and throughout its entire history. (Genesis 17:12; Exodus 12:48-49; Leviticus 19:34; Leviticus 24:22)
All were scattered.

Stop defiling and contaminating the Word of God with your dispensational apartheid racism.

1. But asccording to Gods Word, the last 7 years before Jesus returns- 2/3 will be killed and the remaining 1/3 will receive Jesus as messiah. but that is Gods Word and not yours.

2. It doesn't matter to me or you or any bigot of your belief system. god knows and that is all that matters. You think the thoughts of men and not God.

3.Israel is the Jewish people. It is comprised of the descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Proslytes were converts to teh faith and were not natural Israel. but once again that is Gods Word.

Apartheid racism? Is that the best false accusation you can vomit at me? Have th elast word, this is another thread I will no longer respond to you on because of your blackened soul.

 

[Keraz]

Stop reinterpreting teh bible to fit your agenda and start reinterpreting your agenda to fir the bible as is!

Calling me misled and a re-interpreter of scripture, is the usual reply of those whose beliefs are challenged. The ploy is to accuse and denigrate the messenger, rather than providing Bible based rebuttal.

Stop defiling and contaminating the Word of God with your dispensational apartheid racism.

But those who grip onto the fanciful idea of being raptured to heaven; have to have an Israel here on earth; in the Great Trib while they sit on the4 clouds strumming harps.
Thinking that the Jews are still Gods special people and will be redeemed, IS apartheid. Let alone unscriptural.

 

[Keraz]

1. But asccording to Gods Word, the last 7 years before Jesus returns- 2/3 will be killed and the remaining 1/3 will receive Jesus as messiah. but that is Gods Word and not yours.

Actually Zechariah 13:9 says; Then I shall pass that third thru fire.....and Paul tells us that only a remnant will survive.

2. It doesn't matter to me or you or any bigot of your belief system. god knows and that is all that matters. You think the thoughts of men and not God.

The usual denigration and false accusations from one whose beliefs cannot be supported by scripture.

3.Israel is the Jewish people. It is comprised of the descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Proslytes were converts to teh faith and were not natural Israel. but once again that is Gods Word.

Every person alive today has some of Abraham's genes. Descendants of Jacob are as many as the sands of the sea and comprise the Christian peoples.
The historical record shows that those who claim to be Jews, are in fact, Edomites, Kharzas' and a motley mixture of other races. They belong to the synagogue of Satan.

 

[covenantee]

Proslytes were converts to teh faith and were not natural Israel.

Exodus 12:48
And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the Lord, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof.

Leviticus 19:34
But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.

God drew and draws no distinction between physical descendants and non-descendants of Abraham.

Unlike modernist dispensationalism, God is not racist.

 

[Jay Ross]

Then why not direct them in the right path Jay?
Which Bible are you reading from and what tools are you using? Surely there are members here who would give their right arm to know what you are using?
Talking about serious students of the scriptures.

I have had interactions with Keraz a number of times with respect to his understanding of the scriptures and the errors that are contained in our present English translations. I have even presented how I understand the source texts and given my paraphrasing of those texts in English. They are out there for people to read and absorb. Keraz believes like our translators that God will gather Israel and plant them in the Land of Israel, however the Hebrew word that is translated as "land" is from the Hebrew Root Word that has the meaning of "soil" and this ties in with the Parable of the Sower where the Sower spreads his seeds in the fertile field of Christ, i.e. Israel, to take root in and to receive nourish from. God also tells us that He will teach Israel when He gathers them to himself on the Religion of Christ, i.e. the servant of Israel, where the Hebrew word "mountain" is a metaphor for religion.

I have also found that people are sticklers for their own understanding and openly reject God's truth when it is pointed out to them. I have to allow the Holy Spirit to guide them to come to the realisation that what I have previously posted is God's truth and understanding of the original Language texts.

So what Bible am I reading from? The same ones as you are probably, but the Holy Spirit prompts me to search deeper into the true meaning of the original Language texts and to do that I use an old KJV interlinear which provides the links between the various Root Words.

So, what I am relying on the most is God's prompting of the truth. That is available to all Believers.

Shalom

 

[Keraz]

The new Covenant has nothing to do either with ethnic Israel, nor with mankind in general, but is only for the Spiritual Israelite individuals; the true Overcomers, who are born again faithful Christian believers; the ones who bear the proper fruit. Matthew 21:43

The Bible’s restoration prophesies do not relate to those who call themselves Jews, or to the citizens of the State of Israel, for they are a part of the world that Jesus spoke about in Revelation 2:20-23, John 15:6, Matthew 21:33-46

Bible teaching could not be clearer: it is we Christians who are the inheritors of God’s Promises to the Patriarchs, Galatians 3:26-29, and it cannot be that God will give His holy Land to anyone who rejects His Son and fails to obey the Commandments.