Passover 2009

[tim_from_pa]

It will be here before you know it. Passover will occur this year Wednesday April 8th at sundown.Whenever Passover occurs on a Wednesday, I dub such a year as "resonant" with the last week of our Lord. For those of you into science (like me), resonance is a fancy way of saying tuned or in tune. Your radio or television resonates to the signal. A piano string resonates to a certain pitch. Likewise, whenever Passover (Nisan 14) falls on a Wednesday, it's in tune or sync with the same days of the week that Christ was Crucified, buried and raised again as He was crucified on Passover Nisan 14, Interred the 15th on Unleavened Bread, and arose as Nisan 17 closed and 18th dawned (at sundown) to fulfill the full 3 days and nights or 72 hours.I thought I mention these facts now before time flies and I forget. I can't believe as of the time of this post that it's March 14 already.

 

[shutin45]

QUOTE (tim_from_pa @ Mar 14 2009, 08:11 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70842
It will be here before you know it. Passover will occur this year Wednesday April 8th at sundown.Whenever Passover occurs on a Wednesday, I dub such a year as "resonant" with the last week of our Lord. For those of you into science (like me), resonance is a fancy way of saying tuned or in tune. Your radio or television resonates to the signal. A piano string resonates to a certain pitch. Likewise, whenever Passover (Nisan 14) falls on a Wednesday, it's in tune or sync with the same days of the week that Christ was Crucified, buried and raised again as He was crucified on Passover Nisan 14, Interred the 15th on Unleavened Bread, and arose as Nisan 17 closed and 18th dawned (at sundown) to fulfill the full 3 days and nights or 72 hours.I thought I mention these facts now before time flies and I forget. I can't believe as of the time of this post that it's March 14 already.
Whoa. Forgive the topic tangent, but you said a word that's special to me too -an old USAF Electronic Tech who loves science too.Ahhh resonance. Resonant frequencies. Multiples and submultiples. The thing that makes musical harmony sound so good. Mathematics. This reminds me of a topic Christina wrote recently about number patterns. Our God is an INCREDIBLE and logical God. Things like resonance are but a TINY TINY fraction (no pun intended) of all the wonderfully perfect elements of His creation. Praise the Lord !!Again, forgive me for getting away from the Passover topic. I DID read it!!

Bless you.Jim

 

[tomwebster]

QUOTE (tim_from_pa @ Mar 14 2009, 08:11 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70842
It will be here before you know it. Passover will occur this year Wednesday April 8th at sundown.Whenever Passover occurs on a Wednesday, I dub such a year as "resonant" with the last week of our Lord. For those of you into science (like me), resonance is a fancy way of saying tuned or in tune. Your radio or television resonates to the signal. A piano string resonates to a certain pitch. Likewise, whenever Passover (Nisan 14) falls on a Wednesday, it's in tune or sync with the same days of the week that Christ was Crucified, buried and raised again as He was crucified on Passover Nisan 14, Interred the 15th on Unleavened Bread, and arose as Nisan 17 closed and 18th dawned (at sundown) to fulfill the full 3 days and nights or 72 hours.I thought I mention these facts now before time flies and I forget. I can't believe as of the time of this post that it's March 14 already.
Passover, the real one, is on April 2. It begins at sundown on the 14th day after after the spring equinox.

 

[whirlwind]

QUOTE (tomwebster @ Mar 14 2009, 10:49 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70853
Passover, the real one, is on April 2. It begins at sundown on the 14th day after after the spring equinox.
What do you mean...the real one?

As there can't be two (except for the late passover for those that couldn't keep the first [Num.9:10-13]) why the two different dates?It's terrible that in this country founded by God, where most love God...that no one follows passover or even, if you're like me, know when the spring equinox is.

I know He became our Passover but I would like to keep the literal date too. So, I thank both you and Tim for keeping us posted on the date but...which is it? 4/2 or 4/8?

 

[tim_from_pa]

QUOTE (shutin45 @ Mar 14 2009, 11:13 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70849
Whoa. Forgive the topic tangent, but you said a word that's special to me too -an old USAF Electronic Tech who loves science too.Ahhh resonance. Resonant frequencies. Multiples and submultiples. The thing that makes musical harmony sound so good. Mathematics. This reminds me of a topic Christina wrote recently about number patterns. Our God is an INCREDIBLE and logical God. Things like resonance are but a TINY TINY fraction (no pun intended) of all the wonderfully perfect elements of His creation. Praise the Lord !!Again, forgive me for getting away from the Passover topic. I DID read it!!

Bless you.Jim
No I don't mind the topic shift at all. As a matter of fact, I'm an ol' electronic tech myself. Here's something I may have posted already but I want to make sure you see this. Now this is resonance! (Maybe the death angel at Passover even looked like this.)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FY-AS13fl30

 

[tim_from_pa]

QUOTE (tomwebster @ Mar 14 2009, 11:49 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70853
Passover, the real one, is on April 2. It begins at sundown on the 14th day after after the spring equinox.
I'm curious out there if anyone knows of anyone else who calculates Passover this way besides one ministry? I'm interested in the other organizations. This method of calculation disregards the moon totally, which is not a biblical position or teaching.For those of you into astronomy, the Jewish calendar is luni-solar. This means the months are defined by the moon (as stated in the bible by its frequent mention of new moons) but is bounded by the solar year---- they add an extra leap month every so often to stay in step with the seasons.Apocryphal books warn of the perversion of watching the moon to define the calendar. This is because if one bases the calendar only on the moon, the seasons will walk around the year eventually (like Ramadan does in the in the Islamic Calendar). However, the apocryphal books also make it clear that the time of the month is based on the moon.This is why major feast days occur on the 14th/15th of the month of God's Sacred Calendar. The 14th/15th corresponds to full moon given that the synodic lunar cycle is 29.53 days approximately. The 7-8th is first quarter and the 21-22nd is last quarter while the last day of the month is astronomical new moon. In other words, the month day is simply the age of the moon in days.And for the scientific-minded, we can also understand now why the moon "turns to blood" at ominous Passover events and end-time predictions. The moon can only do so naturally during a lunar eclipse at full moon on the 14th-15th day of the month.

 

[tomwebster]

QUOTE (tim_from_pa @ Mar 15 2009, 07:28 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70858
No I don't mind the topic shift at all. As a matter of fact, I'm an ol' electronic tech myself. Here's something I may have posted already but I want to make sure you see this. Now this is resonance! (Maybe the death angel at Passover even looked like this.)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FY-AS13fl30
I was not trying to shift the topic either, just wanted to clarify the date of Passover.QUOTE (whirlwind @ Mar 15 2009, 06:45 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70855
What do you mean...the real one?

As there can't be two (except for the late passover for those that couldn't keep the first [Num.9:10-13]) why the two different dates?
On your calendar you will see the date given for Passover this year is April 9. This is a date that has been set by the full moon, the lunar calendar, and is wrong. The true Passover was set by the solar calendar. The spring equinox, vernal equinox, is the first day of spring. (Do a google search on spring (vernal) equinox.) Passover, the true Passover, begins at sundown the 14th day after the spring equinox. Exodus 12-13 will tell you the story about the first Passover. QUOTE
It's terrible that in this country founded by God, where most love God...that no one follows passover or even, if you're like me, know when the spring equinox is.

I know He became our Passover but I would like to keep the literal date too. So, I thank both you and Tim for keeping us posted on the date but...which is it? 4/2 or 4/8?

Abid, is the first month in the Hebrew religious calendar. Abid 1, is the first day of spring, every year. (I will put together a study of the Hebrew calendar later today and post it as a different subject)

 

[Vickie]

QUOTE (tomwebster @ Mar 14 2009, 10:49 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70853
Passover, the real one, is on April 2. It begins at sundown on the 14th day after after the spring equinox.
Isn't it in scriptures that "In as often as ye take the bread and wine" do it in the memory of me." whichis were Communion arose from. That the sacraments are taken often and not just at Passover? As far as the Passover is concerned I have followed it with the day the Jews use from their calendar.Though I have had it with people who would celebrate it a day earlier because they thought they wereright.So, I personally feel comfortable on using the same date as the Jews calendar. For whether it is accurate or not is not a big deal with me, because I take it more than once a year. Don't know if this helps anyone or not. Just what I do and why. Thanks for letting me shareLOLVickie

 

[tomwebster]

QUOTE (Vickie @ Mar 15 2009, 03:34 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70870
Isn't it in scriptures that "In as often as ye take the bread and wine" do it in the memory of me." whichis were Communion arose from. That the sacraments are taken often and not just at Passover? As far as the Passover is concerned I have followed it with the day the Jews use from their calendar.Though I have had it with people who would celebrate it a day earlier because they thought they wereright.So, I personally feel comfortable on using the same date as the Jews calendar. For whether it is accurate or not is not a big deal with me, because I take it more than once a year. Don't know if this helps anyone or not. Just what I do and why. Thanks for letting me shareLOLVickie
I was asked, "What do you mean...the real one?" So I answered. Christ was our Passover lamb, and was sacrificed on preparation day for us.Joh 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away. Joh 19:32 Then came the soldiers, and brake the legs of the first, and of the other which was crucified with him. Joh 19:33 But when they came to Jesus, and saw that he was dead already, they brake not his legs: I celebrate Passover every year. Those that would like to celebrate Passover might want to celebrate it on the correct day. The correct day is on the solar calendar of God not the lunar calendar of leader of the dark.

 

[tim_from_pa]

QUOTE (tomwebster @ Mar 15 2009, 07:23 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70872
I celebrate Passover every year. Those that would like to celebrate Passover might want to celebrate it on the correct day. The correct day is on the solar calendar of God not the lunar calendar of leader of the dark.
That's noble, but where in the scriptures does it say that the calendar was not based on the moon as well as the sun? Everyone and their brother knows that the Hebrew calendar based its months on the moon, and there are quite a few references to the new moon.If God's sacred calendar went by the sun only, when indeed it is clearly stated that the moon would be used as well, then how is that any different than the pagan solar calendars like the Julian or the Gregorian? The only difference is that we are reckoning the New Year at the Vernal Equinox instead of January 1.I know where this solar only reckoning comes from, and it has the signature of Pastor Murray all over it with perhaps an ulterior motive for disassociating with the Jews. Tell me who else "calculates" this way? I know no other ministry, nor Jews, nor Christians and I will not take one man's word and his own interpretation of it. It does not even sound scholarly.

 

[tomwebster]

QUOTE (tim_from_pa @ Mar 15 2009, 07:33 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70874
That's noble, but where in the scriptures does it say that the calendar was not based on the moon as well as the sun? Everyone and their brother knows that the Hebrew calendar based its months on the moon, and there are quite a few references to the new moon.If God's sacred calendar went by the sun only, when indeed it is clearly stated that the moon would be used as well, then how is that any different than the pagan solar calendars like the Julian or the Gregorian? The only difference is that we are reckoning the New Year at the Vernal Equinox instead of January 1.I know where this solar only reckoning comes from, and it has the signature of Pastor Murray all over it with perhaps an ulterior motive for disassociating with the Jews. Tell me who else "calculates" this way? I know no other ministry, nor Jews, nor Christians and I will not take one man's word and his own interpretation of it. It does not even sound scholarly.
Check out the many prophecy's and see which ones are given in moons and which ones are given in days. We are children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. Early Hebrew went by the solar calendar. I don't care what you do, follow any calendar you want.

 

[tim_from_pa]

QUOTE (tomwebster @ Mar 15 2009, 09:19 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70875
Check out the many prophecy's and see which ones are given in moons and which ones are given in days. We are children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. Early Hebrew went by the solar calendar. I don't care what you do, follow any calendar you want.
Tom:The Hebrew's calendar was indeed bound by the sun, but what I am saying is the days of the month (hence the feast days) were determined by the lunar cycle. No serious scholar denies this.Consider Sir Isaac Newton's quote:All nations, before the just length of the solar year was known, reckoned months by the course of the moon, and years by the return of winter and summer, spring and autumn; and in making calendars for their festivals, they reckoned thirty days to a lunar month, and twelve lunar months to a year, taking the nearest round numbers, whence came the division of the ecliptic into 360 degrees.And consider Scripture itself in Genesis 1:14:And God said, Let there be lights {That's plural, not one light as in the sun only} in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them {That's plural again, not one light as in the sun only} be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: {and that's what the calendar is for---- if it's plural, then at least the sun and moon is involved}Now for examples of a specific reference to the new moon as the start of the month:Also in the day of your gladness, and in your solemn days, and in the beginnings of your months {translated from the Hebrew meaning the same as New Moon}, ye shall blow with the trumpets over your burnt offerings, and over the sacrifices of your peace offerings; that they may be to you for a memorial before your God: I am the LORD your God.And in the beginnings of your months ye shall offer a burnt offering unto the LORD; two young bullocks, and one ram, seven lambs of the first year without spot;And when worship became empty God Himself declared in Isaiah:Bring no more vain oblations; incense is an abomination unto me; the new moons and sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity, even the solemn meeting.The Strong's number in all three cases of the bolden type is #2320 which is the new moon. That's the very place we get the word "month" is a "moonth".The ancient Hebrew calendar was adjusted such that the feasts fell during certain seasons. That was the purpose of the sun, to determine seasons and years. However, the month days were determined by the moon within that framework. And stop to consider Newton's quote for a minute. How do you suppose the average Israelite was supposed to determine the exact date of the Vernal Equinox when our accurate Gregorian calendar cannot do that much? Observation for sure fails miserably. However, one can look at the moon and get a good idea how far into the month they are.A final word here. I can take my sextant and measure the angle of the moon with the sun, and using biblical verses above I can ascertain the Jewish calendar within a day even when I had no clue what day it was. I did that already. In other words, I could be alone on an island and would not even know that the Jewish calendar even existed, but if I applied the above bible verses and criteria, I'd create a virtually identical calendar they use. I could not do so with the sun only with crude tools and observations.

 

[shutin45]

Genesis 1:14"And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years"

 

[Vickie]

QUOTE (tomwebster @ Mar 15 2009, 06:23 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70872
I was asked, "What do you mean...the real one?" So I answered. Christ was our Passover lamb, and was sacrificed on preparation day for us.Joh 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away. Joh 19:32 Then came the soldiers, and brake the legs of the first, and of the other which was crucified with him. Joh 19:33 But when they came to Jesus, and saw that he was dead already, they brake not his legs: I celebrate Passover every year. Those that would like to celebrate Passover might want to celebrate it on the correct day. The correct day is on the solar calendar of God not the lunar calendar of leader of the dark.
You made me laugh on "leader of the dark." Are you saying the Jews are the leader of the dark? Yes, they are blinded and they do a lot of twisting of God's word and much more. I just am thankful for being set free under the New Covenant to take the Jews calendar and know that I celebrate freedom from the Old Covenant through the blood that has been shed for me. You could explain more for me if you want about this calendar you are speaking of. In Christ's loveVickieQUOTE (tim_from_pa @ Mar 15 2009, 09:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70877
Tom:The Hebrew's calendar was indeed bound by the sun, but what I am saying is the days of the month (hence the feast days) were determined by the lunar cycle. No serious scholar denies this.Consider Sir Isaac Newton's quote:All nations, before the just length of the solar year was known, reckoned months by the course of the moon, and years by the return of winter and summer, spring and autumn; and in making calendars for their festivals, they reckoned thirty days to a lunar month, and twelve lunar months to a year, taking the nearest round numbers, whence came the division of the ecliptic into 360 degrees.
How does it work where Jesus said at the sun setting a new day starts. As fasting was set up from evening to evening. And all this is well spoken about in the bible. So, help me here, please. thanks Vickie

 

[tomwebster]

QUOTE (Vickie @ Mar 15 2009, 09:53 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70879
You made me laugh on "leader of the dark." Are you saying the Jews are the leader of the dark? ...
??? where did I say the "jews" were the leader of the night?

 

[tomwebster]

I just want to bring some things to your attentionGen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light(H216): and there was light. Gen 1:4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness(H2822). H216אורoreFrom H215; illumination or (concretely) luminary (in every sense, including lightning, happiness, etc.): - bright, clear, + day, light (-ning), morning, sun. H215אורoreA primitive root; to be (causatively make) luminous (literally and metaphorically): - X break of day, glorious, kindle, (be, en-, give, show) light (-en, -ened), set on fire, shine. H2822חשׁך;kho-shek'From H2821; the dark; hence (literally) darkness; figuratively misery, destruction, death, ignorance, sorrow, wickedness: - dark (-ness), night, obscurity. H2821חשׁך;cha-shakkhaw-shak'A primitive root; to be dark (as withholding light); transitively to darken: - be black, be (make) dark, darken, cause darkness, be dim, hide. Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day(H3117), and the darkness he called Night(H3915). And the evening and the morning were the first day. H3117יום;yo-myomeFrom an unused root meaning to be hot; a day (as the warm hours), whether literally (from sunrise to sunset, or from one sunset to the next), or figuratively (a space of time defined by an associated term), (often used adverbially): - age, + always, + chronicles, continually (-ance), daily, ([birth-], each, to) day, (now a, two) days (agone), + elder, X end, + evening, + (for) ever (-lasting, -more), X full, life, as (so) long as (. . . live), (even) now, + old, + outlived, + perpetually, presently, + remaineth, X required, season, X since, space, then, (process of) time, + as at other times, + in trouble, weather, (as) when, (a, the, within a) while (that), X whole (+ age), (full) year (-ly), + younger. H3915לילה ליל ליל;layil leyl layelahlah'-yil, lale, lah'-yel-awFrom the same as H3883; properly a twist (away of the light), that is, night; figuratively adversity: - ([mid-]) night (season). Gen 1:6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. Gen 1:7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. Gen 1:8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. Gen 1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so. Gen 1:10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good. Gen 1:11 And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. Gen 1:12 And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good. Gen 1:13 And the evening and the morning were the third day. Gen 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights(H3974) in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: H3974mâ'ôr mâ'ôr me'ôrâh me'ôrâh(1,2) maw-ore', (3,4) meh-o-raw'From H215; properly a luminous body or luminary, that is, (abstractly) light (as an element); figuratively brightness, that is, cheerfulness; specifically a chandelier: - bright, light. H215oreA primitive root; to be (causatively make) luminous (literally and metaphorically): - X break of day, glorious, kindle, (be, en-, give, show) light (-en, -ened), set on fire, shine. The sun and the stars are luminous, they provide light, the moon only reflects the light of the sun, it does not luminate. Also, the stars are for signs. The Scriptures are written in the stars, not the moon. Look at the constellations, they tell His story. The moon isn't a good predictor of a year. Gen 1:15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so. Gen 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light(H3974) to rule the night(H3915): he made the stars also. he made the stars also. If you look in early texts the words "he made" are not there, they were added. The word "also" is not there either. The lesser luminaries, stars, rule the night, not the moon that has no light of it's own. Again: H3915lah'-yil, lale, lah'-yel-awFrom the same as H3883; properly a twist (away of the light), that is, night; figuratively adversity: - ([mid-]) night (season).Gen 1:17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give lightH215 upon the earth, Gen 1:18 And to rule(H4910) over the day(H3117) and over the night(H3915), and to divide the light from the darkness(H2822): and God saw that it was good. H4910משׁלmâshalmaw-shal'A primitive root; to rule: -(have, make to have) dominion, governor, X indeed, reign, (bear, cause to, have) rule (-ing, -r), have power.H2822חשׁךchôshekkho-shek'From H2821; the dark; hence (literally) darkness; figuratively misery, destruction, death, ignorance, sorrow, wickedness: -dark (-ness), night, obscurity.Does that sound like anyone we know?H2821חשׁךchâshakkhaw-shak'A primitive root; to be dark (as withholding light); transitively to darken: - be black, be (make) dark, darken, cause darkness, be dim, hide.Gen 1:19 And the evening and the morning were the fourth day. 1Th 5:5 Ye are all the children of light(G5457), and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness(G4655). G5457φῶςphōsfoceFrom an obsoleteφάωphaō (to shine or make manifest, especially by rays; compare G5316 and G5346); luminousness (in the widest application, natural or artificial, abstract or concrete, literal or figurative): - fire, light.G4655σκότοςskotosskot'-osFrom the base of G4639; shadiness, that is, obscurity (literally or figuratively): - darkness.

 

[tomwebster]

QUOTE (tim_from_pa @ Mar 15 2009, 09:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70877
...The ancient Hebrew calendar was adjusted such that the feasts fell during certain seasons. That was the purpose of the sun, to determine seasons and years. However, the month days were determined by the moon within that framework. And stop to consider Newton's quote for a minute. How do you suppose the average Israelite was supposed to determine the exact date of the Vernal Equinox when our accurate Gregorian calendar cannot do that much? Observation for sure fails miserably. However, one can look at the moon and get a good idea how far into the month they are.A final word here. I can take my sextant and measure the angle of the moon with the sun, and using biblical verses above I can ascertain the Jewish calendar within a day even when I had no clue what day it was. I did that already. In other words, I could be alone on an island and would not even know that the Jewish calendar even existed, but if I applied the above bible verses and criteria, I'd create a virtually identical calendar they use. I could not do so with the sun only with crude tools and observations.
Do you know how the TEMPLE is set up? Did you know that at sunrise of the Vernal Equinox the first light of the sun shine perfectly over the Mt of Olives, through the eastern gate and through the front doors of the temple directly on the Holy of Holies? Think that was before Newton. Have you studied Stonehenge? Did you know that at sunrise of the Vernal Equinox the first light of the sun shine perfectly over a rock and through the front pillars directly on the altar? Think that was before Newton and maybe even your sextant. There are similar findings in the USA back in old, old, cave areas with ancient HEBREW writing and pictures that show the same thing. Have you studied the Great Pyramid? Do you know when IT was built? Someday you will remember.But you see, it doesn't really matter to me if you agree with me. We can still be friends.

 

[whirlwind]

QUOTE (tomwebster @ Mar 16 2009, 12:01 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70887
Do you know how the TEMPLE is set up? Did you know that at sunrise of the Vernal Equinox the first light of the sun shine perfectly over the Mt of Olives, through the eastern gate and through the front doors of the temple directly on the Holy of Holies? Think that was before Newton. Have you studied Stonehenge? Did you know that at sunrise of the Vernal Equinox the first light of the sun shine perfectly over a rock and through the front pillars directly on the altar? Think that was before Newton and maybe even your sextant. There are similar findings in the USA back in old, old, cave areas with ancient HEBREW writing and pictures that show the same thing. Have you studied the Great Pyramid? Do you know when IT was built? Someday you will remember.But you see, it doesn't really matter to me if you agree with me. We can still be friends.
Well Mr. Tom Webster.....

I must say, I really like you. You have a pleasant way of disagreeing, you know what you are talking about (and that does not mean others on this subject don't) and...I agree. We are children of the Light. All prophecy about Satan is given in lunar cycles. And too, passover begins when the sun is going down. The death angel moves in the dark. I looked on my calendar and guess what....no spring equinox was marked. So, I thank you and Tim for keeping us informed on passover, even though there is this dispute on the actual day.

 

[tim_from_pa]

I'm just amazed that something so clearly and straightforwardly taught in the bible can be blatantly denied (about the moon). This forum supposedly prides itself removing itself from the traditions of men and then turns around and blindly believes what one man teaches which I doubt very severely anyone would come to a vernal equinox conclusion on their own without being bamboozled by such a convoluted interpretation and twaddle. Then may I ask, how then were the months reckoned since a tropical solar year is 365.2422 days and 12 certainly does not divide evenly into it? They kept months---- that word is all over the bible, so how was that done since the Hebrew translation for new month relates to the newness of the moon?As for pyramids and temples, I can calculate as well as anyone solar position based on declination and right ascension. I am a man who prides himself in making and setting up sundials and on my own figured out complex calculations such as the equation of time. I "discovered" spherical trigonometry when I needed it for astronomical calculations and did not know what I was using until a fellow math student told me that I was using a form of spherical trigonometry. So I "reinvented" it just as Newton "invented" calculus. The likes of these calculations I severely doubt the likes of the purveyor of this equinox theory can even begin to do. It is still possible to be off by a day or two using solar alignment alone due to refraction of the atmosphere, the precise time the vernal equinox occurs, and the alignment of the structures facing east. It is close enough for planting perhaps, and to tell the seasons, but the actual day itself is in question. To make a specific statement, between the equinox day and the next, the sun's rising is merely a half a degree off at that latitude (about the width of the sun itself).It's dangerous to "change the times" just because the moon is associated with darkness (it was meant to rule the night--- the apocryphal books correctly state that it reflects the sun, so it was to be a light in the darkness. Being IN the darkness does not make it OF the darkness) and the sun ruled the day. That association in itself is no reason to come to such conclusions about calendar keeping. If that were the case, I can make equal assertions about the myriad of scriptures that warn of sun-god worship and Lucifer coming as an angel of light.Let's face it---- the bottom line is that this ministry that promotes this just wants to be different because most Christians do not want to keep feast days, and yet disassociate with the Jews and make up their own calendar rules---- nobody else does that. And it's starting to look ignorant, and I don't know why I'm putting so much energy into debating an obvious and blatant error like this. I guess it's because strange abstract concepts and interpretations I can handle because some ideas are hard to grasp. But when something straightforward like 2+2=4 gets reinterpreted to mean 2+2=5 and then the group follows along because their leader said so, it bothers me. I choose to think for myself, and a true non-conformist will agree that sometimes the masses are correct, and other times they are wrong. But that's not the same as saying something silly just to be different.QUOTE (Vickie @ Mar 15 2009, 10:56 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70879
How does it work where Jesus said at the sun setting a new day starts. As fasting was set up from evening to evening. And all this is well spoken about in the bible. So, help me here, please. thanks Vickie
Hi Vickie:I'm not sure what you are asking here? How does what work? The calendar, the reckoning of seasons or what?

 

[shutin45]

QUOTE (tim_from_pa @ Mar 15 2009, 09:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70877
Tom:The Hebrew's calendar was indeed bound by the sun, but what I am saying is the days of the month (hence the feast days) were determined by the lunar cycle. No serious scholar denies this.Consider Sir Isaac Newton's quote:All nations, before the just length of the solar year was known, reckoned months by the course of the moon, and years by the return of winter and summer, spring and autumn; and in making calendars for their festivals, they reckoned thirty days to a lunar month, and twelve lunar months to a year, taking the nearest round numbers, whence came the division of the ecliptic into 360 degrees.And consider Scripture itself in Genesis 1:14:And God said, Let there be lights {That's plural, not one light as in the sun only} in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them {That's plural again, not one light as in the sun only} be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: {and that's what the calendar is for---- if it's plural, then at least the sun and moon is involved}Now for examples of a specific reference to the new moon as the start of the month:Also in the day of your gladness, and in your solemn days, and in the beginnings of your months {translated from the Hebrew meaning the same as New Moon}, ye shall blow with the trumpets over your burnt offerings, and over the sacrifices of your peace offerings; that they may be to you for a memorial before your God: I am the LORD your God.And in the beginnings of your months ye shall offer a burnt offering unto the LORD; two young bullocks, and one ram, seven lambs of the first year without spot;And when worship became empty God Himself declared in Isaiah:Bring no more vain oblations; incense is an abomination unto me; the new moons and sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity, even the solemn meeting.The Strong's number in all three cases of the bolden type is #2320 which is the new moon. That's the very place we get the word "month" is a "moonth".The ancient Hebrew calendar was adjusted such that the feasts fell during certain seasons. That was the purpose of the sun, to determine seasons and years. However, the month days were determined by the moon within that framework. And stop to consider Newton's quote for a minute. How do you suppose the average Israelite was supposed to determine the exact date of the Vernal Equinox when our accurate Gregorian calendar cannot do that much? Observation for sure fails miserably. However, one can look at the moon and get a good idea how far into the month they are.A final word here. I can take my sextant and measure the angle of the moon with the sun, and using biblical verses above I can ascertain the Jewish calendar within a day even when I had no clue what day it was. I did that already. In other words, I could be alone on an island and would not even know that the Jewish calendar even existed, but if I applied the above bible verses and criteria, I'd create a virtually identical calendar they use. I could not do so with the sun only with crude tools and observations.
Well that was weird. I posted that Verse reference at the exact moment you posted this with the same Verse!Resonance

I'm led to say some things are used by evil that can also be used by good.A note about the moon and evil - When mohammed was "told" to go into the temple in muslims holy book, he was told to take(?) the idol that was the moon god and take down/destroy/leave the other idols. The moon god was supposed to be somehow important/representative of allah.They also worship a blackened meteorite that "fell from the heavens". Hmmm.Bless Y'all.Jim