Priest denies communion to lesbian at mother's funeral

[brightmorningstar]

elysian, Quite honesty what you keep repeating are lies. Paul preached what he received not from man, but from the risen Lord. (Galatians1) Men abandoning the natural use of women and committing indecent acts with men, is not just pederasty, it is men with men instead of women, that would include pederasty as well as any and all homosexual acts. Homosexuals are men and women are they not?
This couldnt be clearer. What thye Bible doesnt refer to is the 'gay ppl' concept you are using, the only tie to that would be ppl who turn from God to worship the created rather than the creator.
God loves the men and women He has created in His image for His purposes, so dont say He doesnt love ppl who claim to be gay ppl. He loves them for who He created them for not who they think they are.

And yes God's word show He is also interested in what ppl do in bed, whether you can understand it or not is irrelevant, you aren't God.. though I should have thought it easily understandable that God would expect ppl to act accordinmg to what He had created them for.

Are most present day Christians quoting the new testament because it can be used to justify -Evil- such as Homosexuality etc.. -God- and the old testament always was against these abominations but Liberal Christians seem to be -OK- with this type of -Evil-. Liberal Christians seem to be -OK- with abortions and many other -Evils- that -God- and the old testament condemned and should be destroyed.
This Catholic Priest was a -Hero- or warrior for -God- and had every right to throw this -Evil- out of the funeral Mass and the Real Christians should back him up, instead these pansy Chtistians bowed to -Evil-, no wonder Christianity has lost it's way...God Bless...

Good post. Yes I would agree, I think liberal Christianty is counterfit.

 

[mjrhealth]

And still today, christians isolate teh gaysand say there sin is worse than all the others Still today the christians judge them and single them out. There would not have being one person in that line that was without sin, and many would be walking in sin that they do know they should not be doing, so why where they not deniied this eucherist. But no, satan finds how easy it is for people to pick on the unerdog, for christians to feel," I am more rightoues then Thow",and so they feel they have the right to judge. You are not Christ, you do not have the right to judge anyone, for you do not and cannot judge rightly. That priest left out love and mercy and grace, should he not be denied the same by Christ.

Judge not lest ye be judged.

Forgive us as we forgive them.

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

If you expect others to forgive you, then start by forgiving them.

In His Love

And if you think you are better than a gay, sit down and ask Christ where you stand,
We ALL fall short of he glory of Christ.

 

[aspen]

The title is misleading. The priests actions actually go deeper than that.

I do not condone what the priest did as far as the rest of the funeral (sounds like he went overboard), but my understanding is that if a priest knows a person is living in sin, he can deny the eucharist to them.

Any way you look at it, it is just sad.



Lesbian Wants Priest Removed After She Was Denied Communion at Her Mother’s Funeral

Rev. Marcel Guarnizo
Barbara Johnson and her family are calling for Rev. Marcel Guarnizo of St. John Neumann Catholic Church in Gaithersburg, Maryland, to be removed from his ministry. The family is making bold proclamations after Guarnizo reportedly denied Johnson, 51, communion at her mother’s funeral on Saturday.

Johnson, a lesbian, was joined at the church by her partner to celebrate her mother’s life. Just before the service, Guarnizo apparently learned about her sexuality and relationship. Then, during the service, when Johnson stood up to receive communion, the priest openly denied her.

“He put his hand over the body of Christ and looked at me and said, ‘I can’t give you Communion because you live with a woman, and in the eyes of the church, that is a sin,’” she explained following the incident.

When he refused her, Johnson said she was shocked and stood in front of him, thinking that he’d change his mind.
“I just stood there, in shock. I was grieving, crying,” she explained. “My mother’s body was behind me, and all I wanted to do was provide for her, and the final thing was to make a beautiful funeral, and here I was letting her down because there was a scene.”

But Johnson, 51, and her family claim that Guarnizo’s offending actions went above and beyond the communion he purportedly refused to offer her. They claim that the priest left the altar when Johnson gave her eulogy and that he didn’t show up at the burial and declined to find a priest to replace him.

In a letter she penned to the priest, Johnson made her disgust and frustration known. She wrote, in part:

“You brought your politics, not your God into that Church yesterday, and you will pay dearly on the day of judgment for judging me.”

“I will pray for your soul, but first I will do everything in my power to see that you are removed from parish life so that you will not be permitted to harm any more families.”​

Barbara Johnson (Image Credit: WUSA9)
The Washington, D.C. Archdiocese claims that the priest’s actions go against “policy.” Although the church has not officially commented to media, this statement was made in a brief note that was released on the matter. The Archdiocese plans to investigate the incident.

“Any issues regarding the suitability of an individual to receive communion should be addressed by the priest with that person in a private, pastoral setting,” the statement also read.

Johnson’s family, though, says they aren’t looking to use the incident to criticize the Catholic Church as a whole.
“We agreed this is not a discussion about gay rights or about the teachings of the Catholic Church,” her brother, Larry Johnson, said. “We’re not in this to Catholic-bash. That’s the farthest thing from our minds.”

Interesting topic, Foreigner.

I admit, I am extremely conflicted. I want to find the correct answer and stick to it. I want to support my church. I want to stick up for the person being singled out. I think the worst part about it is that she is a known sinner - ugh

I love this topic - I am so glad I searched back for it because it made me think and to an extent agonize over me answer. Wow. Anyway - against my own churches' teaching, I think she should have received communion - on the grounds that all sinners need the Eucharist.

Thank you for this topic.

 

[tarmack09]

This is a very touchy subject. I would say that it is wrong that they denied communion simply because there are other gay bishops in other churches. That's really harsh to treat someone that way at their mothers funeral like that. No matter what the sexual tendencies.

 

[aspen]

This is a very touchy subject. I would say that it is wrong that they denied communion simply because there are other gay bishops in other churches. That's really harsh to treat someone that way at their mothers funeral like that. No matter what the sexual tendencies.

Well, to be fair - the gay bishops are celibate. However, I agree with you about offering the Eucharist. It saddens me that my church - the Catholic Church has decided who is worthy to receive Christ.

 

[mjrhealth]

And shall not that priest be denied entrance in to heaven for His sin, He choose not to forgive, he did not choose love, he denied a soul entrance in to heaven, he obeyed his " churches " rules rather thans our Lords, to love all, to forgive, obedience over sacrifice. Again shall he not be judged the same. He walks a dangerous walk, pleasing to man but not to God,

In His Love

 

[aspen]

And shall not that priest be denied entrance in to heaven for His sin, He choose not to forgive, he did not choose love, he denied a soul entrance in to heaven, he obeyed his " churches " rules rather thans our Lords, to love all, to forgive, obedience over sacrifice. Again shall he not be judged the same. He walks a dangerous walk, pleasing to man but not to God,

In His Love

He needs our prayer;

 

[jiggyfly]

Well, to be fair - the gay bishops are celibate. However, I agree with you about offering the Eucharist. It saddens me that my church - the Catholic Church has decided who is worthy to receive Christ.

While they may decide who is worthy to participate in their religious liturgy, it has nothing to do with anyone receiving Christ because there is no mediator, whoever calls He will answer.

 

[aspen]

While they may decide who is worthy to participate in their religious liturgy, it has nothing to do with anyone receiving Christ because there is no mediator, whoever calls He will answer.

A truth which is comforting.

 

[neophyte]

Mans mind is finite, God is infinite, man can not comphehand completely the ways of God. God Himself instituted the Holy Eucharist , the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of the Son. As Catholics we deeply [ at least we should] believe in this miracle that only Jesus could have designed for all of us who wish to partake of our Lord in a very humane, intimate partiscipation of His Body through the Holy Eucharist. Jesus only asks from each of us who wishes to participate in this divine intimacy with Him to first examine ourselfs and if we need reconciliation for our sins to receive forgiveness for those sins by confession before participating in the Holy Eucharist.
The priest apparently understood the young lady to be a Buddhist, a non-Catholic, who does not believe that the Holy Eucharist is the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus, so in this situation the priest made the correct decision in refusing her.

 

[aspen]

Mans mind is finite, God is infinite, man can not comphehand completely the ways of God. God Himself instituted the Holy Eucharist , the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of the Son. As Catholics we deeply [ at least we should] believe in this miracle that only Jesus could have designed for all of us who wish to partake of our Lord in a very humane, intimate partiscipation of His Body through the Holy Eucharist. Jesus only asks from each of us who wishes to participate in this divine intimacy with Him to first examine ourselfs and if we need reconciliation for our sins to receive forgiveness for those sins by confession before participating in the Holy Eucharist.
The priest apparently understood the young lady to be a Buddhist, a non-Catholic, who does not believe that the Holy Eucharist is the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus, so in this situation the priest made the correct decision in refusing her.

I love your posts

 

[jiggyfly]

The priest apparently understood the young lady to be a Buddhist, a non-Catholic, who does not believe that the Holy Eucharist is the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus, so in this situation the priest made the correct decision in refusing her.

I agree, if she could not conform to the religious ideas of their religious group than she should not be allowed to participate in their religious functions.

 

[Foreigner]

Well, to be fair - the gay bishops are celibate. However, I agree with you about offering the Eucharist. It saddens me that my church - the Catholic Church has decided who is worthy to receive Christ.

-- What good is it to give a person who doesn't believe in God what the Catholics believe is the ACTUAL body and blood of Christ if that person doesn't for a second believe in God, let alone what Catholics claim the wafer actually is?

Christ's "pearls before swine" comment comes to mind:

“Do not give dogs what is holy, and do not throw your pearls before pigs, lest they trample them underfoot and turn to attack you." - Matt 7:6 ESV

The New Living Translation actually says it better:

"Don't waste what is holy on people who are unholy. Don't throw your pearls to pigs! They will trample the pearls, then turn and attack you" - Matt 7:6

Christ's own words, not mine.

Perhaps the Catholic church is simply standing on Christ's own words...even if they are wrong about the host becoming the actual, literal body of Christ.


.

 

[aspen]

-- What good is it to give a person who doesn't believe in God what the Catholics believe is the ACTUAL body and blood of Christ if that person doesn't for a second believe in God, let alone what Catholics claim the wafer actually is?

Christ's "pearls before swine" comment comes to mind:

“Do not give dogs what is holy, and do not throw your pearls before pigs, lest they trample them underfoot and turn to attack you." - Matt 7:6 ESV

The New Living Translation actually says it better:

"Don't waste what is holy on people who are unholy. Don't throw your pearls to pigs! They will trample the pearls, then turn and attack you" - Matt 7:6

Christ's own words, not mine.

Perhaps the Catholic church is simply standing on Christ's own words...even if they are wrong about the host becoming the actual, literal body of Christ.


.

You know I like you Foreigner - I really do.

You annoy me, anger me, and make me think. You are immature one moment, and gracious the next. I am not sure what to make of you, to be honest - but I do know you love God and you are good for me.

In this situation, I trust God more than man. Homosexuals need the Eucharist - regardless of their belief. In fact, I do not believe they would take it if they believed it was simply a "wafer" and no the body of Christ.

 

[brightmorningstar]

• 
  Mjrheath,
  Why is it people like yourself keep lying over and over again? If you want to lie why judge others for anything anyway?
  

  And still today, christians isolate teh gaysand say there sin is worse than all the others

  Er no, they don’t, they say it isn’t worse. Lost of people like yourself claim Christians say its worse.
  

  Still today the christians judge them and single them out.

  No they don’t, they just contribute to the debate by pointing out same sex relations are anatomically disordered and against God’s purposes. It is some gays who say they are getting judged.
  

  so why where they not deniied this eucherist.

  Thats already been explained. Gays aren’t greater than God, Christ’s teaching is one must not come to the eucharist trusting in their own righteousness, which people who wilfully commit same sex relations do because Christ’s teaching identifies same sex relations as error.
  

  You are not Christ, you do not have the right to judge anyone,

  How would you know?
  If you acknowledged Christ, you would acknowledge His teaching and thus not be making such remarks.
  

  We ALL fall short of he glory of Christ.

  We do, but gays who support same sex relations obviously don’t think they do. ;-) If you don’t recognise the sin of same sex relations then why should anyone else recognise any sin they don’t care to?
• God can deliver people from same sex relations.

 

[Foreigner]

You know I like you Foreigner - I really do.

You annoy me, anger me, and make me think. You are immature one moment, and gracious the next. I am not sure what to make of you, to be honest - but I do know you love God and you are good for me.

In this situation, I trust God more than man. Homosexuals need the Eucharist - regardless of their belief. In fact, I do not believe they would take it if they believed it was simply a "wafer" and no the body of Christ.

-- Trust me, Aspen, you are appreciated, as well.
This board can get rather dry when I don't have the chance to interact with you.
I am very glad you're back. Honestly.

To be candid, I wasn't thinking about her as a homosexual. I was thinking about her as a Buddhist.
Just because you are a homosexual, that doesn't mean you deny God or don't love Him. Being a Buddhist means just that.
Also, I'm not aware that the Catholic church would deny Eucharist to a homosexual Catholic.

My thought - since I am not longer in the Catholic faith - is that since it is not actually literally the body of Christ, if someone wants to come forward to receive it, I would have no problem with it.

It is what is in the person's heart as they take communion that is important.

 

[brightmorningstar]

aspen2

In this situation, I trust God more than man.

No you obviously trust man more than God. If you trusted God you wouldnt be encouraging people to sin by 'turning a blind eye'.
Everyone needs the eucharist, but Christ's teaching is that people need to come to Christ first. It is quote evident with the response from the gay factions that they dont believe it is the same god anyway. This is what is happening with these people, when it comes to a decision between God's word and believers on the one hand, and homsoexulaity on the other, they side with homosexuality.

Foreigner is absolutely correct.

To be candid, I wasn't thinking about her as a homosexual. I was thinking about her as a Buddhist.
Just because you are a homosexual, that doesn't mean you deny God or don't love Him. Being a Buddhist means just that.

 

[aspen]

-- Trust me, Aspen, you are appreciated, as well.
This board can get rather dry when I don't have the chance to interact with you.
I am very glad you're back. Honestly.

To be candid, I wasn't thinking about her as a homosexual. I was thinking about her as a Buddhist.
Just because you are a homosexual, that doesn't mean you deny God or don't love Him. Being a Buddhist means just that.
Also, I'm not aware that the Catholic church would deny Eucharist to a homosexual Catholic.

My thought - since I am not longer in the Catholic faith - is that since it is not actually literally the body of Christ, if someone wants to come forward to receive it, I would have no problem with it.

It is what is in the person's heart as they take communion that is important.

I understand what you are saying.

aspen2
No you obviously trust man more than God. If you trusted God you wouldnt be encouraging people to sin by 'turning a blind eye'.
Everyone needs the eucharist, but Christ's teaching is that people need to come to Christ first. It is quote evident with the response from the gay factions that they dont believe it is the same god anyway. This is what is happening with these people, when it comes to a decision between God's word and believers on the one hand, and homsoexulaity on the other, they side with homosexuality.

Foreigner is absolutely correct.

Simmer down!

No one is lying or trusting in men on this thread - sheeeeeeesh

Are you Catholic? If you are, you believe the Eucharist is the real body of Christ. Regardless of belief of the individual receiving the Eucharist - it is the real Body. People who are approaching the alter to receive the Eucharist, need it.

 

[[email protected]]

FOREIGNER said it best when he said, "it's their church and their rules".

Don't like it? Have a secular memorial service at the funeral home. Beer and pizza afterward. Pretend its communion.

So someone tell me how it is that gays get off telling everyone ELSE how to live, when they justify breaking every rule in the book among those they want to live with? Sounds like hypocrisy with a capital H to me. Somehow or another, they get their way, like whining children.

If a priest or a church wants to stand for something besides perpetual indulgence, then they are criticized. Meanwhile the twisted brethren corrupt everyone with their sickness. Perhaps that's the reason the church is shrinking so fast; that it won't STAND for anything. Come hell or high water, won't somebody STAND UP for what's right?

Is God as unrighteous as many want Him to be, or does He still hold to His integrity? If God still has standards and if God still loves righteousness, then we are in a lot of trouble. But maybe we're too busy kissing each other's behind to worry about what God thinks or might actually do.

Right up to the end, the citizens of Sodom and Gomorrah believed they were having their way too. Then God brought it all to a screeching halt.
Does it have to go that far? Lost sheep - listen and learn before it does go that far.

The gay life style is wrong and it is forbidden. The Bible says so. God says so.

but that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...

 

[brightmorningstar]

Aspen2,
Calm down. If you don’t like the points put to you perhaps a debating forum isnt the place for you.
Now.... care to address my points in the previous post?

Are you Catholic? If you are, you believe the Eucharist is the real body of Christ. Regardless of belief of the individual receiving the Eucharist - it is the real Body. People who are approaching the alter to receive the Eucharist, need it.

The NT teaching says people should not partake in an unworthy manner. Promoting and defending sin whilst receiving what was done to forgive sin, is doing so in an unworthy manner.
The priest is correct not to give the communion, and as he has trusted God’s word, he has trusted God.
Those who believe they can partake trusting in their sexuality, the acts of which are error to God, are trusting in their own righteousness.


I cant remeber what the Roman liturgy is, but the Anglican one is "we do not presume to come to this table trusting in our own righteousness... "