Reverlation 6, Coronavirus ???

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CharismaticLady

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If I thought that you had understanding on this matter I would listen to you, but your argument is that of a deluded Bishop who did not understand what a prophetic year was.

As I had stated in my previous post, the 2,300 years that was prophesised of the Heathen Gentiles trampling God's Sanctuary and Hosts is a fixed number of solar years.

Jay, do you know what makes these "days" 24 hour periods rather than prophetic days of a year or 1000 years? Tell me. It is the same as in Daniel 8. It is the law of first mention. Ever heard of this law?

You can scoff at me, but it is obvious, I know more than you do. And we are not talking about Daniel 9's 70 weeks of 490 years. We agree on that, I think. Actually, you may believe the last verse is Jesus putting an end to the sacrifices, if you believe as other Adventists, but that is wrong; it is after the destruction of the temple in 70 AD.


Genesis 1:
3 Then God said, “Let there be light”...So the evening and the morning were the first day.

6 Then God said, “Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.” ...So the evening and the morning were the second day.
...
11 Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb that yields seed, and the fruit tree that yields fruit according to its kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth”; and it was so. ...13 So the evening and the morning were the third day.

14 Then God said, “... Then God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night. He made the stars also. ...19 So the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

20 Then God said, “..., “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let birds multiply on the earth.” 23 So the evening and the morning were the fifth day.

24 Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth the living creature according to its kind: cattle and creeping thing and beast of the earth, each according to its kind”; and it was so....26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness;...31 Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good. So the evening and the morning were the sixth day.
 
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CharismaticLady

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I am not sure that the Adventists would want me in their ranks as I disagree with most of what they believe is their "truth." There understanding is very much in line with your man created conceptualisation of the holy scriptures.

But this strawman argumentative put down on your part does not make you an expert at all, IMHO. In fact it just confirms the fallacies that you believe in when you try to pigeon hole a person into a particular "hole" of your biased understanding.

You're not filled with the Spirit are you? Do you speak in tongues or have any of the other gifts? Let me ask you what you mean by my "man created conceptualization of the Holy Scriptures. What in particular? Let's discuss.
 

Jay Ross

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You're not filled with the Spirit are you? Do you speak in tongues or have any of the other gifts? Let me ask you what you mean by my "man created conceptualization of the Holy Scriptures. What in particular? Let's discuss.

So now you are bring out the "I'm more spiritual than you are therefore I must have a better understanding than you, argument."

How sad it is that you must resort to that particular argument in an attempt to prove your superiority over others.

How can I speak in tongues to you on a word based forum, to prove your accusation is wrong? You say that you can see the fruits of a person by how they write their posts? Written texts are one of the hardest means of communicating what a Person actually believes and understands.

What I am sensing is that you have run out of "facts" that support your understandings so you have resorted to personally attacking the person instead. A great move, shooting yourself in the foot by doing this.
 

CharismaticLady

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So now you are bring out the "I'm more spiritual than you are therefore I must have a better understanding than you, argument."

How sad it is that you must resort to that particular argument in an attempt to prove your superiority over others.

How can I speak in tongues to you on a word based forum, to prove your accusation is wrong? You say that you can see the fruits of a person by how they write their posts? Written texts are one of the hardest means of communicating what a Person actually believes and understands.

What I am sensing is that you have run out of "facts" that support your understandings so you have resorted to personally attacking the person instead. A great move, shooting yourself in the foot by doing this.

The reason why I asked is because I sensed a lack of the fruit of the Spirit in your mean posts, so I asked if there were any signs you were indwelt with Him. As far as facts, you didn't answer my question about how many days or years or thousands of years that God took in creating the world. But it doesn't appear you care. You obviously have your mind made up, so what do actual historical facts matter.
 

Jay Ross

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Jay, do you know what makes these "days" 24 hour periods rather than prophetic days of a year or 1000 years? Tell me. It is the same as in Daniel 8. It is the law of first mention. Ever heard of this law?

Yes, I know about this law, and I use it to verify the meaning of both Hebrew and Greek words when I am exploring the scriptures. I do not just go to the Root Word meaning as manner other do.

You can scoff at me, but it is obvious, I know more than you do.

That is just your opinion. Making that claim does not prove that it is true.

And we are not talking about Daniel 9's 70 weeks of 490 years. We agree on that, I think.

Are you agreeing with me that the starting point of the 490 years to repent of and put a stop to their continuous sin of idolatrous worship, is the year, 494 BC?

Actually, you may believe the last verse is Jesus putting an end to the sacrifices, if you believe as other Adventists, . . . .

As I had previously stated, I would not be accepted in any Adventist church. I am not an Adventist as you are suggesting.

. . . . but that is wrong; it is after the destruction of the temple in 70 AD.

It seems to me that you have no idea as to why the Temple had to be raised to the ground by God. It was God’s way of showing the Israelites that He had turn His back towards them and was not listening to their pleas.

Genesis 1:

3 Then God said, “Let there be light”...So the evening and the morning were the first day.

6 Then God said, “Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.” ...So the evening and the morning were the second day.
...
11 Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb that yields seed, and the fruit tree that yields fruit according to its kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth”; and it was so. ...13 So the evening and the morning were the third day.

14 Then God said, “... Then God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night. He made the stars also. ...19 So the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

20 Then God said, “..., “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let birds multiply on the earth.” 23 So the evening and the morning were the fifth day.

24 Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth the living creature according to its kind: cattle and creeping thing and beast of the earth, each according to its kind”; and it was so....26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness;...31 Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good. So the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

I have a question for you to answer. Were the first, second, third, fourth, fifth and six day referenced to time within God’s domain or within man’s domain of understanding?

Have you approached the above quoted verses within the conceptual understanding of God or man?

I would suggest to you that your understanding of the above verses is from the conceptual understanding of man and not that of God.

If we were to apply your rule of first mention then, to Daniel 8:14 as you are suggesting, because of the evening and morning being the same timespan as found in Genesis 1 where the same manner is used to describe a day, then the time span of 2,300 “days” would have to be measured within God’s timeframe of conceptual understanding and not as you are wanting to apply within your framework of time which is the conceptualisation of your understanding within the conceptual framework of man. Now if a day unto the lord within His timeframe of reference, is as a thousand years for mankind, then we are talking about 2,300,000 years, which is not the case and is beyond our ability to comprehend.

Now within mankind’s timeframe of reference with respect to the year for a day understanding within the Book of Daniel, it is my belief that Daniel 8:14 is referencing a time period of 2,300 years which is in keeping with other OT prophecies such as in Hosea 6:2 or Lam 5:19-22 where both prophecies are referencing a period of 2,000 plus years that God has turned His back on the nation of Israel until the third and the fourth period of time of Ex 20:4-6 has run its full course in time.

God’s declared punishment of the nation of Israel was that they would be trampled by the Gentile Nations of the earth wherever they lived during this period.

It seems to me that you have not linked enough OT prophetic passages together to determine the timespan for Daniel 8:14 to understand the errors in your determination of your interpretation.

Shalom
 

Jay Ross

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The reason why I asked is because I sensed a lack of the fruit of the Spirit in your mean posts, so I asked if there were any signs you were indwelt with Him. As far as facts, you didn't answer my question about how many days or years or thousands of years that God took in creating the world. But it doesn't appear you care. You obviously have your mind made up, so what do actual historical facts matter.

You are a very impatient person. You need to give people time to respond.
 

Jay Ross

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No. I'm sorry, I must have missed reading that. What do you base that date on?

If Jesus was born at the very beginning of the fifth age of mankind and if He was born in the year 4 BC then subtracting the 490 years from 4 BC gives us the year 494 BC when the 490 years began of the Daniel 9:24a prophecy.
 

CharismaticLady

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If Jesus was born at the very beginning of the fifth age of mankind and if He was born in the year 4 BC then subtracting the 490 years from 4 BC gives us the year 494 BC when the 490 years began of the Daniel 9:24a prophecy.

The problem is you are adding the entire 490 years. Read Daniel 9 again.
That from the going forth of the command
To restore and build Jerusalem
Until Messiah the Prince,
“And after the sixty-two weeks (out of 70 weeks)
Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself;
 
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Jay Ross

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The problem is you are adding the entire 490 years. Read Daniel 9 again.
That from the going forth of the command
To restore and build Jerusalem
Until Messiah the Prince,
“And after the sixty-two weeks (out of 70 weeks)
Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself;

Daniel 9:24 is a separate prophecy from 9:25 prophecy. In fact, all of the prophecies in 9:24-27 are independent and separate from each other and are not linked as you are suggesting. The 490 years is associated with Israel and Jerusalem repenting of their sin of idolatry, before the end of the second age of the existence of Israel, after which as stated in 24 b, Christ will, "make reconciliation for iniquity, bring in everlasting righteousness, seal up vision and prophecy, and anoint the Most Holy. We are not told when 24 b will occur except, we know from the NT, that it will occur when Christ is raised up on a tree for all to see, which must occur as prophesised in 26 a.

It seems to me that you are trying to explain verses 24-27 from a man based concept and not from a God conceptualisation.

If you had read my post carefully, you would have noticed that the end of the 490 years for Israel to stop their idolatrous sinning co-insides with the end of the second age of their existence which happen when Christ is born at the very beginning of the fifth age, which also happens to be the third age of the existence of the descendants of Abraham. Israel, by not complying with 24a, had already condemned themselves to the visitation of their iniquities upon their children and their children's children because of their idolatrous behaviour. during the next two ages all of Israel will be sold into slavery and scattered to the four corners of the earth.

Shalom
 

Waiting on him

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I understand how you see it. I understand how quite a lot of people in here see it, because I've read their posts for a while now. I think every single person in here (including me) is missing a key.
Revelation 1:1 KJV
[1] The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Maybe the key is in this verse?
Tecarta Bible
 
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Waiting on him

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Uh...maybe? Care to explain yourself mister? o_O:p
Well Jesus said the generation wouldn’t pass before these things happen on the mt of olives. My question is had John witnessed the destruction of the temple before penning revelation?
Are the things we’re seeing currently signs of something to come or are they ripples of something already happened?
 
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stunnedbygrace

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I see what you're saying. And yes, the temple was destroyed. But not everything has been fulfilled. If we can make our brains accept it and try to always keep it in mind, prophecy moves backwards and forwards and there are gaps of time where it doesn't TELL us there are gaps of time. In a sense, prophecy is, was and is to come. But it is really hard to read and see in a...linearly fashion, as we do, while also keeping that in mind.

Additionally, there are some who can't seem to catch even a glimpse of the spirit of the words, and even those who do glimpse it at times, they have that dang default position too.

But, our default position way of seeing is not insane. Prophecy is fulfilled literally as well as in spirit. However, if a part has been fulfilled literally already, men might be waiting for something that is not going to happen again literally. For instance, it is possible that the temple being "rebuilt" is the temple in Spirit this time. If their partial blindness is lifted, not a one of those who could finally see would want to build a physical temple for animal sacrifices. Men who could see would not do that!
 

CharismaticLady

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Daniel 9:24 is a separate prophecy from 9:25 prophecy. In fact, all of the prophecies in 9:24-27 are independent and separate from each other and are not linked as you are suggesting. The 490 years is associated with Israel and Jerusalem repenting of their sin of idolatry, before the end of the second age of the existence of Israel, after which as stated in 24 b, Christ will, "make reconciliation for iniquity, bring in everlasting righteousness, seal up vision and prophecy, and anoint the Most Holy. We are not told when 24 b will occur except, we know from the NT, that it will occur when Christ is raised up on a tree for all to see, which must occur as prophesised in 26 a.

It seems to me that you are trying to explain verses 24-27 from a man based concept and not from a God conceptualisation.

If you had read my post carefully, you would have noticed that the end of the 490 years for Israel to stop their idolatrous sinning co-insides with the end of the second age of their existence which happen when Christ is born at the very beginning of the fifth age, which also happens to be the third age of the existence of the descendants of Abraham. Israel, by not complying with 24a, had already condemned themselves to the visitation of their iniquities upon their children and their children's children because of their idolatrous behaviour. during the next two ages all of Israel will be sold into slavery and scattered to the four corners of the earth.

Shalom

You still have a problem. There were no decrees given in 494 BC. Your start date is not historical.

I would still like for you to prove your 2300 day prophecy is years and not 24 hour periods as first shown in Genesis 1.
 

CharismaticLady

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I see what you're saying. And yes, the temple was destroyed. But not everything has been fulfilled. If we can make our brains accept it and try to always keep it in mind, prophecy moves backwards and forwards and there are gaps of time where it doesn't TELL us there are gaps of time. In a sense, prophecy is, was and is to come. But it is really hard to read and see in a...linearly fashion, as we do, while also keeping that in mind.

Additionally, there are some who can't seem to catch even a glimpse of the spirit of the words, and even those who do glimpse it at times, they have that dang default position too.

But, our default position way of seeing is not insane. Prophecy is fulfilled literally as well as in spirit. However, if a part has been fulfilled literally already, men might be waiting for something that is not going to happen again literally. For instance, it is possible that the temple being "rebuilt" is the temple in Spirit this time. If their partial blindness is lifted, not a one of those who could finally see would want to build a physical temple for animal sacrifices. Men who could see would not do that!

One thought I just had, most of the animal sacrifices in the Old Testament BEFORE THE LAW were as burnt offerings, not for sin, but probably for praise and thankfulness.
 
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Jay Ross

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You still have a problem. There were no decrees given in 494 BC. Your start date is not historical.

No, I do not have a problem with what I have posted as it is based on scripture.

Simply read the passage Daniel 9:24-27 and it becomes clear.

The First prophecy which is of two parts: -

First part is for the nation of Israel and Jerusalem: -

24a "Seventy weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of sins,​

We know the end point of this portion of the prophecy as being the end of the fourth age of mankind which is also the end of the second age of the existence of the descendants of Abraham and was set by God in the se3cond commandment Ex 20:4-6. Now if the Nation of Israel had repented of their continual Idolatrous Worship by the time of the 490 years, then what we have to consider is, "Would God have relented on the punishment of the collective Nation of Israel and not then gone ahead with the visitation of the iniquities of the fathers upon their children and the children's children during the next two ages. If we then know the end point for this prophecy, then the starting point for the prophecy must be 490 years earlier, in the year 494 BC since the fourth age of mankind ended and the fifth age began with the birth of Christ. Notice that there is no decreed act which is associated with this one verse prophecy.

The Second Part of this prophecy: -

24b To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy.​

In second portion of this one verse prophecy, the actions described can only be performed by Christ, and there are no time signposts for when this portion of the prophecy will be performed. From a historical perspective, we do know that this portion of the first prophecy occurred in the 34th year of Christ’s life, which we today describe as Christ being 33 years old.

The Second Prophecy in the 9:24-27 passage is: -

25 "Know therefore and understand,
That from the going forth of the command
To restore and build Jerusalem
Until Messiah the Prince,
There shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks;
The street shall be built again, and the wall,
Even in troublesome times.​

This passage does have two signpost markers which we can understand, and they are, 1. The command to restore and build Jerusalem, which is at the start of this prophecy, and, 2. The coming of the Messiah, which ends this prophecy.

This is where we have trouble in our interpretation of this passage. What is meant by the expression, “Until the Messiah the Prince?” Does it mean either: - a. Christ’s birth in Bethlehem, or, b. when Christ began His three or so years of ministry?

Now if the understanding of the end point of this prophecy is the Birth of Christ, then the starting point for this prophecy is the year 483 BC, when Cyrus, the King over Babylon releases the Israelites, to return to Jerusalem and the land of Canaan, to rebuild the temple in Jerusalem. If the understanding of the end point is the beginning of Christ’s ministry, when He was 30 years old, then the starting point of this prophecy is the year 453 BC, which is 30 years later.

Sadly, the Bishop used his Prophetic Years formula to fix the dates, which were also adopted by historians as well, when certain events took place. If we use his formula in reverse, we can get back to the original prophetic years. The Bishop had ignored the fact that the calendar year of the Israelite nation was adjusted to fit the Solar yearly calendar over about a 19 year cycle.

The Third prophecy in the 9:24-27 passage is: -

26a "And after the sixty-two weeks
Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself;​

Now there are no signposts associated with this two-line prophecy in this verse, except that it will happen after the sixty-two weeks of years have passed. Whether the time gap is 3-4 years of 33-34 years is immaterial except with regards to our understanding of when Christ is come.

It is my experience that it is not necessary for us to be able to solve all of the mysteries given in the scriptures, except to come to an acceptance that the mysteries do not alter God’s plan for the salvation of mankind.

The Fourth Prophecy in the passage 9:24-27 is: -

26b And the people of the prince who is to come
Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be with a flood,
And till the end of the war desolations are determined.​

Now in this prophetic passage, it is making reference to the Little Horn who influences Titus to come up against Jerusalem with his army to destroy the Temple and to scatter the Israelite people to the four corners of the earth.

We do have and end date for this prophecy, and that date is when Isaiah 24:21-22 occurs and Satan, the Little Horn and the Beast(s) are thrown out of heaven down to the earth and imprisoned in the pit/bottomless pit for a period of 1,000 years. It is not until the influence of the wicked fallen heavenly hosts influence over the sea of humanity is curtailed that the trampling of God’s Hosts, the Israelites, will end in our near future.

You have also asked that I prove that the 2,300-day prophecy is a year for each of the 2,300 days: -

I would still like for you to prove your 2300 day prophecy is years and not 24 hour periods as first shown in Genesis 1.

Perhaps you may like to answer this question, “Are the Israelites still being trampled today?”

If your answer is “yes,” in that they are still being trampled and are still being oppressed and killed by the heathen nations where they are scattered, then you have determined the answer for yourself and the year for a day rule is applicable for the Daniel 8:14 prophecy.

If your answer is “no,” then you have to prove to me that they are not presently being oppressed and killed by the people around them and that this has been the case, i.e. they are not being oppressed and killed, over the last 2,000 or so years since they were sold off as slaves and scattered to the four corners of the earth. Can you convince me that this has been the case since 70 AD. It is my opinion that you cannot.

The Fifth Prophecy then follows, and we have a pause in the prophecies in the passage 9:24-27 of 1,000 years before the fifth prophecy kicks in.

27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.
And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined,
Is poured out on the desolator."​

In the first line of this passage, we are not told who the “he” is who makes a solemn covenant with the people of the earth. From the Hebrew, we know that the “he” is acting insolently, which means that the “he” is either Satan or the Little Horn who in the Book of Revelation is also called the False Prophet.

The only time for this prophecy to be in play is after the Bottomless pit is opened after the passing of the 1,000 years. In both cases the consummation which is determined is poured out on the one who makes desolate. Bother Satan and the False Prophet makes desolate those who come under their influence.

From where I sit, in reflection, it seems that history confirms what I am posting.

Shalom
 

CharismaticLady

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No, I do not have a problem with what I have posted as it is based on scripture.

Simply read the passage Daniel 9:24-27 and it becomes clear.

The First prophecy which is of two parts: -

First part is for the nation of Israel and Jerusalem: -

24a "Seventy weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of sins,​

We know the end point of this portion of the prophecy as being the end of the fourth age of mankind which is also the end of the second age of the existence of the descendants of Abraham and was set by God in the se3cond commandment Ex 20:4-6. Now if the Nation of Israel had repented of their continual Idolatrous Worship by the time of the 490 years, then what we have to consider is, "Would God have relented on the punishment of the collective Nation of Israel and not then gone ahead with the visitation of the iniquities of the fathers upon their children and the children's children during the next two ages. If we then know the end point for this prophecy, then the starting point for the prophecy must be 490 years earlier, in the year 494 BC since the fourth age of mankind ended and the fifth age began with the birth of Christ. Notice that there is no decreed act which is associated with this one verse prophecy.

The Second Part of this prophecy: -

24b To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy.​

In second portion of this one verse prophecy, the actions described can only be performed by Christ, and there are no time signposts for when this portion of the prophecy will be performed. From a historical perspective, we do know that this portion of the first prophecy occurred in the 34th year of Christ’s life, which we today describe as Christ being 33 years old.

The Second Prophecy in the 9:24-27 passage is: -

25 "Know therefore and understand,
That from the going forth of the command
To restore and build Jerusalem
Until Messiah the Prince,
There shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks;
The street shall be built again, and the wall,
Even in troublesome times.​

This passage does have two signpost markers which we can understand, and they are, 1. The command to restore and build Jerusalem, which is at the start of this prophecy, and, 2. The coming of the Messiah, which ends this prophecy.

This is where we have trouble in our interpretation of this passage. What is meant by the expression, “Until the Messiah the Prince?” Does it mean either: - a. Christ’s birth in Bethlehem, or, b. when Christ began His three or so years of ministry?

Now if the understanding of the end point of this prophecy is the Birth of Christ, then the starting point for this prophecy is the year 483 BC, when Cyrus, the King over Babylon releases the Israelites, to return to Jerusalem and the land of Canaan, to rebuild the temple in Jerusalem. If the understanding of the end point is the beginning of Christ’s ministry, when He was 30 years old, then the starting point of this prophecy is the year 453 BC, which is 30 years later.

Sadly, the Bishop used his Prophetic Years formula to fix the dates, which were also adopted by historians as well, when certain events took place. If we use his formula in reverse, we can get back to the original prophetic years. The Bishop had ignored the fact that the calendar year of the Israelite nation was adjusted to fit the Solar yearly calendar over about a 19 year cycle.

The Third prophecy in the 9:24-27 passage is: -

26a "And after the sixty-two weeks
Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself;​

Now there are no signposts associated with this two-line prophecy in this verse, except that it will happen after the sixty-two weeks of years have passed. Whether the time gap is 3-4 years of 33-34 years is immaterial except with regards to our understanding of when Christ is come.

It is my experience that it is not necessary for us to be able to solve all of the mysteries given in the scriptures, except to come to an acceptance that the mysteries do not alter God’s plan for the salvation of mankind.

The Fourth Prophecy in the passage 9:24-27 is: -

26b And the people of the prince who is to come
Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be with a flood,
And till the end of the war desolations are determined.​

Now in this prophetic passage, it is making reference to the Little Horn who influences Titus to come up against Jerusalem with his army to destroy the Temple and to scatter the Israelite people to the four corners of the earth.

We do have and end date for this prophecy, and that date is when Isaiah 24:21-22 occurs and Satan, the Little Horn and the Beast(s) are thrown out of heaven down to the earth and imprisoned in the pit/bottomless pit for a period of 1,000 years. It is not until the influence of the wicked fallen heavenly hosts influence over the sea of humanity is curtailed that the trampling of God’s Hosts, the Israelites, will end in our near future.

You have also asked that I prove that the 2,300-day prophecy is a year for each of the 2,300 days: -



Perhaps you may like to answer this question, “Are the Israelites still being trampled today?”

If your answer is “yes,” in that they are still being trampled and are still being oppressed and killed by the heathen nations where they are scattered, then you have determined the answer for yourself and the year for a day rule is applicable for the Daniel 8:14 prophecy.

If your answer is “no,” then you have to prove to me that they are not presently being oppressed and killed by the people around them and that this has been the case, i.e. they are not being oppressed and killed, over the last 2,000 or so years since they were sold off as slaves and scattered to the four corners of the earth. Can you convince me that this has been the case since 70 AD. It is my opinion that you cannot.

The Fifth Prophecy then follows, and we have a pause in the prophecies in the passage 9:24-27 of 1,000 years before the fifth prophecy kicks in.

27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.
And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined,
Is poured out on the desolator."​

In the first line of this passage, we are not told who the “he” is who makes a solemn covenant with the people of the earth. From the Hebrew, we know that the “he” is acting insolently, which means that the “he” is either Satan or the Little Horn who in the Book of Revelation is also called the False Prophet.

The only time for this prophecy to be in play is after the Bottomless pit is opened after the passing of the 1,000 years. In both cases the consummation which is determined is poured out on the one who makes desolate. Bother Satan and the False Prophet makes desolate those who come under their influence.

From where I sit, in reflection, it seems that history confirms what I am posting.

Shalom

Your problem is you haven't recognized and accepted the nation in Daniel 8, that the little horn is from - Greece. And it is before Greece was conquered by Rome. Daniel 8 was fulfilled in the Jewish revolt of 160 BC to 167 BC, exactly 2300 literal 24 hour days. This is a completely different prophecy than the 70 weeks prophecy regarding the Messiah of Daniel 9. And the little horn of Daniel 7 is out of Rome and has nothing to do with the little horn from Greece out of Daniel 8. You are trying to combine the 2300 day prophecy with Daniel 9, and that is wrong. Different countries!
 

Jay Ross

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Your problem is you haven't recognized and accepted the nation in Daniel 8, that the little horn is from - Greece. And it is before Greece was conquered by Rome. Daniel 8 was fulfilled in the Jewish revolt of 160 BC to 167 BC, exactly 2300 literal 24 hour days. This is a completely different prophecy than the 70 weeks prophecy regarding the Messiah of Daniel 9. And the little horn of Daniel 7 is out of Rome and has nothing to do with the little horn from Greece out of Daniel 8. You are trying to combine the 2300 day prophecy with Daniel 9, and that is wrong. Different countries!

I will respond when you have answered the other question that I have posed for you in that thread.

I will make the following comment on heavenly and earthly contextualisation.

Your response here is man's contextualisation of the passage by trying to identify the players in the team without also identifying the influencer of the team who is directing the plays.