Only one rapture of all the saints, and only one second coming of Christ

[rebuilder 454]

And you are thinking with your FLESH, thinking that Christ's Salvation is about our flesh when it is not. I have to laugh at those who just BYPASS what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Corinthians 15 about the change to the "spiritual body" at the "twinkling of an eye" on that day. God's Wrath upon the wicked will in no way harm those in Christ, and can be right in the middle of it, just like Shadrach, Meshech, and Abed-nego who were in the hot fiery furnace heated seven times hotter than necessary, and Christ was with them, and they came out of it without their clothes even smelling of smoke (Dan.3).

First you say no flesh involved in salvation.
Then you say he will save your flesh.
Then you give verses where some ancients had their flesh saved.

 

[Davy]

First you say no flesh involved in salvation.
Then you say he will save your flesh.
Then you give verses where some ancients had their flesh saved.

You sure do love telling LIES.

Show me where I EVER SAID JESUS COMES TO SAVE OUR FLESH.

Also show me where I gave verses that some ancients had their flesh saved.

 

[rebuilder 454]

You sure do love telling LIES.

Show me where I EVER SAID JESUS COMES TO SAVE OUR FLESH.

Also show me where I gave verses that some ancients had their flesh saved.

Well here ya go.

Davy said:
And you are thinking with your FLESH, thinking that Christ's Salvation is about our flesh when it is not. I have to laugh at those who just BYPASS what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Corinthians 15 about the change to the "spiritual body" at the "twinkling of an eye" on that day. God's Wrath upon the wicked will in no way harm those in Christ, and can be right in the middle of it, just like Shadrach, Meshech, and Abed-nego who were in the hot fiery furnace heated seven times hotter than necessary, and Christ was with them, and they came out of it without their clothes even smelling of smoke (Dan.3).

Now what was that about your post of flesh being saved you are confused about????
You wrote it.

 

[Davy]

Well here ya go.

Davy said:
And you are thinking with your FLESH, thinking that Christ's Salvation is about our flesh when it is not. I have to laugh at those who just BYPASS what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Corinthians 15 about the change to the "spiritual body" at the "twinkling of an eye" on that day. God's Wrath upon the wicked will in no way harm those in Christ, and can be right in the middle of it, just like Shadrach, Meshech, and Abed-nego who were in the hot fiery furnace heated seven times hotter than necessary, and Christ was with them, and they came out of it without their clothes even smelling of smoke (Dan.3).

Now what was that about your post of flesh being saved you are confused about????
You wrote it.

You are being silly, the event of Christ saving Shadrach, Meshech, and Abed-nego was a MIRACLE that serves as an EXAMPLE of the LAST DAY of this world when God's consuming fire will burn man's works off the surface of this earth. Christ did many MIRACLES per His written Word for He is God. But that still does not BYPASS what The New Testament teaches about His Salvation of our "spiritual body" that Apostle Paul taught in 1 Corinthians 15.

1 Cor 15:49-53
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
KJV

Now if you want to DENY the existence of The New Testament Books, and what they teach, and instead just stay on a FLESHY Jewish Old Testament Babylonian Talmud thinking, fine, then go to, but WHY are you here on a Christian forum?

 

[William Barton]

IMO:
The seven Jewish festivals point to the Messiah:

1. Passover------------------slain as a lamb
2. Unleavened bread----sinless bodily in the tomb
3. First fruits----------------first from the grave
4. Pentecost----------------sends the spirit
5. Trumpets-----------------battle cry, returns in judgment.
6. Atonement---------------atones for Israel
7. Booths---------------------Millennial reign

I assume "spiritual body" is a body with a spirit.," as had Adam and Eve at the beginning.

"Eternal" stems from Latin aevum = "age, lifetime."

"Eternity" in the sense of "never-ending" is a mathematical concept with no practical application.

 

[ewq1938]

The last trump is blown every year on the Feast of Trumpets.

That's Judaism. Paul was a Christian speaking about the end times last trump which is the last of 7.

When Paul wrote about the last trump it was no mystery. It is blown on the fall harvest feast. There is seed time and harvest.

Not what he was teaching about.

Your beliefs have the Church on the earth during the wrath of God when we are clearly told that we are not appointed to wrath.

No, posttrib teaches that the Church is raptured before the wrath of God. You are using a strawman fallacy.

And of course, John wrote Revelation decades after Paul wrote about the last trump. And yet not one clarification by Paul was necessary.

Doesn't matter since God is the author of the info.

 

[The Light]

No, posttrib teaches that the Church is raptured before the wrath of God. You are using a strawman fallacy.

Yeah, that's what post trib teaches. And yet we see no rapture in the scripture before the 7th trumpet. All those trumpets and vials and yet no rapture.

To make post trib work you have to pretend that the 6th seal is the 7th trumpet.

Then you have to pretend that the 7th seal is 30 minutes of silence in heaven while ignoring the 1st six trumpets and six vials.

Then you have to ignore scripture that says we can escape all these things including the including the great tribulation and stand before the Son of man. And ignore that believers can escape the time of testing that will come on the whole world.

Then you have to pretend that the great tribulation and the wrath of God are the same thing.

 

[The Light]

The seven Jewish festivals point to the Messiah:

1. Passover------------------slain as a lamb
2. Unleavened bread----sinless bodily in the tomb
3. First fruits----------------first from the grave

Okay.

4. Pentecost----------------sends the spirit

Contrary to popular opinion the Spirit is sent 50 days later on the Feast of New Wine.

Pentecost is the presenting of the barley and wheat first fruits by the priest. It is also the time of the spring barley harvest which are the dead in Christ.

The wheat harvest occurs at the end of summer and is the alive that remain of the Church..

5. Trumpets-----------------battle cry, returns in judgment.

Fall fruit harvest. These are the 12 tribes, the seed of the woman, that get victory over the beast. They are Jews.

6. Atonement---------------atones for Israel
7. Booths---------------------Millennial reign

Okay.

 

[ewq1938]

Yeah, that's what post trib teaches. And yet we see no rapture in the scripture before the 7th trumpet.

Maybe because the rapture is NOT before the 7th trump?

All those trumpets and vials and yet no rapture.

To make post trib work you have to pretend that the 6th seal is the 7th trumpet.

No, you have to understand the vial is descibed the future events of the 7th trump, as Christ did in the OD as well.

Then you have to pretend that the 7th seal is 30 minutes of silence in heaven while ignoring the 1st six trumpets and six vials.

Adding in anything one wants into the 7th seal is bad interpretation and is classic eisegesis.

Then you have to ignore scripture that says we can escape all these things including the including the great tribulation and stand before the Son of man. And ignore that believers can escape the time of testing that will come on the whole world.

Here's how to understand "escaping":


1 Corinthians 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to BEAR it.


One can escape something by being able to bear it. It is not a physical escape but a mental and spiritual one.

Then you have to pretend that the great tribulation and the wrath of God are the same thing.

Pretrib believes that not posttrib.

 

[Davy]

Okay.


Contrary to popular opinion the Spirit is sent 50 days later on the Feast of New Wine.

Pentecost is the presenting of the barley and wheat first fruits by the priest. It is also the time of the spring barley harvest which are the dead in Christ.

The wheat harvest occurs at the end of summer and is the alive that remain of the Church..


Fall fruit harvest. These are the 12 tribes, the seed of the woman, that get victory over the beast. They are Jews.


Okay.

Not accurate per New Testament prophecy. Can't just slap any Old Testament event onto New Testament prophecy.

1. In Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27, Jesus showed the day of His coming to gather His saints will be AFTER.... the tribulation. That immediately disagrees with your use of a spring harvest time of the saints.

2. Also In Christ's Olivet discourse, He used symbolic 'summer' as the only harvest time associated with His coming to gather His Church.

3. Today, the Jews represent ONLY the tribes of the "house of Judah", the southern kingdom of Judah at Jerusalem-Judea. They were the tribes of Judah, Benjamin, and Levi. But the rest of the tribes of Israel dwelt in the northern holy lands and made up the "house of Israel", and "kingdom of Israel" after God had split old Israel into two separate kingdoms because of Solomon's folly. Thus the MAJORITY of the Seed of Israel was with the ten tribes of the "house of Israel" with one born of the tribe of Ephraim as its king (Jeroboam was first). God scattered the ten tribes first out of the land, never to return as a people. They slowly were led westward into Asia Minor and Europe and became the founders of the western Christian nations along with the believing Gentiles. Most of the ten tribes today think they are Gentiles, having lost their old heritage as part of Israel.

What this does is completely SCRAPS that theory of the 12 tribes all being JEWS, and also that they all are unbelievers, even during the coming tribulation.

Also what this does, is it reveals you actually don't really know your Old Testament history either.

 

[Scott Downey]

Yeah, that's what post trib teaches. And yet we see no rapture in the scripture before the 7th trumpet. All those trumpets and vials and yet no rapture.

To make post trib work you have to pretend that the 6th seal is the 7th trumpet.

Then you have to pretend that the 7th seal is 30 minutes of silence in heaven while ignoring the 1st six trumpets and six vials.

Then you have to ignore scripture that says we can escape all these things including the including the great tribulation and stand before the Son of man. And ignore that believers can escape the time of testing that will come on the whole world.

Then you have to pretend that the great tribulation and the wrath of God are the same thing.

You over complicate what is simple, why would God do that.

Jesus only taught the post-trib rapture. It is our gathering to Him.

Ephesians 1:10
that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven and which are on earth—in Him.