Rightly Dividing Calvinism
- Thread starter Episkopos
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Big Boy Johnson
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shepherdsword
Well-Known Member
I think a proper understanding of the tenets of Calvinism shows it is a false man-made system. It was created by a youth when he was only 22 years old. I have often wondered why I see a classic paradox when contemplating the difference between election and free will. This may be a good way to reconcile the two.
Big Boy Johnson
Well-Known Member
shepherdsword
Well-Known Member
And so is Arminianism. I think Epi is showing the roots of error as well as the truth in both.
Big Boy Johnson
Well-Known Member
They teach man has free will which is biblical correct being that God created man in His image
There may be other aspects that are not biblical since it too came from reformed theology, but the free will part if very biblical.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Shall I post a video of one who abandoned Armenians and adopted Calvinism because they found it to be better and more accurately biblically?
If e has refuted teh five points, he is not rightly divivding Calvinsim.
Big Boy Johnson
Well-Known Member
In other words calvinism is a cult and anybody that doesn't not agree with cult doctrine is not saved.
Those that accept all the Lord teaches in His Word could never be calvinists, as they would have to twist scripture and deny scripture in order to agree with the calvinists and kick Jesus to the curb
David Lamb
Active Member
No that just is not so. Calvinism does not teach that you have to be a Calvinist to be saved. It says that when any sinner is saved, it is the work of Jesus Christ which accomplishes that salvation. I don't understand what " kick Jesus to the curb" means - probably some term from an American sport. No Calvinist I have ever come across has denied or twisted scripture.
Big Boy Johnson
Well-Known Member
It means they follow John Calvin first and foremost by not believing all that the Lord teaches in His Word
In other words they interpret scripture thru the spirit of John Calvin rather than the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ
Deceived people cannot see which is why they are deceived.
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There are different levels to being a Calvinist. Maybe you aren't too severe in your own viewpoint.
Accomplishes? Here are you referring to a liberation from sin? If so, agreed! We can't save ourselves from sin. If you are talking about a later inheriting of life....that is by God's mercy. If that is the case it is a future redemption/salvation.
Where Calvinism fails miserably is in inventing a class of sinner called "saved sinners". The idea of that is that certain sinners are forgiven because of beliefs whereas others who do exactly the same things are not forgiven because of a lack of beliefs. As if people are going to be judged by their beliefs rather than their works.
Oh my. Either you are exceptional or you are in for a shock.
David Lamb
Active Member
I have said before that I believed the doctrines of grace because I found them in the bible, long before I had ever heard of a man called John Calvin. So I certainly don't " interpret scripture thru the spirit of John Calvin rather than the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ."
Big Boy Johnson
Well-Known Member
Yeah you actually do since you agree with John Calvin.
You were influenced by the teachings of John Calvin some where along the line, probably a fake pastor or fake bible teacher
David Lamb
Active Member
Can you give any examples of people who hold Calvinistic beliefs saying that sinners have to become Calvinists to be saved?
I was referring to every aspect of salvation. Ephesians tells us that in our natural state we are "dead in trespasses and sins." Thus by nature we are not in a position to contribute to our salvation.
Did Calvinists invent the term "saved sinners?" Surely it just means a sinner who has been saved. By nature, we are all sinners. When we are saved, we are saved sinners. I don't see the problem with the phrase.
As for being saved because of belief, surely we all believe that. The jailer at Philippi was told to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and he would be saved. Christians are those who are "in Christ," and that is how they are judged.
I am certainly not exceptional.
David Lamb
Active Member
I was not influenced by the teachings of Calvin, or by a fake pastor or fake bible teacher As I said, I hadn't even heard of him when I came to believe what I do, and I found those doctrines in the bible.
Jesus came to save us FROM our sins not IN our sins. So you are barking up the wrong tree when it comes to being saved in the present. A future salvation is always possible based on God's mercy.
Why do people deny the power of the gospel even as they purport to embrace the message of the gospel? Religious conditioning.
David Lamb
Active Member
Yes Jesus saves from sin. But we are in our sin when He saves us. He doesn't wait for us to somehow get out of sin's clutches by ourselves, and then save us. (He would be waiting for ever if that were the case!) That shows the power of the gospel, eternal life given to sinners dead in trespasses and sins. Charles Wesley (not a Calvinist) wrote about the power in his hymn, "Jesus, the Name High Over All," one verse of which says:
Jesus! the prisoner's fetters breaks,
And bruises Satan's head;
Power into strengthless souls it speaks,
And life into the dead,
And life into the dead.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Reader,
God makes Christians
Calvin and his DISCIPLES make Calvinists.
Calvinists come to a "christian" forum with their videos and their TULIP doctrine... hoping and praying to sell you their Calvinism, and they hope you will buy it for life.
You end a truly deceived person, if this happens to you.
So, beware.
= Fair Warning..
So...Figure that out asap, and you've discovered the GLARING issue with John Calvinism, that no amount of denying it on the part of a Deceived Disciple of Calvin, is going to erase.
David Lamb
Active Member
You might just as well replace "Calvin" and "Calvinists" with "Arminius" and "Arminians" in your post.
Speaking for myself, I didn't become a Calvinist and then somehow become a Christian. After my conversion, I encountered the doctrines of grace in the bible, and I believed them. I wasn't a disciple of Calvin - I hadn't heard of him at the time. And again speaking for myself, I am not trying to "sell" Calvinism to anybody. As I have already said, I believed the doctrines before I had even heard of Calvin or Calvinism.
I fully agree that God makes Christians. Some Christians believe the doctrines of grace, what you refer to as Calvinism, and some don't. This is a Christian discussion forum, so of course we encounter other posters with different views to our own, on this and many other matters.
Behold
Well-Known Member
The term "doctrines of grace" are not found in any NT ever created, or any "extant" Koine Grk Text.
This "calvin speak" you are using....... is Calvinism, that is pretending that you were not lead to the "dotrine of Grace" by this cult that created them.
So, as i stated.
A Calvinist, YOU< or Episkapos...or Brightframe, or Ronald Nolette, or similar.....will try to SELL Calvinism. on this Forum......any way you can, just like ever other Disciple of J-C.
Christians lead people to CHRIST
Calvinists lead people into their Calvinism Mania.
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