Charlie24,
All I have is, 1 Thessalonians 1:1-3. I am not here to argue or debate with anyone. All I can do is simply share what the scripture invites, and share my beliefs nothing more really.
Thank you, grace and peace,
Matthew
Revelation 3:10
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Charlie24,
All I have is, 1 Thessalonians 1:1-3. I am not here to argue or debate with anyone. All I can do is simply share what the scripture invites, and share my beliefs nothing more really.
Thank you, grace and peace,
Matthew
Ok, I was just wondering if that had crossed your mind.
We share in common the Idea that we don't want to argue, in the bad sense of the word anyway.
Charlie24,
Hopefully, the mention of the starting opening letter helps in understanding. It's amazing how people forget the original audience to begin with, and Complete also shared concerning the passage, on the first page, which mention a passage in Zeph. I am someone who does believe that the bride of Christ in that day in age still was made up of Gentiles, and Jews of that time. Whom were gathered up together and taken.
Grace, and peace,
Matthew
Hopefully, the mention of the starting opening letter helps in understanding. It's amazing how people forget the original audience to begin with, and Complete also shared concerning the passage, on the first page, which mention a passage in Zeph. I am someone who does believe that the bride of Christ in that day in age still was made up of Gentiles, and Jews of that time. Whom were gathered up together and taken.
Grace, and peace,
Matthew
I'm not sure what you mean by this, Matthew, we're not exactly on the same track in Scripture.
It's so easy to misunderstand what is believed or said, not knowing one another.
Hello Charlie24,
I look at everything wholistically. Not in bits and pieces. Not sure where you wanna go from there. What I mean by wholestically, I consider the old testament and new testament as a whole. I believe people typically just chop up the bible a lot more than looking at it in such a way. Its understandable that you wouldn't get what I shared, but it seems like I was open in sharing what is that concerning your question.
I am not sure how I can help or proceed.
Grace, and peace,
Matthew
I look at everything wholistically. Not in bits and pieces. Not sure where you wanna go from there. What I mean by wholestically, I consider the old testament and new testament as a whole. I believe people typically just chop up the bible a lot more than looking at it in such a way. Its understandable that you wouldn't get what I shared, but it seems like I was open in sharing what is that concerning your question.
I am not sure how I can help or proceed.
Grace, and peace,
Matthew
There are many people who do not like the Old Testament God... Yahavah/Yahweh/Yehovah. Lol.
I think he is pretty based personally! Though he had to interact in the way he did, in order for the nation of Israel to surivie, with having nations wiped out and children put to death, yatta yatta...
I'm thankful for Yeshua, and him doing what he has done, because those nations not having been wiped out, he would have never came to begin with.
For him being put to death, the same would come back upon them for their their desire to forget God all together, worshiping the law.
It's like a football that is inside out, pulled into its right state again.
I think he is pretty based personally! Though he had to interact in the way he did, in order for the nation of Israel to surivie, with having nations wiped out and children put to death, yatta yatta...
I'm thankful for Yeshua, and him doing what he has done, because those nations not having been wiped out, he would have never came to begin with.
For him being put to death, the same would come back upon them for their their desire to forget God all together, worshiping the law.
It's like a football that is inside out, pulled into its right state again.
The New Testament is the Old Testament revealed.
Christ is hidden in the OT in types and shadows, but revealed in the flesh in the NT.
Paul preached Christ from the OT while he was writing the NT.
Many times in his epistles he proved Christ was the Messiah from the old prophets speaking in the OT.
Hello Charlie24,
I am uploading a video to why I believe that Jesus is not coming back today with use of the bible. If you watch it or not. That is up to you. It took me 27 minutes to make, but I don't have to sit here and try to argue with anyone back and forth through text anymore! :)
www.christianityboard.com
Thank you, praise God,
Matthew
I am uploading a video to why I believe that Jesus is not coming back today with use of the bible. If you watch it or not. That is up to you. It took me 27 minutes to make, but I don't have to sit here and try to argue with anyone back and forth through text anymore! :)
Not a future seeing Jesus coming guy
You didn't address what I said. I'm not saying this is the case, but you come across as if you didn't believe in spiritual things that are unseen and you only believe in things that you can physically see. We are spiritually in the kingdom of God/heaven/Christ right now. When Jesus returns, we...
www.christianityboard.com
Thank you, praise God,
Matthew
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Hello @MathewG, (& Carlie24)
In regard to what you have said concerning an holistic approach to Scripture i.e., [(dictionary):- in a way that is characterized by the belief that the parts of something are intimately interconnected and explicable only by reference to the whole]: At the beginning of a study I have in my possession, the writer says, '... we cannot expect to find the general principles, which we may regard 'the truth,' by arguing from certain particular parts of the truth. On the contrary, we must reason from the general to the particular, if we would reason accurately. I believe this to be sound advice.
Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
Hello @complete, I was not sure what you were saying. I agree with you too! Absolutely.
Here’s a breakdown of what they’re saying:
Core Idea:
• Holistic interpretation means understanding Scripture by seeing how all its parts fit together, rather than isolating verses or doctrines.
• The writer of the study they reference argues that we shouldn't try to extract "general principles" (or ultimate truths) by cherry-picking isolated verses.
• Instead, we should begin with the overall message or framework of Scripture and then interpret individual passages in light of that.
Reasoning Method:
- From general to particular: Start with the big picture—God’s character, covenantal themes, redemptive arc—and then interpret specific verses accordingly.
- This guards against distortion, where someone might take a verse out of context and build a doctrine that contradicts the broader biblical narrative.
This approach resonates with how Jesus and the apostles interpreted Scripture:
- Jesus often said, “You have heard… but I say…” (Matthew 5), reframing specific laws within the broader ethic of love and mercy.
- Paul wrote, “The whole Scripture is God-breathed…” (2 Timothy 3:16), implying unity and coherence across texts.
- Proverbs 8 and John 1 both present wisdom and the Word as foundational—not fragmented.
They’re saying:
“Don’t build theology from isolated verses. Start with the full revelation of God’s nature and purpose, then let that shape how you understand the details.”
It’s a call for contextual integrity and spiritual coherence—a method that aligns with your own remixing of theological chaos into clarity.
'Because thou hast kept the word of My patience,
I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation,
which shall come upon all the world, (G3625)
to try them that dwell upon the earth.' (G1093)
(Rev 3:10)
Hello @MatthewG,
How would this principle be used in relation to your question in the OP? You would presumably see how the word 'earth' is used elsewhere in Scripture generally, especially where the context is relative to the one you have quoted? Forgive me if I back track and take a look at this now with this principle in mind.
'the earth' = (Str.No. G1093) . Gr. 'ge.'
Used of :-
a. the ground - (e.g., Matt. 10:29 & Mrk.4:1)
b. the country or region - (Luke 4:25)
c. the world - (Luke 21:35)
* In the Companion Bible App. 129:4:-
'ge' - the land as distinct from water; or earth, as distinct from heaven; or region or territory. Used of one special land, or country, as distinct from other countries, in which peoples dwell, each on its own soil.
Ref:- Zeph. 1:14-18
(14) The great day of the LORD (Rev. 1:10) is near, it is near, and hasteth greatly,
even the voice of the day of the LORD: the mighty man shall cry there bitterly.
(15) That day is a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress,
a day of wasteness and desolation,
a day of darkness and gloominess,
a day of clouds and thick darkness,
(16) A day of the trumpet and alarm
against the fenced cities, and against the high towers.
(17) And I will bring distress upon men, that they shall walk like blind men,
because they have sinned against the LORD:
and their blood shall be poured out as dust, and their flesh as the dung.
(18) Neither their silver nor their gold shall be able to deliver them in the day of the LORD'S wrath;
but the whole land shall be devoured by the fire of His jealousy:
for He shall make even a speedy riddance of all them that dwell in the land.'
* The Trumpet is a call to arms.
Thank you, Matthew
In Christ Jesus
Our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.
Chris
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Hello Chris,
I believe you are a natural Carmen Sandiago, or a Hardy Boy, or Sherlock Holmes (those are some people who are detectives I have read in my lifetime.) There are so many people that do not even know these things at all. We could reduce with all your findings in such a way we could simply change the text itself into saying.
Revelation 3:10 Because you kept my command to endure, I also will keep you from the hour of testing which is to come on all the region, to try those who dwell upon the land.
Of course someone may say "Matthew you are taking away and adding to" you are doomed. However wouldn't that make much more sense? Especially with the notion of the first few passage concerning the opening letter, "things which must shortly come to pass."
Grace and peace,
Matthew
Hi @MatthewG,
I believe that the book of Revelation was written to the Jew, and not the church of God, and they would have no difficulty therefore in knowing what was intended. Having the word of God, by the mouth of Zephaniah and the other Old Testament prophets to confirm it. No change of text needed if enquirers simply compare Scripture with Scripture, and let the word of God speak, without the interference of the words of man.
For the unbeliever or those who have not heard the gospel of the grace of God, the gospel of John is all that they require to come to faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, and that is all that any one needs. The letters of Paul bring in the gospel of the grace of God, and take the new fledgling on into Christ risen, the assurance of salvation and the inheritance that is theirs in Christ. They need therefore not fear the wrath to come, or the words of the book of Revelation, important as that book is.
Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Risen and glorified
and sat at God's right hand.
Chris
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Hello complete,
Exactly. That is why when I see world, I think "their world." Their preisthoods, their temple they had, the way they lived. All of it was coming to and end. Using the scripture itself, even with the referencial change makes no difference whether "the world" is used or not. Though people can abuse the text with any means needed if they need to do so, as you have admitted there would be no reason to question when looking at the Old Testament itself, and comparing it with Revelation as there are so many references connecting them both as it was to the Jewish people in that day. I dont know what you mean about church of God. However, I do believe all of it relates to the bride of Christ, the gentile and jewish people that made that bride whom was very small who were taken in that day in age, with the consuming of the land itself with God's wrath.
Praise God that cup was poured out, never to be filled again.
Thank you for the text you have shared with me again because it just makes the case itself more evident for people to see.
Grace and peace,
Matthew
Hello @MatthewG,
'The Church of God' (Acts 20:28), is intended by me as an all covering title, as is the title, 'The Kingdom of God', nothing more. I am a member of the church which is the Body of Christ, of which Paul wrote in Ephesians, Colossians, Philippians, 2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon, following a revelation of God, while the Lord's Prisoner (Eph. 3) at the end of the book of Acts.
'The Bride of Christ' is yet another calling. Which will require another thread.
Have to leave now.
In Christ Jesus
Chris
Thank you for all you shared with me, @complete
I believe people are part of that Bride of Christ today, but they don't face what that first-century group did.
All that is left to do truly is worship Yahavah/Yahweh/Yehovah/God in spirit and truth, which the Father seeks for according to the Lord Jesus!
I do believe we inherit what He has, and we are able to find strength in Him helping us by His resurrected Spirit, and live by that power if we so abide in Yeshua…
“Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me.” — John 15:4
…and are looked at as children of God, and mature into sons or daughters of God, as we grow and live and experience in this life, which is and can be extremely overwhelming and difficult.
Going tomorrow to go get a job, and hopefully it all goes well. Imma stick it out this time, and stay sober and do what is right, though my flesh will dread it, is scared, is afraid, nervous, 'cause it feels like it needs to be a certain way all the time…
…but if I can put it to death and just let the Lord Yeshua come through, and God work on my mind and heart.
You enjoy your time, hope all is well with your loved ones,
Grace and peace
Matthew
I believe people are part of that Bride of Christ today, but they don't face what that first-century group did.
All that is left to do truly is worship Yahavah/Yahweh/Yehovah/God in spirit and truth, which the Father seeks for according to the Lord Jesus!
I do believe we inherit what He has, and we are able to find strength in Him helping us by His resurrected Spirit, and live by that power if we so abide in Yeshua…
“Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me.” — John 15:4
…and are looked at as children of God, and mature into sons or daughters of God, as we grow and live and experience in this life, which is and can be extremely overwhelming and difficult.
Going tomorrow to go get a job, and hopefully it all goes well. Imma stick it out this time, and stay sober and do what is right, though my flesh will dread it, is scared, is afraid, nervous, 'cause it feels like it needs to be a certain way all the time…
…but if I can put it to death and just let the Lord Yeshua come through, and God work on my mind and heart.
You enjoy your time, hope all is well with your loved ones,
Grace and peace
Matthew
ScottA
Well-Known Member
Why do you make such claims?
That is a message to the Church--not only to "Jewish people" and not under the Old Covenant, but under the New Covenant.
Hello ScottA,
The reason I do is because Jesus came to fulfill the Old Covenant, and there was promises of when he came, of what was to come. The Wrath of God for the disobedient Jewish people of that time. You see in the scripture themselves.
I'll tell you this much, from my point of view, Gentil and Jewish people were part of the bride. I believe there may have been Jewish people within that same bride that were still going by the law, and there was the other ones whom were faithful, whom were also part of this people. We know that Jesus was the only one to uphold the law, however if you go and look and read about Mary and Joseph, you will find that they too were blameless in walking in the Law.
I do not believe we walk by that law any longer because the Old Covenant, and the Old Wolrd was replaced by the new, everything concerning the Spirit of the Resurrected Lord Jesus Christ within us, with also the notion of understanding that God also is within us, not saying we are "God" himself however we are a part of him, and somehow he lives within each and every person.
So. I hope this answers your question throughly and thoughtfully being spirit led as well,
Because I do believe these things are true, Gentile and Jewish people all showed up together at the temple.
It's in the Old Testament, and continue to be done in the New Testament. Then Jesus came to gather this bride.
And Destruction ensued.
The apostles governed over this bride.
Grace and peace,
Matthew
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Co-Pilot Rewrite with Scripture
The reason I do is because Jesus came to fulfill the Old Covenant, and there were promises of what would come when He arrived. “Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill” (Matthew 5:17). The wrath of God was revealed against the disobedient, as foretold—“For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men” (Romans 1:18). You see this in the scriptures themselves, especially in prophetic warnings and the judgment that followed.
I'll tell you this much, from my point of view, Gentile and Jewish people were part of the bride. “There is neither Jew nor Greek... for you are all one in Christ Jesus” (Galatians 3:28). I believe there may have been Jewish people within that same bride who were still going by the law, and others who were faithful in Spirit—both part of this people. We know that Jesus was the only one to uphold the law perfectly—“He committed no sin, nor was deceit found in His mouth” (1 Peter 2:22)—yet if you read about Mary and Joseph, you’ll find they too were righteous in their walk. “They were both righteous before God, walking blamelessly in all the commandments and statutes of the Lord” (Luke 1:6).
I do not believe we walk by that law any longer, because the Old Covenant and the Old World were replaced by the new. “By calling this covenant ‘new,’ He has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear” (Hebrews 8:13). Everything now concerns the Spirit of the Resurrected Lord Jesus Christ within us—“Christ in you, the hope of glory” (Colossians 1:27)—with the understanding that God dwells within us.
Not that we are God Himself, but we are part of Him, and He lives within each person who believes. “Do you not know that you are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in you?” (1 Corinthians 3:16).
So, I hope this answers your question thoroughly and thoughtfully, being Spirit-led as well. I do believe these things are true—Gentile and Jewish people worshipped together at the temple. “My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations” (Isaiah 56:7).
We also remember what happened right? Jesus coming stating "You have made my Fathers house a den of theives." That was how far away from God they had gotten. They started selling animals for the price of sin. (add statement)
This was true in the Old Testament and continued into the New. Then Jesus came to gather His bride—“The bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding banquet” (Matthew 25:10)—and destruction followed for those who rejected Him. “But the sons of the kingdom will be cast out into outer darkness” (Matthew 8:12).
The apostles governed over this bride, laying the foundation. “Built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the cornerstone” (Ephesians 2:20).
Grace and peace,
Matthew
The reason I do is because Jesus came to fulfill the Old Covenant, and there were promises of what would come when He arrived. “Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill” (Matthew 5:17). The wrath of God was revealed against the disobedient, as foretold—“For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men” (Romans 1:18). You see this in the scriptures themselves, especially in prophetic warnings and the judgment that followed.
I'll tell you this much, from my point of view, Gentile and Jewish people were part of the bride. “There is neither Jew nor Greek... for you are all one in Christ Jesus” (Galatians 3:28). I believe there may have been Jewish people within that same bride who were still going by the law, and others who were faithful in Spirit—both part of this people. We know that Jesus was the only one to uphold the law perfectly—“He committed no sin, nor was deceit found in His mouth” (1 Peter 2:22)—yet if you read about Mary and Joseph, you’ll find they too were righteous in their walk. “They were both righteous before God, walking blamelessly in all the commandments and statutes of the Lord” (Luke 1:6).
I do not believe we walk by that law any longer, because the Old Covenant and the Old World were replaced by the new. “By calling this covenant ‘new,’ He has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear” (Hebrews 8:13). Everything now concerns the Spirit of the Resurrected Lord Jesus Christ within us—“Christ in you, the hope of glory” (Colossians 1:27)—with the understanding that God dwells within us.
Not that we are God Himself, but we are part of Him, and He lives within each person who believes. “Do you not know that you are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in you?” (1 Corinthians 3:16).
So, I hope this answers your question thoroughly and thoughtfully, being Spirit-led as well. I do believe these things are true—Gentile and Jewish people worshipped together at the temple. “My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations” (Isaiah 56:7).
We also remember what happened right? Jesus coming stating "You have made my Fathers house a den of theives." That was how far away from God they had gotten. They started selling animals for the price of sin. (add statement)
This was true in the Old Testament and continued into the New. Then Jesus came to gather His bride—“The bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding banquet” (Matthew 25:10)—and destruction followed for those who rejected Him. “But the sons of the kingdom will be cast out into outer darkness” (Matthew 8:12).
The apostles governed over this bride, laying the foundation. “Built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the cornerstone” (Ephesians 2:20).
Grace and peace,
Matthew
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